[Grades] Grades v. Sixers & Refs 1/2/2014

[HighFlyingMonkey]

That's exactly what I was thinking. Great minds.

I don't think its possible to hate a city more than Kings/49ers fans hate Seattle

 

[Revenge]

Malone's rotations in the second half are horrible. No way Gay (or Cousins, IT) should sit out half of the 4th Q. Malone gets fooled into his "energy" guys are playing well enough that he lets his starters rot until it's too late. Fortunately, most of the time Jimmer is so bad he doesn't get an extended run like last night. I still like Malone overall, but not liking some of his rotation choices in the second half of games.

The problem is that it's usually the starters putting the team in these bad situations... so if the bench comes out and makes some things happen, I think it makes sense to keep them in a bit longer. Does it always work out? No. But how often have our starters "worked out" in terms of proving that they can win games? I think we all know how that story goes.

 

[Uncia03]

Ditto! Kings had 27 fouls called against them to 31 called against 76ers. Yes, officiating was bad last night but it cut both ways. I've said it a zillion times - constantly blaming refs for a loss is total loser mentality.

Typically this is true, but not all fouls are created equally.

If the Heat are playing the Pacers in Game 7 of the Eastern Conference Play-offs and in the first 5 minutes of the game 6 fouls are called against Miami and the foul distribution is:
James: 1
Wade: 1
Bosh: 2
Battier: 1
Chalmers: 1

You say that Pacers are being aggressive or the Refs are calling things tight.

But if the foul distribution is:
James: 3
Wade: 2
Bosh: 1

And two of the calls against James are complete phantom calls which forces James to the bench for the half, and then James picks up a 4th foul 3 minutes into his next stint...well at that point you have to wonder what is going on because no-one is watching the game to see the most dominate players sitting on the bench because a ref decided to put him there. And if the Heat lose that game, of course you've got people talking about the 'worst officiated games of all time'.

I think people have a hard time distinguishing what the role of a Ref is and don't take into account that you truly can have good Ref play and bad Ref play.

Some people seem to think that Refs are above reproach and that they don't have an impact on the outcome of a game, but both things are blatantly false.

Also I think people consider a Ref's job as a science, when in fact it's much more like an art. It's not a Ref's job to analyze every single movement and blow the whistle whenever said movement falls outside the parameters of what is acceptable. Instead, it's an art where the Refs manipulate the ebb and flow of the game, making sure that the broad strokes of the movement are consistent with what is required for basketball play, with-out hopefully, having such a large imprint at specific moments to leave eye-popping marks on the canvas.

A great ref is one who's artistry on that game allows the players to shine on a beautiful piece of artwork with-out any observer seeing their distinctive hand in the work at all. In this particular game there is a giant red X right through half of the canvas courtesy of some Refs that decided to make their imprint on the game and basically ruin the canvas.

Being a ref is hard. Being a great Ref in the NBA when the players are so fast and big is even harder. But it is the responsibility of the Refs to control the game with-out doing too much to leave their handiwork visible, but in this particular game they failed miserably.

So, the Refs are usually never the cause of a loss. But in this one they failed their duty to orchestrate the game.

 

[VF21]

Malones job is not to win games, it's to change the culture. I'm really not seeing much culture change though.

Then you're not paying attention (she said, sarcastically).

I think some people have differing ideas on what changing the culture really means. I think it means the attitude of the team, the coaches and the staff (many of whom didn't even speak to each other last year); it means doing your job, whether it's selling tickets or being the 13th guy to come into a game; it means promoting your product with passion and perseverance; it means getting back to the days when the Sacramento Kings weren't the laughing stock of the NBA.

I think if you look at it that way, you'll realize the culture has already undergone significant (and positive) changes and will continue to evolve.

 

[Chubbs]

Then you're not paying attention (she said, sarcastically).

I think some people have differing ideas on what changing the culture really means. I think it means the attitude of the team, the coaches and the staff (many of whom didn't even speak to each other last year); it means doing your job, whether it's selling tickets or being the 13th guy to come into a game; it means promoting your product with passion and perseverance; it means getting back to the days when the Sacramento Kings weren't the laughing stock of the NBA.

I think if you look at it that way, you'll realize the culture has already undergone significant (and positive) changes and will continue to evolve.

Off the court, yes. That part has taken a huge leap forward. On the court is hit and miss right now.

