I'm not sure you understand how roster construction works.
Well, see you in a different uniform next season IT
- Thread starter HereWeBoogie
- Start date
Penetrating guard =/= penetrating point guard.
Also, how many of those teams had a low post threat like Cousins? Maybe only Portland, somewhat the Wizards with Nene. Chris Paul and Griffin are slightly different. Even the Spurs don't just throw it to Duncan most of the time - he gets his off ball movement. A recent cowbellkingdom article compared IT to Tony Parker. I would like to personally bet that IT will never ever be as successful a point guard as Parker. Sure, Parker benefited a lot from having the greatest PF ever on his team, but that's besides the point. Parker runs the best offense in the NBA to near perfection. IT barely gets guys easy looks. Difference is that Parker was coached well from the beginning, and was never allowed the free reign that IT has been given thus far in his early career in just chucking up shots.
And even that, I don't think a penetrating guard is that hard to find in the NBA, if all you're looking for is someone who can penetrate.
Big Cuz 15
All-Star
thats why letting reke go was a dumb move.
Big Cuz 15
All-Star
it's not a big 3, more like 2 and 1/8th
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Was just going to reinitialize that fight again, for that very reason. Duh.
Also BTW, you have to stretch the definition quite a way to get a three point chucker like Lillard in as "penetrating guard".
The thing about it is THE MODERN GAME HAS NOT CHANGED. Not in that regard. The key observation about basketball has ALWAYS been, you need somebody who can control the middle. Play inside out. Now there was a broadening of who that player could be, especially from the 80s onward in particular as ballhandlers got better. It didn't have to just be a big guy who started out inside. Now it could be a slashing guard/forward who started outside and slashed down inside. But despite the radical differences in play style, the essential underlying basketball spacing truths remained the same: you attack inside, you get higher percentage shots, it forces defenses to collapse thus opening up perimeter players for open shots, if you miss a shot its at the rim, hence short rebounds more likely to be corralled for offensive follows, and less likely to trigger long board fastbreaks. You draw fouls. Its all good. But its always been all good. Its not a modern phenomenon. there is a reason that people who fall in love with jumpshooting/jumpshooters annoy me so. That's not the sport we are watching.
MassachusettsKingsFan
All-Star
And because Ben McLemore is, in all honesty, one of the worst ball handlers / penetration guards in the league (if not THE worst starter) ... so much pressure goes on whoever this teams point guard is. He's the sole ball handler.
The team has committed so much time and energy on Ben. So much of their reputation is at stake (they loved him! best player in the draft!) they will be stubborn as hell to make it work, and if it doesn't you're looking at years of poor shooting guard play before they call it a bust.
Of course, Ben could get better. That would be nice.
The team has committed so much time and energy on Ben. So much of their reputation is at stake (they loved him! best player in the draft!) they will be stubborn as hell to make it work, and if it doesn't you're looking at years of poor shooting guard play before they call it a bust.
Of course, Ben could get better. That would be nice.
HighFlyingMonkey
Starter
I'm not entirely sure you understand the point. If Rudy and Cousins are your foundation, you need to have a penetrating guard, either at SG or PG.
Well, duh.
But Ben McLemore is not a penetrator. So if you want to replace Isaiah with a non-penetrating type, you're going to have to replace Ben too.
Well, I've been on the record as pro-Keep-Reke, but unfortunately we didn't. Letting Isaiah go without a replacement lined up would be a similar mistake.
Yes, Lillard gets his 20/6 on 5 FTs per game just hanging out on the perimeter
HereWeBoogie
Hall of Famer
Was this posted in here yet? An interview with IT about his free agency from Cowbell Kingdom.
http://cowbellkingdom.com/2014/05/22/isaiah-thomas-discusses-his-pending-nba-free-agency/
One part that caught my attention, where he calls himself a score-first PG. I guess he wont be working on being more of a distributor.....
http://cowbellkingdom.com/2014/05/22/isaiah-thomas-discusses-his-pending-nba-free-agency/
One part that caught my attention, where he calls himself a score-first PG. I guess he wont be working on being more of a distributor.....
Dreadnought
Bench
Score first PG? Sigh.
Did you happen to catch the first part of the interview where he shows support for Sacramento at the council meeting arena vote? Or how about where he said he's looking to improve his game in all aspects?
Of course you didn't, you only focus on something that can be perceived as "negative" and then make a stupid, biased conclusion off that perceived "negative" comment.
ShastaKingsFan
All-Star
and he wants to prove people wrong about him not being a starting PG. I think the writing is on the wall for where this is heading...
It's the right decision for him and he is rightly selling himself on that point. No sense in selling himself as something he's not. I have no problem with that, I just don't want him on our team.
