Will Eric Musselman ever take us to the title?

[TheJoker]

I'll match my passion for the Kings with him any day of the week. It's not about being a passionate fan. This has dissolved into BawLa ranting that only his perception is right and if we don't agree with it we're not TRUE fans. That's just silly...

Anyone can be a passionate fan without actually expecting the top prize, i don't get what BawLa is trying to do here... but i think hes really trying to speak for us and no one likes that especially since he thinks no one is a true fan if no one agrees which is a horrible remark to make.

 

[Arby's Roast Beef]

Wow, possibilities, possibilities...

This question is equivalent to...

Will Mike Bibby leave us within the next 5 years?
Will we eventually get a new head coach within the next 5 years?
Will we have any injuries during the season?

Of course everything that's started from scratch has something that may eventually come into fruition, but this is really jumping the gun.

 

[Kingzrool]

Will we have any injuries during the season?

Well that one is a no brainer. Does a bear s*** in the woods?

 

[bajaden]

Nonsense

So lets see here, first you are criticizing the style of which I choose to believe. Thanks, really classy. I'm sorry that your life is so negative that you gotta criticize every thing I say because my view may be too optimistic and postitive. If I truly believe Muss will have great success here in Sac then what is so wrong with that, as delusional as it may be?

Secondly, you are saying that you don't have to believe in your coach if you are a true fan. Yeah, that makes sense... And if the day comes when Muss is successful it will be so easy for you to hop on board as if you were here the whole time. But if he fails then you can sit back and say I told you so. And if you don't feel one way or another right now, and you just want to wait to pass judgement, then why are you even posting on this thread? Probably just to criticize my thoughts and feelings.



Earlier in this thread you made the statement: "how the bleep could we possibly know at this point". Which tells me that you want to see Muss be successful or unsuccessful before you answer the question. I don't affiliate with organized religion, but I do understand the ideas of faith and belief. If god came down to earth and said here I am, believe in me, then it would kind of defeat the purpose of faith.


Maybe YOU don't realize this because your mind is CLOUDED with NEGATIVITY but negative thoughts only lead to negative outcomes. Think about your most successful friends. I'll wager they have a positive outlook on life. And the same should be true about the antithesis. Well, I could be wrong...after all it is New York, where any given person would be willing to gut the next person over a taxi.

All I'm trying to say is that if people believe Muss will succeed, then he will succeed. Similarly if people believe he will fail, then he will fail.
And if you are idle and don't believe either, then you are not helping.

Take a look at page 42 in the fandom handbook, it clearly states that you must believe to achieve.

I'm not sure where to begin. First you say that Bricky is critical of the style you choose to believe. I thought we were talking about winning and loosing not style. Belief isn't a style.

When Bricky said how could anyone possibly know at this time, he was right on. Anyone who thinks he or she knows is smoking too much weed. There aren't enough facts to even make a judgement. Give me 20 or so games to watch and I'll try to give you and answer. Not to jump on the bandwagon, because I'll still root for my team even if I don't think they have what it takes to win a championship.

I tend by nature to be more optimistic than Bricky, but that doesn't make him less of a fan. I might add, it is not up to you to tell us what we should or should not believe. You can believe what you want. Thats all fine and good. Custer didn't believe that there were indians around either. Just believing something, doesn't make it happen.

I don't know anything about page 42 of the fan book. I do know that what you said applies to the players, not the fans. Lastly, please don't confuse God with basketball. If my belief in God has to be the same as my belief in basketball I'm in big trouble. My place of worship is a church, not ARCO arena.

 

[BawLa]

I'm not sure where to begin. First you say that Bricky is critical of the style you choose to believe. I thought we were talking about winning and loosing not style. Belief isn't a style.

I'm not sure where to begin with you. First you must read what everyone wrote before you begin to comment on it. BRICK was the one that brought up style. I took what Brick said and applied it to my point, or counterpoint if you will.

When Bricky said how could anyone possibly know at this time, he was right on.

And I'll say to you what I said to him, why post in this thread if you aren't willing to speculate? The entire thread was predicated on speculation. TITLE: Will Eric Musselman ever take us to the title?

