I like it. If Sabonis' training with LethalShooter is successful and can get him to at least 35%. And if Fox can keep shooting 6 threes a game at 37%, like he has been since Sabonis has been here, then it won't matter if we don't have our own "Splash Brothers." If your whole team can, quite literally, shoot the three ball then that puts a lot of pressure on the opposing team.
KINGS PICKING 4TH IN 2022 NBA DRAFT!
- Thread starter Tetsujin
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The beauty is it wouldn't be overtly difficult.
-Draft Keegan at 4.
-Flip Holmes for Kleber (try to get a pick if we can, or bug them for Josh Green for a developing wing prospect). My guess is they'll be very willing to comply with adding extra; they're more or less capped out. Luka starts his big contract next season, Brunson needs to be resigned, Bertans has 2 more years on his big deal, Dinwiddie has another season before they can opt out of him, DFS just got extended, Hardaway Jr has 3 more years on his deal, Bullock has one more year before they can get out, Powell is on an expiring.
-We have the DDV bird/RFA rights. Just have to resign him (likely in the 8-11 mil/season range is my guess)
-Use the MLE for Porter. We're operating as an over the cap team with the DDV hold, the Lyles hold and the #4 overall pick cap hold. Hopefully for cheaper than the full MLE, but I expect us to pay a "good player tax" as usual to get guys to ink here.
-Use the BAE (according to the one website I looked at, we still have it. So not entirely sure here) for Jones. If he gets more than 3-4 mil on the open market, more power to him. In this team build though, I think back-up C would mostly be played by Kleber and just a smidge of Murray. Would love to keep Jones after the surge he showed and overall just being a pretty good player for most of the season, but not an enormous loss if he doesn't come back. With Trey Lyles/Metu on cheap deals too, tbh, I think I'd rather just roll with a small-ball 5 as the back-up and just have Queta/Len on reserve if we need the big body.
Would still have some incredible optionality in the 2023 off-season. Davis, Len, Harkless, Holiday, Lyles, Metu, Barnes, Kleber would all be UFA. I'm hoping we can find a way to make use of the expiring's and consolidate some talent, but the Kings would have some room to revamp the core after next season.
-Draft Keegan at 4.
-Flip Holmes for Kleber (try to get a pick if we can, or bug them for Josh Green for a developing wing prospect). My guess is they'll be very willing to comply with adding extra; they're more or less capped out. Luka starts his big contract next season, Brunson needs to be resigned, Bertans has 2 more years on his big deal, Dinwiddie has another season before they can opt out of him, DFS just got extended, Hardaway Jr has 3 more years on his deal, Bullock has one more year before they can get out, Powell is on an expiring.
-We have the DDV bird/RFA rights. Just have to resign him (likely in the 8-11 mil/season range is my guess)
-Use the MLE for Porter. We're operating as an over the cap team with the DDV hold, the Lyles hold and the #4 overall pick cap hold. Hopefully for cheaper than the full MLE, but I expect us to pay a "good player tax" as usual to get guys to ink here.
-Use the BAE (according to the one website I looked at, we still have it. So not entirely sure here) for Jones. If he gets more than 3-4 mil on the open market, more power to him. In this team build though, I think back-up C would mostly be played by Kleber and just a smidge of Murray. Would love to keep Jones after the surge he showed and overall just being a pretty good player for most of the season, but not an enormous loss if he doesn't come back. With Trey Lyles/Metu on cheap deals too, tbh, I think I'd rather just roll with a small-ball 5 as the back-up and just have Queta/Len on reserve if we need the big body.
Would still have some incredible optionality in the 2023 off-season. Davis, Len, Harkless, Holiday, Lyles, Metu, Barnes, Kleber would all be UFA. I'm hoping we can find a way to make use of the expiring's and consolidate some talent, but the Kings would have some room to revamp the core after next season.
Kleber has more value than Holmes he's bigger way more versatile and has skills like good to elite defense and decent floor spacing which Holmes does not, Why on earth would Dallas throw in something extra in that deal? I have been wanting Kleber on the Kings for some time but lets not act like Dallas has to be throwing in extra stuff for a Dwight Powell upgrade.
