Lottery luck...

[est.1999]

Let's say we luck out in the lottery like Portland and Chicago did recently. What do you do:

•Draft Wall, trade Martin, slide Reke over

•Trade down one spot, get some candy, draft best big

•Trade pick for superstar big(however to make it work for both sides)

can someone please add a poll?

 

[VF21]

While I might or might not draft Wall (a lot can happen to draft favorites between now and June), I don't think I'm ready to say trade Martin and move Reke over to the SG position.

The problem with these kinds of threads IMHO is that there are way, way, way too many variables that could change between December and June.

 

[bajaden]

Regardless of how Evans turns out by the end of the year, you draft Wall. He is right now, hands down, the best player in college basketball. Even if you don't need a point guard, he has more value than anyone else you might be able to draft. As far as trading Martin. That would depend on how he fits back in. As VF21 stated, a lot of different senario's could play out between now and then.

 

[Uncia03]

If you have the opportunity to draft a superstar you do it.
So if we had a chance at Wall, I'd draft him and then make whatever changes might be necessary to make it work.

It's like asking Dever if they should draft a LeBron clone while still having Carmelo. You just do it, and figure things out later.

I agree that chemistry is important and you don't want to have major mis-matches at various positions, but though this draft is going to have a lot of solid big man, I don't think any of them will be the type of impact player that Wall has the chance to be.

Fortunately for us, though a Star bigman would be great, we don't have to have a star big man, just a good young defensive big man in order to start taking about making waves in the playoffs.

 

[Vlade4GM]

Depends how other players in the draft develop past this point, but Favors is the only one that can possibly sway me away from taking Wall. I don't think Favors is going to be that convincing come draft time though, he'll probably still be an unknown and a project offensively. I think (at this point) I definitely take and keep Wall, try things out with him and Evans (although I don't have high hopes that they can maximize each other's games,) trade Martin for either another lotto pick or a big like Okafor, and then re-evaluate the backcourt situation after they've played together for a little while.

 

[Rockmeister]

Regardless of how Evans turns out by the end of the year, you draft Wall. He is right now, hands down, the best player in college basketball. Even if you don't need a point guard, he has more value than anyone else you might be able to draft. As far as trading Martin. That would depend on how he fits back in. As VF21 stated, a lot of different senario's could play out between now and then.

I agree with bajaden. I have watched Walls in several games and he is just amazing therefore, you have to draft the best player and right now its Wall.

 

[Bricklayer]

There is only one correct answer here -- you draft Wall, trade Kevin, and move on.

And that is coming from someone who does not think that Wall and Reke make a natural pairing -- both want and need the ball to be effective. Both have weaknesses with the outside shot. That said, talent is talent, superstars are incredibly rare, and if by some miracle if you had a chance to draft your second superstar level talent in two years, you just bleeping take it and work out the rest later. At its best it could literally be, not one ounce of hyperbole involved, one of the best backcourts of all time. Defensively dominant, impossible to stop off the dribble.

 

[bajaden]

There is only one correct answer here -- you draft Wall, trade Kevin, and move on.

And that is coming from someone who does not think that Wall and Reke make a natural pairing -- both want and need the ball to be effective. Both have weaknesses with the outside shot. That said, talent is talent, superstars are incredibly rare, and if by some miracle if you had a chance to draft your second superstar level talent in two years, you just bleeping take it and work out the rest later. At its best it could literally be, not one ounce of hyperbole involved, one of the best backcourts of all time. Defensively dominant, impossible to stop off the dribble.

It would be a nice problem to have. And in fairness to Wall, when he gets himself set, his outside shot is pretty solid. The problem with Wall, if it is a problem, is that he plays at a speed to which most aren't acustomed. I also would like to point out that there's a distinct difference between having to have the ball in your hands to be an effective scorer, than having to have the ball in your hands most of the time. When Evans gets better at moving without the ball, and there's no reason to believe he won't, he'll become even more dangerous. And, if then paired with Wall, well, it could be fun to watch.

