Can he play defense or at least stop a chair?
Early look at some 2012 freeagents:
- Thread starter bajaden
- Start date
Can he play defense or at least stop a chair?
bajaden
Hall of Famer
I believe somewhere in this thread, I posted him as my first choice in freeagency. He's a young player thats just coming into his own. Plus he can play both PF and SF. He's a terrrific outside shooter, and a very good rebounder as well.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
Yes, he can. And he hasn't had a chair score on him all year.
MassachusettsKingsFan
All-Star
I've said it before, but I'll say it again ..
Ilyasova would make me very happy. He's a fighter.
Ilyasova would make me very happy. He's a fighter.
KingsCitizen
Starter
If we draft a big, my hope is for Gerald Wallace to finish his career where it all started, Sacramento. He'll be 30 but I still see him play 3 years of good basketball.
If we draft a SF, I hope we at least try to give an offer to McGee or Ryan Anderson. "At least."
If we draft a SF, I hope we at least try to give an offer to McGee or Ryan Anderson. "At least."
Kings Faithful
Starter
I would love Ilyasova...whether we play him at SF or PF is irrelevant to me, he makes us better either way.
Mass
Starter
Camby is exactly what we need. I've been saying it for a while, even if he's old, he is the type of player and person we want in this team. I'd offer him a 2 years contract, he could be very helpful next to Cousins, and also from the bench if we are lucky enough to draft Davis.
I'd love to get Ilyasova, he can play 2 positions and he adds talent to this team. Even if it's not the perfect SF, he is much better than what we have right now. Plus, we don't have the luxury to choose. If he is willing to sign, grab him and don't even think about it.
I'd love to get Ilyasova, he can play 2 positions and he adds talent to this team. Even if it's not the perfect SF, he is much better than what we have right now. Plus, we don't have the luxury to choose. If he is willing to sign, grab him and don't even think about it.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
Well considering that we have little or no depth in the big dept, I think he could be very useful. Actually when I looked up all his stats on Synergy, he's played more minutes at SF than he has PF. Personally I've always thought of him as a PF, and your right, compared to JT, he's a little lighter. But his rebounds per are better than JT's at the PF Position, and he's a lights out shooter. But most of all, he plays with a little chip on his shoulder. He's a tough kid thats not afraid to mix it up inside.
Right now, we have Cuz, JT, and Hayes. Thats a very thin front line, and lets not forget that Hayes is only 6'6". I think it would better to balance the team out a little bit. Plus, there's no guarantee that JT will be back. I know the Kings want him back. And he probably will be. But there might be some idiot out there desperate for a big man thats willing to overpay. One thing I've learned from listening to other teams announcers is that JT is highly thought of around the league. He's a 6'11" hustle guy thats very durable, plays defense, rebounds, and never demands the ball. He's always in good shape, and he's a great teammate. Those kind of players are very desirable.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
I might add that Ilyasova is only 24 yrs old. He's shooting 45% from the three this year, and he's had 16 double/double's. This is a kid that just starting to hit his stride
There's only 96 minutes at PF and C. Yes, there are injuries and your C is more like 30 minutes guy at the moment. Jason Thompson takes 25 minutes if he's resigned. I would hope Whiteside is getting 10mpg next season. That only leaves 30 mpg. Ilyasova won't settle for $4 million/year, he will likely be paid twice as much. If Hayes stays and Ilyasova comes in, you have to let Thompson go. Then again you're running Cousins-Hayes-Ilyasova upfront with very little paint protection and plenty of opportunities to get into foul trouble for Cousins.
82games.com claim that with Ilyasova Bucks are much worse on defense and in defensive rebounding. He improves team offense and offensive rebounding that Kings have enough already. Yes, +/- in offensive/defensive rating is very suspect but for the lack of better data I look at it. And Thompson looks much better in those metrics.
