I don't understand Donte's loss in minutes while Westphal complains about the interior defense. The weird truth is that Donte improves our interior defense while on the floor and our overall defense as well. He is only getting minutes if he's scoring, which flies in the face of Westphal's complaints.
Westphal's Recent Coaching
- Thread starter xrzn
- Start date
SacTownGrantFan
Bench
A recurring Kings coaching problem
Why does Westphal have a problem with letting our youngs play more, like Casspi and Donte, instead of letting marginal vets like Udoka and Nocioni soak up a lot of the minutes?
Not only would these players develop and contribute, but I think they would do a better job than Nocioni and Udoka if they go a lot more playing time. This last game (against the Jazz), we desperately needed defense down low. Paul Millsap destroyed us with 34 points, 14 boards and 7 assists. Why not put Donte in? He has been playing solid defense lately, not to mention he's 6' 11". It's ironic that Westphal actually started Donte, and yet he got 4 minutes of total playing time! What is that all about?
I remember that this 'coaching/minutes/young vs. old' issue was discussed with Theus, and I think Adelman as well. Why do coaches do this?
Why does Westphal have a problem with letting our youngs play more, like Casspi and Donte, instead of letting marginal vets like Udoka and Nocioni soak up a lot of the minutes?
Not only would these players develop and contribute, but I think they would do a better job than Nocioni and Udoka if they go a lot more playing time. This last game (against the Jazz), we desperately needed defense down low. Paul Millsap destroyed us with 34 points, 14 boards and 7 assists. Why not put Donte in? He has been playing solid defense lately, not to mention he's 6' 11". It's ironic that Westphal actually started Donte, and yet he got 4 minutes of total playing time! What is that all about?
I remember that this 'coaching/minutes/young vs. old' issue was discussed with Theus, and I think Adelman as well. Why do coaches do this?
Kings Fan Gerard
Bench
We just have too many players that play the same positions, and unfortunately, those positions aren't forward or center.
I can understand showcasing Noc for a trade but Ime is getting far too many minutes. Donte also needs to go out and just play D when his number is called, play good solid D and take open shots. Every game he seems to take wild drives and spins and throws up really bad shots and I think that is what has been costing him minutes. Agreed Westphal should have a longer leash on him, and that is really coach's mistake. I think benching him when he does make such dumb plays could be a good idea to reinforce the idea of playing more under control into Donte, to make sure he doesn't take steps backwards after making good progress. But he should be given the opportunity to come back into the game after that.
King Baller
All-Star
Donte was getting creamed on defense! Should Westphal leave him on AK so he can go for 30 points? How is that going to help Donte?
As for Milsap, no King could guard him last night. He was scoring on JT and Brockman pretty easily. Donte is considerably lighter so I'm pretty sure Westphal made the right call.
The Kings missed most of their three's and could not defend Milsap....end of story
KB
As for Milsap, no King could guard him last night. He was scoring on JT and Brockman pretty easily. Donte is considerably lighter so I'm pretty sure Westphal made the right call.
The Kings missed most of their three's and could not defend Milsap....end of story
KB
JoMama
Bench
The musical chair lineups of Westphal may be to define who stays and who goes in trades. No way this team is playoff ready or worthy so why not get long looks at players who may or may not fit into the master plan? Coaches and management should now have a great idea of which players to keep when trade deadline nears. Losing hurts but I'm trying to look at the bigger picture this season.
MassachusettsKingsFan
All-Star
Donte was getting creamed on defense! Should Westphal leave him on AK so he can go for 30 points? How is that going to help Donte?
As for Milsap, no King could guard him last night. He was scoring on JT and Brockman pretty easily. Donte is considerably lighter so I'm pretty sure Westphal made the right call.
The Kings missed most of their three's and could not defend Milsap....end of story
KB
Our whole team gets ruined on Defense. Martin is a terrible defender, our "Bigs" cant defend anyone. But Greene is the only one who gets 'punished' for it.
SacTownGrantFan
Bench
That's what Carmichael Dave said as well. Good point.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
I'm not happy as a clam with some of the rotations. Or at least how long he stays with them at times. Such as at the end of the third quarter, which is where we lost the game when Utah went on what I beleive was a 14 to 4 run.
I have mixed emotions over Donte. Westphal has been able to turn around his career. So I'm willing to give Westphal the benefit of the doubt, since I'm not sure what his reasons were. Yeah, I know what he said, but he's one of those coaches thats not going to air his laundry on television.
The way Evans and Martin were playing last night, I think I would have tried to have at least one of them on the floor at all times just for the offense.
