The PG Thread

T

The Hammer

All-Star
PGs PGs PGs!!!

Do we keep either of Collison or Lawson? Which one?

Does Mason surprise and challenge for starter spot or at least significant minutes?

Is Fox given the reigns to the team on opening day or does he draft behind a vet for half a season?


My answers:

I think we keep Collison on a reduced contract. We need familiarity/continuity, and he has on problem coming off the bench. I see a 2 yr/8m deal.

Mason will surprise. He's got a ton of experience being a floor general and running a team. Would not be surprised if he's the starter opening day. I mean I'd be surprised, but I wouldn't be surprised.

Eventually it will be Fox's team though. And I see Mason as an ideal 6th man sparkplug/ball handler off the bench. Could also fit will in a two PG lineup due to his impressive shooting.
 
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if you can get one of Lawson or Collison back on a short term deal, then I think you do it. Otherwise, roll with the rookies.
 
kingsboi said:
if you can get one of Lawson or Collison back on a short term deal, then I think you do it. Otherwise, roll with the rookies.
Click to expand...

I'd be happy with either on a short cheap contract. Lawson is likely the better deal financially. 1 yr vet min, 2nd yr team option.
 
Hammer, I like your answers. Collison or Lawson- whichever you can get. I'd prefer Lawson. We do need a potential vet started. I agree that Mason might be the first to be ready to start but that Fox is the eventual starter. No a bad deal for the Kings. Both are capable guys, Maso is he more experienced.
 
I would bring back Collison but I am not sure that he would come back at a reasonable contract. Collison would start for the time being, be a mentor for Fox and Mason and eventually step into the reserve role. Does that fit in with what Collison is looking for? Collison can also spend some time on the court with Fox and Mason playing off the ball. That is something that makes him a more attractive option than Lawson.

I don't want the Kings to spend a LOT of money on a PG. Collison at around $10 million per season on a 2-3 year deal would be OK with me. If Collison leaves then I would be looking for a solid veteran who is best as a backup but can be a starter on a rebuilding team. Someone like Nelson from Denver or someone of similar ink. The player has to be a good mentor and a great locker room guy like Collison and Temple are.
 
Čarolija said:
I would bring back Collison but I am not sure that he would come back at a reasonable contract. Collison would start for the time being, be a mentor for Fox and Mason and eventually step into the reserve role. Does that fit in with what Collison is looking for? Collison can also spend some time on the court with Fox and Mason playing off the ball. That is something that makes him a more attractive option than Lawson.

I don't want the Kings to spend a LOT of money on a PG. Collison at around $10 million per season on a 2-3 year deal would be OK with me. If Collison leaves then I would be looking for a solid veteran who is best as a backup but can be a starter on a rebuilding team. Someone like Nelson from Denver or someone of similar ink. The player has to be a good mentor and a great locker room guy like Collison and Temple are.
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http://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2017/06/22/darren-collison-on-the-drive-062217/

To paraphrase: Vlade has been doing an exceptional job moving team in right direction. Kings have a plan in place. Too many young players? Loves the fans. Players want to win and make the playoffs - that will play into his decision. Kings are trying to rebuild but have some guys that can win. Dave is a great coach that loves to win. If he came back he would likely be a mentor to a young player. If you respect the game and the way it should be played you should want to be a mentor. He's always going to be trying to help players get better. It's part of the job. He cannot talk to the team right now (until July 1). Was enlightened and encouraged in the exit interview with the team. He likes their vision. Players don't understand the love and support the city gives the team. You don't get that everywhere else in the NBA. The locker room moving forward looks to be good, will try to compete, good mix of young players. The team has been disfunctional for the last few years but is getting better after the all-star break. A good locker room is often underrated. Peja was one of his favorite vets - helped him out when he was younger. Important to have good vets to help the young players learn. Also discussed his draft experience.
 
