Point Guard

[KingMilz]

Do you think Livingston's knees can keep up with starter minutes? I'm not so sure.

Someone on the trade block is jarrett jack. He was rumored in a trade for our very own Marcus Thornton, so he would come cheap. He would improve the defense, but not much of a facilitator.

He played solid mins all year while playing both ends of the floor meaning he was guarding the oppositions best perimeter player while playmaking/cutting off the ball. I rather have a PG who plays both ends and can play without the ball for 26-30mins per game than one who chucks plays zero D and playing 35+.

Jack is a terrible defender

 

[CurseOfTheSalmons]

Do you think Livingston's knees can keep up with starter minutes? I'm not so sure.

Someone on the trade block is jarrett jack. He was rumored in a trade for our very own Marcus Thornton, so he would come cheap. He would improve the defense, but not much of a facilitator.

i think in brooklyn he started at sg next to deron williams. we could copy that here, with livingston starting next to isaiah thomas. then he wouldn't have all the ball handling responsibility on him, and there would be less stress on his knees.

 

[KingMilz]

i think in brooklyn he started at sg next to deron williams. we could copy that here, with livingston starting next to isaiah thomas. then he wouldn't have all the ball handling responsibility on him, and there would be less stress on his knees.

Williams was injured a lot he played with Joe Johnson just as much

 

[pdizo916]

i'd rather sign Darren Collison.

 

[ockingsfan]

i'd rather sign Darren Collison.

I agree. I think Collison still has some upside.

I think he could be had for a reasonable 4 year/$16million contract.

In the right situation, I think he can have a break out year like Goran Dragic. I think he could average 15ppg, 7assist per game, 1.5 steals per game in the right situation.

 

[sterö]

i think in brooklyn he started at sg next to deron williams. we could copy that here, with livingston starting next to isaiah thomas. then he wouldn't have all the ball handling responsibility on him, and there would be less stress on his knees.

With that starting line-up we'll be one of the worst three-point shooting teams again next year.

 

[ParniValjak]

Do you think Livingston's knees can keep up with starter minutes? I'm not so sure.

Someone on the trade block is jarrett jack. He was rumored in a trade for our very own Marcus Thornton, so he would come cheap. He would improve the defense, but not much of a facilitator.

He only really needs to be a starter that plat around 30mpg. Similar what Vasquez was with us, only infinitelu better defender

 

[Bricklayer]

Do you think Livingston's knees can keep up with starter minutes? I'm not so sure.

Someone on the trade block is jarrett jack. He was rumored in a trade for our very own Marcus Thornton, so he would come cheap. He would improve the defense, but not much of a facilitator.

Because of Stauskas, assuming he works out, we can consider guys like Jack, Knight, Hill, Chalmers, guys who aren't terribly creative, but do other things. Has a tough contract, but we might be able to flop Jason for him if indeed JT has punched his ticket out, and we would actually shave a year from our obligations (while also continuing to recreate Golden State East for the Warriors faithful in our management tree who haven't shaken that unfortunate affiliation off yet). But the interesting thing is we still have McCallum. So if whatever starter we bring in, or retain, is not a great facilitator...well, we just won't have one on the roster, assuming we intend to keep Ray as the primary backup rather than 5th guard.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

Ray McCallum knows how to stay out of the way and make sure others get theirs as true pass first point guard. He can shoot the three and he does play consistent defense. I really think his ability is being underestimated by a lot of folks. I would be very interested to see him work with Stauskas in the backcourt...and no doubt we will here soon, at summer league and into preseason.

The complaints about "wasting last years pick" could be washed away, once our second round pick from last year reaches his full potential.

We're an up and coming team. We're not a contender at the moment to go deep in the playoffs. Potential starting lineup for preseason games...

McCallum, Stauskas, Gay, Evans, Cousins

 

[dude12]

Ray McCallum knows how to stay out of the way and make sure others get theirs as true pass first point guard. He can shoot the three and he does play consistent defense. I really think his ability is being underestimated by a lot of folks. I would be very interested to see him work with Stauskas in the backcourt...and no doubt we will here soon, at summer league and into preseason.

The complaints about "wasting last years pick" could be washed away, once our second round pick from last year reaches his full potential.

We're an up and coming team. We're not a contender at the moment to go deep in the playoffs. Potential starting lineup for preseason games...

