[Grades] Grades v. Rockets 11/6/2015

How many MVPs will Seth Curry win?

  • 1

    Votes: 2 5.4%
  • lots more than 1

    Votes: 5 13.5%
  • lots lots more than 1

    Votes: 10 27.0%
  • less than 1

    Votes: 20 54.1%

  • Total voters
    37
  • Poll closed .

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#1


Well, another loss. But a loss with honor I suppose. If there can be honor in letting everybody score 110 on you.

Something mysterious about our starting lineup though -- no matter who is placed in it, they are guaranteed to suck, and suck hard. Am wondering if the league ever thought to mandate whether a team had to start people or not? Maybe can just skip that whole part against the Warriors tomorrow.

Boxscore

Stats: 18min 2pts (0-4, 0-3, 2-2) 5reb 0ast 0stl 0blk 0TO
Summary: Sure, he's being played out of position a bit. Still, gotta do better than this.. Curry may have already taken his minutes.

Anderson ( D ) -- my only significant notes on Anderson were on a sequence where he was repeatedly slow to get out on Thornton on defense, and Marcus drained several threes in his face , then Anderson came back down the other way and return fire, and missed it badly. Impeded Harden a few times. Not too many as you can tell from the final tallies. Don't specifically remember the 5 rebounds, but its something he can do some of, and something you need when your old coach is playing tinyball and the center and "power forward" are dead legged. Expectations too low and not enough negative stuff to slap on an F, but obviously did nothing, and with the bench guards all better, could be yet another early season jumble vs. the Warriors.

Stats: 26min 15pts (5-15, 1-2, 4-6) 5reb 2ast 1stl 0blk 2TO
Summary: Maybe he's got post partum now? Missed chippee after chippee again, before barely sputtering to life down the stretch.

Gay ( D- ) -- really unacceptable play by Rudy since Cuz went down. This is precisely when he's been needed most, and he's given us nothing, and hence very little chance to sneak out with one of these. Was completely dead and invisible for the first 6 minutes of this one. Karl had to a call a timeout and run a play in order for him to get his first hoop with a little jumper. And then just nothing. Missed gimme after gimme inside. Got into foul trouble with only 2pts 2rebs and would continue missing until the mid third, when he finally barrelled Ariza right over to get the finish. It wasn't until the 4th when he gave us anything at all. in fact we were better without him almost the entire game. made enough plays during our big stretch run to avoid the F here, but not by much. Surprised Harden in the open court for a steal and quick dunk. Hit a feet set three at the 6min mark. Still wasn't "The Man" we needed him to be, but was at least contributing. but it came after 3+ quarters of energy sapping nothing.

Stats: 25min 6pts (3-7, 0-0, 0-0) 7reb 0ast 1stl 1blk 1TO
Summary: One night later, and the shoe was on the other foot at center with Koufos showing little touch or energy, and WCS having impact off the bench.

Koufos ( D ) -- one night after a strong consistent effort on both ends in Phoenix that earned him the game ball, Kosta came out in this with an alarmingly dead and lost starting crew and was reduced to what kindly might be referred to as a "big body". He wasn't playing anybody either. Clint Cappella. Long, skinny backup C, nothing Kosta hasn't seen 100 times before. The blowing layup thing is getting old pretty quick, and he and Rudy started off the game blowing gimme after gimme in there. if that had been the only problem it would just be a wart, but he just lacked energy. Even had problem s keeping Chuck Hayes from sneaking in behind him for hoops. Chuck was almost out of the league a week ago. Fumbled and failed to grab a key rebound at the 1:30 mark, and the Rockets scored to make the comeback even more unlikely and put us down 9. Quickly getting the little jumper from Curry down at the other end no more than canceled the mistake, leaving us still down 7 with 1:30 to play. WCS clearly has some magic special stuff to his defensive game. But he's too scrawny for a starting C. Kosta will look better once Cuz is back and Kosta is the backup C.

Stats: 23min 5pts (2-10, 0-5, 1-2) 1reb 2ast 0stl 0blk 0TO
Summary: just simply cannot get into a groove. Clearly not getting the shots he's comfortable with, and did nothing else.

Belinelli ( F ) -- fell into the starting SG abyss. Hit one early shot and then just down down down spiraling, just hoping after a while. For the first time the shooting slump had him looking desperate. With such a dead/distracted starting unit, very little of the smart ball movement plays he is capable of either. Just an all around faceplant. At least Harden did not light it up early, but that had nothing to do with Beli, who wasn't even consistently checking him. Until Bels snaps out of this awful slump, this position remains unfilled.

