Dr. Spaceman
Bench
Were you watching the Sharks game? Is there a duo named Favors and Boogie in the NHL? Because clearly, you're not watching the sport of basketball. Or if you actually are, you're doing it wrong.
[Grades] Grades v. Jazz 3/22/12
- Thread starter Bricklayer
- Start date
Were you watching the Sharks game? Is there a duo named Favors and Boogie in the NHL? Because clearly, you're not watching the sport of basketball. Or if you actually are, you're doing it wrong.
Favors and Boogie were actually a 70's duo. They had such hits as:
"Meet You At the Boards"
"Your Love Is So Foul, It's Good"
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
Whatever you're smoking, I want some.
kupman
Starter
I am one that agrees with you. Starting does not mean much to me. It is much more important who is on the floor at the end of the game as well as minutes played.
McHale and Havlichek came off the bench.
42%
Too much David Locke.
If your guys are sooooo good why so few wins? Nobody expects a championship but if Evens is on the cusp of greatness and Boogie is going to be the next Shaq and if Thornton is close to being an all star you would think a .500 record would be a slight under achievement.
Cousins has great potential. Outside of rebounding he doesn't help you win. On many nights he is the reason you lost. That is almost never the case with Favors. He is a net positive almost every time he steps on the floor. Boogie is a net negative more often than not.
Cousins has great potential. Outside of rebounding he doesn't help you win. On many nights he is the reason you lost. That is almost never the case with Favors. He is a net positive almost every time he steps on the floor. Boogie is a net negative more often than not.
No, I am sure locke feels the same way though.
I think you actually believe that he was holding your three all-stars down.
As for the rest, dude. Seriously, dude.
MassachusettsKingsFan
All-Star
He certainly wasn't helping.
And the Kings have exactly 0 All-Stars. It doesn't mean 3 of their players don't have that potential though.
43.4%, if anybody is actually counting.
And a PER of 20.7, compared to Favors' 16.8.
Oh, and Cousins outdoes Favors in ORebs, DRebs, Assists, and Steals (both per-36 and %age). Cousins has a bit higher TO per-36 but a lower TO% (because he has a higher usage rate - Favors actually turns the ball over more often relative to how often he's used on offense). Oh, and Cousins shoots jump shots at 40%, while Favors shoots at 25%. So as of right now, Favors dunks more, and has 0.3 more blocked shots per-36.
But hey, go ahead and dismiss our center who can dribble around your guards in the open court, hit a jump shot, pass, and will probably lead the league in rebounding in short order in favor of your athletic guy who doesn't have a lot of basketball skill yet. Your guy is young, so there's hope for him.
He does. But he's not exactly a deep thinker.
Padrino
All-Star
favors has amare stoudemire potential. and what exactly has amare accomplished in this league, outside of all star selections that were deeply indebted to steve nash and mike d'antoni? i think favors will have a solid career, but more in that "awww, isn't that nice?" kinda way. demarcus cousins, on the other hand, has the potential to be a once-in-a-decade franchise center in that "holy ****, did he really just do THAT" kinda way. truth be told, i roll the dice on such potential over ANY player in the nba who does not exhibit obvious lebron james-level skill...
A couple of things stuck out last night- I agree about missed FT, sloppy passing on break, and missing layups and giving up more than 15 blocks. Are the Jazz bigs that good? I wish we had big Al. The Kings have faded in the 4th quarter all year. It was great to see the all defensive team collapse a zone on Utah and really mess up their offense. It gave the Kings a chance to win, MT did his magic and the game was won until Cousins got caught between the shooter and big Al. Game over.
The spirit of the post is still accurate, though: there is an enormous difference in circumstances, that cannot be overlooked. By the time Ginobili got to the NBA, he had already won multiple titles, multiple MVP's, a gold medal at the FIBA Americas tournament, and a silver medal at the FIBA World Championships. Those sort of accomplishments have a way of tempering your outlook regarding the urgency of starting. You know what else makes you less likely to be in a rush to start? Winning an NBA Championship your first time out of the gate.
When your coach asks you to come off the bench for the good of the team, it will help if your team is not losing. I would also venture to guess that, in 2012, "the good of the team" means something different in a gym in Bahia than it does in a gym in Chester. Some people, I think, undersell the values dissonance between US players and international players. If a player on a mediocre-to-bad team feels as though he should be starting, and a GM offers him a fat contract and says, we will start you, and new team is either greater than or equal to the old team, as US player will take that, probably ninety-nine times out of one hundred.
But, Jason Terry comes off the bench! Jason Terry was a starter the first eight years of his career, including the team that got to the Finals in 2006.
But, Lamar Odom comes off the bench! Odom started something like 573 out of the first 577 games of his career, including the team that got to the Finals in 2008.
But, Jamal Crawford comes off the bench! Crawford also started a substantial portion of his first eight years in the league. Crawford has also reached a point in his career where he's realized that most of his best basketball is behind him, and now, he just wants to win. Earlier in his career, wanted to start, and did so.
But, James Harden comes off he bench, and he's never started! True, but as previously stated, it helps when you are not losing. The Thunder are a team with championship aspirations. And, not for nothing but, title contenders or not, the Thunder are going to going to have to deal with this exact problem, in the same amount of time. You expect me to believe that a chance to start is not going to pose a strong temptation to Harden? He was the third overall pick: of course he wants to start! OKC will soon find that it is a question of how much does he want to start.