P.S. I'm interested what Hayes' value is around the League? Would Wolves be interested? Because out of three main frontcourt guys he's by far the worst.
82games.com claim that with Ilyasova Bucks are much worse on defense and in defensive rebounding. He improves team offense and offensive rebounding that Kings have enough already. Yes, +/- in offensive/defensive rating is very suspect but for the lack of better data I look at it. And Thompson looks much better in those metrics.
P.S. I'm interested what Hayes' value is around the League? Would Wolves be interested? Because out of three main frontcourt guys he's by far the worst.
DesertFox
Starter
I get the feeling if the team is to add an athletic shotblocker while keepin JT and Hayes, it will have to be a 3/4 rather than a true big. That also allows for Whiteside to get a chance to compete for spot PT as the 5th big.
Everyday Terrence Jones looks better to me, if this team is unable to land the top pick. He's a bit of a reach in the top 6-7 but I don't think it matters so much in the NBA where so few players are drafted anyway.
Everyday Terrence Jones looks better to me, if this team is unable to land the top pick. He's a bit of a reach in the top 6-7 but I don't think it matters so much in the NBA where so few players are drafted anyway.
MassachusettsKingsFan
All-Star
If I'm going after Ilyasova its under the impression he's starting at SF for me.
He has a lot of the skills AK47 has .. in that he can do a little bit of everything. What he lacks in AK's defense and playmaking he makes up for in shooting. Plus, like Baja said, he's very young. I think we have 3 rotation bigs right now. I think it is HIGHLY likely we draft another one (with a top 10 pick no less) and I think it is highly likely we sign another veteran at that spot. ( I like Asik, some suggested Camby ).
So with that being said .. I think if you sign Ilyasova on a team like ours you're projecting him as an SF, and I would love that size at that position.
The nice thing is that AK himself will also be out there, and we are clearly interested. I'd be very happy with either guy.
He has a lot of the skills AK47 has .. in that he can do a little bit of everything. What he lacks in AK's defense and playmaking he makes up for in shooting. Plus, like Baja said, he's very young. I think we have 3 rotation bigs right now. I think it is HIGHLY likely we draft another one (with a top 10 pick no less) and I think it is highly likely we sign another veteran at that spot. ( I like Asik, some suggested Camby ).
So with that being said .. I think if you sign Ilyasova on a team like ours you're projecting him as an SF, and I would love that size at that position.
The nice thing is that AK himself will also be out there, and we are clearly interested. I'd be very happy with either guy.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
I believe its important that we resign Thompson. I won't speculate how much it will take, because whatever it is, it will be whatever the market is willing to pay. And if the another team offers some ridiculous amount, its possible we'll lose him. I hope not, but thats life in the big city. If indeed Ilyasova is going to sign for 8 mil or more, then I probably have to take him off my wish list, unless we, 1. End up losing Thompson, or 2. We see him as just a SF, a postion we need to upgrade. I have my lucky fantasy team in mind. Lucky because it would require getting the 1st pick in the draft, and it would also require the FO to spend money. But since its just a fantasy and won't happen, I'll share it.
Center: Cousins, Hayes, Whiteside
Power Forward: Anthony Davis, Thompson
Small Forward: Ilyasova, Garcia, Honeycutt
Shooting Guard: Evans, Thornton
Point Guard: Dragic, IT, Fredette
I would prefer better backups at the SF position, but we only have so much capspace. Like I said, this won't happen, but this is a better balanced team. In reference to Hayes. Yes I would love to trade him, and I know there were several teams that were interested in him prior to our signing him. The question with the Wolves is who would they want us to take back. Beasley, Milicic, or perhaps Wes Johnson would be the most likely one's.
Beasley is in a qualifying offer year next season and he's making 6.2 mil now. Milicic has two years left at 5 mil a year, with the second year being a team option. Don't know if the Wolves really want to move Johnson, but he's probably an upgrade at backing up SF, at least defensively, and he has 3 years left, with the year after next being a team option year. I didn't mention Randolph, because I want no part of him.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
I would imagine that the Bucks will make him a good offer. There has been many nights this season when he was the best player on their team.
