[Grades] Grades v. Bulls 11/27/10

[OptimusRhyme]

i just wanna say JT look really good in this game, he wasnt forcing anythign and letting the game come to him.
If we can see that effort consistently from him we will have a nice player

 

[Bricklayer]

I know this has been gone over a million times, and it's always easier in hindsight, but as the roster stands now, it's hard to agree with that.

Thoe downgrade from Martin to Head/Jeter looks steeper than going from Landry to JT. And if you believe the team has to overpay to attract talent, the risk of 4 years of Martin is better than 1.5 years of Landry and whoever they sign next.

No its really not. For us, Martin was overpaid, and as the Rockets struggle to 30 wins and Kevin gets hurt next week, they'll be thinking the same thing. Whoever we sign with his money has a much greater chance of being the right fit. I'm not at all sure Kevin Maritn is a winning basketball player. If he is he is the first non-defending, non-rebounding, non-passing passionless winning basketball player in history. But even if he were, he was not going to be a winning basketball player HERE, and as I'm convinced that we didn't target Landry as our first choice, I can only assume that hsi trade value was not too much higher than that. Having his salary money to add a piece that does fit is more valuable than the awful struggle we had while he was active last year. People forget that as much as we are struggling now, we were a disatrous 3-21 or some such with Kevin last year, and most of them looked like the Clippers game. That just did not work, and as I detailed time and again last year during the great Kevin debates, 2 20pt backcourt scorers has basically NEVER worked, even if they are both far more well rounded than Kevin.

 

[Asaf]

No its really not. For us, Martin was overpaid, and as the Rockets struggle to 30 wins and Kevin gets hurt next week, they'll be thinking the same thing. Whoever we sign with his money has a much greater chance of being the right fit. I'm not at all sure Kevin Maritn is a winning basketball player. If he is he is the first non-defending, non-rebounding, non-passing passionless winning basketball player in history. But even if he were, he was not going to be a winning basketball player HERE, and as I'm convinced that we didn't target Landry as our first choice, I can only assume that hsi trade value was not too much higher than that. Having his salary money to add a piece that does fit is more valuable than the awful struggle we had while he was active last year. People forget that as much as we are struggling now, we were a disatrous 3-21 or some such with Kevin last year, and most of them looked like the Clippers game. That just did not work, and as I detailed time and again last year during the great Kevin debates, 2 20pt backcourt scorers has basically NEVER worked, even if they are both far more well rounded than Kevin.

In all fairness to Kevin, I don't think he is the problem in Houston.

Also, we looked just as bad after the trade as we did when Kevin was here, which should at least make us ponder the possibility that there were other problems besides him...

 

[Bricklayer]

In all fairness to Kevin, I don't think he is the problem in Houston.

Also, we looked just as bad after the trade as we did when Kevin was here, which should at least make us ponder the possibility that there were other problems besides him...

Oh, I think Kevin is very much part of the problem in Houston. He is the ultimate empty suit. Numbers without meaning. And he won the personality war with Battier. That whole team plays like him now. All their grit, toughness, defense, resiliency, out the window. Replaced with running up and down the court padding stats and letting the other team score so you can get back up the court more quickly to shoot again. Its not just him of course, repeated personnel decisions have led them down this road, but its a sad state, and we are the team that slipped them repeated mickeys.

And no, we were poor after the trade, but not as poor as we were with Kevin, and had a whole swath on non-Kevin injuries and player fatigue (Omri) to deal with as well. Nobody said Kevin was the sole problem here, but he certainly was not the solution. And he was a $11mil non-solution.

 

[mac]

Oh, I think Kevin is very much part of the problem in Houston. He is the ultimate empty suit. Numbers without meaning. And he won the personality war with Battier. That whole team plays like him now. All their grit, toughness, defense, resiliency, out the window. Replaced with running up and down the court padding stats and letting the other team score so you can get back up the court more quickly to shoot again. Its not just him of course, repeated personnel decisions have led them down this road, but its a sad state, and we are the team that slipped them repeated mickeys.

And no, we were poor after the trade, but not as poor as we were with Kevin, and had a whole swath on non-Kevin injuries and player fatigue (Omri) to deal with as well. Nobody said Kevin was the sole problem here, but he certainly was not the solution. And he was a $11mil non-solution.

Who won the personality war here?

 

[Bricklayer]

Who won the personality war here?

We don't have one yet, and Westphal's frequent fiddling has restricted its development.

We have begun to frequently show defensive grit however. That's something. Although there is no true leader to point to. We will need one before all is said and done, either on the sidelines or on the court.

 

[hrdboild]

Kevin Martin is a fine NBA player and a nice guy. He's worked hard and made a very nice career for himself. I would be proud to call him my friend (not that he is, but just hypothetic-like). But, he doesn't have the intensity it takes to win right now. Who knows, maybe he learns it later on. That rarely happens though. Kobe's a jerk but he knows how to win. There are plenty of other examples. Whatever else happens from here on out, we should at least stop wishing we had Kevin Martin back. That was a good trade for this team, whether Landry sticks around or not.