now is the time to trade salmons

#1
he's been putting up around 20 a game lately. his scoring is good for one reason, to help get him out of here. the kings dont need what he's giving. he's not batman and he's not even robin, and we're still talking about if kmart will ever be a pippen type robin. why dont we start exploring options now
 
#2
he's been putting up around 20 a game lately. his scoring is good for one reason, to help get him out of here. the kings dont need what he's giving. he's not batman and he's not even robin, and we're still talking about if kmart will ever be a pippen type robin. why dont we start exploring options now
As soon as Francisco is healthy... pull the trigger. But who wants/needs a John Salmons?
 

Entity

Hall of Famer
#3
Cleveland and Denver both need john that can play the 2 and the 3. Carmello and Lebron are both SF's what happens if they miss 3 or 4 games and the team is used to having the SF make plays. Well thats when you bump John up from the 2 to the 3. Not to mention neither team has a viable option at SG. New Jersey also comes to mind.
 
#4
I'm up for this idea just so we can see more Donte Greene. To me this year is all about seeing the new talent mature. Keeping close in games is a bonus. Winning a few is a cherry on top.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Staff member
#5
John, Brad, Mikki...the list hasn't changed. Even if we got rid of all three we'd still be:

C-Hawes - 20
PF-Thompson -22
SF-Cisco - 27
OG-Martin - 25
PG-Beno - 26

SF/PF - Greene - 20
PF/C - Williams - 24
PG/OG - Brown - 24
PG/OG - BJax - 35
OG - Douby - 24
PF - Thomas - 31

We would not be as "good", but we'd survive, let alone if we got back a young player or two in the deal(s).
 
Last edited:
#6
Who would be interested in a John Salmons? Well, I'm sure there are at least a few teams out there. For starters, there's another thread in this very forum that speculates that the Hornets could be interested, given their woes from their current corps of SG/SF. They've also seen John torch them firsthand, although they could also be well aware that John doesn't play as well when he doesn't dominate the ball, something that may be a concern with one Chris Paul. That said, if we could get something close to Rasul Butler+Julian Wright and/or 09 first, I'd have to take it, fitting along with the Bibby/Artest Expiring+late first/early 2nd+prospect model.

The Clips could also be interested. They're clearly in win now mode dealing for Baron and Randolph, but faring quite poorly at it. Salmons could fit in next to Baron at OG if they don't think Gordon is ready, or at SF if they're willing to deal Thornton. Doubt either is likely, but if we're willing to lower our standards a little, we could take a flier on DeAndre Jordan and take back Hart and Skinner's expirings (and immediately cut both, lest Reggie be tempted) as well as the Clip's 09 first.
 

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#7
Absolutely. Trade him. NOW. If not NOW, then at the latest the mid-season trade deadline. One of the problems with trading him for a pick is that the 2009 draft looks weak. So how about 2010 with no conditions? While we're at it, I'd trade Beno also. Do a Salmons/Beno package for a more athletic pg and a pick.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Staff member
#8
Absolutely. Trade him. NOW. If not NOW, then at the latest the mid-season trade deadline. One of the problems with trading him for a pick is that the 2009 draft looks weak. So how about 2010 with no conditions? While we're at it, I'd trade Beno also. Do a Salmons/Beno package for a more athletic pg and a pick.

Beno is young, and we need him as our only starting quality guy. We also just signed him to a long term deal, so I don't see him going anywhere anytime soon.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#9
Absolutely. Trade him. NOW. If not NOW, then at the latest the mid-season trade deadline. One of the problems with trading him for a pick is that the 2009 draft looks weak. So how about 2010 with no conditions? While we're at it, I'd trade Beno also. Do a Salmons/Beno package for a more athletic pg and a pick.
I think its a little early to give up on Beno. He deserves at least this year to prove himself one way or another. So far this year, I would call his game somewhere between decent to good. His assist total could be higher if people could just finish plays, or even catch the ball.

My greatest fear right now is the return of Cisco and Martin. I'm afraid that Greene will be so buried at the end of the bench he'll need a flashlight to find his way to the floor. I'm also afraid that Reggie is falling in love with small ball, and combined with his love affair with Mikkie, Thompson's minutes are going to suffer.

I hope I'm wrong. If not, then as Bricky said, trade Miller, Mikkie, and Salmons.
 
#10
I think over the course of his five year extension Beno will become a trade asset, much like Salmons and Miller are right now. He's quite productive right now and surprisingly has a flair for brilliant risk type plays, but a positional upgrade will eventually be necessary--he is what he is at this point.