There aren't enough facts to even make a judgement. Give me 20 or so games to watch and I'll try to give you and answer. Not to jump on the bandwagon, because I'll still root for my team even if I don't think they have what it takes to win a championship.

1. I never said we had what it takes right now to win a championship. The question clearly states will Eric EVER?....not implying this year.

2. If you really think there arent enough facts to make a judgement then just say that instead of all this other "stuff".

3. Belief and cheering (rooting) are two different things.

I tend by nature to be more optimistic than Bricky, but that doesn't make him less of a fan.

I never said anything about Brick being less of a fan. When I say true fan, it is merely a category of people in my own head. Everyone has blown it out of proportion, but thats okay.

I might add, it is not up to you to tell us what we should or should not believe.

Fair enough. However, remember this is a message board where people share their opinions. If you don't like my opinion, you have every right so say so. You SHOULD take my opinions the same as ALL opinions and that is with a grain of salt. Listen to everyone possible and formulate your own opinion. Fortunately I don't need other people to think for me.

You can believe what you want.

This I did not need to be told.

Just believing something, doesn't make it happen.

Agreed. But belief is an integral part of making things happen. If you don't believe you can make tons of money, or take out that cute girl, then you never will.

If you want to expand your mind then send me a message and I will be happy to share some interesting materials with you.

I don't know anything about page 42 of the fan book. I do know that what you said applies to the players, not the fans.

Agree to disagree. I think it applies to both. And maybe someone could pick up on the trend that I have been setting with my recent anti-negative posts.

Lastly, please don't confuse God with basketball. If my belief in God has to be the same as my belief in basketball I'm in big trouble. My place of worship is a church, not ARCO arena.

Confused? I never said your belief in basketball has to be the same as your belief in god, but blind faith is blind faith.

God is a part of whatever you do no matter what church you go to.

And think about all sports. Most players, and especially the successful ones, belive in god, and more specifically a christian/catholic god. And they happen to be very outspoken about it. Ever seen the espy awards or some player talking to a reporter after a good game? The first person they thank is god for keeping them healthy, giving them the opportunity, etc. Religion and sports are heavily intertwined whether you believe so or not.

 

[Sac.Kings]

The title does say if Muss will ever get us a title, but he hasn't even coached a single game for the Kings yet. For all we know he could last only for a season. We have to see how the Kings do under Muss and how his philosophy is adopted and how the players adapt to it. Right now, specualtion has no cold hard facts to be backed with. This question doesn't have an answer yet IMO.

 

[D-Mass]

I'll try to be careful here, mods...

God is a part of whatever you do no matter what church you go to.

Not all people believe this, you know.

Most players, and especially the successful ones, belive in god, and more specifically a christian/catholic god.

1.) Some people also don't believe that is a prerequisite for success.
2.) Muslims/Jews/Buddhists/etc. don't experience success in sports?

Religion and sports are heavily intertwined whether you believe so or not.

They're only intertwined for those specific athletes. They only have something to do with each other for the people who believe they do. For everyone else, there's sports...and there's religion.

 

[SacTownKid]

C'mon people. Lets face the facts. We will win the championship this year.

Seriously, how can this question be answered right now? I'll say yes for sake of discussion.

 

[D-Mass]

C'mon people. Lets face the facts. We will win the championship this year.

So how many people have to believe that for it to happen?

 

[BawLa]

Not all people believe this, you know.

I know, I wasn't talking to everyone. I was specifically responding to something bajaden said. I don't see how that is not clear to you. Try reading what he said, and then my response.

It seems as though people don't like me on this forum because why else would people pick apart every little thing I say.

1.) Some people also don't believe that is a prerequisite for success.

Agreed. Some people do and some people don't. Where are you going with that point?

2.) Muslims/Jews/Buddhists/etc. don't experience success in sports?

Please don't put words in my mouth. I said most players and especially. I haven't seen tatoos of the Buddah or the Star of David as much as I've seen athletes amongst every sport wearing a chain, or tatoo, with a cross (crucifix?).

