These same fans helped save the Kings from leaving, so that may be a bit unfair. Tyreke was getting millions to play for the Kings and be a professional. He was an excellent sport about getting jerked the way he did, but that doesn't make him a saint, just a good professional. The fans pay to see the players and the team... Fans are always going to judge and have different opinions.
Kings trading Evans for Vasquez/Lopez
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I agree. And the more I think about this, the more I believe they are really sure Tyreke is not the right player for this team or won't ever reach the potential we think he has. Why? Because for a brand new FO the easiest thing to do is matching the offer. The fans are happy, and they play it safe. They decided to make a move, an unpopular one, so I believe they must have a plan. I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt until I see the final product, and what this team will be in 2 or 3 years.
For what we know, Tyreke could become a Larry Hughes. He's not a sure thing.
For what we know, Tyreke could become a Larry Hughes. He's not a sure thing.
If this is true that he is bein traded and i keep saying if cuz I really hospe it's not, but most of you are acting like its the end of the world. Don't get me wrong I REALLY want Tyreke here for a long time just because of his potential and for what he did as a rookie and a PG
but
If it is true at least PDA isn't letting him go for nothing. Over the years a lot of you always complained of how we needed a pass first PG and now we might have one, not a star by any means but as of mat year a solid player. And I understand that Tyrekes strengths match perfectly with B MCKs but Vasquez didn't lead the league in assists for being a sub par PG on a not so good NO team.
Over the years we've always wanted a shot blocker, now we have one, again not a top teir one but we have one, probably won't even be the same as when we had Dally but we still have one! Now all we need to do is get an above average SF and we are headed in the right direction.
Don't get me wrong I probably want Tyreke just as
Much as Tyrekes number one fan but I have faith in our FO.
but
If it is true at least PDA isn't letting him go for nothing. Over the years a lot of you always complained of how we needed a pass first PG and now we might have one, not a star by any means but as of mat year a solid player. And I understand that Tyrekes strengths match perfectly with B MCKs but Vasquez didn't lead the league in assists for being a sub par PG on a not so good NO team.
Over the years we've always wanted a shot blocker, now we have one, again not a top teir one but we have one, probably won't even be the same as when we had Dally but we still have one! Now all we need to do is get an above average SF and we are headed in the right direction.
Don't get me wrong I probably want Tyreke just as
Much as Tyrekes number one fan but I have faith in our FO.
A comparison, an unfortunate one, suggested itself to me, and I looked it up, and sure enough:
Career Per36 numbers of two largish, slowfooted, shooting impaired 26yr old PGs:
Player 1: 16.3pts (.441 .324 .798) 4.3reb 6.7ast 1.1stl 0.1blk 2.7TO
Player 2: 13.2pts (.429 .325 .806) 4.0reb 8.3ast 1.0stl 0.1blk 3.2TO
Player 1 is Ramon Sessions. Players 2 is Grevis Vasquez.
And hence why despite the nice statline last season I have questions about how much is solid and how much illusion with Vasquez. Only added to when New Orleans summarily replaced him as their first offseason move. I obviously like him more than Sessions, but do I trust him? Is he legit or just big numbers on a bad team.
Career Per36 numbers of two largish, slowfooted, shooting impaired 26yr old PGs:
Player 1: 16.3pts (.441 .324 .798) 4.3reb 6.7ast 1.1stl 0.1blk 2.7TO
Player 2: 13.2pts (.429 .325 .806) 4.0reb 8.3ast 1.0stl 0.1blk 3.2TO
Player 1 is Ramon Sessions. Players 2 is Grevis Vasquez.
And hence why despite the nice statline last season I have questions about how much is solid and how much illusion with Vasquez. Only added to when New Orleans summarily replaced him as their first offseason move. I obviously like him more than Sessions, but do I trust him? Is he legit or just big numbers on a bad team.
since when did not signing talent qualify as "having balls"? it's precisely because this team isn't winning that it's imperative to bring in more talent. if that means signing iggy, then fine. but ranadive/PDA showed a complete lack of balls by pulling out because iggy didn't give them an immediate response. now they're showing fewer balls between them by failing to do what they should have done in the first place: lock up tyreke on a reasonable contract. if you don't like him, you trade him on your terms, and for something closer to value than vasquez/lopez. but this whole thing reeks of ineptitude, of a new regime afraid to get its feet wet. they're taking the safe, lazy way out. and it is disappointing, to say the least, especially after all this talk of being aggressive. it's faux aggression. y'know, "let's push hard for free agents, but let's not actually sign either of the two most talented players we've negotiated with."