Cn-YURSWYAEkER3.jpg
 
Warhawk said:
http://sacramento.cbslocal.com/2017/06/22/darren-collison-on-the-drive-062217/

To paraphrase: Vlade has been doing an exceptional job moving team in right direction. Kings have a plan in place. Too many young players? Loves the fans. Players want to win and make the playoffs - that will play into his decision. Kings are trying to rebuild but have some guys that can win. Dave is a great coach that loves to win. If he came back he would likely be a mentor to a young player. If you respect the game and the way it should be played you should want to be a mentor. He's always going to be trying to help players get better. It's part of the job. He cannot talk to the team right now (until July 1). Was enlightened and encouraged in the exit interview with the team. He likes their vision. Players don't understand the love and support the city gives the team. You don't get that everywhere else in the NBA. The locker room moving forward looks to be good, will try to compete, good mix of young players. The team has been disfunctional for the last few years but is getting better after the all-star break. A good locker room is often underrated. Peja was one of his favorite vets - helped him out when he was younger. Important to have good vets to help the young players learn. Also discussed his draft experience.
Click to expand...
I did listen to that but I am not sure if that view has changed somewhat because Kings drafted two PG and are raving about both of them. If it was one PG then sure I could see him staying but now that question might have a different answer!
 
When looking at Ty and Darren, I like them both well enough. From a strictly on court team production point of view, the offense seemed to stagnate more under Darren than Ty.

Collison hovered around the three point line looking for the play a lot more than Ty. Lawson seemed more willing to drive into the paint and collapse the defense than Darren when we needed something to happen.

Not expert analysis by any means, and I would be fine with either being retained.

We have a blank slate and cap room, I am pretty confident the FO is going to continue nailing this rebuild.
 
I think Ty Lawson would be more willing to take a reasonable contract to be a mentor to the young point guards. I would offer something around 2 year/$12-16 million contract.

I don't think DC is ready to take a reduced mentor role yet. I also like Lawson floor generalship and passing and lobs better.

If we can't get Lawson or DC to come back in the mentorship role, I may just roll with the rookies and temple at point guard.
 
Suicide King said:
When looking at Ty and Darren, I like them both well enough. From a strictly on court team production point of view, the offense seemed to stagnate more under Darren than Ty.

Collison hovered around the three point line looking for the play a lot more than Ty. Lawson seemed more willing to drive into the paint and collapse the defense than Darren when we needed something to happen.

Not expert analysis by any means, and I would be fine with either being retained.

We have a blank slate and cap room, I am pretty confident the FO is going to continue nailing this rebuild.
Click to expand...
Lawson still has that court case that might not even make him an option. Regardless, why I am in favor of Collison is simply because Collison can play off the ball which means that at times you can have Fox and Collison on the court at the same time as Collison has the ability to shoot the 3 and provide more spacing for Fox.

If you sign Lawson then playing him and Fox at the same time becomes troublesome and the spacing becomes terrible.

I think whoever ends up being the veteran PG on this team, the absolute must for me is thay they need to be able to shoot the 3 pretty well. Collison does that and there is the familiarity with the franchise which is another plus. Kings will run next season and I think Collison is suited better to that system than a half court offense.
 
ockingsfan said:
I think Ty Lawson would be more willing to take a reasonable contract to be a mentor to the young point guards. I would offer something around 2 year/$12-16 million contract.

I don't think DC is ready to take a reduced mentor role yet. I also like Lawson floor generalship and passing and lobs better.

If we can't get Lawson or DC to come back in the mentorship role, I may just roll with the rookies and temple at point guard.
Click to expand...

My only problem with bringing Lawson back is that his 3pt shot is unreliable. With him and Fox it could get ugly many games. If I had to pick though i'd still probably go Lawson. I agree with all your points. I don't think Collison is on board for the rebuild.
 
Since we drafted two great rookie PGs, i'm not even into signing Miloš. We don't need a point guard who would "steal" Fox minutes, and in my opinion, Frank Mason is good enough to be backup PG from day one. I would try to get veteran like Udrih, Calderon or Lawson, just to fill the 3rd PG spot, be a mentor and have some minutes from bench at the start. For example, average minutes (due to missed games) in next season: Fox 28, Mason 15, veteran 10.
Collison is too young and good to be only a mentor with small contract.
 
