kenny thomas
- Thread starter sactown_draftpick
- Start date
Do you want to write him a check for 24 million to go away??
Here is the problem as I see it. I think Kenny would be a great sixth man as he can provide rebounding and scoring off the bench if he wanted to. Only thing wrong with that is he thinks he's Tim Duncan and should be a starter and sulks coming off the bench....not necessarily what you would call a true professional.
Here is the problem as I see it. I think Kenny would be a great sixth man as he can provide rebounding and scoring off the bench if he wanted to. Only thing wrong with that is he thinks he's Tim Duncan and should be a starter and sulks coming off the bench....not necessarily what you would call a true professional.
Yes. I think he should be cut. He's clearly the worst starting power forward in the NBA. Kenny doesn't do anything Justin Williams can't do at 10% of the price. Kenny has no business starting on an NBA team and he (apparently) won't play hard if he doesn't start. I think he's basically untradeable unless the Kings take on a worse contract in return. This is part of what I'd do to make over the team. Buyout Kenny's contract and cut him loose.
Last edited:
Depends on what could be negotiated. If we tell him he won't ever see serious minutes for us again and we can give him 12 million in a buyout, maybe he would take it thinking that he could make the other 12 million playing for someone else over the next 3 years. Sounds like NY is doing something similar with Francis this summer. Buying him out for 10 million less than his contract since he thinks he can get the MLE and make it up while playing more.
The threat of rotting on the bench for a rebuilding team may motivate him more than we think. I don't think it's possilbe to trade him unless it is for another bad contract.
The threat of rotting on the bench for a rebuilding team may motivate him more than we think. I don't think it's possilbe to trade him unless it is for another bad contract.
In all honesty, we should buy him out ASAP as we're going to be doing so in about 2 years anyway.
He's untradable, he's not a great player, he's not going to improve, his attitude sucks, and he's taking up too much cap room. Why not take care of an obvious problem now instead of later? Oh that's right, Petrie likes to "wait and see."
He's untradable, he's not a great player, he's not going to improve, his attitude sucks, and he's taking up too much cap room. Why not take care of an obvious problem now instead of later? Oh that's right, Petrie likes to "wait and see."
Since Potapenko has $3.6M & Corliss $6.5M coming off the books after this year, it is still going to sting to buy out Kenny's $24M due to him still, but if you net the 3 together that are the pieces left from the Webber trade...you get $13.9M to write off. Philly wrote Webber's salary off so why don't we do the same and write off Kenny's remaining $ owed to him off and maybe cut some sort of deal with him for him to take a little less if he gets it all now....this situation is really handicapping the team at PF, a very important position in the NBA and especially the West with it's depth at this position.
While that is hard to do and only really reserved to the extreme cases...we are really to the point since Kenny will not come off the bench and we are creating such a mismatch in the opponents favor everytime we play anyone on Kenny's small 6' 7" height for a PF. I think Muss gets around the problem of Kenny needing to start by starting him and then not giving him starting minutes for the game. In a round about way Kenny is in effect coming off the bench, but still starts the game so this might be appeasing him. Also SAR gets a lot of minutes at 4/5 unless we play very small ball and Corliss is at 4/5.
I'd really like to believe now that Kenny hurt his foot that this would give Muss the excuse to say that SAR and/or Williams is outplaying K9 and he will come off the bench for the rest of the year...I don't totally see this as happening with K9's whiny/pouting attitude about it.
While that is hard to do and only really reserved to the extreme cases...we are really to the point since Kenny will not come off the bench and we are creating such a mismatch in the opponents favor everytime we play anyone on Kenny's small 6' 7" height for a PF. I think Muss gets around the problem of Kenny needing to start by starting him and then not giving him starting minutes for the game. In a round about way Kenny is in effect coming off the bench, but still starts the game so this might be appeasing him. Also SAR gets a lot of minutes at 4/5 unless we play very small ball and Corliss is at 4/5.
I'd really like to believe now that Kenny hurt his foot that this would give Muss the excuse to say that SAR and/or Williams is outplaying K9 and he will come off the bench for the rest of the year...I don't totally see this as happening with K9's whiny/pouting attitude about it.
Last edited:
If they buy out Kenny they do not get any cap relief and his salary still stays on the books...he's just not on the roster.
