PRESEASON Grades v. Clippers 10/14

[tyrant]

i've never seen anyone rely as heavily on 1 rookie (or 2nd year player). i understand that we wanna support our guys, but this is rediculous. i think VF21 is being too optimistic. searching for something that isn't there. k-mart does have talent, however he hasn't impressed anyone but the owners and the fans that aren't really serious about competing. fans that just wanna sit back and enjoy the ride. well i wanna win games. now i've watched kevin martin, i have nba league pass and i've seen the games. i've watched the summer league games as well. the only thing that i have not watched were the 1st 2 preseason games. nothing has changed. martin was the leading scorer in last years AND this years summer league, but only manages 4ppg at most during the regular season. i expect the same thing this year. at least with garcia we know that he's gonna go out there and play. 11 points a game is darn good for a rookie; even if it's just preseason. he's not gun shy and not afraid to make a play. at least this is what i get from others posters on this board

 

[tyrant]

i'm kinda optimistic about both guys as well. i want them to compete. the better man will earn the minutes while the other one warms the mighty bench. but i haven't seen anything exciting yet.

 

[thesanityannex]

i've never seen anyone rely as heavily on 1 rookie (or 2nd year player).

Who is "relying" on a rookie??? We are in big trouble if that is the case, which thankfully, is far from it.

 

[VF21]

i've never seen anyone rely as heavily on 1 rookie (or 2nd year player). i understand that we wanna support our guys, but this is rediculous. i think VF21 is being too optimistic. searching for something that isn't there. k-mart does have talent, however he hasn't impressed anyone but the owners and the fans that aren't really serious about competing. fans that just wanna sit back and enjoy the ride. well i wanna win games. now i've watched kevin martin, i have nba league pass and i've seen the games. i've watched the summer league games as well. the only thing that i have not watched were the 1st 2 preseason games. nothing has changed. martin was the leading scorer in last years AND this years summer league, but only manages 4ppg at most during the regular season. i expect the same thing this year. at least with garcia we know that he's gonna go out there and play. 11 points a game is darn good for a rookie; even if it's just preseason. he's not gun shy and not afraid to make a play. at least this is what i get from others posters on this board

Now you're just being stubborn. Martin hasn't impressed anyone but the owners and the fans that aren't really serious about competing?

ROFLMAO.

 

[VF21]

Oh God. Someone please shoot me now...

i'm kinda optimistic about both guys as well. i want them to compete. the better man will earn the minutes while the other one warms the mighty bench. but i haven't seen anything exciting yet.

Hello? You haven't seen ANYTHING yet. Period. You haven't watched a game. If you had, you might have noticed that Martin and Garcia ARE NOT playing the same position. Martin is being used at the off-guard, with Garcia complimenting him at the 3.

You really do NOT have a clue, do you?

Go ahead and talk about my lack of basketball acumen. Talk as though you and you alone know better than the Maloofs, Petrie, Adelman, Elston Turner and the rest of the coaching staff, etc.

If the first two pre-season games are any indication - and there's every reason to believe they ARE - then it seems Petrie may well have drafted Garcia with the full intention of using him more as a small forward than a guard. But don't let facts get in the way of your delusions.

 

[Bricklayer]

Garcia's numbers are a bit deceptive -- they are "camp" numbers. He is firing up shots from all over the court that would get him benched instantly in the regular season playing with the rotation. Doesn't mean he doesn't have potential to contribute. But does means he's scoring 11.0ppg in the same way that Tierre Brown is averaging 24.0pts or Luther Head 12.5. Its nice, shows potential, but not done in the way he will have to operate to get minutes in the regular season. In fact the very things that I think might give him the edge over Kevin eventually -- the all around game, passing etc. that could mark him as a true Kings player, have been the things he's not showing much of right now. Just gunning up shots for the most part.

As far as Kevin -- yes, many are eternally overoptimistic about hm, but right now he's looking very solid and playing a better all around game. And of course his special talent is his ability drive -- his quickness with the ball is truly NBA worthy. Thing with him I still wonder about is his head. Doesn't seem to be able to master contolled aggression. Either he is out of control and forcing, or he slips back and confuses letting the game come to him with being passive. Needs to figure otu how to attack while staying within the flow. But definite potential there if he ever does.

 

[tyrant]

it seems like you're gonna love the kings no matter what. and as the long as you see them trying and busting their butts to get better you will look at the positives and move on. it fits you, so do what you will. whatever works. I on the other hand will not buy into that A for effort garbarge. players are gonna have to prove that they can compete at a high level. i don't like or dislike a player because owners or broadcasters or other fans tell me to do so. never buy in the hype

 

[tyrant]

Oh God. Someone please shoot me now...