As for the Clippers, I agree we could dump Salmons off to them. But there's no way they would sack Kaman for him, and it's not like we need another big of that mold either. They're really thin on the easiest position to attain in the league (swings/OGs), so they probably won't trade Thornton, Gordon or any young talent for him; however, judging from Salmons' scintillating play as of late, as I've said in another thread, hopefully we can rope two future 1st rounders and Pritchard those assets on draft day.
 
Last edited:

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#11
Beno is young, and we need him as our only starting quality guy. We also just signed him to a long term deal, so I don't see him going anywhere anytime soon.
Probably not. But I'd still like to see it done, especially if we can get a younger, more athletic pg in the return package. I really don't see Beno as a long term answer. I don't think he'll ever be a top 10 pg in the league, and then off the bench he's shown he's more like Salmons (not nearly as good).
 

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#12
I think its a little early to give up on Beno. He deserves at least this year to prove himself one way or another. So far this year, I would call his game somewhere between decent to good. His assist total could be higher if people could just finish plays, or even catch the ball.

My greatest fear right now is the return of Cisco and Martin. I'm afraid that Greene will be so buried at the end of the bench he'll need a flashlight to find his way to the floor. I'm also afraid that Reggie is falling in love with small ball, and combined with his love affair with Mikkie, Thompson's minutes are going to suffer.

I hope I'm wrong. If not, then as Bricky said, trade Miller, Mikkie, and Salmons.
I totally with you on those points regarding playing time of the youngsters. Until I see otherwise, I expect Greene is going to be the forgotten man when we're at full strength. Maybe Thompson might get some minutes, but then with Reggie, who knows?
 
A

AriesMar27

Guest
#13
the suns could use salmons... hill and barnes arent going to be enough... but i dont want any of their players outside of amare of course... but if we are determined to make martin our number 2 guy then who will be our number 1? it wont be anyone on our current roster and martin cant play sf so it cant be a sg...
 

Entity

Hall of Famer
#15
I totally with you on those points regarding playing time of the youngsters. Until I see otherwise, I expect Greene is going to be the forgotten man when we're at full strength. Maybe Thompson might get some minutes, but then with Reggie, who knows?
Number 1 is not as important as getting a steady 3,4,5,6,7,8. If we get a number it will be clear cut who it is. We have to have the players around him or we will be Minnesota who had the #1 and never had the rest.

I wonder if Phx would do a Salmons, Miller, and Moore for Shaq. Same contract length as miller. It would give plenty of min to our young guys.

Beno/Brown
Martin/Jackson/Douby
Garcia/Greene
Thompson/Hawes/Wiliams
Shaq/Hawes/Williams

Not sure why phx would do this but, I don't think they are going anywhere if they stand pat. The could do a rebuild on the fly like we tried.:D
 

Entity

Hall of Famer
#17
That would leave us with only Sheldon Williams and KT as backups at PF/C and a useless pg. With Shaq we could use him. Now if you just want salary dumps and nothing in return. I could come up with several scenerio's for that.
 
#18
he's been putting up around 20 a game lately. his scoring is good for one reason, to help get him out of here. the kings dont need what he's giving. he's not batman and he's not even robin, and we're still talking about if kmart will ever be a pippen type robin. why dont we start exploring options now
The team doesn't need what he's giving? Tell me: what other player can penetrate the lane and finish? Beno when he's on his game, but nobody else. Martin doesn't have that in his game. He's a great shooter, he can draw the foul in the midrange area, he can work off the ball, but he doesn't break down defenses and get to the basket like Salmons. Garcia doesn't do that either. He's also a better defender than Martin.

I'm not saying he's better than Kevin, but what he does bring to the team is something that is needed, if not by him, then another player who can brought in. He can be criticized about some of his decisions late in close games, but if not for him often times, they wouldn't be in the game. The Kings need a player who can create like that. If they want to deal him, they need another guy who can be that versatile scorer and good defender.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Staff member
#19
Number 1 is not as important as getting a steady 3,4,5,6,7,8. If we get a number it will be clear cut who it is. We have to have the players around him or we will be Minnesota who had the #1 and never had the rest.

You always get the #1 first, or as early as you can. Then you build around him. The #1 is harder to acquite than all the other pieces put together. You are lucky if you get yourself a true #1 once a decade. Its the achilles heel of our rebuild -- we have some nice pieces..but without the heart, the core guy, they will still coalesce into maybe a 45-50 win type team without the oomph to get over the top. In the end we may have to sacrifice a few guys to put together a package for somebody else's damaged goods borderline superstar.
 