Sadly, I'm paying way too much attention actually.

 

[TheBadGuy]

It was a unimpressive 11 points he does not mentally look like the same guy who played with passion when he first came and was quickly becoming a fan favourite, he's looking like a bigger Marcus Thornton since the Gay trade.

Ok I'll be clear, Jimmer was impressive but Williams wasn't and also he played for 25 min. to go with only 11 points.

 

[HereWeBoogie]

I don't think its possible to hate a city more than Kings/49ers fans hate Seattle

(Flame suit on) I Actually like the Seahawks and root for them to go all the way. but im not a Niner fan, in fact i dislike them a lot.

 

[HereWeBoogie]

Can anybody crunch the numbers on what DeMarcus' per36 was for this game?

 

[VF21]

(Flame suit on) I Actually like the Seahawks and root for them to go all the way. but im not a Niner fan, in fact i dislike them a lot.

There's discussion of the NFL in the General thread. I would strongly advise any further discussion in that regard take place there.

 

[Npliam]

Can anybody crunch the numbers on what DeMarcus' per36 was for this game?

1 million.

 

[CruzDude]

Establishing a culture, building a core of players and integrating new players 10 and 17 games into a season is a MAJOR task that cannot happen overnight or even in a couple of months. 4 really good games in 7 is a BIG improvement compared to the first 10 games. They all will have good, bad and mediocre games. Then gradually the core guys will have more good games and the transients will have more mediocre and bad games. One bad game now means nothing. Disappointing yes. But in the grand scheme of building a new team, nah. Give it time folks.

 

[Chubbs]

Anybody put together a compilation of the fouls on cousins?

If someone could make a video that'd be fantastic.

Here are offensive highlights from cousins. Pretty impressive.

 

[Angela44]

The analysis if jimmer was atrocious and flat lies. Jimmer came in and the team was down five and he got a whopping four minutes and left the game with the lead cut to one. He continuously found cousins which is what any real pg should be doing. He got scored on once but written obliterated all your guards all night.

Get a clue and stop the hate

 

[Chubbs]

Oh goodie. A new jimmer fan.

 

[sdballer]

Oh goodie. A new jimmer fan.

Sounds just like an old jimmer fan. Guessing they'll both end up in the same place.

 

[treach1976]

The analysis if jimmer was atrocious and flat lies. Jimmer came in and the team was down five and he got a whopping four minutes and left the game with the lead cut to one. He continuously found cousins which is what any real pg should be doing. He got scored on once but written obliterated all your guards all night.

Get a clue and stop the hate

Coming from a Jimmer fan, let me offer some advice and try to stop this before it starts (although I doubt you will take it). Coming in brand new to the forum and posting inflammatory comments (regardless of whether you perceive them to be true) doesn't do yourself, and more importantly, Jimmer any good. I'm saying this because we've seen it time and time and time again. Fans come in, disagree whole-heartedly about what they see, and throw around terms like "lies", "unfair", etc. While claiming that if we only started Jimmer he would score 30 points a game. Even if there was truth to these comments, the result of picking a fight like this will unquestionably end in 20 pages of an argument that you will lose, and the entire KingsFans forum base wishing Jimmer gone if only to shut you up. He doesn't need that.

I could go right now and post a bunch of stats showing how Jimmer's per 36 is up, and how is TS% is one of the better on the team, etc., but it doesn't matter. Last night for example, sure he caught fire, but he also had 3 costly turnovers in the 4th quarter that resulted in 4 or 6 points the other way. Just stop with the accusations of hate / lies, and let his play speak for himself....

BTW - have you noticed how much hate IT is drawing right now? It's the same thing... His supporters make aggrandizing statements that are met by sharp criticism... Now every move he makes is overly scrutinized.

 

[Chubbs]

For Cousins: 33 points/14 rebounds in 28 mins projects to 47/25 in 40 mins.

 

[VF21]

The analysis if jimmer was atrocious and flat lies. Jimmer came in and the team was down five and he got a whopping four minutes and left the game with the lead cut to one. He continuously found cousins which is what any real pg should be doing. He got scored on once but written obliterated all your guards all night.

Get a clue and stop the hate

Congratulations. You have, once again, won a ticket on the bus. Enjoy the ride.

