[Game] Kings @ Hornets - Thursday, Jan. 17 - 4PT/7PT
- Thread starter VF21
- Start date
sactowndog
All-Star
Not sure anyone had a good game. From my perspective it’s hard to criticize anyone player because they all sucked.
RaY Z
Starter
I did not get to watch the game due to work, but looks like it was worth missing based on comments here?
Saw the box score and looks like Marvin had a good game bar the turnovers. Did notice the +/- was at -21 though. Was there any reason for this? Or was he just surrounded by poor players tonight?
Saw the box score and looks like Marvin had a good game bar the turnovers. Did notice the +/- was at -21 though. Was there any reason for this? Or was he just surrounded by poor players tonight?
DesertFox
Starter
Rookies are up and down, and this was a down game.
Marvin and Harry eat up possessions when the team isn't running up and down the floor. They kind of run into each other on both sides of the ball. They don't mesh well with Fox yet.
Fox will rely on Belly being on the floor until Harry or Bagley starting hitting the 3. JJ was playing that role, but it's not the same. When Belly is on the floor he creates space because he is a threat out to 27 feet. Even if he's missing, he gives Fox space to operate. Belly didn't hit much, and had a couple of his ugly drives which probably ended his night early.
I can see more clearly now why Joeger was slow to give the young bigs minutes. I have no idea what Koufos says on the floor, but he's always talking on both sides of the ball.
Chupacabra
Starter
After looking at the final score and reading a few comments I can say that I'm glad that I forgot that the game started early as it was in Charlotte.
Tizzy Flip
Starter
Just rewatched the last 7 mins of the first half. We were up 41-35. We ended the half down 63-50.
Quick observations:
-We did not one single time during that stretch throw it in to the low post. Even with Marvin in he got the ball outside the 3pt line and created. That was a big strategic mistake especially when they were playing small and had Kidd Gilchrist covering Marvin and Bjelica
-With any Fox/WCS pick and roll they kept Willie’s defender way off and were essentially baiting Fox to come off the screen and create. He needs to work on getting more consistent with his jump shot. It’s his biggest weakness and teams are exposing it. Charlotte did a great job collapsing when Fox drove but closing out really quickly when he would dish it out to the wing
-When the pick and roll wasn’t working, we kept playing the high post game. However, WCS and Bjelica are simply no threat with their back to the basket. They can’t pass like Harry and not a big threat to drive like Giles. So they just played the passing lanes and made sure Buddy was covered at all times. The shot Buddy did make was a ridiculous 3 over a couple defenders
-Turnovers were bad but credit Charlotte’s defense. We couldn’t get open, couldn’t get easy shots and got flustered. Buddy and Shimp had a couple of plays where they over dribbled and went 1 on 1 and it either led to a bad shot or turnover and then an easy fast break
-it felt like Charlotte was constantly on fast break from either a turnover or bad shot so a lot of the points came from bad offense. That said, there were a couple of times Charlotte just waltzed their way in down low unimpeded. It killed me to see Tony Parker and Jeremy Lamb be able to do against our younger faster players
Critical stretch here. If we come out of this road stretch 1-5 I say we need to start Bagley and get Giles 20+ mins. Put WCS on the trade block, upgrade SF and get a defensive minded center
Quick observations:
-We did not one single time during that stretch throw it in to the low post. Even with Marvin in he got the ball outside the 3pt line and created. That was a big strategic mistake especially when they were playing small and had Kidd Gilchrist covering Marvin and Bjelica
-With any Fox/WCS pick and roll they kept Willie’s defender way off and were essentially baiting Fox to come off the screen and create. He needs to work on getting more consistent with his jump shot. It’s his biggest weakness and teams are exposing it. Charlotte did a great job collapsing when Fox drove but closing out really quickly when he would dish it out to the wing
-When the pick and roll wasn’t working, we kept playing the high post game. However, WCS and Bjelica are simply no threat with their back to the basket. They can’t pass like Harry and not a big threat to drive like Giles. So they just played the passing lanes and made sure Buddy was covered at all times. The shot Buddy did make was a ridiculous 3 over a couple defenders
-Turnovers were bad but credit Charlotte’s defense. We couldn’t get open, couldn’t get easy shots and got flustered. Buddy and Shimp had a couple of plays where they over dribbled and went 1 on 1 and it either led to a bad shot or turnover and then an easy fast break
-it felt like Charlotte was constantly on fast break from either a turnover or bad shot so a lot of the points came from bad offense. That said, there were a couple of times Charlotte just waltzed their way in down low unimpeded. It killed me to see Tony Parker and Jeremy Lamb be able to do against our younger faster players
Critical stretch here. If we come out of this road stretch 1-5 I say we need to start Bagley and get Giles 20+ mins. Put WCS on the trade block, upgrade SF and get a defensive minded center
Tizzy Flip
Starter
Bags and Giles were not the issue. When Giles came out for Willie in the 2nd qtr, Kings were still up 6pts. When Bjelica came in for Bags with 4 mins to go, Kings were up 1
KingsSelecao
Bench
I agree Bagley needs to be thrown in the fire.
