what he said.
Tyreke Evans offered Qualifying Offer making him a Restricted Free Agent
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what he said.
Dime Dropper
All-Star
If this is NOT a smokescreen, then it just deserves a face palm of epic proportions. I'm going to wait and see what happens, however. I can't believe the new ownership/FO would be that dumb.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Just got an email from the Kings for a Draft Day party at Sleep Train, and this was included:
•Appearances by Kings great Mike Bibby and current Kings players Isaiah Thomas and Tyreke Evans
Which again just goes along with a pattern we've seen throughout. Tyreke is there at the Stay rally, he's there smiling and talking to Coach Malone last week. His brothers are tweeting Kings for life stuff. He's being trotted out for the draft day party. That just does not feel to me like somebody the Kings or Tyreke is thinking may be gone in a week, unless there is a significant left hand not knowing what the right hand is doing dynamic going on in the organization right now.
•Appearances by Kings great Mike Bibby and current Kings players Isaiah Thomas and Tyreke Evans
Which again just goes along with a pattern we've seen throughout. Tyreke is there at the Stay rally, he's there smiling and talking to Coach Malone last week. His brothers are tweeting Kings for life stuff. He's being trotted out for the draft day party. That just does not feel to me like somebody the Kings or Tyreke is thinking may be gone in a week, unless there is a significant left hand not knowing what the right hand is doing dynamic going on in the organization right now.
Uncia03
Starter
I think this could be one of those times that a group might 'outsmart themselves.
I have been very happy with what has gone on over the last month or so. I like everything I've been hearing from Malone and DA about our roster and what they want to do to build a winning basketball team. (Defense, building around your talent, ect.)
If I recall, I believe that Ranadive mentioned that DA seemed to have a good grasp of how to best work with the cap, especially for a small market team.
I truly believe that they are putting this out there with the hopes that some team will come in and offer Tyreke a 4/32 million a year contract, that they can easily match.
Now, would I like to have Tyreke locked up for 4 years at 8 million a year? Of course!
That would be a mind-boggling good price for Tyreke.
So why do I say that they could be 'outsmarting themselves'?
Well...it's because though it's a great contract it doesn't account for the 'human' factor of the situation. And that human factor includes things such as Tyreke not truly believing that the FO wants him...or allowing Tyreke to begin thinking about other opportunities on specific teams. It's not enough to just have a player on contract...especially as important a player as Tyreke would figure to be on this roster. You want someone like him to be fully engaged in the organization...understanding that the organization is engaged and devoted to him as well.
I'd rather have a supremely motivated and engaged Tyreke at 9 million a year, then a dis-engaged Tyreke at 7.5-8.5 million a year.
From a pure data stand-point...getting Tyreke at a bargain basement price that you just match is a great idea. I'm a data guy...I love analytics...but you don't just win by the numbers...there is a human component that has to be accounted for if you're going to get the most out of your investment.
I have been very happy with what has gone on over the last month or so. I like everything I've been hearing from Malone and DA about our roster and what they want to do to build a winning basketball team. (Defense, building around your talent, ect.)
If I recall, I believe that Ranadive mentioned that DA seemed to have a good grasp of how to best work with the cap, especially for a small market team.
I truly believe that they are putting this out there with the hopes that some team will come in and offer Tyreke a 4/32 million a year contract, that they can easily match.
Now, would I like to have Tyreke locked up for 4 years at 8 million a year? Of course!
That would be a mind-boggling good price for Tyreke.
So why do I say that they could be 'outsmarting themselves'?
Well...it's because though it's a great contract it doesn't account for the 'human' factor of the situation. And that human factor includes things such as Tyreke not truly believing that the FO wants him...or allowing Tyreke to begin thinking about other opportunities on specific teams. It's not enough to just have a player on contract...especially as important a player as Tyreke would figure to be on this roster. You want someone like him to be fully engaged in the organization...understanding that the organization is engaged and devoted to him as well.
