Showtime
Starter
*ahem*
We need Kevin back (merged)
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Showtime
Starter
The point of this thread was to show that Martin is needed to close out these close games. The Kings don't need more talent to win these games, they just need to execute with the capable talent they already have, and they win. Choking is no excuse.
I don't see where we're in opposition in this. I was actually agreeing with you.
Entity
Hall of Famer
Noc has been stellar of late in all aspects. (sarcasm) don't know about everybody else or do I care. I will be glad to see 23 on the court. I just don't trust anybody with the ball right now other than Evans. Everybody is so inconsistant. I want somebody that can't bury teams when we are up by 7. Sombody that if he gets fouled I don't chew off 3 fingernails hoping he makes 1-2.
VF i like that sig. Not sure when Brick said it but its true. WHEN Tyreke gets that jumper down he could make grown men cry.
VF i like that sig. Not sure when Brick said it but its true. WHEN Tyreke gets that jumper down he could make grown men cry.
Aenadin
Starter
would love to see him make laker fans cry
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PoundForPound
Guest
so any word on when kevin is coming back?
Jeez, no wonder you can't spell Martin without MRI.
Jeez, no wonder you can't spell Martin without MRI.
Nighthawk1
Starter
so Any Word On When Kevin Is Coming Back?
Jeez, No Wonder You Can't Spell Martin Without Mri.
Lmao :d
IDidntDoDat
Bench
so any word on when kevin is coming back?
Jeez, no wonder you can't spell Martin without MRI.
Late January, is what I heard
Arco Thunder
Bench
I'm really getting excited about the thought (contrary to what some may feel) as I can't wait to see Kevin and Tyreke out there together! Late January can't come soon enough!!
T4L3NT3D530
G-League
i bet we see him early january... just a feeling.
nickmcclure
Bench
word up! A Martin/Evans backcourt should be awesome.
Chupacabra
Starter
Im waiting for the few people to chime in with, " I dont think Evans and Martin can coexist. They both dominate the basketball. Im worried the other team will put their point guard on Martin thus totally taking away Tyrekes game with their shooting guard..." or something along those lines.
Emma
Starter
Can't happen. Martin is taller, faster, great off the ball. If PG's had to chase him around he'd dump in 35 a night.
The real concern is the team effort it takes to free up Martin, and the lack of team effort it takes to give Evans the ball and just let him go. The two schemes don't really co-exist.
Actually, Martin is pretty good at getting away from defenders, especially if they underestimate his quickness. Always has been.
Personally, I'm intrigued by the problems having Martin and Evans out there at the same time might create for opponents. They double Martin - which they'll need to do at times - and they risk leaving the interior open, and we know what Evans can do with that. They double Evans, and they're running the risk of leaving Martin open on the perimeter... If Casspi continues to show ability to shoot as well, defending against the Kings offense just got a lot tougher. And that's not even mentioning JT inside, or (knock on wood) a return of the Spencer Hawes we saw briefly with the ability to play out of the low post and make the half-hook shot.
I do NOT want to see the Kings get into the mind set of "the lack of team effort it takes to give Evans the ball and just let him go"... that's not the Kings style of play and I cringe every time I think of it. We want crisp passing, good cutting, pick and rolls, and a variety of offensive schemes, not sole reliance on the skills of Evans. We put too much emphasis on him and we're dead in the water once teams really truly start to focus in on him - especially the good defensive teams.
The guy you responded to wasn't being serious. He was trying to be funny in response to the guy above him.
When that happens the game will still be 5 on 5 and Martin will be even more necessary to a balanced, winning team.
kingsnation
All-Star
I dont understand those that make it like Martin needs to be the star, or that martin needs to dominate the ball. Martin would score 25 pts in like 10 shots a game. he does not need the ball, and I have not seen anything from him that would make me think his ego would be a problem.
We have seena few teams start to just sag their defense in the lane to keep Tyreke from blowing past his man for a layup. I love the thought of teams doing that with Martin sitting there on the 3 pts line with no defender near him.
Not only do I think that Martin and reke can play together, they will play together soon, so all of our bantering will be moot. Kind of hilarious to me that people somehow think getting rid of a 25 ppg scorer will make our team better. Not only that, but he scores those big numbers on very few shots with high percentage.