Entity

Hall of Famer
#20
You always get the #1 first, or as early as you can. Then you build around him. The #1 is harder to acquite than all the other pieces put together. You are lucky if you get yourself a true #1 once a decade. Its the achilles heel of our rebuild -- we have some nice pieces..but without the heart, the core guy, they will still coalesce into maybe a 45-50 win type team without the oomph to get over the top. In the end we may have to sacrifice a few guys to put together a package for somebody else's damaged goods borderline superstar.

Do you see any potential superstars that their team is willing to trade?
 
#22
Yes, work the phones, get Salmons out of Sacramento. Brad Miller too. Both have value to other teams and the Kings can lose quite nicely with or without those two. Salmons is not a team player in the sense of distributing the ball and thinking "open man." Miller is just used up, physically and chemically.
 
#23
Yes, work the phones, get Salmons out of Sacramento. Brad Miller too. Both have value to other teams and the Kings can lose quite nicely with or without those two. Salmons is not a team player in the sense of distributing the ball and thinking "open man." Miller is just used up, physically and chemically.
While I agree that the moving Salmons and Brad are for future assets ARE in the teams long term best interest, you WHOLLY over-exxagerate the deficiencies of each player. Please rejoin us on planet earth and realize, you may have to wait for the opportune moment to deal these players for VALUE. Which often times may come right at/around the trade deadline. In the mean time enjoy the season, and what these players bring positively to the team at the moment.
 
#25
While I agree that the moving Salmons and Brad are for future assets ARE in the teams long term best interest, you WHOLLY over-exxagerate the deficiencies of each player. Please rejoin us on planet earth and realize, you may have to wait for the opportune moment to deal these players for VALUE. Which often times may come right at/around the trade deadline. In the mean time enjoy the season, and what these players bring positively to the team at the moment.
I've got nothing against getting "value" for these expendables. By all means, deal away. But I stand by my assessments of both players. Miller has to be dealt before his next drug test. He's either severely depressed or swimming in chemicals. Body language doesn't lie. The guy is not happy.
 

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#26
I've got nothing against getting "value" for these expendables. By all means, deal away. But I stand by my assessments of both players. Miller has to be dealt before his next drug test. He's either severely depressed or swimming in chemicals. Body language doesn't lie. The guy is not happy.
I agree. He does not appear to have fun playing the game. Maybe that has nothing to do with depression or chemicals, but he's not having a great time out there. Everything seems like a struggle for him. Regardless, if they can get value for him, I'd trade him.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Staff member
#27
Do you see any potential superstars that their team is willing to trade?

Not particularly. Maybe Arenas. Think Melo has stabilized. Both are flawed. We got lucky lucky lucky with Webber, and Kings fans take that as a normal procedure. Its very rare.

But that is the fly in the ointment. The problem we have -- youngish superstar/borderline superstar players only come on the trade market once every few years, and you have to take what you can get. T-Mac was out there a few years back (ironically I questioned whether we should trade Peja for him). And he hasn't even gotten them past the first round. Its rare, and the guy you do finally get has to have some warts, or he wouldn't be out there. He's almost sure to be second tier, maybe injuries, or legal woes, coach killer, or whatever. Far better to draft them. This is going to be an issue for us going forward unless we can get our guy in the draft.

As an aside, this agents' tactic of having the entire Lebron/Wade class of rookies intentionally take short term deals so they could all become free agents in 2010 and maybe reap a windfall from a new CBA is not helping matters for teams like us. We aren't going to outbid a team like New York for those guys in an open market, and since they have intentionally taken shorter deals, there are many fewer young superstars on long deals out there who could be agitating for a move. They already have their moves planned.
 
#28
Toronto could use Salmons, but I don't think they have the salaries to match, unless the Kings wanted to take back Kris Humphries. They'd trade Joey Graham in a heartbeat, probably Roko Ukic too, but not Jamario Moon or Will Solomon as well. They'd be left with either no backup wingman, or only one point guard.
 
#30
Put Salmon in a package with Shelden and Douby and sent him to Cleveland for Wally Schzerbiak and his expiring contract....Cleveland gets expiring contracts back and someone to cover Ray Allen and Rip Hamilton in the playoffs...We get another 6 million on the books this year and someone who could spread the floor......