Greg Oden

[ParniValjak]

At least average players (if that is the worst outcome) are still able to play and help the team.

But you still end up mediocre team with no clear way to improve.

Taking a risk on Oden is in no way different that taking a risk on the draft pick. With that pick you could very well end up with Darko and really when you look at it, the value you get out of Darko and the value you would get out of injured Oden is no different. It has no significant effect on the franchise either way.

Sure you screw up a pick or a trade but its no different to any other team. You can't get it right every time. I would rather see us fail by trying to do something as opposed to failing and not trying anything.

This is a high risk-high reward type deal but if you don't take risks, you can't win.

 

[est.1999]

That's the thing. This trade proposal is only up because of his health problems. If we have the oppurtunity to know what his health would be like in the future(good or bad) then Portland would never trade him if they knew he was destined to have a long healthy career

 

[Warhawk]

But you still end up mediocre team with no clear way to improve.

Taking a risk on Oden is in no way different that taking a risk on the draft pick. With that pick you could very well end up with Darko and really when you look at it, the value you get out of Darko and the value you would get out of injured Oden is no different. It has no significant effect on the franchise either way.

Sure you screw up a pick or a trade but its no different to any other team. You can't get it right every time. I would rather see us fail by trying to do something as opposed to failing and not trying anything.

This is a high risk-high reward type deal but if you don't take risks, you can't win.

And Oden sitting on the bench is a way to improve? Really?

You can't get a pick right every time, but if you trade multuiple good assets for someone who is always injured, how does that help your team? How do you get better that way?

 

[VF21]

That's the thing. This trade proposal is only up because of his health problems. If we have the oppurtunity to know what his health would be like in the future(good or bad) then Portland would never trade him if they knew he was destined to have a long healthy career

Exactly. It's much like Groucho Marx, who once said he would never belong to a club that would accept him as a member.

If Portland does put Oden out for trade, we need to run as fast as possible in the other direction. Bringing an injury-challenged player to Sacramento might actually be a prosecutable offense.

 

[Bricklayer]

That's the thing. This trade proposal is only up because of his health problems. If we have the oppurtunity to know what his health would be like in the future(good or bad) then Portland would never trade him if they knew he was destined to have a long healthy career

The same thing could have been said of Nene a couple of years ago.

That's the whole key -- you can't wait to see if he stays healthy, because if he stays healthy he's worth more than your entire franchise sans Reke. You may, and I will stress here "may", have an opportunity to get a huge talent on the cheap because of uncertainty surrounding him. Once that uncertainty is gone, there is no getting him on the cheap, there is no getting him at all.

The other thing of course is Portland's positioning. They are already a near elite team, and could easily bring back two other shotblocker/rebounders in Camby and Pryzbilla. Makes them uniquely positioned to maybe listen to an offer for Oden in a way that a team like Chicago (with Noah) or Indiana (with Hibbert) is not for their far less talented centers. Portland would like to win now, is close to doing so, and has options at the position. There is still a good chance they do not even take the phone call, but if they do its not necessarily because they think Oden is done, its because they are kind of like where we were with Gerald Wallace years ago -- ready to win now, and with a lower stomach/need to accept risk than a team at the bottom might be.

JT would be the opportunity cost here. Otherwise given Oden's age (he's 22), its pretty much just the same thing as drafting Greg Oden this year. That would be scary, but pretty damn exciting too.

 

[ovrush]

The same thing could have been said of Nene a couple of years ago.

That's the whole key -- you can't wait to see if he stays healthy, because if he stays healthy he's worth more than your entire franchise sans Reke. You may, and I will stress here "may", have an opportunity to get a huge talent on the cheap because of uncertainty surrounding him. Once that uncertainty is gone, there is no getting him on the cheap, there is no getting him at all.

The other thing of course is Portland's positioning. They are already a near elite team, and could easily bring back two other shotblocker/rebounders in Camby and Pryzbilla. Makes them uniquely positioned to maybe listen to an offer for Oden in a way that a team like Chicago (with Noah) or Indiana (with Hibbert) is not for their far less talented centers. Portland would like to win now, is close to doing so, and has options at the position. There is still a good chance they do not even take the phone call, but if they do its not necessarily because they think Oden is done, its because they are kind of like where we were with Gerald Wallace years ago -- ready to win now, and with a lower stomach/need to accept risk than a team at the bottom might be.