Martin should be an even better player now that word is out in this league that Tyreke will attack the rim and FINISH. I for one cant wait for Martin to return.
Good time to be a Kings fan. Makes those last 3 years worth it
We have seena few teams start to just sag their defense in the lane to keep Tyreke from blowing past his man for a layup. I love the thought of teams doing that with Martin sitting there on the 3 pts line with no defender near him.
Not only do I think that Martin and reke can play together, they will play together soon, so all of our bantering will be moot. Kind of hilarious to me that people somehow think getting rid of a 25 ppg scorer will make our team better. Not only that, but he scores those big numbers on very few shots with high percentage.
Martin should be an even better player now that word is out in this league that Tyreke will attack the rim and FINISH. I for one cant wait for Martin to return.
Good time to be a Kings fan. Makes those last 3 years worth it
When that happens the game will still be 5 on 5 and it be even more important to have Martin back to have a balanced and winning team.
kennadog
Dog On It!
He'll make grown men cry and get his teammates even more easy baskets.
Ide give reke and martin 15 games, if we go 5-15 with martin back in the lineup I'm done with him, he's the best bait we have to trade for a good center. Otherwise if we go 15-5 I'm all for waiting till draft or free agency to land a center. Lastly statistically I want reke to finish 20-5-5 I feel martin mite ruin that feat.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
I dont understand those that make it like Martin needs to be the star, or that martin needs to dominate the ball. Martin would score 25 pts in like 10 shots a game. he does not need the ball, and I have not seen anything from him that would make me think his ego would be a problem.
We have seena few teams start to just sag their defense in the lane to keep Tyreke from blowing past his man for a layup. I love the thought of teams doing that with Martin sitting there on the 3 pts line with no defender near him.
Not only do I think that Martin and reke can play together, they will play together soon, so all of our bantering will be moot. Kind of hilarious to me that people somehow think getting rid of a 25 ppg scorer will make our team better. Not only that, but he scores those big numbers on very few shots with high percentage.
Martin should be an even better player now that word is out in this league that Tyreke will attack the rim and FINISH. I for one cant wait for Martin to return.
Good time to be a Kings fan. Makes those last 3 years worth it
After you have watched the league for a while you begin to notice certain patterns.
There is a reason that Kobe's backcourt mates have been Derek Fisher, Smush Parker, old man Ron Harper. There is a reason that DWade's have been JWill, Chalmers etc. That Jordan's were BJ Armstrong, Paxson, Harper etc. There's also a reason why Brandon Roy, a step down from those guys, seems to work better with Steve Blake, a borderline scrub, than Andre Miller, a longtime starting quality PG. Same reason A.I. worked best with Snow. Ball dominant, to the hoop, superstar quality guards really need that backcourt mostly to themselves. And lest we get into the that's not a good thing/we don't like that/we're going to reinvent the wheel spiral of duhness, let me note that the above list comprises 11 of the last 19 championship teams. Yes we absolutely want Reke to get to that level if he can. And if it means he can only play with roleplayers in the backcourt, so be it. That strategy has won and won some more in this league.
And even if you want to wiggle, try to say well Reke's a PG, not a SG, well:
a) the position is not really relelvenat, its gamestyle that matters.
b) Reke as a rookie is already as offensively dominant as almost any fo the great scoring PGs over the years. He's 20 5 and 5 at age 20. Payton was 31 before he averaged more than 21.8. KJs top two years were 22.5 and 22.2 in a run n gun system. Tim Hardaway's were 22.9 and 22.4, and that was playing Nellie ball. Penny Hardway's peak was 21.7. Today of course you have Chris Paul at 21-23ppg. And by the time you try to go back and evoke Isiah Thomas or Nate Archibald in their prime, or the Big O from a completely different era, you have really flown far far away in terms of size, playing style, the very rules of the game. There is almost no comparison.
c) of course all of the above players, with the possible exception fo Penny, were pure PGs, Reke is a PG, but has combo in him
d) and even after you do all that work, about the best you come up wiht is a series of 15-17ppg wingmen next to them -- Kendall Gill/Hersey Hawkins, Dan Majerle, Nick Anderson, old Peja. The only real counterexample being Run TMC over two decades ago, playing Nellie ball. And do you think that the numbers of guys playing for Golden State right now mean anything for the rest of the teams?