By the way....not sure why everyone thinks Williams is the savior for our frontcourt. The guy looks completely lost out there and I cringe every time he touches the ball. If he could just stand to the side, out of the way, and then just run in and block a shot or grab a board then I guess it would be okay.
By the way....not sure why everyone thinks Williams is the savior for our frontcourt. The guy looks completely lost out there and I cringe every time he touches the ball. If he could just stand to the side, out of the way, and then just run in and block a shot or grab a board then I guess it would be okay.
Well, we could talk about how his rebounds per 48, blocks per 48, etc., blow away players like our supposed rebounder, KT, who costs us 16.3 times as much. Playing only 2% of minutes, his Roland rating is still -3.0, while SAR, at 50% of minutes has -4.3, and KT, playing 44% of minutes, has a team low (not counting Potapenko) -7.5. But the real key is that he's young, got a great attitude, and will only improve. Our alternatives are not young, have attitudes that range from OK to poor, and they will only get worse as time goes by. Nobody thinks he's a savior, but we want to watch our guys give 100%, and he does that.
Clearer?
Clearer?
If they buy out Kenny they do not get any cap relief and his salary still stays on the books...he's just not on the roster.
By the way....not sure why everyone thinks Williams is the savior for our frontcourt. The guy looks completely lost out there and I cringe every time he touches the ball. If he could just stand to the side, out of the way, and then just run in and block a shot or grab a board then I guess it would be okay.
By the way....not sure why everyone thinks Williams is the savior for our frontcourt. The guy looks completely lost out there and I cringe every time he touches the ball. If he could just stand to the side, out of the way, and then just run in and block a shot or grab a board then I guess it would be okay.
I brought this up a few weeks back, well that and buying out #52 also and didn't get much feedback so I thought no one agreed.....I am glad you brought it up again though....
By reading the posts I now know that most want it done but do the management team and the owners actually have a set, a set lerge enough to improve a franchise that has declined in wins since the highpoint in their 2nd year at the helm....
I believe they bought the team in 2000 so as follows here are the win totals:
00-01 - 55
01-02 - 61
02-03 - 59
03-04 - 55
04-05 - 50
05-06 - 44
06-07 - 28 (thus far, 35 if were lucky, or unlucky I should say since we want a high lottery pick....AL HORFORD)
So I submit no as the answer as to if anyone in charge would actually do anything to make this team better.......
Mark Cuban please buy our team and rescue us like you did the Mavs......love him or hate him he does what it takes to get W's.....
BUYOUT #52 and #9 PLEASE......they suck and have no trade value at all, no one wants these bums and no one would take them even if they both made half of what they make......In my opinion of course
Thoughts anyone, and not the one person who responds to everyone's posts please.....I know you have nothing else to do but reply but I need to hear some fresh opinions, I already have read yours over and over, I need the opinion of the real fans, the working class fans like me.......Thanks Kings Fans...
By reading the posts I now know that most want it done but do the management team and the owners actually have a set, a set lerge enough to improve a franchise that has declined in wins since the highpoint in their 2nd year at the helm....
I believe they bought the team in 2000 so as follows here are the win totals:
00-01 - 55
01-02 - 61
02-03 - 59
03-04 - 55
04-05 - 50
05-06 - 44
06-07 - 28 (thus far, 35 if were lucky, or unlucky I should say since we want a high lottery pick....AL HORFORD)
So I submit no as the answer as to if anyone in charge would actually do anything to make this team better.......
Mark Cuban please buy our team and rescue us like you did the Mavs......love him or hate him he does what it takes to get W's.....
BUYOUT #52 and #9 PLEASE......they suck and have no trade value at all, no one wants these bums and no one would take them even if they both made half of what they make......In my opinion of course
Thoughts anyone, and not the one person who responds to everyone's posts please.....I know you have nothing else to do but reply but I need to hear some fresh opinions, I already have read yours over and over, I need the opinion of the real fans, the working class fans like me.......Thanks Kings Fans...
Last edited:
I brought this up a few weeks back, well that and buying out #52 also and didn't get much feedback so I thought no one agreed.....I am glad you brought it up again though....
By reading the posts I now know that most want it done but do the management team and the owners actually have a set, a set lerge enough to improve a franchise that has declined in wins since the highpoint in their 2nd year at the helm....