 

[randymoss1881]

Establishing a culture, building a core of players and integrating new players 10 and 17 games into a season is a MAJOR task that cannot happen overnight or even in a couple of months. 4 really good games in 7 is a BIG improvement compared to the first 10 games. They all will have good, bad and mediocre games. Then gradually the core guys will have more good games and the transients will have more mediocre and bad games. One bad game now means nothing. Disappointing yes. But in the grand scheme of building a new team, nah. Give it time folks.

They also just had there 3rd practice together since the trade so we should get better with more practices and games together.

 

[VF21]

Oh goodie. A new jimmer fan.

No, not a new one. I think she's trying for a annual pass on the bus.

 

[VF21]

Coming from a Jimmer fan, let me offer some advice and try to stop this before it starts (although I doubt you will take it). Coming in brand new to the forum and posting inflammatory comments (regardless of whether you perceive them to be true) doesn't do yourself, and more importantly, Jimmer any good. I'm saying this because we've seen it time and time and time again. Fans come in, disagree whole-heartedly about what they see, and throw around terms like "lies", "unfair", etc. While claiming that if we only started Jimmer he would score 30 points a game. Even if there was truth to these comments, the result of picking a fight like this will unquestionably end in 20 pages of an argument that you will lose, and the entire KingsFans forum base wishing Jimmer gone if only to shut you up. He doesn't need that.

I could go right now and post a bunch of stats showing how Jimmer's per 36 is up, and how is TS% is one of the better on the team, etc., but it doesn't matter. Last night for example, sure he caught fire, but he also had 3 costly turnovers in the 4th quarter that resulted in 4 or 6 points the other way. Just stop with the accusations of hate / lies, and let his play speak for himself....

BTW - have you noticed how much hate IT is drawing right now? It's the same thing... His supporters make aggrandizing statements that are met by sharp criticism... Now every move he makes is overly scrutinized.

It wasn't her first dance.

 

[TheFirstBandwagonKingsFan]

The analysis if jimmer was atrocious and flat lies. Jimmer came in and the team was down five and he got a whopping four minutes and left the game with the lead cut to one. He continuously found cousins which is what any real pg should be doing. He got scored on once but written obliterated all your guards all night.

Get a clue and stop the hate

As another fan of Jimmer I'm asking you to take the Jimmer goggles off... he played well I agree! His confidence seems to be rising and that can only lead to good things. His D was not to good at times. You must take the good with the bad and he did both last night.
Treach 1976 summed up everything else perfectly.

 

[VF21]

As another fan of Jimmer I'm asking you to take the Jimmer goggles off... he played well I agree! His confidence seems to be rising and that can only lead to good things. His D was not to good at times. You must take the good with the bad and he did both last night.
Treach 1976 summed up everything else perfectly.

Angela44 will not be responding.

 

[bajaden]

The fact that defense was the culprit last night and that so many people can't see it is very discouraging.
The officiating was about as bad as we have seen this year. They did not control the game, and it could have become even more physical. They got a lot of collisions wrong, which is dangerous. But you can never blame the outcome of the game on the officiating. Bad officiating is part of the game at all levels, even the NBA.

Bullcrap! That's nothing but sanctimonious nonsense. Of course the officials can control the game. For example, if they keep calling fouls, when there is no foul, then it becomes a lot harder to play defense. And when lack of defense is causing you to lose the game, then the officials are partly responsible. That was one of the worse ref'ed games I've seen all year. They put Cousins in the position that if he just blows on anyone, its a foul. But at the other end, IT and Jimmer got totally mugged a couple of times. Not to mention Cousins.

 

[Kingster]

Bullcrap! That's nothing but sanctimonious nonsense. Of course the officials can control the game. For example, if they keep calling fouls, when there is no foul, then it becomes a lot harder to play defense. And when lack of defense is causing you to lose the game, then the officials are partly responsible. That was one of the worse ref'ed games I've seen all year.
They put Cousins in the position that if he just blows on anyone, its a foul. But at the other end, IT and Jimmer got totally mugged a couple of times. Not to mention Cousins.

Because the TV producer was focusing on something other than the game, I didn't see the entire play, but it looked to me that one of the Sixers literally took a running start and plowed into Cousins, sort of like a linebacker taking a run at standing quarterback; Cousins got the foul. I'd like to know what the review officials had to say on that one. On another play, Turner just hammered Cousins in the back and Cousins went flying (didn't appear at all to be a flop); Turner got the defensive rebound and headed up court; no foul called. IT got hacked so much during the game that it was more noteworthy when he didn't get hacked, though the Kings' spacing was so lousy IT didn't have much a lane to drive in anyway.

