The direction of the Carter/Randolph signings

[Dime Dropper]

Sixers would likely not make the Playoffs in the West. So


Hinkie was fired, right?

You're flat our wrong if you think we are anywhere close to having as good a situation as Philly. Simmons/Embiid with Fultz in the wings and a likely top 5 pick coming their way next year thanks to our very own GM.

Sure injuries could derail it all but that's possible for any team and a very weak argument against what they've achieved. If you only want to count rings as a measure of success, go ahead and chalk up the majority of NBA team as just as inept as us, but that won't be true either.

 

[King Baller]

You're flat our wrong if you think we are anywhere close to having as good a situation as Philly. Simmons/Embiid with Fultz in the wings and a likely top 5 pick coming their way next year thanks to our very own GM.

Sure injuries could derail it all but that's possible for any team and a very weak argument against what they've achieved. If you only want to count rings as a measure of success, go ahead and chalk up the majority of NBA team as just as inept as us, but that won't be true either.

Well I never said anything about the merits of Philly's team. Except that they have done very little so far and need to prove they can play without injuries. Oh and that Hinkie was fired. Hinkie is no longer the GM of the Sixers, right? IMO they would not make the Show in the West.

 

[King Baller]

This sounds like saying, "Mike Malone got fired, so you shouldn't try playing bully ball with DeMarcus Cousins."

OK I will take on both issues

Hinkie was fired because of all the losing. He kept turning over all those assets and finally someone said, ENOUGH!

As far as DMC I loved to watch the Big Fella play as a King. But after watching things develop for the Pels this season one has to wonder if they are not better without DMC?

 

[King Baller]

You're flat our wrong if you think we are anywhere close to having as good a situation as Philly. Simmons/Embiid with Fultz in the wings and a likely top 5 pick coming their way next year thanks to our very own GM.

Sure injuries could derail it all but that's possible for any team and a very weak argument against what they've achieved. If you only want to count rings as a measure of success, go ahead and chalk up the majority of NBA team as just as inept as us, but that won't be true either.

Oh and what is up with Fultz? Is Philly ever going to draft a player who does not get hurt? What is wrong with their training dept.?

 

[pdxKingsFan]

You're flat our wrong if you think we are anywhere close to having as good a situation as Philly. Simmons/Embiid with Fultz in the wings and a likely top 5 pick coming their way next year thanks to our very own GM.

Sure injuries could derail it all but that's possible for any team and a very weak argument against what they've achieved. If you only want to count rings as a measure of success, go ahead and chalk up the majority of NBA team as just as inept as us, but that won't be true either.

Fultz has yet to show anything, that pick is headed to Boston most likely for Fultz. They are hardly a shining example. They didn't even try for a decade and missed as many times as they hit. Yes, Simmons and Embiid are better than anyone we currently have. No question. They're also an embarrassment to the league.

I expect the pick next year to be 10-14. Every year there are 4-5 teams blatantly tanking and next year won't be different. We've shown we're above that for whatever reason and our kids will have another year under their belts and we'll probably make a minor signing plus have Giles and a top 7 pick even if it's not a top 3. If we're playing ourselves out of the top 5 this year I find it hard to believe we won't somehow play ourselves out of the top 8 next.

 

[kingjatt]

ZBO/VC/G hill were not interested in mentorship. As ridculous as it sounds I think they were promised a push for the playoffs and plenty of playing time.

Think about it logically guys. If your an accomplished playoff tested player with 10+ years under your belt and a large salary are you going to be happy being benched for a kid who is not better than you??. All of these Vets came here for a payday first and foremost and they were promised minutes and no tanking.

Why would they want to mentor anyone in sacramento?? They have no incentive or connection here, there is zero reason for them to come here and rot on the bench. Even if they do want to mentor that does not mean they are going to give up there playing time for it. If you want mentors get some washed up vets on low salaries and be upfront with them.

As stupid as it sounds I honestly think Vlade and Vivek thought these guys could collabratively replace boogies production along with having older young guys like Bogie Willie Buddy+ a hot young rookie like Fox that we could land an 8 seed as we were close last year. That line of thinking scares me as even us armchair GMs realize that doesnt work.