Stats: 24min 12pts (6-14, 0-2, 0-0) 8reb 5ast 3stl 0blk 4TO
Summary: the best of the starters, but not a do it alone player. Forced to shoot too much, and not sure when even SGs got too quick for him to guard.

Rondo ( C+ ) -- this was not a strong game for Rondo, but anybody trying to peg him for the starters struggles here went looking in exactly the wrong place, as he was the only one of the starting 5 out there at least trying to do something. Trying perhaps being the operative word as his tries had a part in our so bad it was not funny at all 19-4 early game deficit. He picked up multiple loose looking turnovers trying to feed Koufos inside in the early going, and as has been the case in the early season, was being dared to shoot again and again, and ended up taking too many of them. But its not like he was gunning all of them up -- there are still multiple times a game when he passed up wide open shots to quickly swing it. Has to be distracting having that thrown in your face all the time. Created some assists and really helped on the boards, including a couple snatched form big guys, but lack of finishing ability was another wart. Finally got some offense going late in the half, got a jumper and layup., but it was never a comfortable dynamic. probably lost a 4th quarter stint when Seth Curry came in and unexpectedly hit a couple of big shots as we did our nightly take the 4th quarter lead from a contender, then fall back and fail thing. Clearly needs Cuz out there, and non-post partum Rudy, to take offensive pressure off him. With a starting lineup that shot 10-36 other than himself, and worse than that until late in the game, Rondo as goto scorer in a lineup is going to be an inefficient look at best.
 
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Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#2
Bench

Stats: 33min 22pts (8-10, 2-3, 4-5) 4reb 1stl 2stl 0blk 2TO
Casspi ( A- ) -- played such a good game, especially compared to the starters, that I wish I had more notes about it. Actually was our first substitution, not unfortunately because Karl recognized the train wreck and moved quickly to get the starters out, but because Rudy got into foul trouble by the middle of the first quarter. And it wasn't until the very end of the quarter when Omri hit his first shot, a three from Rondo that got us right back into a game we had been trailing 19-4. he was better than Rudy in the second. He was much better than Rudy in the third, and while in general he should knock it off (he'd already bricked one earlier), he hit a 25 foot three to get the lead down to 10 and keep us from slipping away. He didn't rebound like you'd like your "power" forward to do, but he kept it efficient and was one of several major impact players off the bench for us tonight.

Stats: 31min 22pts (7-16, 3-6, 5-6) 0reb 9ast 2stl 0blk 3TO
Collison ( A ) -- I saved Collison's writeup for last for reasons beyond his game (annoyingly I, ahem, accidentally deleted about half of his notes during the game). Suffice it to say he was good, and he did...stuff. Lots of it. Sometimes he did that, sometimes this. And it was good. Really. He was good both playing SG next to Rondo when he first came in, giving us some life at a time when we had little, and then good playing the sort of bench PG gunner some of us had hoped IT would accept. But Darren wasn't strictly gunning -- he notched 9 assists as well keeping the bench offense perking. There were times when he went full IT, got too full of himself and threw up some straight junk, but in general he was by far our most forceful offensive presence out there, creating for himself and others. Kept on trying to bomb big shots too, and his 3 at the end of the 3rd cut the lead to 7 and set Curry up for his 2 minutes of heroics.

Stats: 22min 7pts (3-5, 0-0, 1-2) 9reb 1ast 2stl 2blk 0TO
Cauley Stein ( A ) -- while Omri and DC took care of the scoring punch off the bench, I actually felt that WCS may have been the biggest bench key of them all with another serious dose of interior defensive dynamism that gave us a shot of life. Winning plays, not just scoring plays. While the bounce in defensive energy was instantaneous when he first came in, it took a while for the overall impact to be clearly positive. He missed an alley oop, got fouled and sent to the line, which is a gulp (although he split the pair), and I don't know if its the health issue or not, but Karl seems quite intent on only giving him short all out stints no matter how well he is playing. Gave us a huge defensive push again in the late 3rd, and again ended up rebenched so Kosta could blah his way through the key minutes when we were trying to convert a comeback into a win. finally back in in the final 4 minutes for some nice impact plays on both ends. This is how you impact the game as a defensive roleplayer. Don't know where it was down in Phoenix.