What about Taj Gibson? Most of the above applies to him as well, add to the fact that he has better players ahead of him in the rotation than any of these other guys.
I could see Evans coming off the bench for the rest of the year, without it adversely affecting our ability to keep him. Much longer than that, and it's a different story. If Evans is still not starting a year from now, and the Kings are not title contenders, I'd say there's better than a ninety precent chance that he's gone. His brothers will talk him into it, if nothing else.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
The Jazz bigs are very good. There was a good article recently about the Jazz bigs taking the Thunder to the woodshed.
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
Your ability to assess the talent of NBA basketball players is remarkably bad. I doubt you find a single perosn outside the bounds of Utah who would go along with that. Certianly not a single one who knows basketball. Hell, I had the Jazz feed fro last night's game -- evern your own announcers would jsut shake their head at such homerness.
What good is a big that can dribble around? Do you really want your post player taking (not really making) a bunch of jump shots? He has all those skills but they don't help you win. They are things that are risky and ill-advised for your center. I will admit that he is a good rebounder and has great potential. He just is hurting your team more often than he is helping your team. Favors helps his team win more than hurts his team win. They have different roles and have played under vastly different circumstances but to pick Favors over Boogie isn't a stretch like you guys make it out to be.
Mad D
Starter
Isn't Npliam a Jazz fan? Of course he is going to have bias in favor of the Favors.
I agree that 43% is horrible for a post player. Favors is a very efficient finisher at the basket but he only takes 6 and half attempt per game. Even Tyreke has passed Cousins up over these last couple games but his percentage is deflated by him not being able to constantly finish off of his high offensive rebounding rate. As of now Favors is more of a player used for his defensive fundamentals/intanglibes and is definitely more of a project at this point. While Cousins is more comfortable creating offense for himself (and has shown flashes for creating for others) than Favors.
It's clear though that when Cousins goes out of games this Kings team typically stuggles and I feel that can't say the same for Favors for either the Jazz or if he were on the Kings.
I agree that 43% is horrible for a post player. Favors is a very efficient finisher at the basket but he only takes 6 and half attempt per game. Even Tyreke has passed Cousins up over these last couple games but his percentage is deflated by him not being able to constantly finish off of his high offensive rebounding rate. As of now Favors is more of a player used for his defensive fundamentals/intanglibes and is definitely more of a project at this point. While Cousins is more comfortable creating offense for himself (and has shown flashes for creating for others) than Favors.
It's clear though that when Cousins goes out of games this Kings team typically stuggles and I feel that can't say the same for Favors for either the Jazz or if he were on the Kings.
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Padrino
All-Star
you, sir, threaten to steal the mantle of Most Idiotic Poster At Kingsfans.com from several individuals who have spent years earning it...
Last night it was worth (at least) 2 points. He has pretty decent handles in the half-court as well, so he can get to the rim under circumstances when Favors probably could not. Hard to say that's good for nothing.
40% on jump shots is not exactly "not really making" them. And yes, the more weapons an offensive player has, the better. Favors is less versatile offensively, so the defense can focus on his strengths easier. Would you rather have the opposing defense focus on taking away your post player's one strength, or be forced to choose to defend one option at the expense of allowing another?
Now, since I first posted, Salmon's grade has been dropped from a C to a C-. What's this? Also, I admit I haven't read all of the analysis with the grades but I can see the general tenor of the grades and wonder if they all need to be upped at least a slot. Our guys played a good team game despite missed free throws, defensive burps, missed shots, missed layups, etc. Those mistakes were made, in my view, in course of playing a very good game.
rainmaker
Hall of Famer
I don't know how many times you've been wrong about stats, have been corrected, and yet here we are again. Seriously, if you're going to make blanket statements, at least show you've done a little research and have a little understanding of the league.
So apparently Cuz is "not really making" jumpers. Funny, because he's 40% from 16-23 ft. That is exceptional for a center, although you obviously don't know that.
I'm just going to list a few names of players shooting below 40% from that same range, guys who you obviously don't want shooting them given your statement on Cuz.
Kevin Love 32%
Rudy Gay 31%
Lebron James 39%
Monta Ellis 38%
Blake Griffin 32%
Derrick Rose 39%
Carmelo Anthony 31%
Demarcus Cousins 40%
Kobe Bryant 40%
and for fun, Jimmer Fredette 34%. So I've seen you campaigning for Jimmer to shoot more, yet Cuz has the better midrange game, and he shouldn't shoot? That's called a conflict of interest devoid of logic.
Looks like you can leave now, as you have a number of forums to visit to tell everyone guys like Kobe, Melo, and Lebron shouldn't be shooting jumpers.
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Aren't the Kings players your guys? Am I missing something. New on the block?
Also it seems to me that some people don't realize that all the good players in the league can't play for the Kings. Let's all go back and start all over again, if that's OK with hou all.
Npliam is a Jazz fan.
Then what the hell is he doing on here? And why am i talking to him. The Jazz won the game last night but they hardly looked any better than the Kings.
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