Vlade also put himself on the hotseat after the boogie trade by promising to be better in two years. YOU DO NOT GET BETTER in two years after trading a player of boogies caliber. Even us forum posters know that! It was time for a full five year "process" but Viveks need to fill the seats(large arena and surrounding area payments) and general impatientce lead him to try the shortcut route yet again. He did not learn his lesson from the past few years and we are going to pay for it.

Vlades unnesscary "we will be better" comment created all of this. Maybe it was a condition of Vivek letting him trade boogie who knows.

I can already see the writing on the wall next year. Vlade is going to go all in for the playoffs again (his promise) when we are clearly not ready yet. He does not care about the kings 3-4 years down the line at this point. All he cares about is maintaining that NBA kush paycheck for him and his old kings buddies (dont say he isnt in it for the money, no matter how much you have the more the better, and easy money is the best). He is going to sacrafice future flexabilty again for a 2019 run and its going to extend our playoff drought even further.

I love Vlade the player but all of his moves have either not moved the needle or have been all out busts. He has not done anything special or creative in years here and in a market like Sacramento you have to be as creative as they come.

Its going to take another failure next year before Vivek MIGHT bring in a true GM whom he hands over the personell duties completely. That has not happend since he took over so who knows.

All I know is if I was a gambling man and lookong at our talent vs the rest of the west I would bet the farm on the playoff drought reaching 20 years.

We literally cannot even lose properly. This year was as obvious a tank year as they come yet we tried to contend and that is going to get us a 7-10 pick where there are no franchise changing talents yet again. Same old cycle again. This team just seems cursed.

 

[Gliesian]

Fultz has yet to show anything, that pick is headed to Boston most likely for Fultz. They are hardly a shining example. They didn't even try for a decade and missed as many times as they hit. Yes, Simmons and Embiid are better than anyone we currently have. No question. They're also an embarrassment to the league.

I expect the pick next year to be 10-14. Every year there are 4-5 teams blatantly tanking and next year won't be different. We've shown we're above that for whatever reason and our kids will have another year under their belts and we'll probably make a minor signing plus have Giles and a top 7 pick even if it's not a top 3. If we're playing ourselves out of the top 5 this year I find it hard to believe we won't somehow play ourselves out of the top 8 next.

I agree with your pick prediction , but don't think teams will be tanking next year due to the lottery changes. It will be a lot harder than usual for us to get wins at the end of next season.
In the real world of Kangz, we move up this year and get the #1 next year.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

I agree with your pick prediction , but don't think teams will be tanking next year due to the lottery changes. It will be a lot harder than usual for us to get wins at the end of next season.
In the real world of Kangz, we move up this year and get the #1 next year.

Regardless of the changes teams have no incentive to win once they are eliminated from the playoffs and better odds the worse their records are. There will be less incentive to be the worst team but as long as you're top 3/4 bottom you like your chances.

 

[VF21]

Why would he be fired? That's called asset acquisition. Brooklyn did something like that this past off-season and it was a contribution to Sean Marks having a reputation as a good GM.

In fact, teams are starting getting wary of attaching picks to move their bad contracts because it's seen as not worth it.

Every so often someone suggests a move and then you guys shoot it down with statements like this because it goes against the grain of the Kings's direction (that is, NOT acquire assets or draft picks and instead pay veteran free agents for mentorship or whatever), while sweeping under the rug Vlade's actual moves that are an order of magnitude worse.

And the winner for the over-reaction of the thread award goes to...

ALL I said was I'm glad the OP isn't in our front office. I make a very conscious and determined effort to stay out of these things as much as possible but sometimes it's just impossible to resist the urge to at least say something. In this instance, AT SOME POINT the Kings have to quit always trying to better themselves by more and more picks. This is like the woman trying to redecorate her living room by constantly rotating in new furniture but not taking enough time to see if its a good fit before rotating in a whole different set.

The OP said in part: "My example would be to be a team so far under the cap that would allow me to absorb a Landry, Thompson, Stauskus,..." and lost me right there. I do not want to see us absorbing more crap players to obtain more iffy players via the draft. Leave the furniture in the room long enough to see if it will work before you move in a whole new look...again.

 

[SacTownKid]

One of the problems the Lakers have is that they have put a lotof stock in the idea of getting 2 big FAs this off season. You could make an argument that Randle and KCP have been 2 of their best players this year and it is very likely that both won't be back. If they don't get those big signings, they will take a step backwards next year.