Usually the mantra of the big numbers on poor team stems from the scoring aspect. Not usually the case with assist. I am pro tyreke as you have seen throughout the past 4 seasons up until now. However having been a fan during this same time. I see a change has to be made somewhere. first glance I kneejerk like you and hate this trade. At the same time i think I will actually reserve judgment at this time. I trust Maclemore will be a better than good if not great. I also think this is not the end. moves to be made a still 8-9 mil in capspace can be used not counting a possible amnesty.
Amazing that the Kings didn't match. Never saw that coming.
Brick- I've read here a long time. I also come from a family of attorneys, my Dad used to teach at McGeorge under Dean Schaber. I have a special empathy and respect for them.
But man- you sure are the textbook Internet bully aren't you?
Dismissive, condescending, all-knowing. Should someone disagree, they'll rue the day won't they? God forbid they take you on full force, you're a mod with the edit/ban hammer. And let's remember, and bank chock full of e-cred.
Bottom line? This thread makes me want to vomit. Sorry, but yeah- Vivek grabbed this team and RIDICULOUSLY overpaid to keep them here. 535? C'mon. I'm sure he's looking forward to reaping those profits by immediately dropping trou and defacing the Shield of Defiance.
Do they all get some mythical free pass because they may be nice guys? HELL NO. But some of you are screaming bloody murder and rebuild and embarrassment and blah.
Im not advocating being a blind cheerleader at all, and boards are for discussion and all, however:
This was expected
Why are so many convinced the FO is done here?
This was as much about DMC as Evans, both on court and future signing.
Most of all, can these guys perhaps get ONE SEASON? You know, ONE SEASON, to work on this team? Apparently Vivek is not as smart as he seems. Why grab Pete when he had Bricklayer of KingsFans.com waiting in the wings.
I love Tyreke, I really do, despite what some agenda-mongers have said before. But I think and have thought that this will be a good move. Guess what! I also think Tyreke will probably be an all-star someday too!
OH MY GOD AN ALLSTAR HOW COULD WE TRADE HIM?!!! ZOMGWTFBBQ????
Maybe it's possible that this could be a good move for both sides.
Less than two months ago many were convinced that we would be watching the Sonics build a team through the cracks of our fingers while in permanent facepalm. Now some are ready to burn the place down for ineptitude after one draft pick and a trade.
I for one say let's let these guys have some rope, and see where they are taking us. It doesn't benefit them to not have a winning product.
And Brick- swing away Merrill. I know how this works. Flay me open to the world. It's your store, you have to to what you have to do. E-cred baby.
Brick- I've read here a long time. I also come from a family of attorneys, my Dad used to teach at McGeorge under Dean Schaber. I have a special empathy and respect for them.
But man- you sure are the textbook Internet bully aren't you?
Dismissive, condescending, all-knowing. Should someone disagree, they'll rue the day won't they? God forbid they take you on full force, you're a mod with the edit/ban hammer. And let's remember, and bank chock full of e-cred.
Bottom line? This thread makes me want to vomit. Sorry, but yeah- Vivek grabbed this team and RIDICULOUSLY overpaid to keep them here. 535? C'mon. I'm sure he's looking forward to reaping those profits by immediately dropping trou and defacing the Shield of Defiance.
Do they all get some mythical free pass because they may be nice guys? HELL NO. But some of you are screaming bloody murder and rebuild and embarrassment and blah.
Im not advocating being a blind cheerleader at all, and boards are for discussion and all, however:
This was expected
Why are so many convinced the FO is done here?
This was as much about DMC as Evans, both on court and future signing.
Most of all, can these guys perhaps get ONE SEASON? You know, ONE SEASON, to work on this team? Apparently Vivek is not as smart as he seems. Why grab Pete when he had Bricklayer of KingsFans.com waiting in the wings.
I love Tyreke, I really do, despite what some agenda-mongers have said before. But I think and have thought that this will be a good move. Guess what! I also think Tyreke will probably be an all-star someday too!
OH MY GOD AN ALLSTAR HOW COULD WE TRADE HIM?!!! ZOMGWTFBBQ????
Maybe it's possible that this could be a good move for both sides.
Less than two months ago many were convinced that we would be watching the Sonics build a team through the cracks of our fingers while in permanent facepalm. Now some are ready to burn the place down for ineptitude after one draft pick and a trade.
I for one say let's let these guys have some rope, and see where they are taking us. It doesn't benefit them to not have a winning product.
And Brick- swing away Merrill. I know how this works. Flay me open to the world. It's your store, you have to to what you have to do. E-cred baby.
Trying to work through what the deal means for some of the players on our roster ...
