Fox and/or #4 Trade Ideas

twslam07

twslam07

All-Star
#151
#151
I still find myself coming back to this trade:

CHA Gets: Richaun Holmes, Justin Holiday, #9
CHA Gives: Mason Plumlee, PJ Washington, & #15

DET Gets: Mason Plumlee, Mo Harkless, & #15
DET Gives: Jerami Grant

SAS Gets: Alex Len & #4
SAS Gives: Devin Vassell, #9, & #20

SAC Gets: Jerami Grant, PJ Washington, Devin Vassell, & #20
SAC Gives: Richaun Holmes, Justin Holiday, Mo Harkless, Alex Len, & #4


At #20, I'd look at taking someone like Jalen Williams or Kendall Brown. I'd also resign DiVincenzo to around $8-10 mil/year and go into next season with:

PG - Fox / Mitchell
SG - Vassell / DiVincenzo / Davis
SF - Barnes / J. Williams
PF - Grant / Washington / Lyles / Metu
C - Sabonis
Picks - #37 / #49

We'd have...
  • A very complementary starting lineup with defense, shooting, and length around Fox & Sabonis
  • A very strong, deep bench with Mitchell, DiVincenzo, Davis, Williams, Washington, & Lyles all being solid contributors
  • A youngish core with Fox (24), Mitchell (23), Vassell (21), DiVincenzo (25), Davis (25), J. Williams (21), Washington (23), & Saboins (26) that can continue to grow together.
  • Cap flexibility in the 2023 offseason. With Grant, Barnes, Davis, Lyles, & Metu are all expiring. Including Washington's cap hold, we'd probably have around $35 mil in cap space while still having Fox, Mitchell, DiVincenzo, Vassell, J. Williams, Washington, Sabonis, & 2023 SAC 1st under contract.
 
twslam07

twslam07

All-Star
#152
#152
You could also just keep it somewhat simple…

DAL Gets: Richaun Holmes & Mo Harkless
DAL Gives: Dwight Powell, Trey Burke, & #26

DET Gets: Dwight Powell, Alex Len, #4, & #26
DET Gives: Jerami Grant & #5

SAC Gets: Jerami Grant, Trey Burke, & #5
SAC Gives: Richaun Holmes, Mo Harkless, Alex Len, & #4



PG - Fox / Mitchell / Burke
SG - DiVincenzo / Davis
SF - Barnes / Holiday
PF - Grant / Lyles / Metu
C - Sabonis
Picks - #5 / #37 / #49


Gives you a roster that could easily compete for a playoff spot while allowing McNair the freedom to take BPA (vs. feeling the need to take a NBA ready player or trade the pick completely for a veteran).
 
twslam07

twslam07

All-Star
#154
#154
funkykingston said:
Unless Detroit REALLY wants Ivey (or whoever falls to 4 if Ivey goes top 3) and the Kings convince them they'll draft him one slot ahead, I don't think they'd consider that enough for Grant.
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It’s obviously predicated on the Pistons really liking someone at #4 and not wanting to risk losing them. For example, if they think Ivey is a future star and a solid fit with Cunningham and Bey long term, you don’t let an expiring Grant get in the way of that (especially when you’re also getting a late 1st back). If the Pistons think Ivey and Sharpe are similar prospects and both are there when we pick, then it doesn’t make sense for them to make this type of trade. It comes down to the Piston's draft board and if they tend to believe there is a big drop off after #4.
 
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SacTownKid

SacTownKid

Hall of Famer
#155
#155
I can't get behind trading star potential young talent for impending FA's and role guys at this point. Knock this 4th pick out of the park and use your space wisely next summer and you can possibly jump into contention status in a few seasons.
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#159
#159
kb02 said:
Dort only has one year left on his contract. That compresses his value. If he had, say, three more years and the pick was say #7 (Daniels), I'd be all over it. Getting to #7 is totally doable for OKC, btw. So Dort, #7, plus Roby for #4? I might do that.
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Yeah but Dort is a a UFA. If we had his rights, I'd think about that too. And yeah 7 is way different than 12
 
twslam07

twslam07

All-Star
#160
#160
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DAL Gets: Richaun Holmes & #37
DAL Gives: Dwight Powell & #26
Why for DAL? Upgrade their starting spot with a better, more versatile defender who is still a great PnR threat for Doncic.