Hello? You haven't seen ANYTHING yet. Period. You haven't watched a game. If you had, you might have noticed that Martin and Garcia ARE NOT playing the same position. Martin is being used at the off-guard, with Garcia complimenting him at the 3.

You really do NOT have a clue, do you?

Go ahead and talk about my lack of basketball acumen. Talk as though you and you alone know better than the Maloofs, Petrie, Adelman, Elston Turner and the rest of the coaching staff, etc.

If the first two pre-season games are any indication - and there's every reason to believe they ARE - then it seems Petrie may well have drafted Garcia with the full intention of using him more as a small forward than a guard. But don't let facts get in the way of your delusions.

it doesn't make a huge difference whether you're playing the sf of sg positions. garcia is a better player period. that's what i believe. and i also believe that k-mart isn't as promising that some make him out to be. the shooting guard and small forward positions are both wing players. it's not a gaping distance and it's not like comparing a small forward to a power forward.

 

[OptimusRhyme]

i've never seen anyone rely as heavily on 1 rookie (or 2nd year player). i understand that we wanna support our guys, but this is rediculous. i think VF21 is being too optimistic. searching for something that isn't there. k-mart does have talent, however he hasn't impressed anyone but the owners and the fans that aren't really serious about competing. fans that just wanna sit back and enjoy the ride. well i wanna win games. now i've watched kevin martin, i have nba league pass and i've seen the games. i've watched the summer league games as well. the only thing that i have not watched were the 1st 2 preseason games. nothing has changed. martin was the leading scorer in last years AND this years summer league, but only manages 4ppg at most during the regular season. i expect the same thing this year. at least with garcia we know that he's gonna go out there and play. 11 points a game is darn good for a rookie; even if it's just preseason. he's not gun shy and not afraid to make a play. at least this is what i get from others posters on this board

How are the owners & fans not serious about competeing. You just keep writing pointless statements, All of us want the Kings to be successful, the Maloofs want a championship just as much as anyone. So what Martin averaged 4 points a game in his rookie season, so did Jermaine O'neal for the first 4 years of his career, players develop , they get better, your just plain ignorant in that catergory. And by the way I'd rather have someone be very optimistic about something then just give up on it all together.

 

[Dime Dropper]

Tyrant, u DON'T have a clue! U just pick a player to like and a player to hate on and then u think u know more than everyone. I'm sick of u judging Garcia by two preseason games. If you're gonna be like that, then answer this, what has Garcia done for us? ever? I mean in the season, not the pre-season. Has he averaged 4 points or was he even in the L? We'll see will Garcia be averaging 11ppg at the end of the regular season. You're obsessed with stats. And they're from two games!!!! Pre-season games!!!!!!!!!!

 

[tyrant]

How are the owners & fans not serious about competeing. You just keep writing pointless statements, All of us want the Kings to be successful, the Maloofs want a championship just as much as anyone. So what Martin averaged 4 points a game in his rookie season, so did Jermaine O'neal for the first 4 years of his career, players develop , they get better, your just plain ignorant in that catergory. And by the way I'd rather have someone be very optimistic about something then just give up on it all together.

you've misunderstood my post. of course the owners want to win, but the point i was making is that they are expecting something out of kevin martin that may not be there. and when i made the comment about the fans i meant that there are different types of fans. yes both types want to win, but you're gonna have fans that just want to go along for the ride and have little or no opinion about who the team picks up and you have those that are not as easy to win over. VF21 told me that she is just excited about 2 young players with talent getting out there and competiting; i told her that there was nothing wrong with that because i feel the same way. but you can't force other people to respect it. i think kevin martin is gonna stink as much as he did last year.

 

[VF21]

it doesn't make a huge difference whether you're playing the sf of sg positions. garcia is a better player period. that's what i believe. and i also believe that k-mart isn't as promising that some make him out to be. the shooting guard and small forward positions are both wing players. it's not a gaping distance and it's not like comparing a small forward to a power forward.

...sigh...

What I SAW last night was a pretty impressive use of BOTH Garcia and Martin coming from the bench. Along with Hart, Skinner and Thomas, they were about as impressive a second unit as I've seen in a long time.

Arguing with you is like arguing with my cat, although I have to admit one thing...my cat has a better grasp of details.

 

[tyrant]

stats are facts. what has garcia done? more than martin has these past 2 games. imma die hard kings fan and i put in my 2cents in a RESPECTABLE way, but i dont bash anyone. you appreciate these players VF21 and what they have to offer. not everyone is gonna think like you.