 

[Bricklayer]

It would be a nice problem to have. And in fairness to Wall, when he gets himself set, his outside shot is pretty solid. The problem with Wall, if it is a problem, is that he plays at a speed to which most aren't acustomed. I also would like to point out that there's a distinct difference between having to have the ball in your hands to be an effective scorer, than having to have the ball in your hands most of the time. When Evans gets better at moving without the ball, and there's no reason to believe he won't, he'll become even more dangerous. And, if then paired with Wall, well, it could be fun to watch.

Will he? I mean Evans? He will get better of course, but moving without the ball is as a rule something people rely upon who don't have the skill to move with the ball. They certainly aren't more dangerous than guys who can beat you off the bounce. Evans is at his most dangerous with the dribble -- and in fact Evans with the dribble is more dangerous than any pleyer in the league without it. Putting him off the ball would be a complete waste. Which is of course why its not a natural pairing. Have to split duties with the ball. But if you get a chance to have 2 of the top 10 players in the league with the ball, I think you just have to take it and let them sort it out -- or try to.

 

[Merdiesel]

I love Kevin Martin, but having Tyreke Evans and John wall as our back court would be down right scary. You add Casspi with his shooting ability in there at the 3 and you've got an offensive nightmare for opposing teams.

We definitely should make a run at that NYK first rounder that the Jazz have.

 

[bajaden]

Will he? I mean Evans? He will get better of course, but moving without the ball is as a rule something people rely upon who don't have the skill to move with the ball. They certainly aren't more dangerous than guys who can beat you off the bounce. Evans is at his most dangerous with the dribble -- and in fact Evans with the dribble is more dangerous than any pleyer in the league without it. Putting him off the ball would be a complete waste. Which is of course why its not a natural pairing. Have to split duties with the ball. But if you get a chance to have 2 of the top 10 players in the league with the ball, I think you just have to take it and let them sort it out -- or try to.

I don't disagree with anything you just said. But sorting it out would be learning to move without the ball. Because it would make the player with the ball that more effective. Whether that player be Evans or Wall. One thing is for sure. Its hard to score without the ball in you hands.

I've already seen Wall play eight times this year. Fortunately Kentucky is media favorite so far. What makes him so scarey is that when he drives to the basket, you have no idea what he's going to do. I'm not sure he has an idea what he's going to do. But he gets a lot of attention, and that creates a lot of open shots for his teammates. I have never seen anyone quicker with the ball in his hands than Wall. Rose was quick, but in my opinion, Wall is quicker. Look, the odd's of us getting him are slim and none. But if it happens, I'm sure we can find a way to make it work..

 

[jthompson1]

Woah woah woah

Who says we'll be in the lottery?

 

[rainmaker]

I don't want to trade Kevin, especially before we're certian he and Tyreke can't succeed in the same backcourt. But, if we get J Wall, then trade Kevin immediatly. At this point I believe Tyreke is a pg. His shot it too inconsistent to be a sg, fulltime. We also lose our advantage of putting a 6'6" pg in the starting lineup and causing nightmare matchup problems.

However, the potential of a Tyreke/Wall backcourt is just as good, if not better than a Tyreke/Martin backcourt. I still think a Tyreke/Kevin backcourt will be downright scary. But the potential of Wall/Evans, combined with their age, and the player(s) you get in return for KMart, is an offer we can't refuse.

But, I would NEVER consider trading Kevin for a CHANCE at John Wall.

 

[Vlade4GM]

I don't want to trade Kevin, especially before we're certian he and Tyreke can't succeed in the same backcourt. But, if we get J Wall, then trade Kevin immediatly. At this point I believe Tyreke is a pg. His shot it too inconsistent to be a sg, fulltime. We also lose our advantage of putting a 6'6" pg in the starting lineup and causing nightmare matchup problems.

However, the potential of a Tyreke/Wall backcourt is just as good, if not better than a Tyreke/Martin backcourt. I still think a Tyreke/Kevin backcourt will be downright scary. But the potential of Wall/Evans, combined with their age, and the player(s) you get in return for KMart, is an offer we can't refuse.