McCallum, Stauskas, Gay, Evans, Cousins

I was banging the drum for Ray early and often last year before finally getting the opportunity, I like the kid a lot and want to see him play, but we probably are better off bringing in a vet to pair with him.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

I was banging the drum for Ray early and often last year before finally getting the opportunity, I like the kid a lot and want to see him play, but we probably are better off bringing in a vet to pair with him.

Better off for winning as many games as possible right away, or better off going forward as an up and coming team? I also wanted Ray to play much earlier in this past season, but now is the time to let him play with our best players and see what is on his horizon. He has talent and skill, he works hard on defense, he wants to set others up and make them better,...and last but not least he's a high IQ player who plays with the style that fits our team.

I don't know why so many are so intent on going out to bring in another PG, when we've got a prospect for what we need already on our roster, who isn't taking up multiple millions in space

 

[dude12]

Better off for winning as many games as possible right away, or better off going forward as an up and coming team? I also wanted Ray to play much earlier in this past season, but now is the time to let him play with our best players and see what is on his horizon. He has talent and skill, he works hard on defense, he wants to set others up and make them better,...and last but not least he's a high IQ player who plays with the style that fits our team.

I don't know why so many are so intent on going out to bring in another PG, when we've got a prospect for what we need already on our roster, who isn't taking up multiple millions in space

I want a Rondo or Bledsoe, but I'm not on board with Livingston unless its around 3-4 mill, same with Collison, I could see that with Ray.....both getting big minutes, I'm not ok giving Livingston anywhere near a 5-6 mill deal. But we do need another PG if IT is gone and he will be. Same reason I wanted a vet SG paired with Ben instead of another rookie. We are hoping that the young guys take the next step, we are hoping that Stauskas can come in right away and be efficient. Hope is not a plan.

I just read that Phx wants to make a run at a Melo/Lebron package...and they have multiple assets to get a deal down but that ain't going to happen. They could land a guy like Melo or Love....when they drafted Tyler Ennis, it did make me think about a potential deal involving Bledsoe, but that's wishful thinking on my part, plus the RFA's part being a tough thing to overcome but I could see them maybe wanting IT as a cheaper option to Bledsoe if they think they can land Love.

I do believe that we are going to land one of those guards from Boston or strike a deal with Milwaukee or personally, I think Indiana should go after IT....it's a perfect fit for them. They have defense coming out of their ears and IT can be the missing piece there....I would take George Hill from that team as a short term guy, a guy like CJ Watson could back up Ray Mac.

Ideally, we spend 2-4 mill to get a vet to pair with Ray, land one of the big prizes(Rondo, Bledsoe), or swing a deal for someone that can come in and is a proven winner.

 

[bajaden]

Do you think Livingston's knees can keep up with starter minutes? I'm not so sure.

Someone on the trade block is jarrett jack. He was rumored in a trade for our very own Marcus Thornton, so he would come cheap. He would improve the defense, but not much of a facilitator.

I think we need to start listening to what PDA and the rest of the front office is saying, instead of trying to impose our own agenda into their statements. They said prior to the draft that they wanted to improve outside shooting first, along with better passing and ballhandling. I took them at their word and looked at all the possibilities in the draft and came up with Stauskas. They also said that they were looking for a pass first PG that hopefully could defend and had some size. I came up with Payton. Turns out that the two players they had at the top of their board were Stauskas and Payton. Not rocket science folks if you pay attention. So having said that, how in the world does Jarrett Jack fit into that equation? Jack is a shooter. He's a SG in a PG's body. That's not a criticism, just a fact.

As to Livingston's knee's, I have no idea. I can't predict when the next tornado is going to strike either. But I suspect that he won't be very expensive, and therefore not much of a financial risk. He had a very good season last year. He's always been talented, and at one time, thought to be god's gift to the PG community. An exaggeration perhaps, but we'll never know because of his horrible injury. He's a player that knows who he is, plays to his strengths, and doesn't try to do what he can't. I like those kind of players.

 

[Prince_XY]

i think in brooklyn he started at sg next to deron williams. we could copy that here, with livingston starting next to isaiah thomas. then he wouldn't have all the ball handling responsibility on him, and there would be less stress on his knees.

The reason why most people around here wants to get a very good PG is to replace IT from the starting line-up and balance the team especially on defense.

The main knock on him as a starter is that he is too small to defend opposing team's PG creating that big loophole on defense and he cannot change his style of play and not a good facilitator on offense. The guy is just too obsessed to being a score-first PG ala Allen Iverson. In that regard, he is not a starter material, but people think he might be a very good offensive punch or scorer coming off the bench.