I believe they bought the team in 2000 so as follows here are the win totals:
00-01 - 55
01-02 - 61
02-03 - 59
03-04 - 55
04-05 - 50
05-06 - 44
06-07 - 28 (thus far, 35 if were lucky, or unlucky I should say since we want a high lottery pick....AL HORFORD)
So I submit no as the answer as to if anyone in charge would actually do anything to make this team better.......
Mark Cuban please buy our team and rescue us like you did the Mavs......love him or hate him he does what it takes to get W's.....
BUYOUT #52 and #9 PLEASE......they suck and have no trade value at all, no one wants these bums and no one would take them even if they both made half of what they make......In my opinion of course
Thoughts anyone, and not the one person who responds to everyone's posts please.....I know you have nothing else to do but reply but I need to hear some fresh opinions, I already have read yours over and over, I need the opinion of the real fans, the working class fans like me.......Thanks Kings Fans...
By reading the posts I now know that most want it done but do the management team and the owners actually have a set, a set lerge enough to improve a franchise that has declined in wins since the highpoint in their 2nd year at the helm....
I believe they bought the team in 2000 so as follows here are the win totals:
00-01 - 55
01-02 - 61
02-03 - 59
03-04 - 55
04-05 - 50
05-06 - 44
06-07 - 28 (thus far, 35 if were lucky, or unlucky I should say since we want a high lottery pick....AL HORFORD)
So I submit no as the answer as to if anyone in charge would actually do anything to make this team better.......
Mark Cuban please buy our team and rescue us like you did the Mavs......love him or hate him he does what it takes to get W's.....
BUYOUT #52 and #9 PLEASE......they suck and have no trade value at all, no one wants these bums and no one would take them even if they both made half of what they make......In my opinion of course
Thoughts anyone, and not the one person who responds to everyone's posts please.....I know you have nothing else to do but reply but I need to hear some fresh opinions, I already have read yours over and over, I need the opinion of the real fans, the working class fans like me.......Thanks Kings Fans...
edit: and I AM in favor of buying out Thomas.
Yeah, Thomas is kind of unique. Whatever stat measure you like using, whether it's a Roland Rating, PER or what have you, KT's rating is going to be the worst on the active roster. And yet he demands a starting position, which is not what you want from a guy who, statistically, seems like his only job should be keeping Potapenko from getting lonely.
I don't think that buyouts are warranted in many situations -- definitely not for anyone with any trade value at all -- but perhaps to tank (Philly/Webber), as a minor mercy (Hart), or because a guy's attitude makes him a liability. I think that KT may be in that third category, I think he is the only guy on the roster who truly cannot be traded, and buying him out wouldn't be prohibitively expensive.
If I were a Maloof, I'd do it.
I don't think that buyouts are warranted in many situations -- definitely not for anyone with any trade value at all -- but perhaps to tank (Philly/Webber), as a minor mercy (Hart), or because a guy's attitude makes him a liability. I think that KT may be in that third category, I think he is the only guy on the roster who truly cannot be traded, and buying him out wouldn't be prohibitively expensive.
If I were a Maloof, I'd do it.
I'm pretty sure that when you buy somebody out in the NBA that their woulda-been salary contiues to count against your salary cap just as if they were still on your team -- prevents the richer franchises from getting an edge on the poorer ones by being able to just liquidate mistake contracts. So if that's true buying out Kenny's contract doesn't actually do anything to help us. In fact, since he would no longer be on the team, and hence could no longer either fill in for some minutes or ever be traded even in the last year of his contract, we would be 100% stuck with his money against our cap all the way through the end of the deal. Throiw in the fact that this team is run as a cash-strapped enterprise every year -- where going over the luxury cap for a $1,000,000 is considered completely out of line -- and how wexactly are you going to convince the Maloofs to go screeching into the red ink with a gigantic $20+ mil lump sum payment jsut to tella guy to go away?