They will still have some sort of trade value in their young players because they've played significant roles but I agree, they'll take a step back. It's hard to argue with fact and the fact is that the Lakers played up two young role players to the point where they got a TON of cap space and a pick when trading them. In the same deal the Kings played DOWN an all star candidate to the point where the Kings didn't even wipe his entire salary off the books.

 

[Gliesian]

Regardless of the changes teams have no incentive to win once they are eliminated from the playoffs and better odds the worse their records are. There will be less incentive to be the worst team but as long as you're top 3/4 bottom you like your chances.

Below are the odds of getting the 1st pick in the 2018 and 2019 draft.

I added a linear trendline from 0-10, where 10 is the quality of a team with the best record and 0.333 is the quality with the worst record. “Quality” here is a subjective multivariable summation of things like development of players, reputation, culture, fan happiness, team revenue, etc. Ideally, the quality line predicts your success of winning a championship.

If you take a Y-value (choose either Y axis) on the lotto line and add it to the corresponding Y-value on the quality line, then you see a huge difference in where’d you prefer to be.

For ’18 it’s the worst record because the line is exponential. You really don’t want to be 7-9th seed. This has the worst total Y value sum.

In ’19 it's mostly linear and doesn’t really matter unless you go below 3rd seed.

With the current system, you should tank at all costs and don’t mess around or you will fall into the dreadful 7-10th seed area. Next year however, only tank if you are the 4th or 5th seed where there is a small increase in the slope of the line.

You can choose to tank or not next year, but it’s no longer a necessary strategy.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Below are the odds of getting the 1st pick in the 2018 and 2019 draft.

I added a linear trendline from 0-10, where 10 is the quality of a team with the best record and 0.333 is the quality with the worst record. “Quality” here is a subjective multivariable summation of things like development of players, reputation, culture, fan happiness, team revenue, etc. Ideally, the quality line predicts your success of winning a championship.

If you take a Y-value (choose either Y axis) on the lotto line and add it to the corresponding Y-value on the quality line, then you see a huge difference in where’d you prefer to be.

For ’18 it’s the worst record because the line is exponential. You really don’t want to be 7-9th seed. This has the worst total Y value sum.

In ’19 it's mostly linear and doesn’t really matter unless you go below 3rd seed.

With the current system, you should tank at all costs and don’t mess around or you will fall into the dreadful 7-10th seed area. Next year however, only tank if you are the 4th or 5th seed where there is a small increase in the slope of the line.

You can choose to tank or not next year, but it’s no longer a necessary strategy.

View attachment 7418

All of that makes sense but the biggest issue with tanking isn't winning the lotto it's guaranteeing how far you'll fall from the top pick if you don't hit. I think most people are more worried that the Kings will lose 3 spots from where they land and fall from 5 to 8 than they are we'll actually play into the 8th spot.

That's why no matter what they do to "end" tanking, once a team has no shot at the playoffs it becomes in their interest to lose all their remaining games unless the league provides incentives for winning once you get knocked out.

There are going to be 4-5 teams that start next season as "out" from day one. Maybe the NBA would accidentally create a race to get knocked out or do something, but seriously, they need to resort the order by some other means so that teams are rewarded for trying to stay competitive. Maybe give balls based on order of elimination and then give bonus balls for each win after? who knows.

 

[VF21]

According to Kayte, there is a strong likelihood that the league will be taking action against blatant tanking. She referenced Adam Silver's recent warning and said it's highly likely further action will be taken at some point. I totally agree with her assessment and suspect the Memphis Grizzlies are due for a big and somewhat unpleasant surprise at some point.

 

[Gliesian]

All of that makes sense but the biggest issue with tanking isn't winning the lotto it's guaranteeing how far you'll fall from the top pick if you don't hit. I think most people are more worried that the Kings will lose 3 spots from where they land and fall from 5 to 8 than they are we'll actually play into the 8th spot.

That's why no matter what they do to "end" tanking, once a team has no shot at the playoffs it becomes in their interest to lose all their remaining games unless the league provides incentives for winning once you get knocked out.

