Pleasantly surprised by Jimmer.
- Thread starter jayfly
- Start date
Umm ... I don't know about you but in 2 preseason games I've seen the ball kicked out to Jimmer on several occasions, so I really don't know what you're talking about. Also, Jimmer's role on the team is serving as a playmaker and hitting shots, perhaps creating a bit of his own offense when Tyreke and Marcus are out. His ability to shoot alone brings value to the team because defenses cannot just crowd the paint. And please don't act as if the Kings never pass the ball to open shooters. If you feel that way you clearly haven't watched any games. Our problem is over-dribbling, and not moving the ball smoothly within an offensive scheme. We don't have problems with finding open shooters when they do get open.
Livinthedream
All-Star
Hmmm....we over dribble and don't move the ball smoothly within the offense. Know how to solve that problem? Pass the ball. I was actually paying your Jimmer a compliment, so relax.
The role for Jimmer you described is the same role as just about any guard in the NBA. I'm really not sure what you're trying to educate me on with your post.
You said that for Jimmer to have value the team would first have to start learning to pass the ball. That doesn't make sense because in 2 preseason games he's gotten the ball for numerous wide open 3s... And no, he does not have to score like crazy. We already have Thornton, Tyreke and Cousins to do that. Jimmer's role is very much a role playing one, but that doesn't mean he isn't of value to the etam. Last I checked, role players don't score like crazy.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
Howland MORE THAN fully develops players - on the defensive side of the ball. When his players come into the NBA they know the meaning of the word, unlike most other college players.
Chupacabra
Starter
Im not really sure that he helps this team at all if he cant play defense. He has to be able to at least stay in front of his man. If he continues to be a terrible defender and gets significant minutes anyway im going to be pissed lol
OptimusRhyme
Jive Turkey
How has he been a terrible defender so far? he had a bad first half in his first game, then bounced back the second half and had a whhole solid next game except for some defensive 3 second calls, because the rules are different then college i believe.
He seems like hes ALREADY got elite offense so he wont need to work on his scoring all that much, i'm sure his prime focus is defense. sooooo we get it, hes not the greatest defender yet, its becoming madly annoying to read it every other post.
Have you actually watched the games so far? Honest question.
He had some shaky moments during the first half of game 1... but since then - particularly in game 2 - he's been fine. He hasn't been great or even "good" by any means, but he's played his role and he's even, believe it or not, made some plays on defense!
Methinks if we can see that much improvement after just one game, he'll be fine in time. Probably won't ever be considered a "good" defender by any means, but I don't think he'll be a liability, and just like at BYU, he'll probably be good for a steal or two a game.
Glenn
Hall of Famer
Goat Sucker, we are talking about a rookie who has yet to play a real NBA game. It would be the extraordinary rookie that grasped NBA defense right out of the gate. As Italics has mentioned, he already has shown improvement. Defensively I don't think you can ask much more from a guy his size at this point of his career. Will he get better? Probably but how much better is for the future to reveal.
My impression of Jimmer is that he is a real gym rat with a good basketball IQ and although always will be limited by his height, will do just fine.
My impression of Jimmer is that he is a real gym rat with a good basketball IQ and although always will be limited by his height, will do just fine.
Livinthedream
All-Star
You're really taking things to the extreme in your defense of Jimmer and the team. Remember that I'm a Kings fan too. Of course the Kings pass the ball. It's impossible to play the game without passing. If your argument is that we're a good passing team because Jimmer got a couple of open shots, then I won't even go there with you.
If you think the Kings drafted Jimmer to simply play a role as a distributor and maybe hit a shot or two, then you're not being realistic. They drafted him because he can score from anywhere on the court. They didn't draft him because he can play defense or because he's proven point guard. He's a scorer. If he doesn't score a lot, then he's not going to fulfill what he was drafted for. My point was that the rest of the guys on the team need to recognize this and get him the ball when he's open, period. Thornton will get his points no matter what because of his style of play, and Tyreke dominates the ball, so he'll be ok. They just need to keep their eyes open for Jimmer because the kid is an amazing shooter.
I want to see Jimmer score from all over the court and do well. Doesn't mean that I can't be honest about what he is. The defensiveness from the Jimmer cult makes it difficult to fully jump on the bandwagon. All this "Trust me, he can do everything" talk is ridiculous. If it was so obvious that he is the best scorer, great point guard with great athleticism and an above average defender coming out of college, then the people who get paid to draft players would be foolish to not draft him first. Let the kid grow into what he's going to be, but be honest about who he is now.
Uncia03
Starter
Jimmer is a fantastic shooter and there aren't any questions about that.
He doesn't have great NBA athleticism BUT he has shown to have decent quickness and decent upper-body strength. His combine results showed that he was far more athletic than most people perceived him to be. (Now to be fair, a lot of combine drills can be worked on to enhance your success, and I believe that Jimmer did work on those skills. But if he's willing to work that hard for combine tests, that should indicate how hard he is going to work for true NBA readiness on the defensive end.)