You guys are convincing me that Lawson might be the better fit for us. Lawson is cheap, too. IIRC, we paid him something ridiculously cheap like 1.5m last year.

My personal preference is let the rookies run, and have a Lawson type as vet mentor.
"The Serbian Sniper" said:
For example, average minutes (due to missed games) in next season: Fox 28, Mason 15, veteran 10.
Click to expand...

Like this ^


Offcourt issues aside... Lawson is a savvy as heck vet PG.
 
I can see pros and cons for either. It depends a whole lot on if we start Fox from the beginning or not.

The three point shooting is something to consider and definitely favors Darren.

I don't think worrying who could play alongside Fox should enter the equation. We have so many SG's as is, when would we need to run Darren or Ty with Fox?

I agree with The Serbian Sniper that looking elsewhere might be best. Beno Udrih was one that stood out to me if we just need a 3rd PG who is a veteran not looking to break the bank. Thirteen year vet, well liked from his time here, and also shoots with his left like Fox.

Really comes down to if Fox will be driving the bus to start or not.
 
Sign a vet on his last legs. 3 way battle for pt (plus Temple).
By the end of the season, Fox will be starting and Mason will be playing big minutes off the bench.

Collison is 6th man on playoff team caliber. He wouldn't want to caddy these kids on 20 min a night. And Lawson is not far below that level either, though an option if teams still see him as radioactive.

The guys to look at are the veteran discards.
 
I wonder how Tyreke will look next year, could he finally be healthy? If he actually is healed, I almost want to say that I would take him over both DC and Lawson. He can play 1-3, and has paired a decent 3-point shot with his unreal ability to get to the hole at will, he's still somewhat young at 28.

Still one of my favorite Kings ever, just want him to be on the team.
 
Bruski made a great suggestion on the podcast. Shelvin Mack!

Someone that won't cost much and you could offer him a deal structured like Tolliver's and Afflalo's. He is a veteran who worked his ass off for everything and would be a great mentor for the youngsters. He has been a good back up and spot starter on play-off teams.

I an quite liking the idea of Mack as the veteran PG mentor for the team. Gives the team an option of playing Fox and Mason when they can handle the workload but still having a dependable and affordable veteran to rely on.
 
A sick part of me wants to go full Philly process tank mode and hand the position to our two rookies.

Something about this group + Joerger makes losing seem way more palatable than the past few years of listless attempts at the post season with Cuz + scrubs + horrible coaching.

This squad will be fun, scrappy, and never quit. I expect a lot of losses, but not a lot of disheartening blowouts.

We should probably keep one of DC or Lawson though. I think I'm leaning towards DC for the shooting, although he'll cost a bit more.
 
None!

Let the rookies take their lumps and learn how to run an offense. I was a a fan of going and getting Milos as training wheels for Fox, but with Mason on board too, I'd much rather just let these guys take full control of the position. We'll have a good amount of ball-handling from the wings (Buddy/Bogdan especially/Temple) that can take the pressure off if needed.
 
Čarolija said:
Lawson still has that court case that might not even make him an option. Regardless, why I am in favor of Collison is simply because Collison can play off the ball which means that at times you can have Fox and Collison on the court at the same time as Collison has the ability to shoot the 3 and provide more spacing for Fox.

If you sign Lawson then playing him and Fox at the same time becomes troublesome and the spacing becomes terrible.

I think whoever ends up being the veteran PG on this team, the absolute must for me is thay they need to be able to shoot the 3 pretty well. Collison does that and there is the familiarity with the franchise which is another plus. Kings will run next season and I think Collison is suited better to that system than a half court offense.
Click to expand...
We have so many twos though I dunno if the ability to have two pgs on the court at the same time is such a bonus. Lawson will be cheaper (not a big deal with how much cap space we have but still something) and also has more similarities to Fox as a player... Might be a better mentor. I like DC better than Lawson as a player but Lawson might be a better fit for this particular situation depending on how much we're expecting to play Fox this year.
 
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