 

[VF21]

Oh please. YOu make ridiculous statements and then act surprised when people call you on them. YOu pretty much insulted everyone who doesn't agree with you when you made the "do you smell that" comment.

Stats may be facts but NOT everything shows up in the stats. And the manipulation and interpretation of them, especially in lieu of actually seeing something for yourself, is not always the best way to make a decision.

You're not the only die-hard Kings fan around. But you're just about the only one I know who doesn't let the actual facts OF a game get in your way of your own thoughts.

Don't get on a high horse and start preaching now, tyrant.

 

[thesanityannex]

sanityannex the substitute moderator fired.

 

[thesanityannex]

I like Kevin Martin. I must have no basketball knowledge.

 

[VF21]

NOTE: Posts that are entirely in caps, bolded and in much larger than normal fonts are going to be deleted. Period.

 

[Kings113]

"might have," not "might of."

oh...and you mean garcia's nba stats, right? as in, the stats from the two preseason games he's played in?

gimme a break. college stats dont mean ****. both guys have a whole lotta potential. right now thats all it is, for both of them. neither is gonna be an impact player in this league, but both have the ability to contribute. as of right now, i'm unimpressed by francisco garcia because all he has done is shoot the 3. his scoring is better than martin's but he's got big fat zero's everywhere else in his stat line, and that needs to change. the kings dont necessarily need more shooters. we need guys who are gonna pass, rebound, and play a little d. bibby, peja, wells, miller, and SAR have got shooting covered. now, if ya wanna talk about stats, tell me about the ones that are actually relevant.

Actually Garcia can do some of everything aside from scoring - block, steal, pass, even board. All at least nicely for him. That's what he's noted for, why Geoff picked him, and why he was so good for Louisville. He'll have to adjust to the NBA-level, but that doesn't take away his versatility and talent of course. Maybe they're experimenting on things with Garcia, which is all apart of pre-season. Garcia could also be wanting to show how he is as a shooter, which comes into play with the former sentence. Just to say, Garcia showed his versatility in VSL. Which doesn't mean a whole lot NBA-wise, but just shows what he can do.

Anyways, it's just pre-season. Development and getting things back going is what it's for.

 

[Dime Dropper]

NOTE: Posts that are entirely in caps, bolded and in much larger than normal fonts are going to be deleted. Period.

Sorry about that VF21. I just want to silence these very stupid words coming from tyrants mouth.

 

[OptimusRhyme]

you've misunderstood my post. of course the owners want to win, but the point i was making is that they are expecting something out of kevin martin that may not be there. and when i made the comment about the fans i meant that there are different types of fans. yes both types want to win, but you're gonna have fans that just want to go along for the ride and have little or no opinion about who the team picks up and you have those that are not as easy to win over. VF21 told me that she is just excited about 2 young players with talent getting out there and competiting; i told her that there was nothing wrong with that because i feel the same way. but you can't force other people to respect it. i think kevin martin is gonna stink as much as he did last year.

This is also very ignorant.. So your saying any fan that think's Martin is going to be something is a fan that thinks the Kings aren't serious about competeing?
Wow.. your replys make my brain hurt, were not forcing you to respect anything, were just saying that your theory on Martin is total stupidity based on what your basing it on, think about this, your saying Martin is not going to be a good player, because; A) He averaged only 4 pts in his rookie season & B) He hasn't scored more then 5 points in 2 pre-season games.
Now we have all heard over & over from many Kings players, coaches & Media, that Martin has improved greatly this off-season. I geuss all thats left is for him to prove you wrong.

 

[VF21]

Sorry about that VF21. I just want to silence these very stupid words coming from tyrants mouth.

At this point, I personally am bowing out of this argument because it's become very clear to me it's more about the poster than the topic.

Personally, I'm excited about the possibilities I've SEEN so far this pre-season and nothing someone simply looking at stats has to say is going to diminish that optimism.

GO KINGS!!!!!

 

[Dime Dropper]

Fair enough, I think I'll do the same, I've got a headache from arguing with people that know nothing.

Now I'm bowing out. Wishing the best of luck and long successful careers to both Kevin and 'Cisco.

 

[tyrant]

please

 

[OptimusRhyme]

please

Another brain hurting response.

 

[thesanityannex]

To lead the VSL in scoring must mean you suck and can't ball. I finally get it.

 

[VF21]

It's really a shame one person had to ruin this thread for everyone. At this point, little can possibly be gained by leaving it open...so I'm regretfully closing it.