There are going to be 4-5 teams that start next season as "out" from day one. Maybe the NBA would accidentally create a race to get knocked out or do something, but seriously, they need to resort the order by some other means so that teams are rewarded for trying to stay competitive. Maybe give balls based on order of elimination and then give bonus balls for each win after? who knows.

I think there are still some incentives for winning. Culture and all that stuff. The word "culture" is almost as bad as "tank" tho haha XD

 

[pdxKingsFan]

I think there are still some incentives for winning. Culture and all that stuff. The word "culture" is almost as bad as "tank" tho haha XD

Another idea I had a few weeks ago is giving teams in the middle third (the playoff bubble teams on either side) a new kind of signing exception that would enable them to add a potential impact FA to put them over the hump. That way some of the teams in the middle of the lottery actually have reason to try to play into the next 10.

 

[24 rick barry]

And the winner for the over-reaction of the thread award goes to...

ALL I said was I'm glad the OP isn't in our front office. I make a very conscious and determined effort to stay out of these things as much as possible but sometimes it's just impossible to resist the urge to at least say something. In this instance, AT SOME POINT the Kings have to quit always trying to better themselves by more and more picks. This is like the woman trying to redecorate her living room by constantly rotating in new furniture but not taking enough time to see if its a good fit before rotating in a whole different set.

The OP said in part: "My example would be to be a team so far under the cap that would allow me to absorb a Landry, Thompson, Stauskus,..." and lost me right there. I do not want to see us absorbing more crap players to obtain more iffy players via the draft. Leave the furniture in the room long enough to see if it will work before you move in a whole new look...again.

And the winner for the over-reaction of the thread award goes to...

ALL I said was I'm glad the OP isn't in our front office. I make a very conscious and determined effort to stay out of these things as much as possible but sometimes it's just impossible to resist the urge to at least say something. In this instance, AT SOME POINT the Kings have to quit always trying to better themselves by more and more picks. This is like the woman trying to redecorate her living room by constantly rotating in new furniture but not taking enough time to see if its a good fit before rotating in a whole different set.

The OP said in part: "My example would be to be a team so far under the cap that would allow me to absorb a Landry, Thompson, Stauskus,..." and lost me right there. I do not want to see us absorbing more crap players to obtain more iffy players via the draft. Leave the furniture in the room long enough to see if it will work before you move in a whole new look...again.

AND I SAID "Because we have done so well?"

YOUR WAY
For instance, The previous year point guard Darren Collison is interested in re-signing but doesn't receive any interest from the Kings. He signs for $10 mil per year with Indy. And the Kings select 2 point guards in the draft. Then, the Kings go out and sign a point-guard to their highest free agent contract ever this past off-season-19 million per year. And he certainly wasn't a crap player. Within 3 months, the Kings were trying to move him. Finally they did and we were left with another player-who has yet to play a minute for the Kings who the Kings are now on the hook for 11 million next year. Furthermore, I think the Kings hope that he doesn't pick up this 11 million dollar player option.

MY WAY I would do it differently. I would use the 19 mil in trade with a team that is trying to unload a bad contact that would include a draft choice or a valuable piece or underpaid player on a rookie contract-just some additional asset. Where I think you missed my earlier point is that then you combine these additional assets-draft choice/underpaid player on rookie contract/ etc. for a valuable player that has a long term deal perhaps. Then you are not waiting around for the rookies to mature or fail.

At the end of the day... Who makes a better trade- Vlade or me-aspiring new GM?

One other point to ponder. If in fact the Kings picked up Hill thinking they were going to make it to the 8th playoff spot this year...then Vlade should be let go because he is suppose to know and think - steps ahead. He needs to be a chess player no a reactor. And if the league, is moving rapidly to , like seeing athletic and outside shooting perimeter centers where any of the 5 on the floor can hit the 3, then the GM needs to anticipate this NBA type monumental transition. Anybody, that would have seen Papa G in person scouting would have seen his glaring deficiencies. Does anybody here also think that Vlade actually needs to see the players that we might be drafting this year in person rather than through the USA Today sportspage mockdraft.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

There's no way anyone thought this team was competing for a playoff spot except maybe Hill. That's why you actually hear that things are pleasant in Kings land. Even Shumpert who is supposed to be this horrible baggage we're stuck with seems to be actively engaged and coaching the young guys up on their defense from the sidelines. ZBo and Vince would be grumbling and would have tried to have been shipped at the deadline if they thought they could contribute to a playoff team. Hell all we've ever heard was that Vince would close his career in Toronto at some point we could have easily sent them Vince if that's a thing and he wanted out.