Stats: 23min 11pts (3-8, 1-5, 4-6) 4reb 4ast 3stl 0blk 3TO
McLemore ( B+ ) -- ok, so take a look at Ben's statline above. And no, I don't mean the points. The points were a mild step up, he was more aggressive but he still couldn't shoot. A problem for an alleged shooter. But now pan right down that statline and you will see how a misfiring "shooter" can still make himself into a major positive in a game. And those of course are all the things that Ben NEVER does. And he never does them because he's normally not a basketball player. He's an athlete with a well coached shot form. But tonight? Ben was a basketball player. An impact basketball player. And points had nothing to do with it. He hit his only three early, notably curling off a screen in what was again, a basketball play. That's how guys with feel do it. Of course it would be his only one and things on that front still haven't turned -- you shoot 1-5 from 3pt land and .375 for a game and your percentages go up = not a great sign. But more importantly suddenly he, like Willie, was making saavy winning plays. He made a good pass to a cutting WCS, helped rebound, another smart pass ahead to Collison on the break. He still had dribbling issues, but he made another nicely timed drop off pass on the break, and in the 4th he, well he didn't stop Harden at all obviously, but on multiple occasions his defense against him was very sound. In general, Ben was a basketball player tonight. Not an athlete, not a future star, none of that oft-debated crap. But a real contributor making smart plays, winning plays, of a sort that he rarely does. And he was another big impact guy off the bench for us. On "feel" this might have been a Top 5 game for him since he's been in the league, and that's where this grade comes from, not a 3-8 shooting night with 3 TOs.


Stats: 15min 8pts (3-4, 2-2, 0-0) 0reb 2ast 0stl 0blk 0TO
Curry ( B ) -- this is one of those how do you grade this?? grades, as basically we had the OTHER Curry on our squad for 2 minutes to start the 4th, during which time he singlehandedly poured in 8 points to close the gap all the way down to 1, before Harden and friends quickly reestablished order. And from that point on we no longer had the other Curry, we had the kid brother, and nothing else of note happened. Maybe we can keep Seth in a "need a quick burst" bottle, break him out everytime our starters leave us in a hole, then quickly rebench him after he's done his 2-3 minute burst thing.
 
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#4
I wonder when it will dawn on the coach that we suck at small ball. Every team is better at it than we are.

Can we at least see what happens when we go big for long periods of time against a team that refuses to or can't match up with us?

Can't be any worse than the starts we've had this season going small from the start.
 
#6
Rudy deserves a F++++ Kofus deserves a F+++ Belinelli deserves a F++ Anderson deserves a F Rondo deserves a D --

Casspi- B++ WCS- B+ Collison A Ben B Seth A
 

Warhawk

Give blood and save a life!
Staff member
#7
Was at the game tonight - it seemed like every shot Rudy took was going in and then popped out. One of those nights when nothing is falling. Glad they fought back into it, too bad they couldn't keep it up.
 
K

KingMilz

Guest
#13
You know at some point the Rudy Gay honeymoon has to come to an end, the guy is basically a energy zapping cancer who has zero pride in his defense and takes non stop questionable shots. His athletic ability is only going to decline moving forward and it's basically the thing that carried him throughout his career. We need to move him for 2 solid role players like a Morris/Tucker type combo and we will actually be a competitive team you can also say the same for Rondo. Miller last season made our team better with his playmaking than Rondo has so far in 6 games. I'd offer the Knicks Rondo and Koufus for Jose and Ó'Quinn(a player we should have signed in the first place).

While I liked Kosta as a player he does literally nothing DMC/WCS can't do better.

#Every time WCS was in the game our defense seemed very solid
#Seth scored 8 straight and than we froze him out completely not looking for him
#Casspi played with fire
#DC played with fire
#Karl played the wrong guys he basically saw the starting 5 quit on him and the whole arena and kept them in the game

The one thing we have never actually tried to surround DMC is high energy guys who compete (and obviously have some skillset), we have tried all sorts of other crap except guys who actually compete.
 
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#14
Rudy Gay: I'm sick and tired of seeing Rudy Gay play so lackadaisically. The effort is just not there, I'm not sure what the hell his issue is. I have not seen Rudy close out hard on a three pointer all season, he seems to always be a step or two slow on defense. When Cousins went down, Gay was supposed to a key player for us, keeping us afloat. His play has been an utter disappointment to be quite honest. Without Cousins, Rudy has shown an inability to step up and be the man on the team.

Here's a fun fact. Today's game marked the first time since the pre-season that the Kings managed to win the tip at the beginning jump ball. Dating back to his Boston days, Rondo would always do some crazy routine with the ball or fancy dribbling move, I was quite disappointed that we didn't see that today.
 