I'd rather have a supremely motivated and engaged Tyreke at 9 million a year, then a dis-engaged Tyreke at 7.5-8.5 million a year.
From a pure data stand-point...getting Tyreke at a bargain basement price that you just match is a great idea. I'm a data guy...I love analytics...but you don't just win by the numbers...there is a human component that has to be accounted for if you're going to get the most out of your investment.
HereWeBoogie
Hall of Famer
Tyreke has been at pretty much every fan event there has been since he was drafted here. he loves the fans and loves Sac
rainmaker
Hall of Famer
I don't see how this would be any kind of a successful smokescreen, and do you guys think Vivek/PDA are really using CD as a smokescreen? I guess it's possible.
But, telling the league you won't match invites a bidding war. It's the opposite of saying we'll match any offer, which could also be a smokescreen but one meant to deter competition. What this does, telling everyone you won't go above 7M or three years tells other teams to start talking to him and offering him a contract, which while it might start out low, say 8M per year, rises due to competition and the possible belief we won't match if they offer 10, 11 or more. Then, you either lose him for nothing without matching, or match and bring back a Reke who's already likely visited, been woo'd by and pictures himself with a new team, new coach, new city, etc, and likely isn't happy coming back as you already showed what you thought of him with your initial offer. And if he talks to other teams and signs for 10/11/12 and we don't match, well, you likely never found out if you could get him for 9-10 because you lowballed him right off the bat and then told him to go talk to other teams.
And if the plan is to lock him up the first week of July with a decent contract, I see no point in this type of a smokescreen, the opposite(we'll match anything) would actually make more sense.
To believe this is a smokescreen and that was the intent, you'd have to believe telling the league you won't match anything above 7M will deter competition, which I really don't see as likely, at all.
And personally, if I'm in a situation where the team shows they don't value me much and tells me to go find an offer and they'll match, I wouldn't be happy with negotiating with another team, picturing myself there and having my team who doesn't value me much threaten to simply match, and to counter that I reject all offers and leave unrestricted next year. That's a wildcard no one has brought up, that if Reke feels insulted by 7M per and/or is told to try to find a better deal and we'll possibly match, then just play out the year and not have that threat next year. It's not like he could be used any worse than Smart used him and his value will plummet even more.
But, telling the league you won't match invites a bidding war. It's the opposite of saying we'll match any offer, which could also be a smokescreen but one meant to deter competition. What this does, telling everyone you won't go above 7M or three years tells other teams to start talking to him and offering him a contract, which while it might start out low, say 8M per year, rises due to competition and the possible belief we won't match if they offer 10, 11 or more. Then, you either lose him for nothing without matching, or match and bring back a Reke who's already likely visited, been woo'd by and pictures himself with a new team, new coach, new city, etc, and likely isn't happy coming back as you already showed what you thought of him with your initial offer. And if he talks to other teams and signs for 10/11/12 and we don't match, well, you likely never found out if you could get him for 9-10 because you lowballed him right off the bat and then told him to go talk to other teams.
And if the plan is to lock him up the first week of July with a decent contract, I see no point in this type of a smokescreen, the opposite(we'll match anything) would actually make more sense.
To believe this is a smokescreen and that was the intent, you'd have to believe telling the league you won't match anything above 7M will deter competition, which I really don't see as likely, at all.
And personally, if I'm in a situation where the team shows they don't value me much and tells me to go find an offer and they'll match, I wouldn't be happy with negotiating with another team, picturing myself there and having my team who doesn't value me much threaten to simply match, and to counter that I reject all offers and leave unrestricted next year. That's a wildcard no one has brought up, that if Reke feels insulted by 7M per and/or is told to try to find a better deal and we'll possibly match, then just play out the year and not have that threat next year. It's not like he could be used any worse than Smart used him and his value will plummet even more.