I know people don't want to hear it but yes, something is very different about this team than teams I have seen in the past dozen years. We're not good right now but the culture is changing.

 

[Gguod]

The OP said in part: "My example would be to be a team so far under the cap that would allow me to absorb a Landry, Thompson, Stauskus,..." and lost me right there. I do not want to see us absorbing more crap players to obtain more iffy players via the draft. Leave the furniture in the room long enough to see if it will work before you move in a whole new look...again.

Thats just awfull. This would be literally the worst possible way for franchise to act. This is just mindboggling to me. The math and the facts has been presented over and over again in this site and still there are so many who blindly refuse to accept them. Kings havent done a correct rebuild, they have drafted constantly in that 5-10 range and still some people crave more of that.

 

[24 rick barry]

Thats just awfull. This would be literally the worst possible way for franchise to act. This is just mindboggling to me. The math and the facts has been presented over and over again in this site and still there are so many who blindly refuse to accept them. Kings havent done a correct rebuild, they have drafted constantly in that 5-10 range and still some people crave more of that.

Let's see, what would you choose right now:

Kings team that traded Landry, and Thompson, Staukus, 1st pick order sway rights, and our 2019 number 1 pick for
cap room that would allow us to sign Bellinelli who was traded for a pick that was Malichi-who was traded for Bruno; cap room to Sign Rondo -who is no longer here. I do not include Kufous because Kings had enough cap room available to sign Koufos. And of course, forgetting about the useful tool of simply waiving Landry and Thompson and allocate extending those salaries and cap room over the next 5 years?

or

Kings team that still had their number one pick for 2019?

Which would you choose?

In my view, It's about the acquisition of assets and not throwing money at free agents as interim players with no long terms plans to build around them while not getting any other building block assets in return.

Again, I am saying that having your number one pick for 2019 can be utilized as a bargaining chip to be included for the acquisition of another experienced player/building block that you include in your future plans and it does not have to be a draftee ie Kyrie Irving to the Cavs in return for Boston #1, etc.

 

[kingsfan1984]

And this is where i would be picking up bad veteran contracts combined with kickers/valuable assets.

My example would be to be a team so far under the cap that would allow me to absorb a Landry, Thompson, Stauskus, with the kicker of an lottery pick swap and a future unrestricted number 1. Because my team would be under the cap, my trading partner would not have to take anything back.

This is just insanity! Just makes too much sense to ever work in kingsland. Wouldnt want to upset our long history of rebuilding the kings way.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

They're not going to win a championship anytime with their current roster but I'd gladly trade places with the Blazers and simply be able to cheer for my team to win right now and maybe spoil someone's playoff run before it begins, and they are pretty much doing it exclusively with 5-10 level picks, mid-level FA signings that Sac could get, a few trades and bought picks in the later part of the first round.

Life is too short for me to root for enough failure that we could wind up with 2-3 franchise guys through top 3 picks in the draft.

 

[Gguod]

They're not going to win a championship anytime with their current roster but I'd gladly trade places with the Blazers and simply be able to cheer for my team to win right now and maybe spoil someone's playoff run before it begins, and they are pretty much doing it exclusively with 5-10 level picks, mid-level FA signings that Sac could get, a few trades and bought picks in the later part of the first round.

Life is too short for me to root for enough failure that we could wind up with 2-3 franchise guys through top 3 picks in the draft.

How well have that strategy worked for the Kings so far? If you want a franchise guy like Lillard, you need to put yourself in a position where its not a big statistical anomaly to get one(aka top 3 pick). Praying year after year that we could strike gold with 8th pick is something that life is too short for.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

How well have that strategy worked for the Kings so far? If you want a franchise guy like Lillard, you need to put yourself in a position where its not a big statistical anomaly to get one(aka top 3 pick). Praying year after year that we could strike gold with 8th pick is something that life is too short for.

It didn't work for us but before you say "told you so"...