#15
Some thoughts:

* Rudy is a "paycheck" player. No heart. Very uninspiring and rarely makes shots in crunch time.

* We are better when WCS is on the floor. He can defend PG's better than our guards can

* KK has below average hands and misses point blank shots all the time

* Beli obviously is a horrible shooting slump but a lot of that is due to Karl not getting him the ball is better spots

* BMac is better off the bench. Plays with more confidence

* Rondo makes way too many unforced turnovers.

* Our basketball IQ is terrible.

* ;(
 
#16
Rudy Gay is a third option type of player. He's simply unable to carry this team when Cuz is out. He really struggles to score when Cousins is out and it becomes painful to watch. It doesn't help that Karl treats him like he's a Carmelo type of player, which he definitely isn't.
 
#17
You know at some point the Rudy Gay honeymoon has to come to an end, the guy is basically a energy zapping cancer who has zero pride in his defense and takes non stop questionable shots. His athletic ability is only going to decline moving forward and it's basically the thing that carried him throughout his career. We need to move him for 2 solid role players like a Morris/Tucker type combo and we will actually be a competitive team you can also say the same for Rondo. Miller last season made our team better with his playmaking than Rondo has so far in 6 games. I'd offer the Knicks Rondo and Koufus for Jose and Ó'Quinn(a player we should have signed in the first place).

While I liked Kosta as a player he does literally nothing DMC/WCS can't do better.

#Every time WCS was in the game our defense seemed very solid
#Seth scored 8 straight and than we froze him out completely not looking for him
#Casspi played with fire
#DC played with fire
#Karl played the wrong guys he basically saw the starting 5 quit on him and the whole arena and kept them in the game

The one thing we have never actually tried to surround DMC is high energy guys who compete (and obviously have some skillset), we have tried all sorts of other crap except guys who actually compete.
I've been on this train with you for awhile. Rudy has become a lot better of player since putting on the Kings uni, and we severely lacked for talent, so I just stopped talking about it, but he's always been an atrocious side-kick for Cousins. And he's right back to chucker Rudy this season with a 47% TS.

There's a reason guys like IT and DC are so successful with Cousins. They can get to the rim, but they're also threats to space the floor. So you can't leave them to double on to Cousins, but defenses also have to respect the drive.

I look no further than what Detroit is doing with Drummond. They've surrounded him with basically one guy who can create off the bounce (Jackson, Morris is leaning that way too) and a bunch of guys who play hard on both ends and can space the floor.
 
#18
Dont care about shots not falling. Whats disgusting is the effort level of some of our players.
Gay, Belli, Rondo play with no effort and no aggressivness.

Rondo tryning to impress with his smarts. But at some point have to lock down your man on D.
 

CruzDude

Senior Member sharing a brew with bajaden
#19
The Anderson-Belinelli experiment didn't work. Sure its only one game but I expected more. But they just didn't get open shots due to perimeter defense and the glaring differences in the two teams. Actually, the same fifferences with other teams as well; perimeter defence. In Suns and Rockets games they always seem to have perimeter defender tight on any King trying to shoot from deep and did not leave the weak side man wide open. Kings seemed to play off their man on perimeter and often were not within 10-15 ft of the weakside shooter when ball movement got him the ball for wide open shots.

KK is a better bench 5 for sure. Willy altered perimeter shots a number of times. Not sure anyone else did. The Collison-Casspi-Willy trio did well and Curry seems cool, cold blooded scorer, when he got the ball, which after hitting 8-straight was not to happen. Whats with that?

With teams shutting down the outside shot and with no inside-down low presence for now the mess is what it is until some hustle can be injected into the starters who will bring mid-range shots.
 
#20
Starting unit should be

Collison
Marco
Omri
DMC
WCS

Bench
Gay
Seth Curry
Ben
Kosta
Rondo (don't like him)
Anderson



But.... Thats just my opinion.
 
#22
Not worried about KK at all. Guy just had a bad game, which happens with role guys from time to time. More often than not, he's going to be a big net positive when he's on the floor.
I agree with this. Maybe he's a slow starter. I don't know. If he's actually this bad then it's time to recalibrate expectations. As the 3rd big he'd rarely be able to impact a game quite this much in a negative way.

Leave him alone out there and his deficiencies glare brightly. Would you start JT with 4 SF or smaller? I sure wouldn't. And KK is a slight upgrade over JT if that.

I also can't argue anything other than he had a turrible game last night. Along with gay Anderson rondo and Bellinelli.