If you read the blurb, I literally laid out my reasons why they'd be interested. Little assets to improve team, Powell expiring, Kleber expiring, everyone else is getting or going to get very expensive. Holmes represents someone they've shown interest in last season, is a glove fit with their team, and allows them to add a long-term piece to their core with the Kings being motivated to deal with how our team situation has played out.
I don’t think anyone is writing off Murray. He is is certainly in the bucket as an option.
My choices would be:
1) trade up to 2 to get Jabari Smith if he is there. The talent and fit to me is worth trading next years 1. If I could do for Holmes and this years 1 I do it immediately but I think it takes an unprotected first.
2) draft best upside wing at 4… Murray, Sharpe, Eason, Daniels…. At this point Monte is going to prove or disprove his draft chops. It’s easy to take the falling guard. Much harder pick the next all star wing like Tatum or Brown.
3) Pick up a vet and move back for the next tier. I might be willing to take Brogdan, Grant or Jones and move back if those offers are on the table and I don’t love anyone in the tier 2 group.
My choices would be:
1) trade up to 2 to get Jabari Smith if he is there. The talent and fit to me is worth trading next years 1. If I could do for Holmes and this years 1 I do it immediately but I think it takes an unprotected first.
2) draft best upside wing at 4… Murray, Sharpe, Eason, Daniels…. At this point Monte is going to prove or disprove his draft chops. It’s easy to take the falling guard. Much harder pick the next all star wing like Tatum or Brown.
3) Pick up a vet and move back for the next tier. I might be willing to take Brogdan, Grant or Jones and move back if those offers are on the table and I don’t love anyone in the tier 2 group.
I'd start with 2024 unprotected and negotiate down to 2023 Top 4, every top 6 is a roll of the dice in one way or another and if we were drafting Smith there'd be a more than fair chance the team drafting 4 would still wind up selecting the best player in the draft in 5 years time.
It's also why I don't think trading out of the pick for a "star" is likely since there is no guaranteed star in this draft, let alone 4. Maybe in the 5 minutes before Adam Silver announces the pick.
It's also why I don't think trading out of the pick for a "star" is likely since there is no guaranteed star in this draft, let alone 4. Maybe in the 5 minutes before Adam Silver announces the pick.
Yeah, I don't like "trade up" scenarios either in this draft. Whatever you're looking for in that 1-3 range will still be available at #4. Holmgren is a defensive big -- so are Jalen Duren and Mark Williams. Jabari Smith and Paulo Banchero are scoring PFs -- so is Keegan Murray. There's also AJ Griffin, Bennedict Mathurin, and Jaden Ivey who are all athletic wings who can shoot and Tari Eason and Jeremy Sochan who are switchable combo forwards who can guard multiple positions. Any of these guys could end up being the best player in the draft. I know there's a tendency to fall in love with specific prospects but giving up multiple assets to get one guy is just asking for trouble.
I'm not necessarily saying the Kings should trade up, and there's a decent chance the best player from this draft isn't taken top 3, but some of these things aren't like the others.
Yes, Holmgren is a defensive big, but he can stretch the floor, playmake, and possibly play next to Sabonis if he's able to adequately defend on the perimeter. Duran and Williams can't do any of those things. I like both as prospects but they are bad fits with Domas.
For Banchero vs Murray, the biggest difference I see (other than Paolo being a bit bigger while also being two years younger) is that Banchero has shown he can be a playmaker and Murray hasn't.
Jabari Smith is a slightly better outside shooter and a better perimeter defender, but otherwise I can see the argument that not a ton separates he and Murray.
Again, not saying I disagree that unless it's relatively painless to move up it probably not worth doing in this draft, just that there are some potential things the guys in the top three bring that aren't replicated elsewhere in the draft. Particularly with such an unusual prospect as Holmgren.
Yes, Holmgren is a defensive big, but he can stretch the floor, playmake, and possibly play next to Sabonis if he's able to adequately defend on the perimeter. Duran and Williams can't do any of those things. I like both as prospects but they are bad fits with Domas.
For Banchero vs Murray, the biggest difference I see (other than Paolo being a bit bigger while also being two years younger) is that Banchero has shown he can be a playmaker and Murray hasn't.