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HndsmCelt
Hall of Famer
I am skeptical of the whole story. One of the basic rues of business is that you do not loose assets. If the team has a cap they do not wish to spend on Evans, then why advertise it? If they want to do a sign and trade then why not say so to get interest? And on the PR side why spend so much time getting Evan to appear at PR events, and hand out #13 jerseys all around? They even have him ppearing with Bibby and IT at the Draft night party. Mark my words a HAPPY Evans will be playing in Sacramento this season.
Mojo
G-League
Negotiations can begin on July 1st and then contracts can be signed and become official on July 10th.
Bballkingsrock
All-Star
Agree with everything you wrote, but Carmichael Dave, who usually is MONEY with reports, said these tweets:
"Hearing that the Kings will NOT match any increased offers on Tyreke Evans, if they materialize.As it stands, they are prepared to lose him."
"That doesn't mean they are necessarily shopping Evans or committed to life without him,just simply that he's there if a team increases offer"
"Same sources also say Evans wouldn't exactly be upset if he left Sacramento either. Wouldn't mind fresh start."
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
yeah, those tweets were discussed earlier in the thread.
One note, which I mentioned there, CD's moneyness is a fairly recent phenomenon surround the fight to keep the Kings. Over the years he's rarely shown much insight as to roster decisions. But of course with the organization all scrambled/new now, who knows who is sources are. Could be Vivek himself. Could be Peaches and his poison. Just impossible to tell. All I'm pointing out is that Dave's tweets pretty much fly in the face of all the other indicators we've had about the situation. So stack of indicators one side. Dave's tweets on the other. Guess we'll see.
Gary
All-Star
Shoot.. Even I know that you sign him for 4/28...
Kingsfan23
All-Star
ditto
Gary
All-Star
Who knows what the front office is thinking. 4/28 is a deal to me considering I would go as high as 4/38.
Playing devils advocate... Maybe they feel that IT/MT can cover Reke's spot? Last two seasons the Kings are 11-9 without Evans. The year prior the Kings were 6-19 without Evans but that was without IT and for the most part MT.
So who knows what they're thinking. Personally I would love to re-sign Evans as long as they keep him at SG. I think we are a better team when he plays SG and I feel with a pass first PG that can shoot when needed (ahem Burke) Evans could flourish and get a lot more open looks rather than having to always create for himself like he's doing now. That also puts IT on the bench where he could become a change of pace guard and spot starter if needed. As for MT, he would be trade bait, and/or the 4th guard.
Playing devils advocate... Maybe they feel that IT/MT can cover Reke's spot? Last two seasons the Kings are 11-9 without Evans. The year prior the Kings were 6-19 without Evans but that was without IT and for the most part MT.
So who knows what they're thinking. Personally I would love to re-sign Evans as long as they keep him at SG. I think we are a better team when he plays SG and I feel with a pass first PG that can shoot when needed (ahem Burke) Evans could flourish and get a lot more open looks rather than having to always create for himself like he's doing now. That also puts IT on the bench where he could become a change of pace guard and spot starter if needed. As for MT, he would be trade bait, and/or the 4th guard.
I have to disagree with this comment. There are lots of times when Dave just throws stuff out there. You need to read the rest of the thread. There are several problems with his "sources" and his assessment on this one.
Livinthedream
All-Star
The tweet where Dave says that the team would let Reke go so they can have a shot at Wiggins convinced me it couldn't be true. You don't let your 2nd best player go because you hope to win the lottery next year. CD is plugged into the city council, not this current front office. Neither is Napier. CD is either making this up, or running with some 3rd hand information because it fits his desire to have the Kings blow up the entire roster.
Agent23
Starter
He also believes the myth that this team plays better without Reke. I'm surprised how popular that idea actually is among Kings' fans. Reading all the negative comments about Reke on twitter and on Sactown Royalty is eye opening.
MassachusettsKingsFan
All-Star
CD is as good a source as any right now. And I know he's not a basketball guy, but he personally knows the Kings higher ups as well as anyone. Take everything with a grain of salt at this point, obviously, but it is alarming.