 

[Glenn]

Bullcrap! That's nothing but sanctimonious nonsense. Of course the officials can control the game. For example, if they keep calling fouls, when there is no foul, then it becomes a lot harder to play defense. And when lack of defense is causing you to lose the game, then the officials are partly responsible. That was one of the worse ref'ed games I've seen all year. They put Cousins in the position that if he just blows on anyone, its a foul. But at the other end, IT and Jimmer got totally mugged a couple of times. Not to mention Cousins.

I think most of us agree that this last game was ref'd very badly. Because of my 12 years of officiating (baseball) I usually defend officials to whatever degree I can. They all make mistakes. I believe I saw somewhere that even the best of NBA officials are right about 91% of the time. It's a tough game to officiate.

But .... this last game was atrocious. I wish there was a video of the calls on Cousins. I think Chubbs asked if anyone had one. My first reaction was that I must have missed something until I saw replays. He was shoved down with two hands and the foul was called on him. He was chip blocked (a nice football tactic) and knocked over and was called for a foul. And there was another I don't remember exactly. I think there is an assumption that if Boogie is involved, it must be his fault. I wish that same logic went to a few Clippers. The refs have to get over this if this is their mind set. I think the Kings organization has to make some noise at NBA headquarters. Boogie can't speak to defend himself. He doesn't dare.

Perhaps Gray has to send a message. I honestly don't know what to do but will be watching tonight's game with interest.

And for those of you who count fouls as if that tells you anything, forget it. Some teams are more aggressive than others. Some reach in more than others. There are an amazing number of factors to determine which team gets the most fouls. The team with the most fouls is NOT necessarily getting picked on. The team with the least fouls is NOT necessarily getting favoritism. There may be exceptions but as a general rule, foul numbers mean very little if taken totally out of contest.

I feel a little sorry for Boogie as if he needs that from me. Part of his advantage as an NBA player is that he can man handle the man defending him and with that approach, encouraged by Shaq, no doubt, he will continue at his amazing run of effectiveness. Let us not have NBA officials take away his natural advantage.

As Wilt Chamberlain said, "No one roots for Goliath." No kidding except in this case, I will root for Goliath.

 

[Glenn]

Because the TV producer was focusing on something other than the game, I didn't see the entire play, but it looked to me that one of the Sixers literally took a running start and plowed into Cousins, sort of like a linebacker taking a run at standing quarterback; Cousins got the foul. I'd like to know what the review officials had to say on that one. On another play, Turner just hammered Cousins in the back and Cousins went flying (didn't appear at all to be a flop); Turner got the defensive rebound and headed up court; no foul called. IT got hacked so much during the game that it was more noteworthy when he didn't get hacked, though the Kings' spacing was so lousy IT didn't have much a lane to drive in anyway.

IT looked like a pinball.

 

[bajaden]

This is neither in support of Jimmer, nor a criticism. Unfortunately he's in a dammed if you do, and dammed if you don't situation. If he comes in and starts shooting the ball, he's called a chucker, by some. If he doesn't shoot, but tries to set up his teammates, and at the end of the game has only a couple of points, but only took 2 or three shots, he's criticized for doing nothing while on the court. I think the expectations were far too high when he arrived, and anything, and I mean anything he does wrong is magnified, while the same mistakes by others, while noted to some degree, are quickly forgotten. He has in fact, become the whipping boy of the team. Very similar to the situation JT found himself in at one time, when people were criticizing him for playing with his mouth open, and how stupid he looked.

The point is, if Jimmer comes in and scores 15 points, but turns the ball over a couple of times, all that's talked about by some are the turnovers, and not the 15 points. I'm not a big fan of the +/- rating, but only Cousins and Jimmer had a + rating in that game. Was Jimmer perfect? No! But IT had some of the same problems that Jimmer had. Neither could stay in front of Tony Wroten, which didn't surprise me. Wroten is a terrific ballhandler, and a terrific athlete. When at Washington, I thought he reminded me a lot of Tyreke with his ability to get to the basket, but more athletic. IT and Jimmer aren't the first PG's he managed to blow by.

