[Game] Los Angeles Clippers at Sacramento Kings, 11/29/2023, 7pm Pacific 10pm Eastern
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A couple points on your stats.
1) Neither Gobert nor AD are physical centers that would in the model we are concerned about. Sabonis bullied Gobert the entire game and AD has always been super soft.
2) unless the other teams are playing the Warriors D with the center dropping into the lane it’s not the point we are making. It’s when the center drops and perimeter players press out that the offense gets mucked up.
1) Neither Gobert nor AD are physical centers that would in the model we are concerned about. Sabonis bullied Gobert the entire game and AD has always been super soft.
2) unless the other teams are playing the Warriors D with the center dropping into the lane it’s not the point we are making. It’s when the center drops and perimeter players press out that the offense gets mucked up.
Kings really feel Keegans absence in these types of matchups (forget the let down B2B issue that was super apparent) there is no wing person besides Barnes that can take the pressure of Fox and Domas - Offensively and Defensively. I like Kessler defensively, but when he catches the balls he's immediately playing hot potato and trying to throw it to the first open person he sees. When he does catch it and he's open for a shot, it's almost like his brain glitches and realizes he has to shoot it. On occasion when he is catching it the flow of a set, he can catch and fire, but that is it right now. And unfortunately, that person can't play much in the NBA.
This Kings team will continue to be a 45-50 win team, middle top of the conference as constructed. Which is a really good, really fun team, until they can make Domas the 3rd option on offense and 4th or 5th on defense. If Keegan makes that leap this year (he has defensively in my mind) maybe that changes some stuff, but as of now we don't have that. We need another top 30 offensive (bucket getter) player on the wing.
We also need one more defender who isn't a zero on offense. If that player can be both AKA Annunoby, then we have something. But I also don't want Monte to sell the farm for a player who probably isn't Max worthy, probably is getting close to the Max and the sense I get it, he wants to test Free Agency. That could be a disaster.
This Kings team will continue to be a 45-50 win team, middle top of the conference as constructed. Which is a really good, really fun team, until they can make Domas the 3rd option on offense and 4th or 5th on defense. If Keegan makes that leap this year (he has defensively in my mind) maybe that changes some stuff, but as of now we don't have that. We need another top 30 offensive (bucket getter) player on the wing.
We also need one more defender who isn't a zero on offense. If that player can be both AKA Annunoby, then we have something. But I also don't want Monte to sell the farm for a player who probably isn't Max worthy, probably is getting close to the Max and the sense I get it, he wants to test Free Agency. That could be a disaster.
It really limits their options when he is turning down the 14-17 foot shot. I don't see any way around him needing to take that shot and hitting it at a decent clip, in order for this team to become a real contender,... especially when matched up against the bigger centers who greatly minimize the bully ball. It's tough to take it right into them, because these guys are not only heavier and wider than he is, but also longer
I think you're just negatively hyper focused on Sabonis right now. We all know the dude isn't perfect. He's not Jokic, he's not Embiid. He is what he is. Swap him out for any other attainable center out there and the Kings are automatically worse.
I really don't see what the big deal is. He can't dominate every center he goes up against. So what? Fox can't dominate every PG either. Holiday has had his number for years. I don't think the team needs to be looking elsewhere because there's a few centers that can put the cuffs on Sabonis. The player you get in return is not going to be able to dominate all of the starting centers in the league.
I really don't see what the big deal is. He can't dominate every center he goes up against. So what? Fox can't dominate every PG either. Holiday has had his number for years. I don't think the team needs to be looking elsewhere because there's a few centers that can put the cuffs on Sabonis. The player you get in return is not going to be able to dominate all of the starting centers in the league.
I think figuring a way around this issue is the biggest hurdle between another first round exit and going further in the playoffs.
and I’m not calling for Sabonis to be traded. Either Sabonis has to hit 3’s or we have to play more small ball in those instances. But with Keegan’s defensive improvement it is in my opinion our biggest area of needed improvement.
and I’m not calling for Sabonis to be traded. Either Sabonis has to hit 3’s or we have to play more small ball in those instances. But with Keegan’s defensive improvement it is in my opinion our biggest area of needed improvement.