I agree with some of the other posters. Where I start to lose faith in the accuracy of his tweets are when he mentions playing for Wiggins and adding vets. For starters, you can't play for Wiggins. With or without Evans, we won't be a bottom 5 team next season. We weren't a bottom 5 team this season with Smart and the rest of this mess. We just aren't bad enough when you have teams like Orlando, Charlotte, Phoenix, etc. It's just not a sound plan, and I can't believe this FO would go for that. And then second, adding vets to the team will just make us better, making our shot at Wiggins go down the drain completely.
That being said, CD wouldn't just make it up. He wouldn't. He obviously got this information somewhere, it's just a matter of who that person was and what their motivation behind it was.
Needless to say, we are in no position to just let an asset like Tyreke Evan walk. Common sense says that.
I agree with some of the other posters. Where I start to lose faith in the accuracy of his tweets are when he mentions playing for Wiggins and adding vets. For starters, you can't play for Wiggins. With or without Evans, we won't be a bottom 5 team next season. We weren't a bottom 5 team this season with Smart and the rest of this mess. We just aren't bad enough when you have teams like Orlando, Charlotte, Phoenix, etc. It's just not a sound plan, and I can't believe this FO would go for that. And then second, adding vets to the team will just make us better, making our shot at Wiggins go down the drain completely.
That being said, CD wouldn't just make it up. He wouldn't. He obviously got this information somewhere, it's just a matter of who that person was and what their motivation behind it was.
Needless to say, we are in no position to just let an asset like Tyreke Evan walk. Common sense says that.
MassachusettsKingsFan
All-Star
That combo, along with the lack of defense the Kings have inside flies 100% against the 'defense first' attitude Malone and co. are trying to bring here. It would go completely against Malone's strengths as a coach. IT and MT would get destroyed every night. Killed.
Evans is the only guard under contract for next season that can defend, period. Even if you think he is just an average defender, IT, Jimmer, and MT are all undersized and below average. Even as a devils advocate point, I don't know how they could possibly be ok with that.
Gary
All-Star
It's going to take an awful lot of coaching to get the Kings from dead dead dead (and I mean dead) last in defense to a respectable level. Our team defense is just terrible.
Individual D = respectable - If the player has the ball we do a pretty decent job locking them down...
Team D = beyond terrible - Opp team member being guarded? Pass to another player because our off the ball team defense just gets lazy.
Individual D = respectable - If the player has the ball we do a pretty decent job locking them down...
Team D = beyond terrible - Opp team member being guarded? Pass to another player because our off the ball team defense just gets lazy.
Dumping Tyreke to tank for a slim chance of drafting Wiggins. Genius! I'm sure ultra-competetive Cousins will LOVE getting stomped on for an entire season. There's NO way this would end poorly for us. None. Not our franchise. We have great luck. No way we end up with no Tyreke, no Cousins, and the 4th pick.
Seriously though, I have strange faith in the new ownership. They won't Maloof this up.
Seriously though, I have strange faith in the new ownership. They won't Maloof this up.
ParniValjak
All-Star
But you are then making an assumption that there would be no competition between other teams to sign Tyreke which I don't think will be the case. This is not just between Kings and one other team interested in Tyreke, its between the kings and ALL other teams that are interested in him and there will be a "bidding" war between those teams.
Section 101
All-Star
Once again. There are few teams with cap space and most of them have PG/SG in place already. Plus they could be the ones drafting a guard early this year. So it's really Atlanta and Dallas (assuming they don't get Howard or CP3). Utah would have to let either Jefferson or Millsap walk to create cap space.
I'm sorry, but most of you are overvaluing Tyreke in my opinion. We will just disagree on this one, but with my eye test while watching the games, I said many times "Kings have to get rid of this guy". Like I said, his lay ups are cool and at times he looks like Mini-Lebron with his aggressive play at the rim. In my opinion, his problem is he doesn't play one position well. Stop blaming the coach, at some point, you have to blame the player. A coach can coach all day long, but it's up to the player to execute. I know many of you hate Grant, but he sees this stuff first hand. He has been consistent with one point that I agree with, at some point you have to stop looking at the coach and look at the player. He doesn't handle the ball well at the point position, doesn't shoot well enough to be a SG, and isn't tall enough to be the SF.