I realize fans get imprinted by first impressions, and have difficulty letting go of those impressions. Some others just jump on the popular bandwagon which ever way its moving. I just believe in being as fair as possible. Doesn't mean I don't have my biases at times, but I try to suppress them as best I can. If Jimmer plays badly, I'm going to say so, but if he plays well, I'm going to give him credit. The best thing that could happen to Jimmer is to get a fresh start somewhere else.

 

[whozit]

I think most of us agree that this last game was ref'd very badly. Because of my 12 years of officiating (baseball) I usually defend officials to whatever degree I can. They all make mistakes. I believe I saw somewhere that even the best of NBA officials are right about 91% of the time. It's a tough game to officiate.

But .... this last game was atrocious. I wish there was a video of the calls on Cousins. I think Chubbs asked if anyone had one. My first reaction was that I must have missed something until I saw replays. He was shoved down with two hands and the foul was called on him. He was chip blocked (a nice football tactic) and knocked over and was called for a foul. And there was another I don't remember exactly. I think there is an assumption that if Boogie is involved, it must be his fault. I wish that same logic went to a few Clippers. The refs have to get over this if this is their mind set. I think the Kings organization has to make some noise at NBA headquarters. Boogie can't speak to defend himself. He doesn't dare.

Perhaps Gray has to send a message. I honestly don't know what to do but will be watching tonight's game with interest.

And for those of you who count fouls as if that tells you anything, forget it. Some teams are more aggressive than others. Some reach in more than others. There are an amazing number of factors to determine which team gets the most fouls. The team with the most fouls is NOT necessarily getting picked on. The team with the least fouls is NOT necessarily getting favoritism. There may be exceptions but as a general rule, foul numbers mean very little if taken totally out of contest.

I feel a little sorry for Boogie as if he needs that from me. Part of his advantage as an NBA player is that he can man handle the man defending him and with that approach, encouraged by Shaq, no doubt, he will continue at his amazing run of effectiveness. Let us not have NBA officials take away his natural advantage.

As Wilt Chamberlain said, "No one roots for Goliath." No kidding except in this case, I will root for Goliath.

I have enjoyed watching the Kings again. This game made me mad.

I would be shocked if a tape is not forwarded to the league offices. But rather with noise just done quietly.

 

[Glenn]

This is neither in support of Jimmer, nor a criticism. Unfortunately he's in a dammed if you do, and dammed if you don't situation. If he comes in and starts shooting the ball, he's called a chucker, by some. If he doesn't shoot, but tries to set up his teammates, and at the end of the game has only a couple of points, but only took 2 or three shots, he's criticized for doing nothing while on the court. I think the expectations were far too high when he arrived, and anything, and I mean anything he does wrong is magnified, while the same mistakes by others, while noted to some degree, are quickly forgotten. He has in fact, become the whipping boy of the team. Very similar to the situation JT found himself in at one time, when people were criticizing him for playing with his mouth open, and how stupid he looked.

The point is, if Jimmer comes in and scores 15 points, but turns the ball over a couple of times, all that's talked about by some are the turnovers, and not the 15 points. I'm not a big fan of the +/- rating, but only Cousins and Jimmer had a + rating in that game. Was Jimmer perfect? No! But IT had some of the same problems that Jimmer had. Neither could stay in front of Tony Wroten, which didn't surprise me. Wroten is a terrific ballhandler, and a terrific athlete. When at Washington, I thought he reminded me a lot of Tyreke with his ability to get to the basket, but more athletic. IT and Jimmer aren't the first PG's he managed to blow by.

I realize fans get imprinted by first impressions, and have difficulty letting go of those impressions. Some others just jump on the popular bandwagon which ever way its moving. I just believe in being as fair as possible. Doesn't mean I don't have my biases at times, but I try to suppress them as best I can. If Jimmer plays badly, I'm going to say so, but if he plays well, I'm going to give him credit. The best thing that could happen to Jimmer is to get a fresh start somewhere else.

If Jimmer contributes the way he did in the last game on a decently regular basis a difficult task, I think people will warm to him and as he is coachable and actually gives a crap about defense, he may see his minutes increase. He certainly has the capability to hit shots well. The basket is still 10 feet off the ground, directly in the middle from the side lines and the same distance from the end line. Why he lost this shot making ability is probably a mixture of many things but confidence seems to be at the center of it. Now he has a coach who is a positive coach and we'll see what happens with Jimmer. We'll just have to wait and see.