If you are getting Livingston just to start with IT at the backcourt, then it defeats all the purpose of upgrading the PG position. IT will still be there at the starting line-up, which means there will still be that big loophole in defense. which means the team will not improve in defense at all.

With IT, Livingston might not even touch that ball to facilitate the offense!

 

[Prince_XY]

They also said that they were looking for a pass first PG that hopefully could defend and had some size. I came up with Payton. Turns out that the two players they had at the top of their board were Stauskas and Payton. Not rocket science folks if you pay attention. So having said that, how in the world does Jarrett Jack fit into that equation? Jack is a shooter. He's a SG in a PG's body. That's not a criticism, just a fact.

Very good point.

Hopefully, we get Collison or Chalmers at a bargain price.

 

[ockingsfan]

He played solid mins all year while playing both ends of the floor meaning he was guarding the oppositions best perimeter player while playmaking/cutting off the ball. I rather have a PG who plays both ends and can play without the ball for 26-30mins per game than one who chucks plays zero D and playing 35+.

The thing about players with knee problems is that a lot of times they play lots of minutes in one season and you think he is cured. And then the next year his knee just gives out because he was overused the year before.

I think it is very risky if you are looking at Livingston as your starting point guard for next year, regardless if the contract is reasonable or not. If you sign him as your primary back up or 3rd guard, then great, but to let IT go and count on Livingston as your starter, I think would be foolish.

I would much rather try to sign Darren Collison on re-sign IT.

 

[Albatros]

Collison doesn't exactly give you size.

 

[kingsboi]

I'd consider Livingston for a reasonable price. Collison I'm not too fond of, he is a backup PG.

 

[Prince_XY]

Collison doesn't exactly give you size.

Darren Collison is probably fair.

6' 1.5" with shoes

6' 0.25" without shoes

 

[Bricklayer]

Very good point.

Hopefully, we get Collison or Chalmers at a bargain price.

Well would hardly call either of those guys pass first.

I mean, Chalmers is Derek Fisher class, so he's at least not a gunner...or he wasn't allowed to be, because he does have an ego. But he's not very creative. Lebron is the PG there. Wade the backup PG.

And Collison is a scoring point.

If I were to take our front office literally on "pass first PG with some size who can defend" in the entire league I could come up with:

John Wall (but he shoots a LOT)
Ricky Rubio
Michael Carter Williams
-----------------------------
Shawn Livingston* (been a long time since he racked up many assists)
Kirk Hinrich (barely a starter anymore)
Jeremy Lin (maybe)
Jrue Holiday (but he was chucking last year)
Ramon Sessions? (defense unclear)

and then some partial hits:
Mario Chalmers (not pass first, just not shoot first. bring it up get out of the way, defend)
George Hill (ditto)
Grevis Vasquez (no defense, we tried that)
Kendall Marshall (ditto)
Andre Miller (too old now)
Jamal Tinsely (ditto)

And we have been associated with a number of the names above, so maybe the smoke indicates a serious attempt on our part. Some of those guys are accessible.

 

[bajaden]

Very good point.

Hopefully, we get Collison or Chalmers at a bargain price.

I would be fine with that. I doubt their looking for a long term answer at the moment. I mean they'd be happy to find one, but they don't grow on trees. So a short term answer while maybe McCallum develops, or we draft one, is probably what's going to happen. Who knows, maybe it will be PG by committee. Stauskas was esentialy the main ball handler for Michigan last season and he looked great doing it. How that translates to the NBA is anyone's guess. I know he could handle the job for a few minutes here and there. But major minutes, I don't know. I won't say no, but I won't say yes either.

 

[CurseOfTheSalmons]

If you are getting Livingston just to start with IT at the backcourt, then it defeats all the purpose of upgrading the PG position. IT will still be there at the starting line-up, which means there will still be that big loophole in defense. which means the team will not improve in defense at all.

With IT, Livingston might not even touch that ball to facilitate the offense!

however bad IT is at defense, ben mclemore was much worse. we get more bang for our buck by replacing ben instead of isaiah, and not just defensive bang either.

i predict he would get plenty of touches since he'll be wide open at the three point line.

 

[Prince_XY]

Shawn Livingston* (been a long time since he racked up many assists)
Kirk Hinrich (barely a starter anymore)
Jeremy Lin (maybe)
Jrue Holiday (but he was chucking last year)
Ramon Sessions? (defense unclear)

Kirk is okay too. I think he can still pass as starter. He can give the team that veteran leadership on both ends of the floor. Of course it would be nice if we can also get Taj Gibson on board to address the lack of shot blocking big.