JT would be the opportunity cost here. Otherwise given Oden's age (he's 22), its pretty much just the same thing as drafting Greg Oden this year. That would be scary, but pretty damn exciting too.

Plus they might be wanting to wipe their hands of the Oden vs Durant fiasco so it doesn't keep popping up while they're trying to compete and being a distraction (as well as the continual distraction of Oden coming back from injury and questions about his health while they're competing)

Another way of thinking about it... Do you think the Wizards would have traded Chris Webber for Mitch Richmond in a bubble on pure talent. No way.

Webber had personality issues, motivational issues, questions about drug use etc etc etc. The Wizards were also sitting on Juwan Howard as their power forward. Not as talented but solid and less of a distraction. So they took on Mitch who was a solid citizen and a really good two guard and let go of Webber (I think Rasheed Wallace as well but i could be wrong).

 

[Warhawk]

I'm just wondering if everyone advocating this would have said the same last season when JT was looking pretty promising and we just stunk our way to a #4 pick. Now JT still has some improving to do, but how would you feel about JT and Evans playing for Portland and us sitting with Oden on the bench for the year (with his "unforseen" injury). With no JT and no Evans and our star center out for the whole year, where would this team be now - 8 wins? Max?

Taking the long view sure gets old year after year, but I guess yet another year or two of pushing for the worst record in the league would have been OK with everyone?

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Plus they might be wanting to wipe their hands of the Oden vs Durant fiasco so it doesn't keep popping up while they're trying to compete and being a distraction (as well as the continual distraction of Oden coming back from injury and questions about his health while they're competing)

Maybe the national media wants to go there but I can tell you that very few in Portland lose any sleep at night on this because it was understood that Oden was the #1 pick and also because the Blazers actually took out a billboard ad campaign asking fans to vote on Oden or Durant and Oden won overwhelmingly.

 

[Arby's Roast Beef]

I don't think I'd do it, because it's moreso with Oden's lingering injury problems above anything else. I just don't think he'll recover to be his old self, and he'll be more cognizant of his injury and play accordingly.

What I do like is that Oden really made great steps this year--in his 24 minutes of playing time this year, his impact was similar to that of a superstar. Near lockdown defense as he provides your prototypical disruptor/individual defense anchor, and his offense was making great strides. It's unfortunate that foul trouble, but moreover, his injuries, kept impeding him.

 

[bajaden]

One thing I know. This team is in a position where it can't take big risks that might set it back if the move doesn't pan out. This team is on the verge of becoming a good team. Yeah, if we aquire Oden and he stays healthy, were a giant step forward. But if we make this deal and he doesn't stay healthy, were two giant steps backwards. Were in the lottery for the next three or maybe even four years. The seats stay empty at the new arena we don't have. And everyone on this thread that wants to trade for Oden would be calling for Petire's head. I know I would.......

 

[kupman]

Let me just say on the onset that I was right concerning the case of Oden. Just a couple of short years ago pretty much everyone here was saying that Oden was destined to be the next HOF center and we should do whatever we could humanly possible to snag him in the draft.

I was one of the lone few to say "not so fast." There is "no sure thing" in the NBA I said. Most said - "come-on, he is the next Ewing, the next Admiral and so on."

So yes, I was right. Please take pause and pat me on the back at this time.

...I was also on the record I saying that I would take Durant at #1 - but that is another issue.

But now, many have gone 180 degrees the other way. Some even call him a bust at this point. Once again i say "not so fast." This guy could still clearly be a dominate center who ends up in the HOF. would I give up JT and a 1st round pick? In a heartbeat (as long as it is not #1 or #2).

 

[Vlade4GM]

Unless you predicted his injuries, I really don't see how you were right.

 

[Rose2Thomas]

If Oden was never injured at all, there's a pretty good chance that right now he would be the best center in the league.

Outside of #1 pick I would do the trade, outside of Wall, I don't see superstar potential out of any of the picks, Oden still has it even though the chance of it happening goes down with each injury.