I've been saying since before we drafted him, that he would be an upgrade over Beno defensively. Now that isn't saying much, as Beno was benched due to his defense and replaced by Luther Head last year. But Jimmer has better athleticism than Beno, and he knows what the critics are saying, and he's a competitor which will work to prove them wrong. It might take a while for Jimmer to learn NBA defense, but once he gets it down, he'll be less of a liability than Beno.
As to the point-guard skills, you just had to watch him in college, and I don't mean the ESPN highlights.
Jimmer was a great facilitator at BYU. Sometimes he'd spend the entire first half of a game, taking advantage of the defenses' attention to set up his players. He'd use his cross-over to get into the lane to set up players, and showed a good knack of splitting defenders to also get into the lane.
The only people who questioned his ability to distribute the ball were those who didn't watch a lot of his game. He's such a great shooter that people focused solely on that elite skill, while ignoring his good passing skills. Now he's not a passing savant, but he's a smart player who will make more good decisions than bad ones when trying to set up his teammates.
It's going to take him a bit of time to put it all together, but he's going to be fine. I don't expect stardom from him. I'm thinking 20-25 minutes a game as a 3rd guard as Thornton is better than him and should be starting next to Tyreke.
Just because he's an elite shooter doesn't mean that he automatically is unable to be a good passer as well. He does one at the highest levels (shooting) and another at a good level (passing), if he was elite at both, as well as being an unparrelled athlete, then yes, he should have been the #1 pick, but he isn't that guy.
But I was very happy with the pick once we lost out on a top seed and think he's going to do a lot to help this team.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
Just how will Jimmer be limited by his height? He's a PG and 6'2", which is about average height for PG in the NBA. He's also very strong for the position.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
I was going to respond, but you summed it up perfectly. The biggest question mark with Jimmer is of course his defense. But I was pleasantly surprised in the second exhibition game. He played very well. I realize it was an exhibition game, and he was playing the same team he had just played, which helps. But still, any improvement is a good thing. Its going to take a while, but I think he'll be fine in time.
I find it amazing that some people want to ignore his PG skills. Whether he scores, or someone else does as a result of his presence, its still a basket. And thats all that matters. Jimmer has neve been a selfish player with the intent to score a ton of points. He only wanted to win, and sometimes that required him taking over a game. The last thing I'm worried about is Jimmer getting his points. But I love Jimmer getting the ball to a big under the basket when he's doubled just as much as I love him hitting an open three.
Glenn
Hall of Famer
I think basketball players tend to be better when they are taller. 6'2" isn't a tall NBA payer. I was complimenting him. Open some more presents.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
I asked the question thinking that perhaps you didn't know Jimmer's height, or perhaps his true position, since some think he's nothing but a SG. And the response I get back is not only condesending, but discarding. Thats like saying that I think all cars should be able to go fast. Perhaps our goal should be to have all five players on the court 7 foot or taller, since tall players tend to be better. What a load of crap! How tall is Rondo? The answer is 6'1". How about Chris Paul? He's generously listed at 6 foot. I could go on, but its not worth the trouble. You made a statement, that Jimmer would be limited by his height. And since Jimmer is at the very least, average height for a PG, and perhaps to some, slightly above average, I thought perhaps you had made the statement in error. I was giving you the benefit of the doubt.
Instead, in the spirit of Christmas, you tell me to go open presents. Well I'm not your child, and you can't dismiss me that easily. How about this! How about you think before uttering something that makes no sense.
Jason Kidd: 6'4"
Ty Lawson: 5'11"
Andre Miller: 6'2"
Stephen Curry: 6'3"
Johnny Flynn: 6'0"
Kyle Lowery: 6'0"
Chris Paul: 6'0"
Derrick Fisher: 6'1"
Mike Connely: 6'1"
J.J. Barea: 6'0"
Jarret Jack: 6'3"
Steve Nash: 6'3"
Raymond Felton: 6'1"
Tony Parker: 6'2"
Rajon Rondo: 6'1"
Derrick Rose: 6'3"
Deron Williams: 6'3"
John Wall: 6'4"
Jrue Holiday: 6'4"
Jeff Teague: 6'2"
D.J. Augustin: 6'0"
Kemba Walker: 6'0"
Kyrie Irving: 6'3"
Brandon Knight: 6'3"
Mike Bibby: 6'2"
Mario Chalmers: 6'2"
Jimmer Fredette: In shoes, 6'2.5" (all these heights are in shoes)
Its not about the height, but about the skill level. If you can have both, thats great! But if you have to choose between a small guy with a great skill level and a tall guy without, then I'm taking the small guy. I'll put guys like Tiny Archibald, Calvin Murphy, and Spud Webb up against anybody.
Merry Christmas