If we keep Marcus Thornton I think it's highly likely he beats on McLemore for the starting job, and with Vasquez's passing, Cousins attention, and the fact that he'll be relied on heavily as a scorer now we can expect a huge comeback year for him. At the very least, bring his trade value up then deal him at the deadline or in the offseason. I still want Kirilenko. Shooting will no longer be needed now that Evans is gone for two reason. #1 being that the new SG, be it McLemore or Thornton will be able to shoot, and Vasquez can shoot it well enough. #2 being we no longer have an elite penetrator that needs as much floor spacing as possible.
We have 3 legit options to start next to Cousins right now. You could make a case for any of them. I still like JT most as the backup big who can swing between both spots and despite the reserve role he'd still get more minutes than any big not named DeMarcus Cousins.
If we can sign AK47 I wouldn't be against letting Patterson start, as Cousins and AK both like to work inside. AK's rebounding ability would cover up Patterson, and Vasquez is a decent rebounder for a guard.
Lopez is interesting. On the surface he seems like a good fit next to Cousins. Really big but also a very good athlete. He doesn't take any shots he won't make (dunks, putbacks, etc) and he can block shots. I can't figure out why he's such a bad rebounder. It doesn't make any sense. If we start Lopez and Cousins with Patterson and JT off the bench (and most nights those guys could play more than Lopez) I could certainly understand the direction. AK's rebounding would also help us with Lopez lack of rebounding.
If we keep Marcus Thornton I think it's highly likely he beats on McLemore for the starting job, and with Vasquez's passing, Cousins attention, and the fact that he'll be relied on heavily as a scorer now we can expect a huge comeback year for him. At the very least, bring his trade value up then deal him at the deadline or in the offseason. I still want Kirilenko. Shooting will no longer be needed now that Evans is gone for two reason. #1 being that the new SG, be it McLemore or Thornton will be able to shoot, and Vasquez can shoot it well enough. #2 being we no longer have an elite penetrator that needs as much floor spacing as possible.
We have 3 legit options to start next to Cousins right now. You could make a case for any of them. I still like JT most as the backup big who can swing between both spots and despite the reserve role he'd still get more minutes than any big not named DeMarcus Cousins.
If we can sign AK47 I wouldn't be against letting Patterson start, as Cousins and AK both like to work inside. AK's rebounding ability would cover up Patterson, and Vasquez is a decent rebounder for a guard.
Lopez is interesting. On the surface he seems like a good fit next to Cousins. Really big but also a very good athlete. He doesn't take any shots he won't make (dunks, putbacks, etc) and he can block shots. I can't figure out why he's such a bad rebounder. It doesn't make any sense. If we start Lopez and Cousins with Patterson and JT off the bench (and most nights those guys could play more than Lopez) I could certainly understand the direction. AK's rebounding would also help us with Lopez lack of rebounding.
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While I always wanted to see how Malone will work Evans and McLemore to a "T". A sign and trade for Vazquez and Lopez may not add real "star" players to the team, but IMHO this make the team more balance and more atoned to the FO's philosophy of assembling a fast team.
Vazquez has real good size (6'6") and he has taken advantage of this for looking shooters. I don't think his close to 9 assist per is a fluke.
Lopez is preferably the one of the most agile big to run the floor in this generation. And good thing of having Lopez is that DMC can slide to PF and do a lot of damage there.
We can field a really big and balance lineup with:
PG - Vazquez (6'6") - assist man/floor general
SG - McLemore (6'5") - spot-up shooter/high flyer
SF - TBD
PF - DMC (6'11" 260 lbs) - a bully down low/good assist big
C - Lopez (7') - help defense/quick-footed big
As a Kingsfans, I have already been hardened by the idiotic regime of the Maloofs.
Vivek just saved the franchise and kept it in Sac.
He can **** me all he want for one or two season for keeping the team in Sac.
But I know he won't coz the guy is not going to just throw money out there.
The FO is simply revamping team principle and culture.
And changing of guards is where it could start.
Vazquez has real good size (6'6") and he has taken advantage of this for looking shooters. I don't think his close to 9 assist per is a fluke.
Lopez is preferably the one of the most agile big to run the floor in this generation. And good thing of having Lopez is that DMC can slide to PF and do a lot of damage there.
We can field a really big and balance lineup with:
PG - Vazquez (6'6") - assist man/floor general
SG - McLemore (6'5") - spot-up shooter/high flyer
SF - TBD
PF - DMC (6'11" 260 lbs) - a bully down low/good assist big
C - Lopez (7') - help defense/quick-footed big
As a Kingsfans, I have already been hardened by the idiotic regime of the Maloofs.
