UclaKingsFan
Prospect
KP said:
Those were very nice wins, can't deny it. But they didn't get enough of them. Championship teams close the deal; they finish series. Sacramento couldn't do it that year. It just supports the idea that Adelman, while being a good coach, is not a championship caliber coach.
And sometimes people need constructive criticism. Hugs and kisses from SoCal.
UclaKingsFan said:
We have a pretty decent home stand between Dec. 22 and Jan. 8 (with one quick little hop down to LA to play the Clippers). It includes Dallas, Portland, aforementioned Clippers, Celtics, 76ers, Clippers again and Pacers.
Quite frankly, if by that time it just seemed that the team wasn't gelling or that Adelman wasn't able to get them on the same page, I would start watching very closely for visiting unemployed coaches flying into Sacramento. Circumstances would dictate the timing, of course, but if things aren't running smoothly I wouldn't expect to see Adelman much later than that. Not that I would have given up, but sometimes you just have to make the inevitable change and hope for the best.
uolj
Starter
I thought your post was actually pretty good, and I agree with your analysis of his strengths and weaknesses. It is arguments like UclaKingsFan's assertion that taking a favored team with two superstars and coming off back-to-back titles to overtime in 7 games but losing somehow shows that a coach is not championship caliber. If the Kings consistently lost when they were the better team, then I might listen to that argument, but I don't think they ever have.Coach said:
The Kings' FG% against in 02-03 was easily #1 in the league, but the stat I usually look at is databasebasketball.com's defensive efficiency, which had the Kings ranked second that year to New Jersey. (http://www.databasebasketball.com/leagues/leagueyear.htm?lg=n&yr=2002)
Exactly, they bought into his team defense concept. I've actually expressed my wish that Adelman would spend more time and effort emphasizing defense, but I think that the couple of years when the Kings defense has been poor it has had more to do with personnel.thesanityannex said:
kingsfan916
Starter
OMG we are gonna say this after just 2 games???? 2 games????????
UclaKingsFan
Prospect
uolj said:
Sacramento was favored in the series, had home court advantage by virture of their better record in the regular season, and was a 2 point favorite heading into game 7 of the series. So they did lose when they were the better team. (I apologize for not having a link for the odds on the series, but I bet game 7 in vegas which is why I remember the line--I actually got Sac at 1 1/2, but here is a link for the odds on game 7)
http://www.benmaller.com/archives/benstakes/2002_05_26_benstakesarch.shtml
As for the next year against the Mavs, Webber getting hurt turned the series around, and that certainly can't be blamed on Adelman, but his inability to adjust to the injury certainly can. Also a nice little shot at our inability to play defense.
http://www.hoopsvibe.com/nba/nba_articles/playoffs_2003_-_western_conference_recap-ar437.html
And how can our defensive performance from last year against the Sonics be explained? I'm definitely not claiming that we were the better team, but my God, some effort would have been nice.
Its obvious we won't agree and I'm content to leave it at that as both sides of the argument have very good points, but please get the facts straight before you try to discredit my side.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
UclaKingsFan said:
Sacramento Was NOT favored in the 2002 series vs. the Lakers. That is ridiculous. Many were predicting we were going to be SWEPT (it having happened the year before and not having Peja). By Game 7, who knows what the odds were. We were at home and had proven we could play with them WITHOUT our #2 player.
in 2003 we took Dallas to Game 7 WITHOUT our superstar. And while people continue to be delusional about that Dallas team, they won 60 games that year and went 6 games with San Antonio the next round. I wonder if they would have showed as well without Dirk.
I have made this point before -- the ONLY series we have been favored to win that we have lost in the Adelman era was Dallas in '03, and we wereonly favored to win it so long as we had Chris Webber. We lost to a vastly better Utah team in '99, to a vastly better Lakers team in '00, to a defending champion Lakers team in '01, to a TWO-TIME defending champion Lakers team in '02, to a 60 win Mavs team in '03, without Chris Webber, to the #1 seed in the Western Conference T-Wolves in '04, and to the division champion and #3 seed Sonics in '05. And the last 4 of those years we did it with major injuries lurking all over the roster.
slugking50
All-Star
Purple Reign said:That is not good enough. I wonder what Rex Hughes is doing these days.