Even if he gets schooled. See how he does against Griffin and Drummond.
Giles on the other hand, needs to head back to the G league. He stunk up the place against a mediocre front court in Charlotte. He looked completely lost out there.
Drummond and Blake will embarrass him on Sat. I can see Koufas getting about 20-25 on Sat. A much better match up.
SLAB
Hall of Famer
Lol Giles to the G-League after one bad game is hilarious overreaction.
KingsSelecao
Bench
KingsSelecao
Bench
Giles was not the issue? Did you really watch the game? He was constantly out of position, was standing around too much, and forgot Box Out 101.
People were talking the Hornets frontcourt. Not, Anthony Davis.
Tizzy Flip
Starter
Was Giles in when we went from a 1pt lead to a 13pt deficit in the last 3 mins of the 1st half? Giles had a bad game, but for all the mistakes he had he still created plays (4 assists). Like I mentioned we were up 6 when he got pulled in the 2nd qtr which is when we lost it. Just facts
SLAB
Hall of Famer
He played 16 (bad) minutes. The rest of the team did a pretty good job of stinking up the place too.
Was he part of the issue? Yes, tonight he was. He looked more like early season Giles than the player we’ve seen recently.
Was he THE issue? Hell no.
KingsFanSince85
All-Star
The KINGS got beat at the foul line tonight. Plain and simple. Same number of FG's. Same number of 3 pt FG's. But -19 at the FT line.
Why was that? Turnovers, poor defense, and not enough aggressive play.
Why was that? Turnovers, poor defense, and not enough aggressive play.
The Effort Police
Starter
Lol, one bad game and back to the G-League? Meanwhile Koufos consistently sucks butt the entire season and all of a sudden deserves 25 minutes. Maybe he'll kill momentum for us again.
Everyone sucked, but if I had to point fingers at one guy it would be Shumpert with his ill-advised bricks and turnovers. Rookies may be up and down, but Shumpert and Bjelica have been consistently awful for the better part of a month. Koufos too before he was pulled for Giles.
Why are our veterans the ones getting leeway for their abysmal play?
The tunnel vision of Shumpert/Bagley when they get the ball is absolutely absurd at times, Bagley can get away with it to some degree because he can jump three times for a rebound before most people jump once on a miss but he's got a terrible habit or whenever he touches it to not even look to pass to the point where it's not even an option.
I said in the other thread that Shumpert will end up losing us games with his momentum killing shots which most his shots are, when bad shots miss it's deflating. Even Buddy tonight despite a good % had some awful momentum changing chucks unless your the GSW you can't play like that.
Giles had 4 great passes but I thought Dave in the 2nd quarter went way to long with the 2nd unit and we never got the game back.
I said in the other thread that Shumpert will end up losing us games with his momentum killing shots which most his shots are, when bad shots miss it's deflating. Even Buddy tonight despite a good % had some awful momentum changing chucks unless your the GSW you can't play like that.