 

[NewArena]

Let me just say on the onset that I was right concerning the case of Oden. Just a couple of short years ago pretty much everyone here was saying that Oden was destined to be the next HOF center and we should do whatever we could humanly possible to snag him in the draft.

I was one of the lone few to say "not so fast." There is "no sure thing" in the NBA I said. Most said - "come-on, he is the next Ewing, the next Admiral and so on."

So yes, I was right. Please take pause and pat me on the back at this time.

...I was also on the record I saying that I would take Durant at #1 - but that is another issue.

But now, many have gone 180 degrees the other way. Some even call him a bust at this point. Once again i say "not so fast." This guy could still clearly be a dominate center who ends up in the HOF. would I give up JT and a 1st round pick? In a heartbeat (as long as it is not #1 or #2).

I can not stand it when people do this. What do you want, a reward? Anyway, yes i would do that deal in a heartbeat unless we got a top 3 pick. It is exactly the kind of risk we need to be taking because franchise big men with his size and defensive ability do not come along often.

He is the kind of guy we so desperately need. Of course i am afraid of his injuries but at some point, we have got to stop drafting all these damn skinny guards.

 

[QoooooQ]

So yes, I was right. Please take pause and pat me on the back at this time.

This guy could still clearly be a dominate center who ends up in the HOF.

All right enough already. You'll get one pat on Oden's induction day, but that's it.

 

[kupman]

I can not stand it when people do this. What do you want, a reward?

Take a breath. I was just joking around...hence the "."

I am seldom correct with the opinions I express around here so I thought it would funny to point out when I was correct...that apparently was another mistake on my part.

 

[NME]

Wait, since you say "not so fast" to everything, you've set it up so you get patted whether he busts or is inducted into the HOF.

 

[Rookie]

Wait, since you say "not so fast" to everything, you've set it up so you get patted whether he busts or is inducted into the HOF.

Not so fast...don't judge him on being right or wrong yet.


(I will post this when he's right or wrong and get credit.)

 

[hammystyle]

Let me just say on the onset that I was right concerning the case of Oden. Just a couple of short years ago pretty much everyone here was saying that Oden was destined to be the next HOF center and we should do whatever we could humanly possible to snag him in the draft.

I was one of the lone few to say "not so fast." There is "no sure thing" in the NBA I said. Most said - "come-on, he is the next Ewing, the next Admiral and so on."

So yes, I was right. Please take pause and pat me on the back at this time.

...I was also on the record I saying that I would take Durant at #1 - but that is another issue.

But now, many have gone 180 degrees the other way. Some even call him a bust at this point. Once again i say "not so fast." This guy could still clearly be a dominate center who ends up in the HOF. would I give up JT and a 1st round pick? In a heartbeat (as long as it is not #1 or #2).

You were "one of the lone few" eh?

 

[NewArena]

I gotta say, im pretty shocked at the poll results so far.

 

[TTown Kings]

82 games in 3 YEARS, he was also injured for most of his only college season. He played like 22 minutes a game in the one season where he played 60 games. What are the chances he will ever be able to play big minutes for an entire season?

That's worth JT and a top draft pick? Not in my book.

 

[hrdboild]

I'm sure someone has said this already, but it's hard to answer that question without knowing what our pick is going to be this year. If it's top 5 I don't think I would make the trade. At least I would have to think long and hard about it. (Which I see is in the poll, but it's still a tough call) I still think Oden hasn't had a fair shot and it's too early to write him off, but there's enough of a pattern for there to be concern. And the risk involved in that scenario would make it hard for me to part with Thompson and a top 5 pick. That's the kind of move that can kill you if it turns out badly.

On the other hand, if we're looking at picking 6-10 than it becomes a lot more appealing. If Oden does get healthy then you basically have your team set already with Tyreke and Oden and you just have to fill in around that with the right teammates. We'd still have Landry, Casspi, Greene, and Hawes which is a good start. Not to mention a draft day trade of that magnitude would set you up for some pretty appealing free agency offers. Does Portland make the trade for a 6-10 pick though? Eh, not likely. So there's the rub. Wish I had a crystal ball.