As for Kenny's uses -- the problem that nobody recognized with him is that he is NOT a good bench big. And he's an extraordinarily drab starter. Like so many people on our sucky little team, he is a one trick pony -- one dimensional. A TWO dimensional backup big -- shotblocker/rebounder for instance....now that's useful. But a ONE dimensional backup big opens up as many holes as it fills. His insertion becomes as much a problem as a solution eery night he is in. And as a starter the remainder of his skills are so mediocre that on most nights you basically have a PF who is worse at EVERYTING else he does than his opponent...except rebounding. And if he was some sort of freakishly energetic savant ala a Rodman or whatnot, then he could still have an impact. But he's not. He's a "good" rebounder. But not agreat one. Not a dominant one. not a scary one. Being a "good" rebounder is a very nice skill if its one amongst many that you have. It can make an otherwise flawed big complete. But if its ALL yoou have, and you are merely "good" but not consistently dominant, it is just not enough. Not enough to justify starting. Not enough to be an impact bencher (indeed a problematic one because of the size issues). Just not enough period.
As for Kenny's uses -- the problem that nobody recognized with him is that he is NOT a good bench big. And he's an extraordinarily drab starter. Like so many people on our sucky little team, he is a one trick pony -- one dimensional. A TWO dimensional backup big -- shotblocker/rebounder for instance....now that's useful. But a ONE dimensional backup big opens up as many holes as it fills. His insertion becomes as much a problem as a solution eery night he is in. And as a starter the remainder of his skills are so mediocre that on most nights you basically have a PF who is worse at EVERYTING else he does than his opponent...except rebounding. And if he was some sort of freakishly energetic savant ala a Rodman or whatnot, then he could still have an impact. But he's not. He's a "good" rebounder. But not agreat one. Not a dominant one. not a scary one. Being a "good" rebounder is a very nice skill if its one amongst many that you have. It can make an otherwise flawed big complete. But if its ALL yoou have, and you are merely "good" but not consistently dominant, it is just not enough. Not enough to justify starting. Not enough to be an impact bencher (indeed a problematic one because of the size issues). Just not enough period.
http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#60
60. How do buy-outs affect a team's salary cap?
The agreed-upon buy-out amount (see question number 59) is included in the team salary instead of the salary called for in the contract. If the player had more than one season left on his contract, then the buy-out money is distributed among those seasons in proportion to the original salary. For example, say a player had three seasons remaining on his contract, with salaries of $10 million, $11 million and $12 million. The player and team agree to a buyout of $15 million. The $15 million is therefore charged to the team salary over the three seasons. Since the original contract had $33 million left to be paid, and $10 million is 30.3% of $33 million, 30.3% of the $15 million buyout, or $4.545 million, is included in the team salary in the first season following the buyout. Likewise, 33.33% of $15 million, or $5 million, is included in the team salary in the second season, and 36.36% of $15 million, or $5.455 million, is included in the team salary in the third season.
The distribution of the buy-out money is a matter of individual negotiation. Changing the number of years in which the money is paid does not change the number of years in which the team's team salary is charged. In the above example in which the player's contract is bought out with three seasons remaining, the buyout amount is always charged to the team salary over three seasons. It does not matter if the player is actually paid in a lump sum or over 20 years (a spread provision).
60. How do buy-outs affect a team's salary cap?
The agreed-upon buy-out amount (see question number 59) is included in the team salary instead of the salary called for in the contract. If the player had more than one season left on his contract, then the buy-out money is distributed among those seasons in proportion to the original salary. For example, say a player had three seasons remaining on his contract, with salaries of $10 million, $11 million and $12 million. The player and team agree to a buyout of $15 million. The $15 million is therefore charged to the team salary over the three seasons. Since the original contract had $33 million left to be paid, and $10 million is 30.3% of $33 million, 30.3% of the $15 million buyout, or $4.545 million, is included in the team salary in the first season following the buyout. Likewise, 33.33% of $15 million, or $5 million, is included in the team salary in the second season, and 36.36% of $15 million, or $5.455 million, is included in the team salary in the third season.
The distribution of the buy-out money is a matter of individual negotiation. Changing the number of years in which the money is paid does not change the number of years in which the team's team salary is charged. In the above example in which the player's contract is bought out with three seasons remaining, the buyout amount is always charged to the team salary over three seasons. It does not matter if the player is actually paid in a lump sum or over 20 years (a spread provision).
Well, I though buyout doesn't count against your salary cap... or at least doesn't carry over into all those future seasons... so no.
Keep K9 for what it's worth. He still can rebound which is worth something. Not his current salary of course. But I still really, truly believe that we can sucker one of the stupider GMs (which the league fortunately seems ripe with) into a deal which would take him far, far away from Sacto (or, failing that, to LA). Cleveland was almost ready to bite on him from what I remember from that potential Bibby trade gossip. Ignorant fools, didn't know how close they were to their doom *cue mad scientist laughter here*.