But, I would NEVER consider trading Kevin for a CHANCE at John Wall.

Evans probably only has about an inch on Wall. Evans is really 6'5, not 6'6.

 

[bajaden]

Evans probably only has about an inch on Wall. Evans is really 6'5, not 6'6.

Hey, maybe he grew an inch. It does happen. We'll never know anyway. Wall is listed at 6'3" by Kentucky, which means he's probably closer to 6'2". Doesn't really matter. He's certainly tall enough to guard just about any point guard in the NBA.

 

[Vlade4GM]

Hey, maybe he grew an inch. It does happen. We'll never know anyway. Wall is listed at 6'3" by Kentucky, which means he's probably closer to 6'2". Doesn't really matter. He's certainly tall enough to guard just about any point guard in the NBA.

Well, he was measured out at 6'5 in shoes at the pre-draft camp which was back in June.

 

[bajaden]

Well, he was measured out at 6'5 in shoes at the pre-draft camp which was back in June.

Yeah, I know that. I was just joking. Everytime I mention that Howard measued out at 6'9" at the camp someone says that he's grown since then. Or if I mention that Durant didn't have a very good vertical at the camp, I'm told that he wasn't really trying so it doesn't count. So turnabout is fair play.

 

[Nighthawk1]

At the rate we're playing we'll be picking 10th or above anyways...

 

[bajaden]

At the rate we're playing we'll be picking 10th or above anyways...

Your probably right, but who knows, its a long season. Not that I'm wishing for anything to go wrong. I think it would be poetic justice for the Kings to hold the 13th spot and get the first pick. It would sort of make up for all those bad luck years..

 

[Nighthawk1]

Your probably right, but who knows, its a long season. Not that I'm wishing for anything to go wrong. I think it would be poetic justice for the Kings to hold the 13th spot and get the first pick. It would sort of make up for all those bad luck years..

To be perfectly honest, I'd be happy for us to go tank the last half of the season (most fans wouldn't). That is if we're a team hovering around .500 and haven't made any trade deadline trades. We need more talent, and in key/specific areas..

 

[Bricklayer]

To be perfectly honest, I'd be happy for us to go tank the last half of the season (most fans wouldn't). That is if we're a team hovering around .500 and haven't made any trade deadline trades. We need more talent, and in key/specific areas..

Not this season.

1) if we are hovering around .500 that deep, you gotta go for it. That means you are still in the playoff hunt, and even being in the loose hunt going into March is just a momentous acheivement/learning experience for such a young team.

2) how exactly would we tank? Normally you do that by playing your young guys -- the "tank" is also player dvelopment time. But we are winning preceisely because of our young guys. We started a lineup of all 5 guys 23 and under against Cleveland and took them to OT. So how do we tank? Play the old guys? Hope that Kevin messes us up? Actually throw games? There's just no clean way to do it without throwing a stink over a breakout season and crushing whatever renewal of the ticket base that might have been cooking. The the team can start to get good again in Kansas City.

 

[bajaden]

Not this season.

1) if we are hovering around .500 that deep, you gotta go for it. That means you are still in the playoff hunt, and even being in the loose hunt going into March is just a momentous acheivement/learning experience for such a young team.

2) how exactly would we tank? Normally you do that by playing your young guys -- the "tank" is also player dvelopment time. But we are winning preceisely because of our young guys. We started a lineup of all 5 guys 23 and under against Cleveland and took them to OT. So how do we tank? Play the old guys? Hope that Kevin messes us up? Actually throw games? There's just no clean way to do it without throwing a stink over a breakout season and crushing whatever renewal of the ticket base that might have been cooking. The the team can start to get good again in Kansas City.

Well said!

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Agreed that no deliberate losing of games should be considered this year but by the same token its why I am not getting worked up over close hard fought losses that are definite learning experiences and exciting to watch. I want to watch the Kings this year. It felt like a chore the past few seasons and I dropped league pass (life got in the way as well there).