Jabari Smith is a slightly better outside shooter and a better perimeter defender, but otherwise I can see the argument that not a ton separates he and Murray.
Again, not saying I disagree that unless it's relatively painless to move up it probably not worth doing in this draft, just that there are some potential things the guys in the top three bring that aren't replicated elsewhere in the draft. Particularly with such an unusual prospect as Holmgren.
I’m good with Keegan Murray at 4. I’m in Camp Don’t Overthink.
This dude scores without plays being called for him. Whatever wings we have are going to score on passes from Fox and Domas. Hell space the floor and add defensive flexibility and make us a smarter basketball team. And he’s a guy that won’t get played off the floor come playoff time.
I was down on Banchero because of fit - until I heard a Pop quote about playing 2 bigs together - you can do it if they can both pass.
So - if one of the “top 3” fall, fine. If Monte thinks another player can be a top 20 guy, fine, but otherwise - take the long and tall guy that can hit 3’s, rebound, and play good team D.
This dude scores without plays being called for him. Whatever wings we have are going to score on passes from Fox and Domas. Hell space the floor and add defensive flexibility and make us a smarter basketball team. And he’s a guy that won’t get played off the floor come playoff time.
I was down on Banchero because of fit - until I heard a Pop quote about playing 2 bigs together - you can do it if they can both pass.
So - if one of the “top 3” fall, fine. If Monte thinks another player can be a top 20 guy, fine, but otherwise - take the long and tall guy that can hit 3’s, rebound, and play good team D.
In a vacuum yes but Orlando has Chet's high school running mate and I think there's a compelling case to reunite them if you think Chet is an NBA player.
This is our best case scenario since Houston and OKC are definitely still tanking next season and in position to shoot for star power & "potential".
This is our best case scenario since Houston and OKC are definitely still tanking next season and in position to shoot for star power & "potential".
I keep seeing this claim, and it's just...weird. I mean, Murray had a 29.7% Usage (highest among all expected candidates for a top-5 pick), and took 263 more FGA and 62 more FTA than anybody else on his team. He was also clearly the best offensive player on his team. Fran McCaffery isn't smart enough to call plays for this guy? Iowa just ran plays for everybody else, and then when the plays broke down Murray bailed them out, all season long?
(Obviously Murray had far more plays called for him than any other player on his team.)
(Obviously Murray had far more plays called for him than any other player on his team.)
I thought it was Captain Factorial - not Captain Literal.
What I should have said - is that he scores within the flow of the offense. He doesn’t isolate and pound the ball. And he’s versatile and can score from anywhere - so you don’t have to force him the ball at certain places on the court. So - if the kings want the ball to move around, he’s a good option.
Of course his coach wants the ball to go to his best player - but the whole offense doesn’t have to be tailored to getting him the ball.
https://247sports.com/LongFormArtic...turn-attention-to-home-stretch-182852922/Amp/
But the only league I watch regularly is the WCC - and I haven’t cured up all Murray’s games to chart the play calling.
What I should have said - is that he scores within the flow of the offense. He doesn’t isolate and pound the ball. And he’s versatile and can score from anywhere - so you don’t have to force him the ball at certain places on the court. So - if the kings want the ball to move around, he’s a good option.
Of course his coach wants the ball to go to his best player - but the whole offense doesn’t have to be tailored to getting him the ball.
https://247sports.com/LongFormArtic...turn-attention-to-home-stretch-182852922/Amp/
But the only league I watch regularly is the WCC - and I haven’t cured up all Murray’s games to chart the play calling.
I don't have negative feelings about Chet specifically, I have negative feelings about every supposed franchise big man drafted in the last 20 years who has gone on to have an underwhelming career.
If he falls to #4 you'd have to ask, is there a reason why? Embiid should have been #1 but he fell to #3 for health reasons and low and behold he's fantastic but only for about 2/3 of a season and you just have to hope that includes the playoffs.
If we trade up we're going even more all-in on betting he's a franchise changer. We already have the player who led the NCAA in most defensive categories a year ago on our bench not getting playing time. There are other players who can shoot who will be available. It's nice to have one player who can do everything but then what are you going to do when your unicorn do-everything big is injured? Successful teams don't just have role players, they also have roles.