What about the following ...
Eddie Jor....oh sorry he already has a job
Sonny Allen
Maura McHugh
Bill Russell no longer works for the Celtics
Jerry Reynolds can coach and talk about the team at the same time
RIDICULOUS!!!!
Hey, You forgot about Dick Motta. Harrold Pressely's favorite coach...lol
Burrito06
Bench
What other good coaches are out there exactly? Everyone is always saying "Fire Rick" but they don't see that there are really only 5 elite coaches out there and I consider Rick to be one of them so if you would rather have a Mo Cheeks or a going back to the old days Gary St. Jean then that is your own opinion.
Ryle
Starter
It's not about snagging another teams head coach. There are plenty of Assistants on NBA benches that are worthy of head coaching gigs. Remember before Adelman was hired we had interviewed a relatively unknown Assistant by the name of Rick Carlisle???? Sure would have been nice to hire him instead of Adelman. What he did with Indiana last year was amazing.
Because Rick Carlisle has accomplished so much more than Rick Adelman! Like when he led Detroit to the Championship in 2004... no, wait, that wasn't him... Or at least when he got them to the Finals in 2003... no, that didn't happen... Well, at least he showed how wrong Detroit was to fire him when he eliminated them from the playoffs in 2004 and 2005... aw crap, that didn't happen, either!
Well, if nothing else, he can say that he won the division twice, and that's something that Rick Adelman has NEVER done!
Well, if nothing else, he can say that he won the division twice, and that's something that Rick Adelman has NEVER done!
uolj
Starter
I don't see where any of my facts have been discredited. If you don't want to continue the discussion, that's fine (although it reinforces my earlier point). But if you want to make statements like "get your facts straight", please actually show where my facts are crooked.UclaKingsFan said:
Gary
All-Star
Is Adleman TRYING to get fired? Or is he clueless when to put in/take out reserves? There was no flow to this game, and the substitution pattern again sucked. I say give him until game 10. If the Kings aren't at least .500 than fire him. We don't need to see this all year. I am tired of it already.
After we fire Adleman than trade Williamson, and Thomas. Maybe get in a backup that wants to play backup.
After we fire Adleman than trade Williamson, and Thomas. Maybe get in a backup that wants to play backup.
Gary said:
Once again, I find it so funny that Adelman is the one taking the blame for the lack of focus or effort by some members of our team. Peja was MIA; the only thing Adelman should be faulted for is not benching him and leaving Corliss in. Miller looked atrocious; and it wasn't because of Adelman. He didn't get a call in the beginning and he started his infamous pouty face routine. We don't have any other bigs, however, that can actually body up against Ben Wallace so Miller was pretty much the only choice open, even though he disappeared once he lost his cool.
This game points out the obvious: WE HAVE NO DEFENSE. It's not Adelman's fault. He can't pull defense out of the air if the players Petrie brings to the team don't care about it to begin with...
If things don't get better quickly there will undoubtedly be more calls for RA's head and it's a shame. If you're going to be fired, you should at least be fired for something you've done wrong. In RA's case, he hasn't been given adequate tools to do his job properly and it showed pretty painfully tonight...
One other thing? It's real easy to say "trade Williamson and Thomas." Do you honestly think Petrie hasn't been trying? They are NOT going to draw a lot of offers.
At this point, I would pull the trigger on any deal that got us even a half-arsed defender in return for Peja and anybody else it took. Mark my words. Peja is going to break our hearts again... teasing us with a performance just like the 3rd quarter against Phoenix and then turning around and putting forth a total lack of anything resembling all-star caliber play like tonight. He's done it for 7 years.
kingsofnba
G-League
IF we fired adelman, what are the options to replace him??? i need names!!!
It's pretty half-assed just to fire Adelman. We should ship out the Revolving Door, Invisible Man, and Furious George as well. Give Petrie his walking papers too. Collect as many 1st/2nd round picks as possible while taking on crap players and a 3rd tier temporary coach that'll babysit for the remainder of the season. I suppose this could wait a few more games but where's the fun in that?
R
R1LOVER
Guest
Send both of them to the EDD line..................