PG - Brunson / Dinwiddie / Ntilikina / Burke
SG - Hardaway / Green / Brown
SF - Doncic / Bullock
PF - Finney-Smith / Bertans / Chriss
C - Holmes / Kleber / Marjanovic

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IND Gets: Gary Trent, Dwight Powell, Mo Harkless, #4, & #26
IND Gives: Malcolm Brogdon, Myles Turner & #6
Why for IND? The Pacers sell off their win now vets to trade up in the draft, land a late 1st, and add 23 year old Trent who looks like a solid fit with Haliburton.

PG - Haliburton / McConnell / Washington
SG - Trent / Hield / Taylor
SF - Duarte
PF - Brissett / Harkless
C - Jackson / Powell / Bitadze
Picks - #4 / #26 / #31 / #60

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TOR Gets: Malcolm Brogdon, Myles Turner, & 2023 SAC 1st (Top 4 Protected)
TOR Gives: OG Anunoby & Gary Trent
Why for TOR? They clear the SF & PF spots for Barnes & Siakam long term while upgrading their starting SG & C spot to make a run during the playoffs. They also get a lightly protected 1st to continue to add cheap, young talent.

PG - VanVleet / Banton / Flynn
SG - Brogdon / Mykhailiuk / Brooks
SF - Barnes / Watanabe
PF - Siakam
C - Turner / Achiuwa / Birch
Picks - NA

----------------------------------------------------

SAC Gets: OG Anunoby & #6
SAC Gives: Richaun Holmes, Mo Harless, #4, #37, & 2023 SAC 1st (Top 4 Protected)
Why for SAC? Anunoby is a big upgrade at PF that complements Sabonis very well while also being on the same timeline as our core (24 years old). They also still have a top 6 pick to try and add another piece this year that can help with their playoff run while being on a cheap rookie contract.

PG - Fox / Mitchell
SG - DiVincenzo / Davis
SF - Barnes / Holiday
PF - Anunoby / Lyles / Metu
C - Sabonis / Len
Picks - #6 / #49

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The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#163
#163
SacTownKid said:
Yeah for Collins/Hunter but otherwise heck no. haha.
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I love Okongwu too, I think he's a real break-out defensive star candidate. Collins-Okongwu-Sabonis is a real real interesting big man trio, although going the other direction in terms of the importance of the big man. But if we care about defensive upside, guys like Okongwu are how you do it.

But yeah would need Hunter to feel good about it. Get 2 high-end starters that directly address a lot of team needs and still get a solid developmental prospect at 16. The nice thing is Hunter and Collins are both still 24 and directly on the Sabonis/Fox timeline. With Fox/Sabonis/DDV/Mitchell on board, would have everyone under 26 and just entering their prime. Would cap us out, but I think it'd be near impossible to get that talented through FA.

Barnes-4-contracts for Collins-Hunter-16?
 
twslam07

twslam07

All-Star
#164
#164
The_Jamal said:
Yeah but Dort is a a UFA. If we had his rights, I'd think about that too. And yeah 7 is way different than 12
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I think the deal that makes the most sense with OKC is:

Lu Dort
Kenrich Williams
#2

for

Mo Harkless
#4
2023 SAC 1st (Unprotected)


Why for OKC?
If the rumors are true and OKC really likes Sharpe, then they still get their guy at #4 while picking up an unprotected 1st (which also gives them some higher odds at Wembanyama in 2023).

Why for SAC?
Kings trade up to take Homgren/Smith as the long term PF next to Sabonis while picking up Dort who is a great perimeter defender and Williams who is a solid rotational SF/PF.