They're only intertwined for those specific athletes. They only have something to do with each other for the people who believe they do. For everyone else, there's sports...and there's religion.

I didn't say entirely, I said heavily. Religion and sports are heavily intertwined...

That doesn't mean everyone religious plays sports. It means that many, and IMO most, of the athletes are religious. I don't have stats for you, sorry.

Bajaden originally stated: "please don't confuse God and Basketball". So I respond by saying religion and sports are heavily intertwined. Now you're saying religion and sports are only intertwined for the people that are both religious and play sports? And that there are other people that play sports that are not religious? Why? Why are you breaking my basketballs?

 

[SacTownKid]

So how many people have to believe that for it to happen?

Who cares facts are facts.

 

[BawLa]

So how many people have to believe that for it to happen?

Now that you're making light of the subject I might enjoy responding.

The answer is one of two possibilities:

1. More than all of the people who believe we will fail.

2. Exactly 32,752.

 

[D-Mass]

BawLa...I don't believe people are attacking you personally, but that's the way it can feel sometimes when people start picking apart your posts.

Please don't presume that I didn't read the original posts you were responding to. I did. But just in case, I went back and read them again, just to make sure I didn't miss anything. I stand by my responses to you since I believe I didn't misinterpret any of the implications in your posts.

I'm done arguing about this now, mainly because it enters into territory that is not appropriate for this forum. Hopefully a simple, "we'll agree to disagree" will suffice.

 

[VF21]

I know, I wasn't talking to everyone. I was specifically responding to something bajaden said. I don't see how that is not clear to you. Try reading what he said, and then my response.

It seems as though people don't like me on this forum because why else would people pick apart every little thing I say.



Agreed. Some people do and some people don't. Where are you going with that point?



Please don't put words in my mouth. I said most players and especially. I haven't seen tatoos of the Buddah or the Star of David as much as I've seen athletes amongst every sport wearing a chain, or tatoo, with a cross (crucifix?).



I didn't say entirely, I said heavily. Religion and sports are heavily intertwined...

That doesn't mean everyone religious plays sports. It means that many, and IMO most, of the athletes are religious. I don't have stats for you, sorry.

Bajaden originally stated: "please don't confuse God and Basketball". So I respond by saying religion and sports are heavily intertwined. Now you're saying religion and sports are only intertwined for the people that are both religious and play sports? And that there are other people that play sports that are not religious? Why? Why are you breaking my basketballs?

I'll simply comment one more time that you're taking things WAY too personally. People aren't attacking you, as D-Mass has tried to point out, along with others.

This is a message board. People argue about the topics in the various threads. You threw down the gauntlet when you pretty much said anyone who didn't agree with you wasn't a true fan. Them's fighin' words around here, especially during TDOS when there isn't much else to get all heated up about.

The original question is a homer delight any way you look at it. (And I'm a self-confessed homer, so I recognize them when I see them.)

Your response - that true fans have to say yes - was attacked because a lot of us around here consider ourselves to be TRUE FANS, and yet we don't necessary have to say yes to the question that was posed.

Note again: Your response was attacked, not you. If you, as a true fan, believe Musselman will take us to a title, more power to you. I'm glad you have that kind of faith. If I, as a true fan, say I don't know and I'm going to wait and see, then I'm not being any less of a fan by being honest.

Blind homerism is fine, and a lot of people practice it, but please don't mistake it for TRUE fandom. There is no such animal.

I'm not responding, by the way, solely to the post above that I quoted. I merely did that so it would be clear I'm responding to your posts and not someone else's.

 

[Warhawk]

Please don't put words in my mouth. I said most players and especially. I haven't seen tatoos of the Buddah or the Star of David as much as I've seen athletes amongst every sport wearing a chain, or tatoo, with a cross (crucifix?).

I didn't say entirely, I said heavily. Religion and sports are heavily intertwined...

That doesn't mean everyone religious plays sports. It means that many, and IMO most, of the athletes are religious. I don't have stats for you, sorry.