I have mixed emotions over Donte. Westphal has been able to turn around his career. So I'm willing to give Westphal the benefit of the doubt, since I'm not sure what his reasons were. Yeah, I know what he said, but he's one of those coaches thats not going to air his laundry on television.
The way Evans and Martin were playing last night, I think I would have tried to have at least one of them on the floor at all times just for the offense.
Donte looks to be a bust, plain and simple. We're just a better team with Udoka out there and it's not like hes a 33 year old declining player.
For ever 1 good game Greene has, he has 7 bad ones to go along with it. He has so many empty box score stat lines this year that its ridiculous. If we have a player whos playing 25 minutes and is getting 4 points, 2 reb, 1 ast and 1 blk on most nights, he's really not doing us any good at all at being out there unless he's a premier defender. Which he is not.
For ever 1 good game Greene has, he has 7 bad ones to go along with it. He has so many empty box score stat lines this year that its ridiculous. If we have a player whos playing 25 minutes and is getting 4 points, 2 reb, 1 ast and 1 blk on most nights, he's really not doing us any good at all at being out there unless he's a premier defender. Which he is not.
SacTownGrantFan
Bench
So you're not looking hard enough.
matthew76
Bench
LOL, have you even seen Donte play in any of the games. He's always a good defender, and sometimes he'll get really hot on offense. Inexplicably, Westphal will pull him out. Donte will re-enter later in the game, but by then he's already off and can't shoot at all.
GeraldWallace#3
Bench
That is the stupidest thing I've heard in a while....Do you even watch the games? Donte is the best defender we have plain and simple, we give him the challenge of putting him on Kobe Lebron ect. and most of the time he does a great job at it.
I don't know where your getting this whole "bust" idea from. The kid had a horrible horrible coaching staff in his rookie year, and this season he changed it all, I just don't understand how you can call a 21 year old kid who has gone from chucker to a very very good defender a "bust".
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Win now thinking/pressure with the awful streak, adn I think to prove the Kevin/Reke thing works. And frankly this: there is limited room for a Casspi or Donte to shine alongside Kevin and Reke. Very difficult to get your touches, highly unlikely you're going to score 20. The old roleplayers understand better how to be roleplayers and contribute without many touches. At least in theory (Noc having taken the opposite route to maximizing his touches simply by shooting it every time it touches hsi ahnd).
rainmaker
Hall of Famer
You couldn't be more incorrect. This is one of the more surprising statements I have ever seen on this forum. Donte is anything but a bust, and might have more raw talent than anyone on our team not named Tyreke. Labeling Donte a bust was surprising enough, until you followed it up with that comment about us being a better team with Ime.
You're right, Ime isn't a 33 yr old declining player. He's a 32 yr old declining player, who's best days are far behind him. You either a) have not watched this team play once this season, or b) when you do watch, have no idea what you're looking at.
Don't you think the coaching staff knows when Donte has played well on defense. They sit closer than I do. Aren't they the ones that know what is good defense? Donte's playing time is going to continue to be as consistent as he is. It's going to be off and on.
Donte is not a bust. But he is not good enough to play the minutes he has. I hope he keeps getting his chances to improve but I'll go with the coaches here.
Donte is not a bust. But he is not good enough to play the minutes he has. I hope he keeps getting his chances to improve but I'll go with the coaches here.
King Baller
All-Star
Donte has had some very good games defending the leagues best big guards and small forwards. WHEN he gets stronger and bigger as he works hard and matures he will be able to defend your AK47's and Milsap's, he is not yet able to defend your PF type player.
The Jazz are paying AK and Milsap all that money for a reason, they are GOOD
As we all saw the Jazz had enough to beat the Kings even without Deron and Boozer.
The Kings Bigs, JT, Hawes, Donte and Brockman are all very young by NBA standards. During this rebuilding time they are going to get schooled by NBA vets like Milsap. They may learn from it, develop and grow. Or, they may not But either way its not a coaching problem.
KB
The Jazz are paying AK and Milsap all that money for a reason, they are GOOD
As we all saw the Jazz had enough to beat the Kings even without Deron and Boozer.The Kings Bigs, JT, Hawes, Donte and Brockman are all very young by NBA standards. During this rebuilding time they are going to get schooled by NBA vets like Milsap. They may learn from it, develop and grow. Or, they may not
But either way its not a coaching problem.KB
FaStRmAn
Starter
I prefer Paul Westphal to the 2 previous coaches the Kings had. PW is a bona fide NBA coach. He has the experience and has had success coaching in the NBA. He has a young team that he has to teach the game to while still trying to win games in the NBA. That is a difficult balancing act. At times, his substitution patterns have looked helter skelter, but there are a lot of factors that go into a coaches decisions regarding who plays and who sits. Injuries, players not playing well, players playing well, too many players at the same position, not enough players at some positions. You would have to be the coach to know ALL the factors that go into the decisions made during a game or why a starting lineup card is filled out a certain way.