We drafted an All-NBA level player in Cousins at 5, could have drafted Lillard the following year, hung onto Tyreke without forcing him to be something he's not, and not blown the next few drafts while our dirtbag owners tried to Major League their way out of town and I think we'd be in a far better position than even the Blazers today without a top 3 pick.

So yeah, the franchise has made a number of mistakes, mostly either from previous front offices or trying to fix their errors and win with a major talent the likes we'd rarely had in this town, but we absolutely could have built a winner without resorting to what the 76ers did had we not had incompetent ownership intent on meddling in negative ways.

 

[Gguod]

It didn't work for us but before you say "told you so"...

We drafted an All-NBA level player in Cousins at 5, could have drafted Lillard the following year, hung onto Tyreke without forcing him to be something he's not, and not blown the next few drafts while our dirtbag owners tried to Major League their way out of town and I think we'd be in a far better position than even the Blazers today without a top 3 pick.

So yeah, the franchise has made a number of mistakes, mostly either from previous front offices or trying to fix their errors and win with a major talent the likes we'd rarely had in this town, but we absolutely could have built a winner without resorting to what the 76ers did had we not had incompetent ownership intent on meddling in negative ways.

Math have been posted here, odds have been posted here. No point in denying them. Just no point. You could point out every single good player ever drafted after the 5th pick but every single one of those players are already included in the odds so its literally pointless. I dont understand why its the same awnser every time.

If you want a franchise guy but are not willing to do what the odds suggest, thats ok but at least you should have to admit that you are willing to sacrifice the long term succes of the franchise for your own short term amusement.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Math have been posted here, odds have been posted here. No point in denying them. Just no point. You could point out every single good player ever drafted after the 5th pick but every single one of those players are already included in the odds so its literally pointless. I dont understand why its the same awnser every time. Does people not understand probabilites or they just refuse to understand it in this context?

If you want a franchise guy but are not willing to do what the odds suggest, thats ok but at least you should have to admit that you are willing to sacrifice the long term succes of the franchise for your own short term amusement.

All I'm saying is this franchise was in fantastic position the day they drafted Cousins and our terrible owners sunk us. Rather deliberately I might add. And our new owner who I think will ultimately turn out to be a decent one got in way over his head during years 1 and 2 with his shiny new toy and killed what little promise we had left with Cousins.

I was certainly pro-tank all year even though you'll never catch me use asinine terms like Lin on this forum. I just think that what the 6ers did was abhorrent, they missed as often as they got it right, and that we have a nice core that can bring us a competitive team even if we somehow don't get the best player in this year's draft.

 

[Gguod]

All I'm saying is this franchise was in fantastic position the day they drafted Cousins and our terrible owners sunk us. Rather deliberately I might add. And our new owner who I think will ultimately turn out to be a decent one got in way over his head during years 1 and 2 with his shiny new toy and killed what little promise we had left with Cousins.

I was certainly pro-tank all year even though you'll never catch me use asinine terms like Lin on this forum. I just think that what the 6ers did was abhorrent, they missed as often as they got it right, and that we have a nice core that can bring us a competitive team even if we somehow don't get the best player in this year's draft.

Im not even advocating for sixers level of tanking. Im simply suggesting that if we trade away our best player and have two drafts before we dont have our pick, for those two years use cap space to gain assets, dont sign stupid vet free agents, dont play too much vets so that for two years we could be in a position to add our new franchise guy.

Your last sentence is just wrong. Or not technically wrong but not smart. You could have a competitive team with this core without adding a franchise player but why on earth would we do that? All the math and pobabilities have been linked here se the argument that "we could get a good player outside the top 5" is irrelevant. We could but why would we bet on those odds when we could drastically improve the odds and the only downside of that would be that some fans would have to sacrifise a little short term amusement for long term benefits.
There is literally zero rational reasons to do anything else than try hard to get the franchise player.

 

[whozit]

Im not even advocating for sixers level of tanking. Im simply suggesting that if we trade away our best player and have two drafts before we dont have our pick, for those two years use cap space to gain assets, dont sign stupid vet free agents, dont play too much vets so that for two years we could be in a position to add our new franchise guy.

Your last sentence is just wrong. Or not technically wrong but not smart. You could have a competitive team with this core without adding a franchise player but why on earth would we do that? All the math and pobabilities have been linked here se the argument that "we could get a good player outside the top 5" is irrelevant. We could but why would we bet on those odds when we could drastically improve the odds and the only downside of that would be that some fans would have to sacrifise a little short term amusement for long term benefits.
There is literally zero rational reasons to do anything else than try hard to get the franchise player.