 

[bajaden]

This will be my last word on this one. If you need a crystal ball to reinforce your confidence in any trade, you probably shouldn't do that trade. Its your gut telling you its a mistake.

Its these type of pie in the sky trades that got the Kings orginization in trouble shortly after they came here. They were looking for quick fixes. first Derrick Smith and then Ralph Sampson. And there were others. They took not great, but good established players plus first round draft picks and traded them for a star. An injured star that they hoped would return to his former self. They lost every bet and ended up saddled with useless players with big contracts and no first round picks. I don't care to go down that road again. Not with the light at the end of the tunnel finally being seen.

 

[ParniValjak]

This will be my last word on this one. If you need a crystal ball to reinforce your confidence in any trade, you probably shouldn't do that trade. Its your gut telling you its a mistake.

Its these type of pie in the sky trades that got the Kings orginization in trouble shortly after they came here. They were looking for quick fixes. first Derrick Smith and then Ralph Sampson. And there were others. They took not great, but good established players plus first round draft picks and traded them for a star. An injured star that they hoped would return to his former self. They lost every bet and ended up saddled with useless players with big contracts and no first round picks. I don't care to go down that road again. Not with the light at the end of the tunnel finally being seen.

I am sorry but that just the sort of explaination that you get from people who are afraid of risk!

Here is another little fact, the biggest trade that the Kings pulled in their Sacramento history was the Webber trade. Sure talent for talent it was a no brainer but there were SO many ways that could have gone wrong. Webber could have just stood his ground and never made it to Sacramento. He could have easily been a malcontent in Sacramento as he was in all his previous stops. There was a lot of risk associated in that trade.

Every single trade has a risk associated with it. You take a flier and see what comes out of it. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose but if you don't attempt something, you will never get it done!

 

[Vlade4GM]

I am sorry but that just the sort of explaination that you get from people who are afraid of risk!

Here is another little fact, the biggest trade that the Kings pulled in their Sacramento history was the Webber trade. Sure talent for talent it was a no brainer but there were SO many ways that could have gone wrong. Webber could have just stood his ground and never made it to Sacramento. He could have easily been a malcontent in Sacramento as he was in all his previous stops. There was a lot of risk associated in that trade.

Every single trade has a risk associated with it. You take a flier and see what comes out of it. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose but if you don't attempt something, you will never get it done!

Losing an old Mitch Richmond isn't that much of a risk.

 

[Superman]

And you're talking about Chris Webber, who had proven himself to be a pretty doggone good player in the first five years of his career. Oden 2010 <<< Webber 1998

 

[bajaden]

I am sorry but that just the sort of explaination that you get from people who are afraid of risk!

Here is another little fact, the biggest trade that the Kings pulled in their Sacramento history was the Webber trade. Sure talent for talent it was a no brainer but there were SO many ways that could have gone wrong. Webber could have just stood his ground and never made it to Sacramento. He could have easily been a malcontent in Sacramento as he was in all his previous stops. There was a lot of risk associated in that trade.

Every single trade has a risk associated with it. You take a flier and see what comes out of it. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose but if you don't attempt something, you will never get it done!

If you stick you hand in the fire and you get if burn't, hopefully you learn from that. Its called learning from experience. In some circles its called wisdom. And if you stick your hand in again just to make sure, its called stupid. Do you remember the definition of insanity. Its repeating the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

The Webber trade doesn't even come close to being the same kind of risk. We were trading a veteran player that was basicly at the end of his career for a very talented and healthy player with a checkered background. There are all kinds of risks in the world. Trust me, I've taken my share of them. To me a better risk would be to make a deal for, lets say Chris Bosh and then hope you can convince him to stay. Its still a big risk, but if your sucessful you at least know you have a very good healthy player.

I hope that Oden comes back and stays healthy. The more good players in the NBA the better. And if that happens, then yeah, maybe I'll wish he was on our team. Depending on how he develops. Lets be honest here. He hasn't proved anything yet. To be fair, he hasn't had a chance. But if he stays healthy I wouldn't bet against him. But for my taste, he's just too big a risk to give up an established player and a high first round pick. Your giving up possibly two potential starters for someone you hope will stay healthy. You go ahead, but I'll pass..