PG - Fox / Mitchell
SG - Dort / DiVincenzo / Davis
SF - Barnes / Holiday
PF - Holmgren / Williams / Lyles / Metu
C - Sabonis / Len
 
kb02

kb02

All-Star
#166
#166
twslam07 said:
I think the deal that makes the most sense with OKC is:

Lu Dort
Kenrich Williams
#2

for

Mo Harkless
#4
2023 SAC 1st (Unprotected)


Why for OKC?
If the rumors are true and OKC really likes Sharpe, then they still get their guy at #4 while picking up an unprotected 1st (which also gives them some higher odds at Wembanyama in 2023).

Why for SAC?
Kings trade up to take Homgren/Smith as the long term PF next to Sabonis while picking up Dort who is a great perimeter defender and Williams who is a solid rotational SF/PF.


PG - Fox / Mitchell
SG - Dort / DiVincenzo / Davis
SF - Barnes / Holiday
PF - Holmgren / Williams / Lyles / Metu
C - Sabonis / Len
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Sure, but think this goes against OKC's goal: get higher quality picks. Not add more first round picks to their pile of 10,000 first round picks.
 
SacTownKid

SacTownKid

Hall of Famer
#167
#167
The_Jamal said:
I love Okongwu too, I think he's a real break-out defensive star candidate. Collins-Okongwu-Sabonis is a real real interesting big man trio, although going the other direction in terms of the importance of the big man. But if we care about defensive upside, guys like Okongwu are how you do it.

But yeah would need Hunter to feel good about it. Get 2 high-end starters that directly address a lot of team needs and still get a solid developmental prospect at 16. The nice thing is Hunter and Collins are both still 24 and directly on the Sabonis/Fox timeline. With Fox/Sabonis/DDV/Mitchell on board, would have everyone under 26 and just entering their prime. Would cap us out, but I think it'd be near impossible to get that talented through FA.

Barnes-4-contracts for Collins-Hunter-16?
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Yeah, that deal looks decent. I would much rather keep the pick and gamble with space since I'm not a huge fan of Collins but overall the value seems fair.
 
twslam07

twslam07

All-Star
#168
#168
kb02 said:
Sure, but think this goes against OKC's goal: get higher quality picks. Not add more first round picks to their pile of 10,000 first round picks.
Click to expand...
Well if Sharpe is on top of Presti's board, is taking him at #2 any different than taking him at #4 in regards to getting "higher quality picks?" From that perspective, he's still getting his highest quality pick.
 
SacTownKid

SacTownKid

Hall of Famer
#169
#169
kb02 said:
Sure, but think this goes against OKC's goal: get higher quality picks. Not add more first round picks to their pile of 10,000 first round picks.
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That's an unprotected 1st rounder though that I'm sure if the league took a survey they'd say it's for sure a lottery pick next year (THEY WILL BE WRONG! haha). If they wanted Ivey/Sharpe they don't pass that up. At this point, for Chet, I'd do it.
 
kb02

kb02

All-Star
#170
#170
twslam07 said:
Well if Sharpe is on top of Presti's board, is taking him at #2 any different than taking him at #4 in regards to getting "higher quality picks?" From that perspective, he's still getting his highest quality pick.
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Presti aint afraid to go off of draft boards. He’ll take his dude, if he feels dude is BPA regardless of perception. Russ n Harden we’re both picked higher than where most assumed they would go.
 
kb02

kb02

All-Star
#171
#171
SacTownKid said:
That's an unprotected 1st rounder though that I'm sure if the league took a survey they'd say it's for sure a lottery pick next year (THEY WILL BE WRONG! haha). If they wanted Ivey/Sharpe they don't pass that up. At this point, for Chet, I'd do it.
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Presti will wheel and deal, but dude ain’t afraid to pull on BPA.
 