First off, I am not a season ticket holder but I do try to put myself in their position. Maybe you are and don't care but the NBA is an entertainment business. The season ticket holders are the paying customer and they come before any fan in Kentucky (me) or any that are watching at home.

There is only so many entertainment dollars to go around and once a customer finds a better place to spend their dollars they often become a former customer. Those are hard to get back once lost. The Kings franchise is on borrowed time. How much apathy has already set in?

Your numbers while true are ignoring another set of numbers, the bottom line. I want a successful team but not on the back of the current paying customers. None of us are promised a tomorrow. They payed for today.

 

[Gguod]

First off, I am not a season ticket holder but I do try to put myself in their position. Maybe you are and don't care but the NBA is an entertainment business. The season ticket holders are the paying customer and they come before any fan in Kentucky (me) or any that are watching at home.

There is only so many entertainment dollars to go around and once a customer finds a better place to spend their dollars they often become a former customer. Those are hard to get back once lost. The Kings franchise is on borrowed time. How much apathy has already set in?

Your numbers while true are ignoring another set of numbers, the bottom line. I want a successful team but not on the back of the current paying customers. None of us are promised a tomorrow. They payed for today.

Yeah, thats pretty much what I'm all against for. Willingly sacrifising future succes for subjective short sighted "entertainment". Fans come back when they see the poster of a future superstar or at the latest when the team starts winning and the media acknowledges the bright future ahead. Cheering for a team with Zbo chucking up shots and "fighting" to get those few insignificant W's just to end up picking after seven teams have already got their pick of a possible franchise player. You want that scenario? Sure you are entitled to, but when questioned about it you also need to acknowledge that your scenario more likely leads to less succes in the future than the other scenario, and its not a debate, its a fact.

And I dont even care If someone chooses not to accept correctly rebuilding. The thing that makes me angry is when a guy like that really tries to argue that his way is the smart way to go and as good for the future as correct rebuilding. That argument is unintelligent and wrong. Either the person doesnt understand probabilities or he just refuses to understand it. You can choose whatever you want but when you start an argument against math and facts, thats just stupid

 

[ESP47]

I think Vlade had the mindset of acquiring assets through bad contract trades this year but no teams were willing to bite. There were plenty of rumors that they were looking for draft picks when trying to find a home for Hill but that didn't happen so I'm guessing the offers weren't out there.

I can't remember all the trades that went down but I don't remember any first round picks being swapped this year at the deadline. I think teams are valuing them higher than they did in years past.

 

[whozit]

Yeah, thats pretty much what I'm all against for. Willingly sacrifising future succes for subjective short sighted "entertainment". Fans come back when they see the poster of a future superstar or at the latest when the team starts winning and the media acknowledges the bright future ahead. Cheering for a team with Zbo chucking up shots and "fighting" to get those few insignificant W's just to end up picking after seven teams have already got their pick of a possible franchise player. You want that scenario? Sure you are entitled to, but when questioned about it you also need to acknowledge that your scenario more likely leads to less succes in the future than the other scenario, and its not a debate, its a fact.

And I dont even care If someone chooses not to accept correctly rebuilding. The thing that makes me angry is when a guy like that really tries to argue that his way is the smart way to go and as good for the future as correct rebuilding. That argument is unintelligent and wrong. Either the person doesnt understand probabilities or he just refuses to understand it. You can choose whatever you want but when you start an argument against math and facts, thats just stupid

Entitled? Earlier I think you used the term, selfish. I ask, pot or kettle?

I am not monetarily invested in the team other than the money I pay for league pass. Big whoop. I have now lived in Kentucky for nearly 22 years and am still following the Kings. Through the good but mostly bad years. I probably could handle a couple more years of sucktitude.

However to have no empathy for the current paying customers so you can have YOUR entertainment down the road is the epitome of selfishness.

If your a paying customer (goes to the games on a consistent basis), my apologies.

There is no arguing with the math. But doing what is right isn't so black and white. Personally I would prefer the youth and let the chips fall where they fall based on what they do. But like I said, I'm not a paying customer.