One danger of tanking is players getting comfortable with losing. I think the young guys that are getting all the action right now are clearly not comfortable with losing and that is a great thing.

 

[CruzDude]

Trouble is Wall should go #1 in draft and Kings will not be at that level. In fact, I had part of a dream last night that the Kings finish with 39 wins and 9th in west. That said, we will know better after the all-star break where team is and what is needed. Sean May is not needed but is insurance only. Brockman is showing more and more value each game as the 3rd big and Greene can be a 4 backup as well as a 3 (tho' his 3 play has been great lately, especially on Defense).

If Martin comes back and can provide 20 pts/gm+ at the 3 with Greene backup and Casspi then Noce, who I like a lot, becomes tradeable and could be a good fit for many teams.

Odd thought about K9: what if he stays, takes the vet minimum next year and mentors and gets 15 min/gm next year helping the kids to deep in playoffs? Just a thought.

 

[mr. moustache]

Tank perhaps isn't the right word, but I do think we should be prioritizing player development over winning. That said, I don't think it's fair to sit players that give you a chance to win.

I'd like to see 0 minutes for Beno, Noc, Kenny, Ime, and anyone else over 25 that's currently getting minutes. I don't know how much value Beno and Noc have, but I'd happily trade for expirings, or if that deal isn't there, for shorter contracts.

Beno and Ime have certainly accounted for some wins this year if you replace all of their minutes with Sergio and Greene.

Not this season.

1) if we are hovering around .500 that deep, you gotta go for it. That means you are still in the playoff hunt, and even being in the loose hunt going into March is just a momentous acheivement/learning experience for such a young team.

2) how exactly would we tank? Normally you do that by playing your young guys -- the "tank" is also player dvelopment time. But we are winning preceisely because of our young guys. We started a lineup of all 5 guys 23 and under against Cleveland and took them to OT. So how do we tank? Play the old guys? Hope that Kevin messes us up? Actually throw games? There's just no clean way to do it without throwing a stink over a breakout season and crushing whatever renewal of the ticket base that might have been cooking. The the team can start to get good again in Kansas City.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Tank perhaps isn't the right word, but I do think we should be prioritizing player development over winning. That said, I don't think it's fair to sit players that give you a chance to win.

And so far we've done precisely this. We'll have to see when Kevin and Cisco get back what happens but stuff like putting the game in Rekes hands the past few nights have cost us games but offered huge learning experiences in the process. Like I said in the Lakers game thread, without a doubt Theus would have benched Reke at the end. We'd probably won the game and been worse off in the long run for it.

 

[Vlade4GM]

My attitude this season about our draft position is whatever will be, will be. Honestly, I'd love to have another high pick because I'm a draft hound and I follow year round, but there's a cost to that. This year is different than years past, we are actually playing for something, the development of our young players. I don't know what more you can do in a rebuilding situation. Still, the draft is very important to what we're doing and we're not finished in terms of building our core.

 

[bajaden]

My attitude this season about our draft position is whatever will be, will be. Honestly, I'd love to have another high pick because I'm a draft hound and I follow year round, but there's a cost to that. This year is different than years past, we are actually playing for something, the development of our young players. I don't know what more you can do in a rebuilding situation. Still, the draft is very important to what we're doing and we're not finished in terms of building our core.

I agree with you 100%. My gut tells me that were not going to make the playoffs this year. And stranger things have happened. But, if your in the lottery there's always a chance, a small chance, but a chance of landing the first pick. Not counting on it though. However this is shaping up to be a pretty deep draft. It may not be deep at the position we would prefer but I think the Kings will get a good player out of it.

I'm always hopeful that someone like an Evan Turner will slide because of his back injury. Yeah, I know he's a SG, but he's a dammed special one. Whatever happens, this should be one of most interesting off-seasons we'll have in a long time.

 

[Gary]

Wall is a once in a decade PG talent.. I can see him being better than Paul (yes he's that good).. If we had a chance to get him regardless of who's playing at PG we need to take him.