I'm not saying don't draft him, just that I would really really have to be confident he was the exception. And even then, just playing the odds and taking a guard or wing in the top 5 is probably a smarter move.
If he falls to #4 you'd have to ask, is there a reason why? Embiid should have been #1 but he fell to #3 for health reasons and low and behold he's fantastic but only for about 2/3 of a season and you just have to hope that includes the playoffs.
If we trade up we're going even more all-in on betting he's a franchise changer. We already have the player who led the NCAA in most defensive categories a year ago on our bench not getting playing time. There are other players who can shoot who will be available. It's nice to have one player who can do everything but then what are you going to do when your unicorn do-everything big is injured? Successful teams don't just have role players, they also have roles.
I'm not saying don't draft him, just that I would really really have to be confident he was the exception. And even then, just playing the odds and taking a guard or wing in the top 5 is probably a smarter move.
So what?
Kings draft Tyrese Haliburton - laughingstock
Kings develop Haliburton into solid young PG - laughingstock
Kings draft defensive stalwart Davion Mitchell - laughingstock
Kings trade from a position of strength to get a 25-yo All-Star center who fits really well with their PG - laughingstock
Kings land #4 pick in draft and explore all possibilities - laughingstock
Sticks and stones, man. I'm ready to ignore the name-calling, get this pick (or trade) right, land a franchise player, establish a 10-year dynasty, and go all sticks and stones on the rest of the league while they keep calling us a laughingstock.
Kings draft Tyrese Haliburton - laughingstock
Kings develop Haliburton into solid young PG - laughingstock
Kings draft defensive stalwart Davion Mitchell - laughingstock
Kings trade from a position of strength to get a 25-yo All-Star center who fits really well with their PG - laughingstock
Kings land #4 pick in draft and explore all possibilities - laughingstock
Sticks and stones, man. I'm ready to ignore the name-calling, get this pick (or trade) right, land a franchise player, establish a 10-year dynasty, and go all sticks and stones on the rest of the league while they keep calling us a laughingstock.
In fairness, nobody laughed at us for drafting Haliburton. That was largely seen as a steal, even at the time.
The jury is still out on the Sabonis trade. If he bolts in FA and we're still in the gutter whole Hali continues his trajectory, then it will continue to be viewed as a short-term, ill-advised trade.
That said, we should of course explore all options. But generally the team trading a top pick for a veteran is not going to come out on top. And we have rightfully been a laughing stock for a long time due to one disastrous move after another. Monte doesn't deserve the heat for all of that, but that's the way it goes.
The jury is still out on the Sabonis trade. If he bolts in FA and we're still in the gutter whole Hali continues his trajectory, then it will continue to be viewed as a short-term, ill-advised trade.
That said, we should of course explore all options. But generally the team trading a top pick for a veteran is not going to come out on top. And we have rightfully been a laughing stock for a long time due to one disastrous move after another. Monte doesn't deserve the heat for all of that, but that's the way it goes.
Yeah, I said at the time that the trade could only really be evaluated until we know if Sabonis gets resigned or not. If he does, great, win-win trade with the Kings getting an excellent top 25 player that potentially works better with Fox. No matter how high the Hali trajectory goes. If he doesn't, it's just another franchise crippling trade, probably only behind passing Luka and firing Malone in the last 15 years. Definition of high-risk, high reward deal.
Monte basically has these 2 off-seasons, before the Sabonis extension kicks in to get the team in a position to be a long-term winner. Once you have to pay max Sabonis/Fox, there isn't a ton of wiggle room to make things happen. I like the McNair seemingly has full power finally, got rid of the Vivek mole in Dumars, Catanella is out, the Walton stench is gone and replaced with his coach/staff.
Monte basically has these 2 off-seasons, before the Sabonis extension kicks in to get the team in a position to be a long-term winner. Once you have to pay max Sabonis/Fox, there isn't a ton of wiggle room to make things happen. I like the McNair seemingly has full power finally, got rid of the Vivek mole in Dumars, Catanella is out, the Walton stench is gone and replaced with his coach/staff.
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