I'm tired of Coach standing there on the sidelines with his arms folded... lol
I'm tired of Coach standing there on the sidelines with his arms folded... lol
8
80sdemon
Guest
The fact is that this team is loaded with crappy players who can't score a basketball or defend a shot. When peja or bibby(especially bibby) or brad, take a dump, then it is up to other players to fill the gaps. We do not, I repeat, do NOT have any scoring machines outside of the inconsistant peja and bibby. Bibby is not even that good of a guard. He can't spread the floor for crap.
Addleman is stuck with crappy(mainly black) players. Many scrubs on former teams.
I don't understand petrie at all. Why did he go for a bunch of scrub/stiff 3rd rate type players when we could of had some sic all star euros(who would be far more productive than what we've got.
Bibby is deplorable, we could of had any number of wicked pg's(that can play D, spread the floor and score the ball. Stefan Hamman(german cup mvp), diamantidis(6'5 ultra tough pg, greek mvp of eurobasket), marko popovic(croatian mvp), juan carlos navarro(another all star), gianmarco pozzecco(at least as a backup for bombing threes and breaking down defenses with his speed and ability to spread the floor.
For bigs, we lack after brad. Skinner is a decent shot blocker. Not as good as a robert javtokas, who blocked duncan, marion, amare and odom in one olympic game. Skinner at 6'9 is undersized and ineficient.
would should have grabbed these beast type players instead.
robert javtokas 6'11 260 (uleb cup mvp) 25 y/o
nikola vujcic(maccabi tel aviv center and tough defender, banger, scorer. had 22 against the raptors. had a tripple double in euroleage. only 24.
darius lavrinovic
robert gulyas huge 7'1 340 monster. avergaed like 15ppg in europe. 31 though.
if we simply wanted blocked shots and good backup C's, we could have went after the spider man, eurelejus zukauskas.
for PF we could have grabbed the toughest player in europe, kaspars kambala. the guy was a beast at unlv and stomped other current nba centers in college. he had 34 against rasho when they played slovenia. he didn't get to play in the nba probably because his coach took money. why fault the player? spreewell and webber got exceptions for REAL illegal crap.
for SF backup jorge garbajosa is a strong hustling reliable all star player who can give you 12-15 ppg.
Getting rid of songaila was a stupid move.
I want a championship not barely making the playoffs. This team dosen't inspire me in the least.
Addleman is stuck with crappy(mainly black) players. Many scrubs on former teams.
I don't understand petrie at all. Why did he go for a bunch of scrub/stiff 3rd rate type players when we could of had some sic all star euros(who would be far more productive than what we've got.
Bibby is deplorable, we could of had any number of wicked pg's(that can play D, spread the floor and score the ball. Stefan Hamman(german cup mvp), diamantidis(6'5 ultra tough pg, greek mvp of eurobasket), marko popovic(croatian mvp), juan carlos navarro(another all star), gianmarco pozzecco(at least as a backup for bombing threes and breaking down defenses with his speed and ability to spread the floor.
For bigs, we lack after brad. Skinner is a decent shot blocker. Not as good as a robert javtokas, who blocked duncan, marion, amare and odom in one olympic game. Skinner at 6'9 is undersized and ineficient.
would should have grabbed these beast type players instead.
robert javtokas 6'11 260 (uleb cup mvp) 25 y/o
nikola vujcic(maccabi tel aviv center and tough defender, banger, scorer. had 22 against the raptors. had a tripple double in euroleage. only 24.
darius lavrinovic
robert gulyas huge 7'1 340 monster. avergaed like 15ppg in europe. 31 though.
if we simply wanted blocked shots and good backup C's, we could have went after the spider man, eurelejus zukauskas.
for PF we could have grabbed the toughest player in europe, kaspars kambala. the guy was a beast at unlv and stomped other current nba centers in college. he had 34 against rasho when they played slovenia. he didn't get to play in the nba probably because his coach took money. why fault the player? spreewell and webber got exceptions for REAL illegal crap.
for SF backup jorge garbajosa is a strong hustling reliable all star player who can give you 12-15 ppg.
Getting rid of songaila was a stupid move.
I want a championship not barely making the playoffs. This team dosen't inspire me in the least.