Matchups are huge in the NBA. Most games are decided because of matchups or mismatches. As a coach you have to take all these factors and come up with a gameplan that can work that night. It seems like a very difficult job. Theus was terrible at it. Kenny Knatt was terrible at it. Westphal IMHO has done a pretty good job of teaching the young players, dealing with injured players either coming or going off the injured list, working out a gameplan with matchups and mismatches, and oh yea...finding the right combination to win games in the NBA.
I am sure that once this team the Kings have now start to play together and get familiar with each others games, this team will start playing more competitively. Then people wont be trying to dissect what the coach is trying to do or why he plays one guy and not another. Winning just kinda makes those things unimportant. I like the way PW has given certain players more time on the court than they have probably earned to try and teach a young player in a game situation. I'm sure that other players who should have gotten more time sat on the bench because another player was getting a live game lesson. But it is the end results that matter. How this team finishes the year and how they are playing at the end of this year is the most important thing. Westphal has worked with the pieces he has been given and done pretty good considering all the factors involved. He might not be the coach to get this team to the finals, but he is the coach we need now with the youth on this team.
Matchups are huge in the NBA. Most games are decided because of matchups or mismatches. As a coach you have to take all these factors and come up with a gameplan that can work that night. It seems like a very difficult job. Theus was terrible at it. Kenny Knatt was terrible at it. Westphal IMHO has done a pretty good job of teaching the young players, dealing with injured players either coming or going off the injured list, working out a gameplan with matchups and mismatches, and oh yea...finding the right combination to win games in the NBA.
I am sure that once this team the Kings have now start to play together and get familiar with each others games, this team will start playing more competitively. Then people wont be trying to dissect what the coach is trying to do or why he plays one guy and not another. Winning just kinda makes those things unimportant. I like the way PW has given certain players more time on the court than they have probably earned to try and teach a young player in a game situation. I'm sure that other players who should have gotten more time sat on the bench because another player was getting a live game lesson. But it is the end results that matter. How this team finishes the year and how they are playing at the end of this year is the most important thing. Westphal has worked with the pieces he has been given and done pretty good considering all the factors involved. He might not be the coach to get this team to the finals, but he is the coach we need now with the youth on this team.
xrzn
Starter
Against Nuggets: Playing too much JT in the 3rd when Brockman was rolling.
Can Westphail seriously draw up a play? In regulation, the ball is inbounding to Hawes about a foot within the 3 point line with his back facing the basket with about 3 seconds left. If he couldn't pass the ball, which he couldn't, wtf was he suppose to do?
And we all know Martin tries to draw the foul on every play, so why the hell is Westphail trying essentially "1-4 flat" with Martin? At least Reke would drive in and try and make the shot.
The #1 WTF has to be Donte Green. The guy starts the guy, plays really well, provided points and rebounds, and he gets shafted. I could've sworn Westphail had a lineup with both Beno and Sergio on the floor. He comes up with that crap but barely plays Donte.
Westphail has lost his touch.
Can Westphail seriously draw up a play? In regulation, the ball is inbounding to Hawes about a foot within the 3 point line with his back facing the basket with about 3 seconds left. If he couldn't pass the ball, which he couldn't, wtf was he suppose to do?
And we all know Martin tries to draw the foul on every play, so why the hell is Westphail trying essentially "1-4 flat" with Martin? At least Reke would drive in and try and make the shot.
The #1 WTF has to be Donte Green. The guy starts the guy, plays really well, provided points and rebounds, and he gets shafted. I could've sworn Westphail had a lineup with both Beno and Sergio on the floor. He comes up with that crap but barely plays Donte.
Westphail has lost his touch.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
Substitutions depend on a variety of factors. There are no absolutes in how to coach and how to substitute. There is no playbook like you would have everybody believe there is. It's about judgement. Reading the players, knowing how to motivate them, knowing when to pull them out or put them in. There is no good coaching by the numbers. Westphal, in the past few games is giving his horses more of a reign. Good for him. But that doesn't mean that he should have been doing that all along. It just means that his players were ready for more minutes, that he believes they have earned more freedom. Or, it may simply believe that he thinks his previous style was experiencing the law of diminishing returns.
Insomniacal Fan
Starter
Non-rotation players have become our biggest contributors in the past few games. Plus, Spence seems to be playing more aggressively since his starting position has been threatened. Complacency does seem to be a factor at play in our team's slump.
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