$7 to $8 million a year would be my tops too. I think people overvalue him because so many of the other Kings players are not good players. I think both Tyreke and Jennings are going to expect much more money then they will receive from around the league. The new salary cap started to effect decisions last year, but I think it will be more apparent this year.
Also, I really don't understand the argument that you need to overpay the player to make them happy. I've seen that argument here and with Cousins in other threads. I am a huge Redskins fan and if there is one thing I know, paying the player doesn't always work (Haynesworth, Deon Sanders, Bruce Smith, and all the other free agent signings they have made). If Tyreke wasn't motivated to improve his play during the first three years like Harden and Curry did, why would he now improve after you overpay him?
$7 to $8 million a year would be my tops too. I think people overvalue him because so many of the other Kings players are not good players. I think both Tyreke and Jennings are going to expect much more money then they will receive from around the league. The new salary cap started to effect decisions last year, but I think it will be more apparent this year.
Also, I really don't understand the argument that you need to overpay the player to make them happy. I've seen that argument here and with Cousins in other threads. I am a huge Redskins fan and if there is one thing I know, paying the player doesn't always work (Haynesworth, Deon Sanders, Bruce Smith, and all the other free agent signings they have made). If Tyreke wasn't motivated to improve his play during the first three years like Harden and Curry did, why would he now improve after you overpay him?
If you've resorted to defending Smart (vis a vis Grant), I don't know what to say.
I'm going in for an eye appointment today - pretty sure my vision will remain unchanged, but I'm pretty excited about maybe getting those transition lenses for my new glasses. You know, the ones that darken in the sun? I hear that they are much better now, which would be great because my allergies can get pretty bad in late spring/early summer, making it hard to wear contacts.
I'm going in for an eye appointment today - pretty sure my vision will remain unchanged, but I'm pretty excited about maybe getting those transition lenses for my new glasses. You know, the ones that darken in the sun? I hear that they are much better now, which would be great because my allergies can get pretty bad in late spring/early summer, making it hard to wear contacts.
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I'm not defending Smart, but I agree with one point. Don't just look at the coach, also look at the player. Tyreke isn't a big money player in this league. He hasn't improved enough over the past three years to earn it. I think you need to check your eyes, funny guy.
Dime Dropper
All-Star
You have ignored all the tangible evidence presented to you in favour of your very subjective (and clearly influenced by idiotic sources such as Grant) "eye-ball" test, in the process defending disastrous coaches such as Smart and, presumably, coaches before him like Westphal. At this point, I'll leave you with a genuine LOL and bow out of the discussion, because frankly, that's all your post deserves.
LOL
No problem. You are another person who only blames the coach because Tyreke hasn't improved his game. I was using Grant as my point of not just looking at the coach. I didn't use him as my reference for Tyreke's game. I don't even remember him being critical of Tyreke's game.
Obviously, people who know more about basketball about me are in agreement with me, or at least as CD reported. You shake your head at me, I shake my head at you defenders of a complacent Tyreke over the years. I expect players with his given talents to become better.
Continue to support him palming the ball way too often when the ball is in his hands, dribble into traffic at the wrong time, and shoot with an unnecessary slight fade away. That stuff is basketball 101. He should know that stuff by now. Not a big money player. I'm glad you guys aren't the GM.
Obviously, people who know more about basketball about me are in agreement with me, or at least as CD reported. You shake your head at me, I shake my head at you defenders of a complacent Tyreke over the years. I expect players with his given talents to become better.
Continue to support him palming the ball way too often when the ball is in his hands, dribble into traffic at the wrong time, and shoot with an unnecessary slight fade away. That stuff is basketball 101. He should know that stuff by now. Not a big money player. I'm glad you guys aren't the GM.
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