Think the point also has to be made that we're the Sacramento Kings. We're not the Lakers/Knicks/Heat/Warriors that get to cycle through stars like they're candy and always be considered a FA destination or trade destination. That's changing a little bit in the past few years, but still, I don't think Sacramento ever becomes like a top 10 destination for guys to go.
So while Fox/Domas can be considered flawed as a star duo (Shooting/defense, etc) we have to make the best of it because we just aren't going to find better options very often. Both dudes are already 2 of the best Kings of all time in the Sacramento era... in nearly 40 years of the team being here.
And thankfully, both guys have actually improved on the shooting/defense aspect of their game since becoming a duo. They're getting better, which should give us some hope they can fill those holes in their games. But it's also on Monte to have a team build around them that's a bit more unique in order to fit their skill-set.
So while Fox/Domas can be considered flawed as a star duo (Shooting/defense, etc) we have to make the best of it because we just aren't going to find better options very often. Both dudes are already 2 of the best Kings of all time in the Sacramento era... in nearly 40 years of the team being here.
And thankfully, both guys have actually improved on the shooting/defense aspect of their game since becoming a duo. They're getting better, which should give us some hope they can fill those holes in their games. But it's also on Monte to have a team build around them that's a bit more unique in order to fit their skill-set.
Yeah, Idk what happened in the Warriors series. Whether he was hurt, lost confidence, whatever, but him refusing to shoot with 10 feet of space was a major problem. But that wasn't an issue for most of the regular season and it hasn't been an issue this season either. Domas took a couple 3's with no hesitation and an elbow jumper with no hesitation last night. I almost don't care if he makes them or not, I just want him to be shooting when he's open and in rhythm.
I don't have an issue with trying something different when Sabonis is off his game. I just think his off games are very few and far between. It can definitely be an issue in a playoff series though. I honestly thought Sabonis letting Looney out rebound him was a much bigger factor than any issues he had offensively in that series. Those second chance points killed us. I don't think his shooting was the difference maker there and I don't think it's a difference maker in most of our games. Usually the centers that he faces up against can't shoot very well either.
But the series wasn't lost because of him. Barnes, Huerter and Davion were pretty bad as well. The Warriors had a good game plan, out muscled us and we missed our shots. It seems to get in their heads because I feel like when they start off the game hot from the perimeter, they stay hot. If they start cold, they just chuck up brick after brick for the next 3 quarters.
But the series wasn't lost because of him. Barnes, Huerter and Davion were pretty bad as well. The Warriors had a good game plan, out muscled us and we missed our shots. It seems to get in their heads because I feel like when they start off the game hot from the perimeter, they stay hot. If they start cold, they just chuck up brick after brick for the next 3 quarters.
You don’t think this is a somewhat slippery appeal to authority when you’re essentially arguing ITT that the reigning “NBA person” of the year has it all wrong about one of his most valued players?
is your buddy a GM? assistant GM? Assistant to the assistant?
While I’m sure most NBA front office employees have opinions about basketball, I do know that they don’t all have valued opinions about basketball. So being an NBA person doesn’t really mean anything to us without specifics..and even then, roster oriented NBA people are fired en masse every year for being wrong too often about basketball.
it doesn’t really matter what your friends role is since nobody is arguing you’re wrong about Sabonis simply because they think McNair is good at his job. It’s based on “data”.
I think you know that as well, otherwise you wouldn’t consistently lean on the most context void and meaningless of stats in +\- to minimize one of the best advanced data players in the game from last season.
it also can’t be true that he always or even fairly often struggles against the type of bigs you described. Domas bad games were so rare last season that I can still name them off the top of my head. He wouldn’t be one of those most consistent and efficient players in the NBA if he had such apparent weaknesses.
Quite simply, he would be a reserve if he was as you described because atleast half the starting bigs in the league are a bit taller or as strong if not stronger than him.
You don’t get to where Sabonis has in the modern NBA by accident. He’s one of the best bigs in the NBA going by raw numbers and advanced stats. Also results. He makes his team and teammates better.
You know..kb02 didn’t go off the rails immediately. He was a serious poster and one of the better ones on the forum for awhile. Even his initial misgivings about Fox weren’t unreasonable…but he became obsessed with the take and started lapping up the negative responses he got as people who can’t “handle the truth”. Then came the Fox and Mo Williams comparison and a fan who couldn’t even enjoy his team finally being good.
