Winning A Bad Thing?

[SacKings384]

I know some people are already scratching their head when they see this. But what I'm saying is this, is it possible that the few stints of winning are actually a bad thing? For example, after the 5 game skid Rick was in line to get fired and Peja was in line to get traded. They win three in a row and then Rick is staying and it looked as if Peja was staying as well. It gives the Maloofs and Geoff to be stagnant and I don't know if that's nessecarily a good thing.

 

[SacDoug]

Patience is a good thing.

Dec 15 is the open season for trading. Geoff never tips his hands so we will just have to see. I expect to see a roster move.

As far as Adelman goes, he is not going anywhere until the end of the year IF the Maloofs let him go. He may be resigned. You don't give up a known winning coach unless you know you have a good replacement.

 

[Bricklayer]

I know some people are already scratching their head when they see this. But what I'm saying is this, is it possible that the few stints of winning are actually a bad thing? For example, after the 5 game skid Rick was in line to get fired and Peja was in line to get traded. They win three in a row and then Rick is staying and it looked as if Peja was staying as well. It gives the Maloofs and Geoff to be stagnant and I don't know if that's nessecarily a good thing.

This is actually a legitimate question that has clouded the minds of many a Kings fan in recent times. Too many agendas to be a pure fan, or even define what a pure fan is. Win every game now, but fewer int he future? Actually think its ok to lose now to see more wins in the future? Distracting.

And also I think a difficult thing for fans to answer honestly. Upsetting I think.

 

[SacTownKid]

I understand the idea behind the question, but I learned a long time ago that you just have to take whats given you. No matter how many great trades you put through the trade checker you have no control over the team. Changes? Sure. But I am not setting myself up for disappointment if they A) don't happen or B) are not ones I agree with.

They win they win, they lose they lose. I support all the players on this team. Whoever they may be.

 

[Bricklayer]

As far as Adelman goes, he is not going anywhere until the end of the year IF the Maloofs let him go. He may be resigned. You don't give up a known winning coach unless you know you have a good replacement.

I have real doubts Rick is going to give the Maloofs the chance to resign him. The bound of trust has been broken, and maybe the team as well. His detractors aroudn here don't realize thnat he wouold/will be the top free agent coach thius summer, and I would not be at all surprised to see him use that power to get a sweet new gig.

 

[John Galt]

You mean you're considering whether there is a possible scenario where we're HOPING to lose?

Never. Not for me. Not to climb up in the draft - not to maneuver into a specific playoff spot. Never.

 

[Bricklayer]

You mean you're considering whether there is a possible scenario where we're HOPING to lose?

Never. Not for me. Not to drop in the draft - not to maneuver into a specific playoff spot. Never.

As I mentioned above. Normal response perhaps.

But if I tell you that (just for example) that if we lose the next 5 games, that as a result we will make a move that allow us to win 10 more a year every yuear for the rest of the decade, they wouldn't being a fan and wanting your team to do well dictate wanting to get those longer term wins rather than a paltry handful now?

 

[SacTownKid]

As I mentioned above. Normal response perhaps.

But if I tell you that (just for example) that if we lose the next 5 games, that as a result we will make a move that allow us to win 10 more a year every yuear for the rest of the decade, they wouldn't being a fan and wanting your team to do well dictate wanting to get those longer term wins rather than a paltry handful now?

Then again we could make a move that puts us into a position to hopefully be able to reach the playoffs in 5 years time.

Who knows what would happen. Those are some big ???. Whos to say we'd be better or worse. You never know until it happens.

 

[piksi]

Day I hope they lose is the day I stop watching

 

[kennadog]

As I mentioned above. Normal response perhaps.

But if I tell you that (just for example) that if we lose the next 5 games, that as a result we will make a move that allow us to win 10 more a year every yuear for the rest of the decade, they wouldn't being a fan and wanting your team to do well dictate wanting to get those longer term wins rather than a paltry handful now?

Well, I don't want to wish losses on my team. I would hope that if there is any move to be made that would improve our team that much, that it would be done regardless of whether we win or lose the next 5 games. Altho, I understand that winning might give false hope and has the potential to delay. But I should hope that GP can see more clearly than fans can and isn't seduced by false hope, but sees the reality of the team good or bad. And then makes decisions accordingly. And someone else has to want to trade something to us that will make that difference, which as pointed out above is no sure thing anyway.

 

[Bricklayer]

Then again we could make a move that puts us into a position to hopefully be able to reach the playoffs in 5 years time.

Who knows what would happen. Those are some big ???. Whos to say we'd be better or worse. You never know until it happens.

Always layers of complexity, centered around assessments of course. Nonetheless, not as clean and easy as it appears at initial glance.

Its the last day of the season, your team and mine are both tied for the worst record in the NBA, and Tim Duncan is waiting to be drafted #1. My team loses, and then I turn on the TV to watch yours. I want your team to WIN, because that's a BAD thing for your team and a good thing for mine. Meanwhile, if you are rooting for your team to win, you are also perhaps unwittingly rooting for bad thing to happen to them.