SacTownKid

SacTownKid

Hall of Famer
#173
#173
SacTownKid said:
That's an unprotected 1st rounder though that I'm sure if the league took a survey they'd say it's for sure a lottery pick next year (THEY WILL BE WRONG! haha). If they wanted Ivey/Sharpe they don't pass that up. At this point, for Chet, I'd do it.
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But is he perhaps wanting to swing into the next draft and pick up that big man? The Thunder are obviously looking to jump all in 2 years from now so one last shot at the top in that 2023 draft might be worth it. That 23 pick will also be fresh on teams minds in the case of sign and trades.
 
Reverend

Reverend

Bench
#175
#175
Section 101 said:
Not a collins fan. Doesn't rebound well enough. The Kings need someone who can rebound at the 4.
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Well I mean Sabonis is a great rebounder and then depending on lineups a guy like Donte can rebound fairly well for his position I wouldn’t really focus on what he can’t bring because there’s a lot that he can do that would help right away.
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#176
#176
Section 101 said:
Not a collins fan. Doesn't rebound well enough. The Kings need someone who can rebound at the 4.
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I'd argue Collins is a pretty great rebounder for the 4. He's just had to share a front-court with Clint Capela, one of the top NBA rebounders, the last few years.

Even still, with Sabonis and DDV on board, it's not too big of an issue. Collins staying healthy and if a Collins/Sabonis front-line could hold up defensively would be my bigger worries.
 
E

ESP47

All-Star
#177
#177
Look up Dort's metrics sometime. He's a below average player. Has never even had a positive VORP in his career either. He's trending toward average and could take a step forward and be a solid player but I'm not using a player with his metrics as the main cog in any type of lottery pick trade. He's had 3 years to become an average player and still isn't there yet. I see him getting there this year or next but I don't think he has a very high ceiling past that. Not a needle mover IMO.
 
kb02

kb02

All-Star
#178
#178
ESP47 said:
Look up Dort's metrics sometime. He's a below average player. Has never even had a positive VORP in his career either. He's trending toward average and could take a step forward and be a solid player but I'm not using a player with his metrics as the main cog in any type of lottery pick trade. He's had 3 years to become an average player and still isn't there yet. I see him getting there this year or next but I don't think he has a very high ceiling past that. Not a needle mover IMO.
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I haven't looked at his advanced stats, but Dort + Mitchell + Daniels/Sochan gets the Kings into the playoffs. Kings go from one of the worse perimeter defending teams to one of the best. I've like Dort for a lonnnnnng time.
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#179
#179
ESP47 said:
Look up Dort's metrics sometime. He's a below average player. Has never even had a positive VORP in his career either. He's trending toward average and could take a step forward and be a solid player but I'm not using a player with his metrics as the main cog in any type of lottery pick trade. He's had 3 years to become an average player and still isn't there yet. I see him getting there this year or next but I don't think he has a very high ceiling past that. Not a needle mover IMO.
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Hard to get a read on a guy like Dort. Had that massive breakout as a defensive star in the 19-20 playoffs, basically shutting down Harden as well as you can and then OKC has been on the full tank the last few seasons while he's only played 50 games each season. He's obviously miscast in his role there where they need him to be a feature option and there's just not a whole lot of talent.

The numbers aren't good, but I think watching him he's an actual difference maker on defense. He's someone I'd be willing to take a leap on where if you put him in a proper role, the impact numbers get better. Still just 23 as well. As a 2023 UFA, he's one of my favorite targets that summer to use our cap space on.
 
Jkbiker

Jkbiker

Starter
#180
#180
According to Jonathan Givony of ESPN, the Thunder are looking to move up from No. 12 to get a top-tier talent alongside who they take with the second overall pick.

He reports that the Thunder are said to be aggressively pursuing trade conversations for pick No. 12, seeking to package it with future assets or existing OKC players in order to move into the mid-lottery to target players like Sharpe and Jaden Ivey.


So:

Justin Holiday. #4 for OKC Dort, Poku #12 and 2023 1st Rd (From Detroit- unprotected)

Sac gets two win now wing players, #12 and 2023 pick

OKC gets Ivey to go with Chet
 
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