[KINGS] Comments that don't warrant their own thread (Redux)

Random thought about tomorrow’s game. I’m feeling pretty worried tbh. OKC is super hot right now and they have a well rounded team. They mainly lack interior defense but besides that they have been pretty good. I feel a loss incoming if Sabonis sits. I can easily see them in the Playoffs this year.
 
Spike said:
Should he flex next time he dunks? I can't think of anyone better for the Kings in last year's draft. I was hoping Jabari Smith Jr. would drop, but man am I happy.

It's hard to look at where the Kings are and think someone else would be a better fit. Sometimes it's not about the individual talent or potential, but what makes the team better RIGHT NOW. I don't see the Kings at 3rd in the standings with Ivey. This team is looking to win NOW, and the team, for those who have been paying attention, isn't built for a rebuild.

Look, I think this argument held more water in the off-season, when we didn't know what we would get (kind of, we knew we weren't tanking with Sabonis and Fox), but you can't arguably look at who we ended up with and how he, and the team, is excelling and say he's just a role guy who would drop in a redraft. He's doing exactly what we ask and more.
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Yeah, that's not a question right now but in a few years I can see all of Griffin, Mathurin, Sharpe, or Ivey being players fans bash all over about how you let them slip. I mean even if the Kings win a ring they'll do it, lol. Look at the Dubs for goodness sakes.
 
SacTownKid said:
Yeah, that's not a question right now but in a few years I can see all of Griffin, Mathurin, Sharpe, or Ivey being players fans bash all over about how you let them slip. I mean even if the Kings win a ring they'll do it, lol. Look at the Dubs for goodness sakes.
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I guess why don't you see that same upside in Keegan, especially with what he's done so far this year? His top skills so far in the NBA are absurdly valuable in a 6'9 forward
 
pdxKingsFan said:
When people do redrafts, just like when they are mocking next year's draft in January - they typically aren't drafting for any kind of roster composition in mind, unless one player just stands out as totally perfect for a team that passed him up - they are drafting BPA for whatever date they have the hindsight of drafting for.

There was not a more ready made for this roster player than Keegan. But even that assumes we knew we'd land Huerter and Monk (probably did but that would be "illegal" if we had talked to them).

In 2019 there was still a possibility where even as big a project/reach as Marvin was, he tunes his dad out and doesn't get hurt and we don't hire Walton and he develops into a top 5-6 guy from his class and we build on the 2018-2019 season and it isn't a total loss. In 2023 that book is shut and Vlade is the worst GM in history (not fair, but hey).

In 2023 Murray deserves some props and respect even if in 2028 folks with the benefit of hindsight can tell you why we should have drafted Shaedon Sharpe or Johnny Davis.
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I think if he didn't land Huerter or Monk and I'm sure he had both plans working in some way shape or form with him talking to the Hawks for so long and Fox/Monk I'm sure doing some usual backstage tampering haha. Monte was obviously looking to add shooting ability first and foremost. He would have likely moved on the the next options at that point if he didn't get either.
 
The_Jamal said:
I guess why don't you see that same upside in Keegan, especially with what he's done so far this year? His top skills so far in the NBA are absurdly valuable in a 6'9 forward
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Same upside? No, this is a guard skill league (from players like Jokic to Morant or Harden or Curry), but more than that, I'm not sure about his role even if he is capable. The question is whether or not he can be allowed to develop the obvious skills he lacks in this role at his age. The best thing the Kings have done for him so far is to use him as the stretch 4 that he is and win in the process. The thing that I still want to see is that post game. If they do give that to him it's very possible that the production levels we saw in college will come back. That said, he's not running anyones offense nor is he being allowed to show much iso skill right now anyway and that could be part of the plan. We see some post up plays here and there early in games. The stats are there. He is a function of the offense right now and his iso play doesn't even register at the moment. Like nearly 90% of his offense is assisted and for development that's not a great thing, for winning and considering the skills he does have? Yes it is. Monte took the best fit and most developed player and it's working out wonderfully so all is well in my book but you know redrafters, they'll pick the guy that shines every day.
 