When all five "starters" suck, you're not going to win many games.
 

dude12

Hall of Famer
#23
Fffffffuuuuuuuuddddddgggggggeee! Starters dug a hole. Again giving up uncontested 3's.

That lineup in the 2nd half that brought us back was quick and athletic and worked their ass off....WCS, DC, Curry, Ben and Casspi I think it was. If you go small, you have to be quick and make up for the lack of heighth somehow. That starting small lineup just isn't quick enough.

I have faith once Cuz is back that it will get turned around.
 

CruzDude

Senior Member sharing a brew with bajaden
#24
Starting unit should be

Collison
Marco
Omri
DMC
WCS

Bench
Gay
Seth Curry
Ben
Kosta
Rondo (don't like him)
Anderson
But.... Thats just my opinion.
I could live with that but until then....? Kosta and WCS don't yet work together very well. Maybe Moreland?
 
#25
The players are still trying to figure things out but why is it taking them so long?

I can't believe all the missed shots at the rim. The constant TOs. The non-existent perimeter defense. Why were the Kings allowing Harden to destroy them...again?

Kosta was just terrible. He missed so many easy shots at the rim. Some of those missed shots should have been simply slammed in. Gay had a pathetic performance. Rondo didn't show up.

If it wasn't for the energy that the bench provided the Kings would have been utterly destroyed in front of a national audience.

Bill Simmons tweeted out last night that the Kings still suck even with all of their draft picks through the years. I despise that guy because the truth hurts.

Sending healing vibes to Cousins.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#26
Personally, I would have given Willie an A for the night. He was our best defensive player, and every time he came into the game, Houston went back to being human. By my count, four times in the game Harden was one on one with Willie on the perimeter, and three of those times he thought better of trying to take him off the dribble, and the one time he did try to score on Willie, he missed badly. You can't judge Willie by his stat sheet. He only had two blocks in the game, but he altered several others, and changed some minds more than once. He disrupted the pick and roll time and time again. He along with Collison were the two main difference makers.

I think Curry has earned more playing time. So far, he's hitting shots, and in a couple of defensive situations, he more than held his own. He certainly knows how to use screens, and so far is hitting his shots coming off screens. Hell, if he's just half as good as his brother, he deserves to be on the floor. Welcome back Omri. He was a little out of control at times, but all in all, he played very well. Ben had one of his better nights, and if not for some very stupid turnovers at the wrong time (at times he thought he was James Harden) I would have given him a B. But I would give him a C instead. I won't even comment on the starters. Except for maybe Koufos, they all deserved D's or below.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#27
The players are still trying to figure things out but why is it taking them so long?

I can't believe all the missed shots at the rim. The constant TOs. The non-existent perimeter defense. Why were the Kings allowing Harden to destroy them...again?

Kosta was just terrible. He missed so many easy shots at the rim. Some of those missed shots should have been simply slammed in. Gay had a pathetic performance. Rondo didn't show up.

If it wasn't for the energy that the bench provided the Kings would have been utterly destroyed in front of a national audience.

Bill Simmons tweeted out last night that the Kings still suck even with all of their draft picks through the years. I despise that guy because the truth hurts.

Sending healing vibes to Cousins.
One must always remember that Simmons main agenda is to bring Cousins to the Celtics. So anything he can do to influence that result, he'll do. Other than that, I do enjoy his show. You just have to take it with a grain of salf.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#29
I agree with this. Maybe he's a slow starter. I don't know. If he's actually this bad then it's time to recalibrate expectations. As the 3rd big he'd rarely be able to impact a game quite this much in a negative way.

Leave him alone out there and his deficiencies glare brightly. Would you start JT with 4 SF or smaller? I sure wouldn't. And KK is a slight upgrade over JT if that.

I also can't argue anything other than he had a turrible game last night. Along with gay Anderson rondo and Bellinelli.

When all five "starters" suck, you're not going to win many games.
Put Willie along side of Koufos, and you have a different result. A lot of what happened defensively last night wasn't Koufos fault. Gay was slow to rotate at times. Anderson left his man from the left corner to help prevent a backdoor, and he got burn't. The whole starting unit stayed home too much and as a result, they were terrible defensively. When Willie and the other unit came in, basket penetration stopped. Houston was forced into perimeter shots. Shots that were contested. The second unit played well because they defended well. Sadly every time they came in. they were trying to dig themselves out of a hole.
 

Mr. S£im Citrus

Doryphore of KingsFans.com
Staff member
#30
I rather thought that his point was that you could have applied your first sentence to Thompson, and it would have been just as true.