It confuses rooting interests and makes things hard, but who is the bigger fan, the guy who puts his head down and wants them to win everry possible game now, damn the consequences or future, or the guy taking the longer term view wanting them to win more games in the future and willing to absorb short term losses for long term gains? Not sure either one is the "bigger fan". Different, and confusingly so however, especially when it starts to mix in distate for current team members etc.

 

[SacTownKid]

Always layers of complexity, centered around assessments of course. Nonetheless, not as clean and easy as it appears at initial glance.

Its the last day of the season, your team and mine are both tied for the worst record in the NBA, and Tim Duncan is waiting to be drafted #1. My team loses, and then I turn on the TV to watch yours. I want your team to WIN, because that's a BAD thing for your team and a good thing for mine. Meanwhile, if you are rooting for your team to win, you are also perhaps unwittingly rooting for bad thing to happen to them.

It confuses rooting interests and makes things hard, but who is the bigger fan, the guy who puts his head down and wants them to win everry possible game now, damn the consequences or future, or the guy taking the longer term view wanting them to win more games in the future and willing to absorb short term losses for long term gains? Not sure either one is the "bigger fan". Different, and confusingly so however, especially when it starts to mix in distate for current team members etc.

Of course, there are some "slam dunks". But I don't see any around at this moment in time. We aren't in a vacuum right now with our current situation. What moves there are we can make, and whats out there thats realistically any better than what we currently have are serious questions.

 

[John Galt]

Bricklayer: I understand what you're saying. But I don't think the end justifies the means if you find yourself rooting subconsciously for your team to lose (unless you're trying to double reverse negative opposite jinx them into winning).

Example: I really really dislike Peja - for longer than you have and more intensely than you. But in any given game I still would rather he stop trembling, grow a pair and break a nail going after a loose ball, even if that makes Geoff pick his pen up off the trade deal - change his mind - and keep him.

I guess in this case it is moot. I don't think a short term streak one way or the other right now will dictate anybody's fate. Much as I think Geoff is on a losing streak - I do think he tends to take the long view in general.

 

[SacTownKid]

Believe me, the Maloofs will not except this team hovering around .500. I say that with confidence. The problems this team faces are very clear, and the problems are fixable. The Maloofs said this summer they know the only way to win a championship is with defense. Hell, they just figured that out first hand and got a ring out of it. They have to know whats up.

 

[Warhawk]

I always want the team to win. I understand the "losing now to win later", but like others said, if the move is smart, then make it whether you are winning or losing. For example, Miami could have stood pat on their team after coming so close and fighting injuries, but they still made moves they thought would help.

 

[Bricklayer]

Believe me, the Maloofs will not except this team hovering around .500. I say that with confidence. The problems this team faces are very clear, and the problems are fixable. The Maloofs said this summer they know the only way to win a championship is with defense. Hell, they just figured that out first hand and got a ring out of it. They have to know whats up.

But the tickler is that the Maloofs don't make roster decisions (with the possible exception of the Webber deal, but even that's unclear). The Maloofs say defense, ok. What happens if the GM sees it a different way? I know what happens if I'm the owner -- I meddle. But what if you're jsut a couple of rich casino magnates who jet in to catch the occasional game but don't want to be bothered?

 

[SacTownKid]

But the tickler is that the Maloofs don't make roster decisions (with the possible exception of the Webber deal, but even that's unclear). The Maloofs say defense, ok. What happens if the GM sees it a different way? I know what happens if I'm the owner -- I meddle. But what if you're jsut a couple of rich casino magnates who jet in to catch the occasional game but don't want to be bothered?

Well from what I have heard they actually do have a part in what goes on with this team. Doesn't change things. They know what they need and if doesn't get done then I would assume they would do what I would do. Make it get done.

What if? I don't think they are so it doesn't matter much to me.

 

[kennadog]

But the tickler is that the Maloofs don't make roster decisions (with the possible exception of the Webber deal, but even that's unclear). The Maloofs say defense, ok. What happens if the GM sees it a different way? I know what happens if I'm the owner -- I meddle. But what if you're jsut a couple of rich casino magnates who jet in to catch the occasional game but don't want to be bothered?

I don't believe they can't be bothered. They didn't get to be rich businessmen by not paying attention to their businesses/product. And if they ultimately think an employee(s) isn't getting the message or getting the job done, they'll fire 'em. (Oops, let them "resign," like Stan VG. )

 

[SacTownKid]

I don't believe they can't be bothered. They didn't get to be rich businessmen by not paying attention to their businesses/product. And if they ultimately think an employee(s) isn't getting the message or getting the job done, they'll fire 'em. (Oops, let them "resign," like Stan VG. )

That and the current times are that the Maloofs can't afford to have a subpar product out on the floor. Even if just from a business standpoint.

 

[SacKings384]

I am a gigantic Kings fan. But there comes a time when I think, why stay in this average (well right now below average) area? Either have a championship team, or rebuild. That's it. But then there are times when I want to see Reef make the playoffs, and want to see the Kings go on a winning streak. It's very difficult to turn on a game and being torn when they win.

 

[sactown_draftpick]

loosing brings much needed changes i welcome changes therefore i welcome losing a few games to help the overall future of the club

 

[Insomniacal Fan]

I root for the team winning as often as possible, for totally selfish and shortsighted reasons, watching the team lose sucks.