 

[Prince_XY]

however bad IT is at defense, ben mclemore was much worse.

No problem.

Let us also get rid of MacLemore or we can try Stauskas to start as our SG.

Like IT, it is actually a very good idea to move McLemore now while he still has some value. The defects on these players are crystal clear. They are really not worth playing and paying as starter if we want to have a Championship team.

 

[fursty13]

Kirk is okay too. I think he can still pass as starter. He can give the team that veteran leadership on both ends of the floor. Of course it would be nice if we can also get Taj Gibson on board to address the lack of shot blocking big.

I'm a big fan of Gibson, but aren't the Bulls really high on him? They're dumping Boozer to let Gibson take over, aren't they? If there's a way the Kings can acquire Gibson, I'd be all for it. If they feel good about McLemore, they can use a scoring 2, that's for certain.

 

[dude12]

I'd like for the Kings to deal JT or Landry to ATL for Denis Schroeder....they need a big man to go along with Horford and Millsap. Brand is UFA and Mike Scott is a stretch 4 type. Seems like either JT or Landry would help there and I think Schroeder can add defense from the PG spot without breaking the bank.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

I'd like for the Kings to deal JT or Landry to ATL for Denis Schroeder....they need a big man to go along with Horford and Millsap. Brand is UFA and Mike Scott is a stretch 4 type. Seems like either JT or Landry would help there and I think Schroeder can add defense from the PG spot without breaking the bank.

So you'd play Shroeder over McCallum at this point?

 

[ockingsfan]

I think we need to start listening to what PDA and the rest of the front office is saying, instead of trying to impose our own agenda into their statements. They said prior to the draft that they wanted to improve outside shooting first, along with better passing and ballhandling. I took them at their word and looked at all the possibilities in the draft and came up with Stauskas. They also said that they were looking for a pass first PG that hopefully could defend and had some size. I came up with Payton. Turns out that the two players they had at the top of their board were Stauskas and Payton. Not rocket science folks if you pay attention. So having said that, how in the world does Jarrett Jack fit into that equation? Jack is a shooter. He's a SG in a PG's body. That's not a criticism, just a fact.

As to Livingston's knee's, I have no idea. I can't predict when the next tornado is going to strike either. But I suspect that he won't be very expensive, and therefore not much of a financial risk. He had a very good season last year. He's always been talented, and at one time, thought to be god's gift to the PG community. An exaggeration perhaps, but we'll never know because of his horrible injury. He's a player that knows who he is, plays to his strengths, and doesn't try to do what he can't. I like those kind of players.

You have a good point. PDA has pretty much been transparent in his player pickups.

If PDA can be taken by his word of wanting more unselfish pass first PG and defense, I think Mario Chalmers would be the number one FA target, at the expense of IT.

With all the PDA and Vivek talk of changing the culture, I think Chalmers would be the perfect fit. He has been a team-first player all these years with Miami, giving up bigger paydays to play the good soldier role for Miami.

He was a steady, pass first point guard for Miami's big three and played solid defense and he can hit the open three and doesn't make a lot of mistakes.

I make a prediction. I think that PDA will throw the full MLE for 4 years (approx 4 years/ $26 million) at Mario Chalmers, in hopes that his championship pedigree will steady the Kings. And I predict Chalmers will take it and IT will walk or be dealt in a sign and trade.

 

[kingsfan101]

If I had to guess, I'd say that the player the Kings would be interested in would be Livingston. He's a pass first PG. He has great size for the position. He hardly ever turns the ball over, and he a pretty good defender. And, he would probably come fairly cheap. He's not a good 3 pt shooter, but then he hardly ever takes a 3 pt shot. Other than that, he averages around 46 to 47% overall.

Exactly the reasons I have been hoping that we pursue him. I believe we need to keep IT. We were extreeeeemly bad in outside shooting last year, and IT is our best shooter.

 

[ESP47]

I'd like for the Kings to deal JT or Landry to ATL for Denis Schroeder....they need a big man to go along with Horford and Millsap. Brand is UFA and Mike Scott is a stretch 4 type. Seems like either JT or Landry would help there and I think Schroeder can add defense from the PG spot without breaking the bank.

Since when is Schroder considered a defender? The guy is one of the smallest NBA players I've ever seen. ESPN has him listed at 168lbs. Not that size is everything but were just going to switch from complaining about the shortest player to complaining about the lightest player.

With that said I'd still trade Landry for him just to get rid of that contract. That is if we can't get a better PG before hand.