The reason I bring it up is that last night you basically implied he was a back up big and Zubac was out of his league(or he’s overmatched) by suggesting that his minutes should be lined up with Thies instead… because after all, he’s only good against marginal, weaker and undersized bigs like Thies. So forgive those who might start to think your skepticism is evolving to trolling.
is your buddy a GM? assistant GM? Assistant to the assistant?
While I’m sure most NBA front office employees have opinions about basketball, I do know that they don’t all have valued opinions about basketball. So being an NBA person doesn’t really mean anything to us without specifics..and even then, roster oriented NBA people are fired en masse every year for being wrong too often about basketball.
it doesn’t really matter what your friends role is since nobody is arguing you’re wrong about Sabonis simply because they think McNair is good at his job. It’s based on “data”.
I think you know that as well, otherwise you wouldn’t consistently lean on the most context void and meaningless of stats in +\- to minimize one of the best advanced data players in the game from last season.
it also can’t be true that he always or even fairly often struggles against the type of bigs you described. Domas bad games were so rare last season that I can still name them off the top of my head. He wouldn’t be one of those most consistent and efficient players in the NBA if he had such apparent weaknesses.
Quite simply, he would be a reserve if he was as you described because atleast half the starting bigs in the league are a bit taller or as strong if not stronger than him.
You don’t get to where Sabonis has in the modern NBA by accident. He’s one of the best bigs in the NBA going by raw numbers and advanced stats. Also results. He makes his team and teammates better.
You know..kb02 didn’t go off the rails immediately. He was a serious poster and one of the better ones on the forum for awhile. Even his initial misgivings about Fox weren’t unreasonable…but he became obsessed with the take and started lapping up the negative responses he got as people who can’t “handle the truth”. Then came the Fox and Mo Williams comparison and a fan who couldn’t even enjoy his team finally being good.
The reason I bring it up is that last night you basically implied he was a back up big and Zubac was out of his league(or he’s overmatched) by suggesting that his minutes should be lined up with Thies instead… because after all, he’s only good against marginal, weaker and undersized bigs like Thies. So forgive those who might start to think your skepticism is evolving to trolling.
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GS are up 17 points after 17 minutes against Clipers ....
Wonder if there is a statistic for the back to back games teams are playing during the season ....
What is the reason to schedule such games , after all players are also human , not robots , it is close to impossible to recover for
less then 24 hours ...
Wonder if there is a statistic for the back to back games teams are playing during the season ....
What is the reason to schedule such games , after all players are also human , not robots , it is close to impossible to recover for
less then 24 hours ...
Here is one for the 2013-14 season:
<To the surprise of no NBA fan, teams playing on the tail end of a back-to-back win less frequently than teams who aren’t. Since the beginning of the 2013-14 season, teams on back-to-backs have a .444 win percentage compared to .517 otherwise. And while this discrepancy is partially explained by the fact that most back-to-backs end on the road (68%), teams win roughly 8% less often both at home and away.>
https://greenandgoldanalytics.wordp...nalyzing-the-effect-of-the-back-to-back-game/
<To the surprise of no NBA fan, teams playing on the tail end of a back-to-back win less frequently than teams who aren’t. Since the beginning of the 2013-14 season, teams on back-to-backs have a .444 win percentage compared to .517 otherwise. And while this discrepancy is partially explained by the fact that most back-to-backs end on the road (68%), teams win roughly 8% less often both at home and away.>
https://greenandgoldanalytics.wordp...nalyzing-the-effect-of-the-back-to-back-game/
According to Jason Anderson, Trey Lyles has been ruled out against Denver with "a high right ankle sprain." If he was injured in the Clippers game, I missed it. This is a similar injury to the one Alex Len has, but so far, I am not finding out anything about the severity.
Lyles has played just four games since finally joining the team on the court in November.
Lyles has played just four games since finally joining the team on the court in November.
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Great point. It's not like the league is ignorant of statistics. It is probably not a coincidence that the Kings have played back to backs against western conference teams that they may end up competing with for playoff positioning. I'm immediately curious to know what the 7akers schedule looks like regarding back to backs and who their opponents are for such games. Pansies.
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