HereWeBoogie
Hall of Famer
lol
Or, you could try to not be derivative, and see if something else might work. For all the rhetoric about how "everybody's doing it," it's not like you see a whole lot of penetrating guards starting on championship teams. In fact, there have only been three since 2002 (the last time Kobe Bryant could be reasonably described as a penetrating guard), and one of them (Rondo) was penetrating to pass. Not only do teams with starting guards who play like Thomas not win in the Finals, they virtually never even get to the Finals. He's pretty much said that he doesn't want to come off the bench, at least not here, so unless your plan is to build the entire team around him, a la Philadelphia in 2001, it's probably best for everybody involved if he gets the money he's earned from somewhere else.
Pretty much, yeah.Yes, Lillard gets his 20/6 on 5 FTs per game just hanging out on the perimeter
Here's the career average distance (in feet) per FGA of some of the notable penetrating guards in this year's playoffs:
Dwyane Wade: 10.2
Russell Westbrook: 10.8
Jeff Teague: 10.8
Tony Parker: 10.3
Lillard's career average distance per FGA is 15.6 feet. Additionally, 55.5 percent of his shots came from outside of sixteen feet this season. Now, you might not personally want to classify him as a "perimeter guard" but, going by those numbers... If I may borrow a British idiom, he's as close to a non-penetrating guard as makes no odds.
Also, what's supposed to be the significance of 20/6 and 5 FTA? James Harden averaged 25/6, and 9 FTA, and I hope you're not classifying him as as a penetrating guard?
theclash4u5
Starter
So IT was on the radio with Grant today, and no matter how Grant phrased it and tried to give him questions to make him look like the good guy, he just kept saying "in the end it's a business and I'm going to do what's best for me and my family". I don't know if the interview is online yet, but listen to it if you can. Grant asks him a few questions that IT clearly holds back on and then answers the normal "it's a business and...."
K
KingMilz
Guest
I didn't hear the interview but maybe IT himself would not mind getting out of Sacramento that's another possiblilty. If you think about it guy's his size are easy to replace and there value depreciates much faster with age than compared to bigger players so for him it would be a smart move to try get the most he can anywhere.
End of the day championships and winning is great but you got the rest of your life to think about and it's more important you set that up first imo, in particular when you are a midget playing in league where the average height is 6'6.
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I don't really think anybody is questioning whether IT will chase the money. Of course he will. He's not giving us any hometown discount. The question is whether he's going to get an offer sheet big enough we don't care to match it.
King Baller
All-Star
I like IT and I hope he gets a ton of money. Personally after watching the Pacers in the Playoffs I think he would be a fantastic sixth man in Indy.
Nikolizzle
G-League
I agree.
Offer sheet? I thought he was unrestricted?
Nor should he. He's toe to toe with Chandler Parsons as the best contracts/production in the NBA the past 3 seasons. Both guy deserve to get paid.
No, IT is restricted. What gave you the idea he wasn't?
Apparently basketball-reference does not list any qualifying offers (check other RFAs this year like Eric Bledsoe).
Hoopshype has it wrong. It's possible that they have removed the QO value because it is a special case (see below).
Shamsports has it, but actually has the value of the QO wrong. (http://data.shamsports.com/content/pages/data/salaries/kings.jsp)
The CBA FAQ will verify that Thomas will be an RFA:
Thomas, having been in the league for three seasons, is eligible for restricted free agency. However, his QO is not the standard QO:
This means that IT's QO will be either $2.725M or $3.27M, depending on whether the "qualifying offer applicable to the 21st pick" applies to the 100% scale salary or the 120% scale salary. It doesn't really matter, because at either price we will tender that offer.
S
SacKings2002NBAChampions
Guest
So, Ranadive sent IT to India to market and promote the Kings/NBA as well as doing some charity work. Ranadive and PDA up to some tricks. I think they're planning on keeping on IT and uses this opportunity to convince IT to stay and will probably convince him to stay for a nice cheap price of 6-7 million.
Hopefully once we resign him, we can bench him.
Hopefully once we resign him, we can bench him.
K
KingMilz
Guest
6-7 million is not cheap imo 3-4 is cheap
S
SacKings2002NBAChampions
Guest
For a player like IT, 3-4 million would be an insult.
He's getting minimum 6 million. I'm pretty sure IT's argument is that if we can pay players like JT, Landry, and D-Will in 6 mill range then we can do afford him at least that. I personal think he'll get 7 mill and max 8 mill but that's overpaying him or matching a desperate offer. At that point, I rather let him walk. Would rather pickup an extra second rounder that could be next IT for another 3-4 years
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