And for the people who think that Kenny would opt out if he were to bench him for good... who are you kidding folks? 24 mil or so for coming to sit around the bench every game in 3 upcoming years? If somebody offered that for me, I would be there in a breeze. I'd even agree to put my suit on, though I hate that thing
And Kenny's ability to get anything close to the same contract in the NBA is as good as mine now. He wouldn't get MLE in the Euroleague they way he's playing. Which it doesn't have of course. But I wish implemented a salary cap system already, not only so it would make things more interesting, but also because I could say "Hah, Kenny couldn't get MLE in the Euroleague!"
Also, enough of the Euroleague jokes in the other threads, folks. We're not NBA, we get it. But we're pretty good. Make fun of CBA or something once in a while. You know, stuff where the level actually sucks as opposed to "really darn good, but not good enough for us, neener-neener".
Keep K9 for what it's worth. He still can rebound which is worth something. Not his current salary of course. But I still really, truly believe that we can sucker one of the stupider GMs (which the league fortunately seems ripe with) into a deal which would take him far, far away from Sacto (or, failing that, to LA). Cleveland was almost ready to bite on him from what I remember from that potential Bibby trade gossip. Ignorant fools, didn't know how close they were to their doom *cue mad scientist laughter here*.
And for the people who think that Kenny would opt out if he were to bench him for good... who are you kidding folks? 24 mil or so for coming to sit around the bench every game in 3 upcoming years? If somebody offered that for me, I would be there in a breeze. I'd even agree to put my suit on, though I hate that thing
And Kenny's ability to get anything close to the same contract in the NBA is as good as mine now. He wouldn't get MLE in the Euroleague they way he's playing. Which it doesn't have of course. But I wish implemented a salary cap system already, not only so it would make things more interesting, but also because I could say "Hah, Kenny couldn't get MLE in the Euroleague!"
Also, enough of the Euroleague jokes in the other threads, folks. We're not NBA, we get it. But we're pretty good. Make fun of CBA or something once in a while. You know, stuff where the level actually sucks as opposed to "really darn good, but not good enough for us, neener-neener".
KT will not retire in 3 years, so you'd think he'd want to be somewhere he plays so he can improve his value. Right now, I'm guessing around 3-4 million a year would be his value. The point of the buyout is that the Kings eat the extra 12-15 million over 3 years, which gives us some cap space, saves some money, and gets him out of the locker room if he is going to be a problem on a rebuilding team. Win.
From KT's perpective, he gets the buyout money plus whatever he will earn in another contract over the next 3 years, which should be about the same as what he would earn if he just played the contract out. He has a chance to up his value and gets to play more. Win.
Unless we can package him in a trade this summer, probably not a bad option.
From KT's perpective, he gets the buyout money plus whatever he will earn in another contract over the next 3 years, which should be about the same as what he would earn if he just played the contract out. He has a chance to up his value and gets to play more. Win.
Unless we can package him in a trade this summer, probably not a bad option.
The problem there is KT is starting and averaging 23 mins per game. I don't think he'll be looking at more playtime anywhere he goes. There might be a few teams that wouldn't mind taking him at 3 to 4 mill a year but none, that I can think of, would ever consider starting him and/or give him 23 mins a game.
Since Kenny's only really useful for his rebounding, I went to check out which teams were worse than us in rebounding that could potentially use a boost on the boards. But lo and behold there's only one team, Toronto, that's worse!
We have had so much underachievement and unconsistence on this team especially with Bibby and Miller where they were thought of as near All Stars, or near the top of the best at their position. Kenny on the other hand is a major weak point we carry every game and that has offset the advantage we usually can count on at 3/4 with KMart and Artest.
I would have taken Webber gimpy or not and have his $ coming off the books at the end of this year then the bad situation we are in now. With all the time that GP looks at deals and trys to get the better of trades...I don't know how he figured that trading Webber for 3 "moveable pieces" was a good decision. Also a forgotten piece of that trade was trading away a decent homegrown player as well in Matt Barnes. I would love to have him back, but I'm happy he's doing good just down the road a little in Oakland...his shot sure has looked better.