Bajaden originally stated: "please don't confuse God and Basketball". So I respond by saying religion and sports are heavily intertwined. Now you're saying religion and sports are only intertwined for the people that are both religious and play sports? And that there are other people that play sports that are not religious? Why? Why are you breaking my basketballs?

A. Having a cross tatoo does not make one religious, any more than a Japanese character for "Love" on your bicep makes you Asian.

B. Some people have the opinion that sports and religion can be considered intertwined. Others, myself included, do not. Just stating something doesn't make it so. Please give some pretty concrete examples to back that up if you are going to make such a broad assumption on something I think most would disagree with. I don't think they mark first downs in cubits or make sure all free throws must be shot facing east....

C. Most people in the US are religious, or consider themselves to be. The same would tend to follow for atheletes, since they are a subset of that population. Your point being?

D. I have no idea what you are trying to say in that last paragraph....

 

[SacTownKid]

It is already widely known that pro athletics is more closely realated with the satanist/cult movement.

Hence the pentagram on Bonzi's left buttcheek.

 

[bajaden]

Bawla. This is my last word on the subject. I believe that you and I are closer in what we believe than Bricky and I are. What I took umbrage with is the fact that you tried to define what a fan is. Its well and good for you to have your own opinion on this, but when you post them, someone might be upset. To say that Bricky is negative is fine. But to say that he isn't a true fan (your words) because he doesn't agree with your standards is unappropiate. To call him a bandwagoner is an insult to him. I don't think you really meant it to sound that way, but it did.

I think that belief in sucess is important, but only to the indiviual who has that belief. I can believe in my son all I want, and I think that can have an influence on him. But if he doesn't believe in himself, all my faith is meaningless. Most suscessful people I know don't need me for inspiration. They have that burning inside of them already. However, I think screaming my lungs out at the game helps. At least it helps me.

 

[VF21]

Bawla. This is my last word on the subject. I believe that you and I are closer in what we believe than Bricky and I are. What I took umbrage with is the fact that you tried to define what a fan is. Its well and good for you to have your own opinion on this, but when you post them, someone might be upset. To say that Bricky is negative is fine. But to say that he isn't a true fan (your words) because he doesn't agree with your standards is unappropiate. To call him a bandwagoner is an insult to him. I don't think you really meant it to sound that way, but it did.

I think that belief in sucess is important, but only to the indiviual who has that belief. I can believe in my son all I want, and I think that can have an influence on him. But if he doesn't believe in himself, all my faith is meaningless. Most suscessful people I know don't need me for inspiration. They have that burning inside of them already. However, I think screaming my lungs out at the game helps. At least it helps me.

Very well said...

 

[Greenspan 101]

You know...I am getting more than a little tired of those kinds of self-serving proclamations about the nature of fandom. Just paging through the fandom handbook I see not a single mention of "must be delusionally optimistic and self righteous about it".

I sit on the coast and in a city (New York) where they think if you don't boo, criticize your team, and scream bloody murder at every opportunity, then you aren't only not a true fan, you're a spineless dilettante without any depth of sporting knowledge or passion. They aren't right either.

The ONLY litmus test for a fan is that you want the team to win. Whether you in the meantime spend your time with your head in the clouds refusing to hear anything but praise and admiration for everyone from the owners to the ballboys, or in the trenches snarling and barking and tearing your hair out at every real or perceived setback is just a matter of style.

Jeez, take it easy, man!

 

[VF21]

All he's saying is the only real test for a fan should be if you WANT the team to win. Bricklayer, along with many of us around here, is just more than a little tired of the "if you don't do __________, you're not a true fan" comments that people seem to want to use.

Fans cannot be cubbyholed into convenient categories like socks. Fans come in all shapes and sizes, all levels of intensity. Some are always optimistic, others are always pessimistic.

It's not about ONE person here deciding that he or she can define "true fan." It just doesn't work that way.

 

[BawLa]

A. Having a cross tatoo does not make one religious, any more than a Japanese character for "Love" on your bicep makes you Asian.

Comon, are you serious? Well thats very cute but I don't think people get tatoos of the letter "t". I might need some concrete examples of people that have a tatoo of a cross and aren't religious in order to believe you. I'll wager you couldn't find ONE. Then again thats my belief so everyone will probably try to pick it apart.