SacTownKid said:
Same upside? No, this is a guard skill league (from players like Jokic to Morant or Harden or Curry), but more than that, I'm not sure about his role even if he is capable. The question is whether or not he can be allowed to develop the obvious skills he lacks in this role at his age. The best thing the Kings have done for him so far is to use him as the stretch 4 that he is and win in the process. The thing that I still want to see is that post game. If they do give that to him it's very possible that the production levels we saw in college will come back. That said, he's not running anyones offense nor is he being allowed to show much iso skill right now anyway and that could be part of the plan. We see some post up plays here and there early in games. The stats are there. He is a function of the offense right now and his iso play doesn't even register at the moment. Like nearly 90% of his offense is assisted and for development that's not a great thing, for winning and considering the skills he does have? Yes it is. Monte took the best fit and most developed player and it's working out wonderfully so all is well in my book but you know redrafters, they'll pick the guy that shines every day.
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I find this argument strange. Starting Keegan and putting him in a position to succeed strikes me as precisely what you want to do from a development standpoint. Tossing a guy out there and telling him "Go get yours" is great for the Rookie of the Year race, and it's great for the fans, but I'd hardly call it an optimal development plan. The Kings have been there/done that with a bunch of their first round picks in the last decade and a half, and so many of those guys failed to live up to expectations because they were never taught what it takes to thrive in the NBA. I'm thrilled to see that Brown and his staff are teaching Keegan how to succeed in the NBA and not overextending him. I'm sure they'll layer in more responsibility as he continues to acclimate to the big leagues.
 
Padrino said:
I find this argument strange. Starting Keegan and putting him in a position to succeed strikes me as precisely what you want to do from a development standpoint. Tossing a guy out there and telling him "Go get yours" is great for the Rookie of the Year race, and it's great for the fans, but I'd hardly call it an optimal development plan. The Kings have been there/done that with a bunch of their first round picks in the last decade and a half, and so many of those guys failed to live up to expectations because they were never taught what it takes to thrive in the NBA. I'm thrilled to see that Brown and his staff are teaching Keegan how to succeed in the NBA and not overextending him. I'm sure they'll layer in more responsibility as he continues to acclimate to the big leagues.
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It's because you're looking at the wrong argument considering I'm not even arguing against your points. I totally agree with them but FANS who come back and quarterback these things after the fact will likely have a different opinion. Again, I'm not saying what the Kings are doing is wrong, in fact, my opinions are definitely that of being a proponent of players like him trying to max out what they do well rather than attempting to reshape their whole game at this stage. That said, go find me the examples of players in the top 25 right now that aren't running an offense. That is something Keegan didn't really show in college either however he certainly shows production potential as a scorer. Also, there's a difference between development and refinement and I would consider what they are doing with Keegan more refinement although we still need to see those post opportunties more considering plenty of prognosticators believe that part of his game won't translate either. For a player to become something they aren't they kind of have to be put in a situation to "go get theirs" and as I said, in time I wouldn't be surprised at all for some of the redraft people to push him down merely because of situation in his case.
 
SacTownKid said:
Yeah, that's not a question right now but in a few years I can see all of Griffin, Mathurin, Sharpe, or Ivey being players fans bash all over about how you let them slip. I mean even if the Kings win a ring they'll do it, lol. Look at the Dubs for goodness sakes.
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That puts us in a no-win situation. With someone like Sharpe, we're not winning as many games as we currently are. Then the narrative becomes "Fox & Ox can't seem to put it together." Players like that just aren't on our timeline. Can you imagine this team without Murray's shooting? Sharpe would probably have quite a few DNP-CDs racked up. There was no doubt McNair wasn't going to go with the most NBA-ready player, potential be damned. Not only is that not his MO, but this team isn't built to take on a project. Keegan does so many things well without the ball. He's a big IQ guy.

But whether or not you believe Murray is the right guy depends on your perception of the team. Some of us thought Fox was "holding this team back." Other thought, "it's players, not coaches" that win in this league. (For a strong rebuttal, look at the discussion on 3rd quarter adjustments.) Those in this camp likely wanted to blow things up, and if you're in that camp, sure, project players seem intriguing because you can afford to sit it out for a while.

However, this roster was not built to tank. There were workable pieces, and Monte has made some savvy moves. Monte built a competitive team and hired a coach (who, I'll admit to not being my first choice), and now this team is near the top of the west in late January.

All of this is to say, sure, hindsight five years from now is great, but we're not looking at 2027 to start winning.
 
(Not so random, but...) Extremely "random" fact of the day: THE Sacramento Kings are 7 wins away from registering the 3rd best season since our current playoff drought began.
 
QWERTYLICIOUS said:
(Not so random, but...) Extremely "random" fact of the day: THE Sacramento Kings are 7 wins away from registering the 3rd best season since our current playoff drought began.
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7 wins away from sending a certain (ex?) poster who bet the under to the poor house.
 
pdxKingsFan said:
I'm willing to bet you know who I am speaking of.
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I probably do, but am drawing a blank right now...