Vivek just saved the franchise and kept it in Sac.
He can **** me all he want for one or two season for keeping the team in Sac.
But I know he won't coz the guy is not going to just throw money out there.
The FO is simply revamping team principle and culture.
And changing of guards is where it could start.
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Do we have to keep talking about Vivek saving the team when basketball moves are being made? we are all in debt to him in that regard, but this is the NBA. Moves happen, people talk about them. People like them or hate them, it's the way it is. No grace period.
If Evans becomes the player Evans can become, this was a terrible move we will feel for a long time. PDA is banking on that not happening. We'll see.
If Evans becomes the player Evans can become, this was a terrible move we will feel for a long time. PDA is banking on that not happening. We'll see.
Man, just as I was preparing to explain to somebody else that I am virturally impossible to insult, along comes this. 
First, don't come on here swinging your E-codpiece as Carmichael Dave, savior of cities, and then accuse me of abusing E-cred. At least I throw out arguments to be attacked. You are throwing out "end all dissent because I am Carmichael Dave!" And if that is not what you intended, its the effect nonetheless because like it or not, you are Carmichael Dave.
Nor come on here and accuse me of abusing mod powers to win arguments. I play a very fair game Dave. I don't think I have banned anyone in a year at least. You can leave it to your pal Napear to do the call screening and hang up on anybody disagreeing with him bit. That denotes weakness, not strength. I pummel people with logic and analysis, I need no cheats.
Its nice that you are friends with Vivek and feel close and warm and fuzzy and stuff. I actually mean that despite the snarky tone, it was a good thing. But your emotional reaction to your friend being attacked and your In Vivek We Trust loyal fan reaction is no more legit than other people's emotional reaction to their player being attacked, and btw Dave, by extension their team being damaged. Because that's the rub isn't it. If you think this is a bad move then you think that PDA came in here, an outsider, a nobody to the Kingdom, and in the matter of a few weeks hurt the future of the team we are all fans of.
And yes, put in a good word for me with Vivek if you will. If Pete keeps on like this, somebody will have to come in and clean up the mess afterwards. Tell him I'll work cheap.
Now let's end this fussing and fighting. Tis unseemly and unsettling for the fanbase.
First, don't come on here swinging your E-codpiece as Carmichael Dave, savior of cities, and then accuse me of abusing E-cred. At least I throw out arguments to be attacked. You are throwing out "end all dissent because I am Carmichael Dave!" And if that is not what you intended, its the effect nonetheless because like it or not, you are Carmichael Dave.
Nor come on here and accuse me of abusing mod powers to win arguments. I play a very fair game Dave. I don't think I have banned anyone in a year at least. You can leave it to your pal Napear to do the call screening and hang up on anybody disagreeing with him bit. That denotes weakness, not strength. I pummel people with logic and analysis, I need no cheats.
Its nice that you are friends with Vivek and feel close and warm and fuzzy and stuff. I actually mean that despite the snarky tone, it was a good thing. But your emotional reaction to your friend being attacked and your In Vivek We Trust loyal fan reaction is no more legit than other people's emotional reaction to their player being attacked, and btw Dave, by extension their team being damaged. Because that's the rub isn't it. If you think this is a bad move then you think that PDA came in here, an outsider, a nobody to the Kingdom, and in the matter of a few weeks hurt the future of the team we are all fans of.
And yes, put in a good word for me with Vivek if you will. If Pete keeps on like this, somebody will have to come in and clean up the mess afterwards. Tell him I'll work cheap.
Now let's end this fussing and fighting. Tis unseemly and unsettling for the fanbase.
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I said that he could be, not that he would be.
Robin Lopez last year - 82 games started, 26MPG, 11.3 PPG, 8.8 FGA, .534 FG%, 5.6 REB, 1.6 BLK
Jason Thompson last year - 81 games, 28 MPG, 10.9 PPG, 9.1 FGA, .502 FG%, 6.7 REB, 0.7 BLK
One could make the case that Lopez was better last year in every stat category aside from rebounding. More points, less shots, less minutes, more blocks, higher FG%. It's close, but Lopez has a very nice season last year.
Robin Lopez last year - 82 games started, 26MPG, 11.3 PPG, 8.8 FGA, .534 FG%, 5.6 REB, 1.6 BLK
Jason Thompson last year - 81 games, 28 MPG, 10.9 PPG, 9.1 FGA, .502 FG%, 6.7 REB, 0.7 BLK
One could make the case that Lopez was better last year in every stat category aside from rebounding. More points, less shots, less minutes, more blocks, higher FG%. It's close, but Lopez has a very nice season last year.
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