If you ever get the chance to talk to Mike Bibby, ask him if he is religious. Or better yet, ask him what that giant cross on his right shoulder means. He'll say exactly what I did: Comon, are you serious?

B. Some people have the opinion that sports and religion can be considered intertwined. Others, myself included, do not. Just stating something doesn't make it so. Please give some pretty concrete examples to back that up if you are going to make such a broad assumption on something I think most would disagree with. I don't think they mark first downs in cubits or make sure all free throws must be shot facing east....

You've got to be kidding. I said sorry I don't have statistics for you. How can I possibly give you concrete examples? I would just be telling you of something you haven't seen so why would you believe me?

Doesn't Jason Kidd touch his head, chest, and shoulders (as if to pray to god) every time he takes a free throw? Or maybe Kidd is the one that kisses his cross that he wears every time he takes a free throw. Either way, from here on out open your eyes and ears when you watch sports and you will clearly see and hear what I'm trying to say.

I've seen athletes expressing their religious beliefs all the time. Just because you haven't seen the same thing does not mean that it does not happen.

C. Most people in the US are religious, or consider themselves to be. The same would tend to follow for atheletes, since they are a subset of that population. Your point being?

Why would you make a point like that? That only helps to prove my original point. So if you are trying to help me out then thanks, but it seemed like you were trying to pick apart what I say.

If you followed along the discussion then you would understand why I brought that up. If you just looked at the one post and you don't understand why it is there, then you would make a rediculous point like that. Go back and read what bajaden wrote, and look at my whole response. If you still don't understand how the discussion got to that tangent then I might be willing to show you. But please, don't try to pick apart everything I say, especially if you don't know how it came about.

D. I have no idea what you are trying to say in that last paragraph....

I don't have the energy to re-repeat everything that was said between 3 different people for you. Sorry, you're just going to have to READ what was said by everyone if you want to understand.

 

[BawLa]

I'll simply comment one more time that you're taking things WAY too personally. People aren't attacking you, as D-Mass has tried to point out, along with others.

This is a message board. People argue about the topics in the various threads. You threw down the gauntlet when you pretty much said anyone who didn't agree with you wasn't a true fan. Them's fighin' words around here, especially during TDOS when there isn't much else to get all heated up about.

Totally understood. Brick did not like my original statement. Hey, not everyone is gonna like everything I say. And now having wasted all this time, I almost regret it.

But when people start trying to pick apart every little detail of every thing I say, for whatever reason, it gets kind of annoying. Especially when people don't even know what they're talking about when they try and "go off" on me.

To boot, I've got people putting words in my mouth.

Also, I've got people implying things that I never intended. I seem to recall having this problem once before. Sorry, I'm still working on my wording.

Blind homerism is fine, and a lot of people practice it, but please don't mistake it for TRUE fandom. There is no such animal.

My opinions of true fandom are mine and mine alone. And they are not a mistake. If people don't like it and want to comment on my thoughts, fine. I am well prepared to stand behind what I say. But don't you think people blew this just a wee bit out of proportion?... I do.

 

[BawLa]

To say that Bricky is negative is fine. But to say that he isn't a true fan (your words) because he doesn't agree with your standards is unappropiate. To call him a bandwagoner is an insult to him. I don't think you really meant it to sound that way, but it did.

Get the facts straight please.

1. I never said Brick is not a true fan if he doesn't believe me. I said "you've" and I wasn't talking to Brick, I was talking to everyone in general. Brick gave a response after I made the original statement. If you can find a quote I would love to see it.

2. I never used the word bandwagon, and even if it was implied it was implied in a HYPOTHETICAL SITUATION. Go back and read and you will see the key word "if".

I think that belief in sucess is important, but only to the indiviual who has that belief. I can believe in my son all I want, and I think that can have an influence on him. But if he doesn't believe in himself, all my faith is meaningless. Most suscessful people I know don't need me for inspiration. They have that burning inside of them already. However, I think screaming my lungs out at the game helps. At least it helps me.