Giles had 4 great passes but I thought Dave in the 2nd quarter went way to long with the 2nd unit and we never got the game back.
He's the only player on the squad that makes an extra pass to make a good shot a great shot, I said all season if you don't involve him somewhat in the offense (not just about taking shots just touches) he's completely useless he's not a raw spot up shooter like Korver or someone like that. I think we do need to trade him before his value plummets.
chief bromden
Starter
I largely agree with your take, but I think he's not 100% healthy. He wrapped his back in ice at the game Monday after he was taken out in the first quarter. He just doesn't look very comfortable out there lately.
chief bromden
Starter
They flew out day of game? Wow ... maybe that was a team vote to get extra home time. Either way, that explains a lot.
sactowndog
All-Star
I see everyone going after their favorite whipping boy. Not hard since everyone sucked. Better to just put this one on the shelf and call it a day. Hopefully Detroit is better.
SLAB
Hall of Famer
Word. One bad loss is okay, all teams have them. It’s time to “panic” if they have another bad loss. This trip could easily spiral. Or it couldn’t. We shall see!
John Galt
Starter
I agree - not so much because of what the one game does in the standings, but if we can't take care of this kind of business... how are we a top-8 Western Conference team when the smoke clears.
Hugely disappointing loss to me - there is a whole other level of professionalism that these people lack right now. that was some BS. And it wasn't like they were partying late in Miami or something. They somehow just didn't show up. Terrible.
Entity
Hall of Famer
thats true. I wonder if the Warriors fans freaked out when the kings beat them the last few years
JCTNKINGFAN
Bench
A bad loss, just checked in expecting to see a major meltdown, but really, not too bad. Maybe we are growing some, too. Oh, the usual suspect or two with their cut and paste hate on Willie, but overall, not too bad a reaction. And it really was a bad loss. The 2nd unit has been playing really well, but they didn't have it tonight, completely gave up the momentum to the Hornets and the team could never get it back. Poor Harry looked like early season Harry and neither he nor Bagley were effective defensively, but plenty of "blame" to go around. All the hype surrounding Bagley and Giles worries me, some fans and media, are just over the top right now with the hype. They are setting the expectations way too high, too soon. They have a chance to be really good, but they are not there yet. I think the hype hurts Harry more than Bagley. Bagley has had a fair amount of success, so far, and is making good progress. Harry wants to do well so badly and live up to those expectations and he is pressing. Both still have a lot to learn with Harry having the least amount of competitive game time experience.
Every team, even the almighty Warriors have bad games and lose games they shouldn't lose. The good, mature teams limit those losses. Younger, inexperienced teams will suffer more of those losses. It's part of the development and maturing, it doesn't happen over night. There will be more.
Every team, even the almighty Warriors have bad games and lose games they shouldn't lose. The good, mature teams limit those losses. Younger, inexperienced teams will suffer more of those losses. It's part of the development and maturing, it doesn't happen over night. There will be more.
JCTNKINGFAN
Bench
Interesting, I never thought about that, wasn't really aware of their flight schedule.
kb02
All-Star
Pretty certain the Kings flew in on Wednesday.
That said, jet lag is real, but it depends on the person's schedule. As an undergrad, I spent a summer in Philly and it took me a week to adjust to the time change.
As an adult, I've traveled to and worked from Hawaii to the east coast (waking up at 3 am Hawaii time) to work remotely. Made no impact. Adjusted seamlessly--but it is because my wife and I am usually up by 4 amish daily.
Ultimately, it just depends on the person and that person's normal schedule.
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
Hopefully a lot was learned from a loss like this and the team stays humble. Defense was comically bad and we were too reliant on the three ball. Buddy, JJ and Shump missed a bunch during our comeback attempt, we coudn't make a stop (had to rely on Charlotte missing a bunch of 3s or we would have lost by 30) and we could not find a way to score inside. The team did look exhausted and off for some reason. WCS was making some defensive plays but I didn't see much energy from anyone else. One of the many areas of growth for this team is to find ways to win when we aren't shooting well. Play good defense, get a few stops and be patient on offense. Growing pains of a young team