DM me if you don't want to reveal their identity to all. But then, at this point, I'm not sure that it would make much of a difference since you have established that you may be speaking of an (ex) poster...
 
SacTownKid said:
Same upside? No, this is a guard skill league (from players like Jokic to Morant or Harden or Curry), but more than that, I'm not sure about his role even if he is capable. The question is whether or not he can be allowed to develop the obvious skills he lacks in this role at his age. The best thing the Kings have done for him so far is to use him as the stretch 4 that he is and win in the process. The thing that I still want to see is that post game. If they do give that to him it's very possible that the production levels we saw in college will come back. That said, he's not running anyones offense nor is he being allowed to show much iso skill right now anyway and that could be part of the plan. We see some post up plays here and there early in games. The stats are there. He is a function of the offense right now and his iso play doesn't even register at the moment. Like nearly 90% of his offense is assisted and for development that's not a great thing, for winning and considering the skills he does have? Yes it is. Monte took the best fit and most developed player and it's working out wonderfully so all is well in my book but you know redrafters, they'll pick the guy that shines every day.
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not sure you need a post game from him. Keegan plays off Domas like Klay plays off Draymond. It’s more his movement off the ball and running off those dribble hand-offs or going back door if they over play him.

Would love to see him put some Barnes slow mo drives to his game
 
sactowndog said:
not sure you need a post game from him. Keegan plays off Domas like Klay plays off Draymond. It’s more his movement off the ball and running off those dribble hand-offs or going back door if they over play him.

Would love to see him put some Barnes slow mo drives to his game
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The movement shooting and off-ball movement/cutting off Domas has me really excited what Murray's ceiling can be. Just aren't many 6'9 dudes with that skill-set and we obviously didn't see any of it at Iowa because he was the offensive engine of that squad. And the C&S is just lights out as he's establishing himself as not only the best shooter in the rookie class but one of the best shooters in the NBA.

And slowly but surely, we're starting to see more hints of the on-ball scoring/creation moves at Iowa being worked into his NBA game. His finishing has been excellent over the last month and he's been significantly more aggressive than earlier in the season. I mean, the dude is at 69.5% TS over his last 15 games where a majority of his shot attempts are threes. That's insane.

In terms of the post-game, we've seen a few times where Keegan is the screener at the 5 and it's been crazy effective because of the Pick-n-Pop potential with his shooting. I'd love to see some Keegan at the 4/Lyles at the 5 type lineups where the defender has to honor the screener or Fox/Monk get a free lane to the rim or kick out for a wide-open 3.
 
Soooo, is it too early to start a Playoff race thread? :p Do we not want to jinx it yet? I’d love for there to be a thread where we can talk about Western opponent’s games. There’s just about 3+ games every night that I track or watch because they involve a team in the Western playoff/playin race.
 
Bosnian Diehard said:
Soooo, is it too early to start a Playoff race thread? :p Do we not want to jinx it yet? I’d love for there to be a thread where we can talk about Western opponent’s games. There’s just about 3+ games every night that I track or watch because they involve a team in the Western playoff/playin race.
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Let's call it "too early".
 
Fantazija said:
Damn, 50% to make a second round.I mean, I am optimistic but that feels high
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Yeah it's high. Especially since the Kings have had some good luck in playing good teams with injured players. Seems like when they play healthy teams that are good, they tend to lose more often than they win. Either way I don't care if they get bounced in the first round. The Webber/Vlade Kings did as well the first couple years. Baby steps.
 
Fantazija said:
Damn, 50% to make a second round.I mean, I am optimistic but that feels high
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The bottom half of the western conference bracket is likely gonna have the Warriors Suns and Clippers in it, who are down there mainly because of injuries and load management. We’re definitely a betting dog against any of those teams so yeah def seems high. If we somehow catch one of the stragglers (Jazz PDX Lakers) I’d be ecstatic
 
https://twitter.com/x/status/1618110512079990784

Damn. A big reason the Kings need to keep their foot on the peddle and just really avoid bad streaks this season especially. A 1-6 type of stretch could all of a sudden see you down in 10th-12th place. Thankfully a little breathing room between them at 2 games with NOP and 3.5 with the rest of the pack, but that could really go away pretty quickly. I don't remember a season like this where the parity is so wide-spread across the league.

Makes that Memphis win all the much more important. Have to avoid losing streaks at all costs to not get clumped up in that 5-13 block that's separated by 2 games lol
 
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