Finally a decent conversation. I agree that your most successful friends don't need you to believe in them because they have it burning inside them already. I actually stated that in different words earlier in the thread.

Personally, I believe that our thoughts can have an affect on other people. If you want to see evidence of that then send me a personal message. I would be happy to share with someone who is open to those types of ideas.

Think about this: ever since the fans (in general) have been disappointed with the soft play of Brad Miller, it has gotten worse. Similarly, ever since people have enjoyed the great play by Kevin Martin, it has gotten better. I'm not saying that the fans totally control the teams outcome. I'm just saying it is more of a factor than most people are willing to understand.

 

[Warhawk]

Comon, are you serious? Well thats very cute but I don't think people get tatoos of the letter "t". I might need some concrete examples of people that have a tatoo of a cross and aren't religious in order to believe you. I'll wager you couldn't find ONE. Then again thats my belief so everyone will probably try to pick it apart.

If you ever get the chance to talk to Mike Bibby, ask him if he is religious. Or better yet, ask him what that giant cross on his right shoulder means. He'll say exactly what I did: Comon, are you serious?

I'm saying there are lots of folks with tatoos for lots of reasons. Picking one person out with a tatoo signifying something TO THAT PERSON and applying that to all NBA atheletes is absurd.

You've got to be kidding. I said sorry I don't have statistics for you. How can I possibly give you concrete examples? I would just be telling you of something you haven't seen so why would you believe me?

Doesn't Jason Kidd touch his head, chest, and shoulders (as if to pray to god) every time he takes a free throw? Or maybe Kidd is the one that kisses his cross that he wears every time he takes a free throw. Either way, from here on out open your eyes and ears when you watch sports and you will clearly see and hear what I'm trying to say.

I've seen athletes expressing their religious beliefs all the time. Just because you haven't seen the same thing does not mean that it does not happen.

Of course you can't have any statistics or concrete examples - you are pulling overarching theories out of thin air.

I've also seen "athletes expressing their religious beliefs all the time" - I just choose to think that it is totally irrelevant to us as Kings fans on a message board. DC showed his love and devotion to his wife by raising his hand in salute and acknowledgement to her often during a game. Big deal. It doesn't make him any better or worse a player.

I've got to go - running late for church.

 

[Jkbiker]

Definition of Fan

Per Websters online:

Main Entry: 3fan
Function: noun
Etymology: probably short for fanatic
1 : an enthusiastic devotee (as of a sport or a performing art) usually as a spectator
2 : an ardent admirer or enthusiast (as of a celebrity or a pursuit) <science-fiction fans

I think this stuff about being a true fan is just silly, all of us here are fans, the key words used in the definition, i feel, fit most everyone on the board.

entusiastic? yeah the fact all of us will sit around in TDOS and argue points on fandom, yeah cant get more enthusiastic than that. whether each of may be a fan with blind faith, or a fan that likes to criticise or debate is just further subcatigories of Kings fans. We all are enthusiastic during every game, yelling cheering, enthusiastic when we come to the board whether to debate, or lurk enjoying the posts. The laker fans on there cell phones, or trying to look pretty for the camera? not enthusiastic. Kings fans standing, screaming, ringing cowbells, screaming at our TVs, yes enthusiastic.

devotee? going to the games, watching during Mitch Richmond Era, hoping to win more than 30 games, getting behind our players and cheering, whether or not we agreed with management player moves, spending sunday morning looking up definition of Fan, all signs of being a devotee.