I set aside until now one pertinent case. Pertinent because Geoff Petrie is our GM. That would be the Clyde Drexler/Terry Porter pairing in Portland. Good backcourt. But frankly one that has a lot more similarity to Reke/Beno than Reke/Kevin. And again, the second player in the pairing, who was Porter, the putative PG, averaged about 17 for most of it (13.1 on low end, 18.1 on high end). Was 17ppg what you had in mind for our 11mil SG? And one of the reasons it worked was becuase Porter and Drexler split PG duties. Neither guy was a selfish one dimensional scorer. They both averaged 6+ assists a night, with the superstar often averaging more than his PG. Upsde being that no matter which of them had the ball there was a chance for their teammates to get involved. There was Bibby/Christie in it. Reke/Beno. Two creaters, not one.
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Kings Faithful
Starter
The way Tyreke plays, and the fact that he is our PG and is forced to touch the ball, will prevent his numbers from going down. Martins might go down slightly because he is no longer our only offensive option, but I still expect him to score 20+ a night. Evans assists might actually go up because Martin can actually finish layups unlike the rest of our team.
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PoundForPound
Guest
Will Kevin Martin's return help or hurt this team?
This team is playing with oozing chemistry and passion right now, led by a marvelous rookie in Tyreke Evans. Now, we know what Kevin Martin is about. Dominating the ball, this guy can score 30 on any given night. That fact, however, has also never really translated into winning with this team. This is what makes Evans' that much more impressive. What he's doing is great; 20 points, 5 rebounds, 5 assists. What is more intriguing, however, is that he's doing it in winning fashion. The point being that this team is winning ball games, given that it has been a group effort. So as we get to my point, is Kevin Martin's return really going to help this team? You can view this subject in two different ways. First, his scoring ability is going to come in great handy when we go through those droughts during games where the offense becomes stagnant and baskets are hard to come by, taking pressure off of Tyreke. On the other hand, K-Mart is a liability on defense, there is no argument against that. His nonphysical presence on that end of the floor could hurt Sacramento more than help them. I'm not saying he doesn't fit on this team, but when have you ever seen K-Mart diving on the floor for loose balls? Also, back to when I talked about K-Mart taking pressure off of Evans, some might argue that Tyreke actually thrives off of that pressure. Time and time again we have seen him come through in the clutch with game winning plays. So what do you guys think about all this?
This team is playing with oozing chemistry and passion right now, led by a marvelous rookie in Tyreke Evans. Now, we know what Kevin Martin is about. Dominating the ball, this guy can score 30 on any given night. That fact, however, has also never really translated into winning with this team. This is what makes Evans' that much more impressive. What he's doing is great; 20 points, 5 rebounds, 5 assists. What is more intriguing, however, is that he's doing it in winning fashion. The point being that this team is winning ball games, given that it has been a group effort. So as we get to my point, is Kevin Martin's return really going to help this team? You can view this subject in two different ways. First, his scoring ability is going to come in great handy when we go through those droughts during games where the offense becomes stagnant and baskets are hard to come by, taking pressure off of Tyreke. On the other hand, K-Mart is a liability on defense, there is no argument against that. His nonphysical presence on that end of the floor could hurt Sacramento more than help them. I'm not saying he doesn't fit on this team, but when have you ever seen K-Mart diving on the floor for loose balls? Also, back to when I talked about K-Mart taking pressure off of Evans, some might argue that Tyreke actually thrives off of that pressure. Time and time again we have seen him come through in the clutch with game winning plays. So what do you guys think about all this?
T4L3NT3D530
G-League
I'd like to think Kevin is smart enough to step down from "leader" of this team. He never wanted to be there and is probably happy we now have someone that can lead. What kevin needs to do to help this team be even more successful than it has been, is return to 2006-2007 form. He used to average 15-18 ppg on like 9 shots. If that Kevin can return, this will work out.
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PoundForPound
Guest
Yes, we will spread the floor, but think about his weakness on the defensive end, though, guys. I'd like to see what you guys think about that aspect of helping this team.
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