My hat is off to all of you on this board, you are all true kings fans (of course except other team fans that visit)

Go Kings

 

[D-Mass]

Per Websters online:

Main Entry: 3fan
Function: noun
Etymology: probably short for fanatic
1 : an enthusiastic devotee (as of a sport or a performing art) usually as a spectator
2 : an ardent admirer or enthusiast (as of a celebrity or a pursuit) <science-fiction fans

I think this stuff about being a true fan is just silly, all of us here are fans, the key words used in the definition, i feel, fit most everyone on the board.

entusiastic? yeah the fact all of us will sit around in TDOS and argue points on fandom, yeah cant get more enthusiastic than that. whether each of may be a fan with blind faith, or a fan that likes to criticise or debate is just further subcatigories of Kings fans. We all are enthusiastic during every game, yelling cheering, enthusiastic when we come to the board whether to debate, or lurk enjoying the posts. The laker fans on there cell phones, or trying to look pretty for the camera? not enthusiastic. Kings fans standing, screaming, ringing cowbells, screaming at our TVs, yes enthusiastic.

devotee? going to the games, watching during Mitch Richmond Era, hoping to win more than 30 games, getting behind our players and cheering, whether or not we agreed with management player moves, spending sunday morning looking up definition of Fan, all signs of being a devotee.

My hat is off to all of you on this board, you are all true kings fans (of course except other team fans that visit)

Go Kings

You know, this post should end this thread (although I fear it won't). Nice work.

 

[Sac.Kings]

^agreed.

 

[BawLa]

I'm saying there are lots of folks with tatoos for lots of reasons. Picking one person out with a tatoo signifying something TO THAT PERSON and applying that to all NBA atheletes is absurd.

No. What is absurd is that you are trying to defend a meaningless point. I didn't "apply" that to all atheletes. The crucifix is a KNOWN SYMBOL of faith. IT HAS BEEN FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS. You said having a tattoo of a crucifix does not neccessarily make you religious. I disagree. If YOU can find ONE person that has a tattoo of a cross, and ISN'T religious then I will believe you. But until you provide some sort of concrete examples to back up your absurd statement you need to just back off.

Of course you can't have any statistics or concrete examples - you are pulling overarching theories out of thin air.

I've also seen "athletes expressing their religious beliefs all the time" - I just choose to think that it is totally irrelevant to us as Kings fans on a message board. DC showed his love and devotion to his wife by raising his hand in salute and acknowledgement to her often during a game. Big deal. It doesn't make him any better or worse a player.

I've got to go - running late for church.

So first you say "of course I can't have any concrete examples", and then you say you've seen those examples "all the time". Your argument makes no sense. Which is why saying I'm pulling overarching theories out of thin air is just like saying that thin air source is between your ears.

While you think it is totally irrelevent to us as Kings fans, you should READ how it got brought up before you make a rediculous post.

No one said anything about religion making a better or worse player. So YOU bringing up irrelevent comments out of thin air as if it was something I said kinda hurts your credibility.

Before you started making these ludicrous posts, I had much more respect for you. Maybe when you get back from church you can apologize and redeem yourself.

 

[GoGoGadget]

No. What is absurd

What is REALLY absurd is that you've felt it necessary to continue this arguement long past the point it's gotten tiresome.

Word of advice: Generalizations are not your friend. You are not in a position to determine what every sports fan is or should be. You are not in a position to assume what every athlete's tattoo means or should mean.

Continuing to argue that you are, for whatever reason, is just silly.

And continuing to do so in such a condescending manner is uncalled for. Let it go.

 

[VF21]

No. What is absurd is that you are trying to defend a meaningless point. I didn't "apply" that to all atheletes. The crucifix is a KNOWN SYMBOL of faith. IT HAS BEEN FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS. You said having a tattoo of a crucifix does not neccessarily make you religious. I disagree. If YOU can find ONE person that has a tattoo of a cross, and ISN'T religious then I will believe you. But until you provide some sort of concrete examples to back up your absurd statement you need to just back off.



So first you say "of course I can't have any concrete examples", and then you say you've seen those examples "all the time". Your argument makes no sense. Which is why saying I'm pulling overarching theories out of thin air is just like saying that thin air source is between your ears.

While you think it is totally irrelevent to us as Kings fans, you should READ how it got brought up before you make a rediculous post.

No one said anything about religion making a better or worse player. So YOU bringing up irrelevent comments out of thin air as if it was something I said kinda hurts your credibility.

Before you started making these ludicrous posts, I had much more respect for you. Maybe when you get back from church you can apologize and redeem yourself.

When it gets to the point where you're making insulting and demeaning comments about the poster and not the post, it's time to close the thread.