So you want Kings to go out and sign another player who needs the ball to be in his hands for way more than MLE, right? Ilyasova is not a good defender at SF and WILL cost $8 million or more per. Where's Williams btw. I would much rather take him than turkish forward.
As for Hayes he's not producing for this team under this coach. I would swap him for Darko instantly and not because I can't wait to see Milicic suit up in Kings uniform.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
I'd like to resign Williams, and if the Kings were willing to spend the money under my scenario, then I'd add him. Just trying to be a little realistic in a fantasy. I didn't expect you to agree, but I think your wrong about Ilyasova. His defense may not be Kirilenko like, but he's not a bad defender. I've been watching every game I get a chance to see, and puts out a good effort every night. Plus, if we have Davis patroling the paint, were not as desperate for a defense only type Sf. And, if I'm signing Ilyasova for the SF position, I don't care if he makes 8 mil a year because he would be a young starter with upside. I mean no disrespect, but how much have you seen Ilyasova play? I ask because frankly I'm surprised by your negativity about him. This kid can really play! And he's getting better!
Oh well, thats why beauty is in the eye of the beholder. As for trading Hayes for Milicic. Yep, I'd do it! While I like Hayes as a person etc. I don't think he's had much of an impact on the team. At least Milicic would bring some size off the bench, and he's proven he can block a few shots and rebound a little. With Cousins eating the bulk of the minutes, someone like Milicic is all you need at minimum at the backup position. When Whiteside gets up to speed, Milicic moves further down the bench.
DesertFox
Starter
While Ilyasova would definitely be an upgrade at SF, he is just not what this team needs at that spot,. He's a really tough rebounder who can shoot a little, a poor man's Kevin Love.
He tries hard on D but he is really not quick or atheltic, and if we sign him to play the 3 he will get abused on D. Still an overall upgrade but not worth the money he would command.
If we lose JT then Ilasova would be worth the money at the 4, but really the best option is to keep JT for cheap and add a stud 3.
He tries hard on D but he is really not quick or atheltic, and if we sign him to play the 3 he will get abused on D. Still an overall upgrade but not worth the money he would command.
If we lose JT then Ilasova would be worth the money at the 4, but really the best option is to keep JT for cheap and add a stud 3.
I haven't seen Ilyasova much but I never saw him play SF and judging by 82games.com 20 most used lineups with Ilyasova for last 2 years he never played SF but he played center. Yay, Smart will get his backup for Cousins. A few times I saw him matched with smaller players they had no problems getting past him since I'm usually impressed when a big guy is capable of stopping small ones from the perimeter. Ilyasova just doesn't have the quickness for SF. As PF he's on the level with JT and he will cost more to Kings than Thompson so no, count me out.
KingsCitizen
Starter
Could Outlaw's latest reincarnation affect organization's search for a SF?
I think Greene is already a goner.
If it does, my assumption would be that we will most likely get a vet PG as a free agent.
Hinrich would be my better choice here.
I think Greene is already a goner.
If it does, my assumption would be that we will most likely get a vet PG as a free agent.
Hinrich would be my better choice here.
DesertFox
Starter
Yeah, Ilyasova can play the 3 the same way JT "plays" the 3, with more 3's and less ball handling ability. While the size in theory sounds nice it would cause almost as many issues as it solves.
mr. moustache
Bench
His latest reincarnation has been one game long. I think we should wait until he strings a few together before counting on him.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
I hate to nit pic, but when you say Ilyasova can shoot a little, its a vast understatement. He's shooting just under 50% overall, but he's shooting 45.5% from beyond the arc. Which is one of the best 3pt averages in the NBA. Look, I doubt the Kings would fork out 8 mil a year for the guy, so its probably a moot point. But if he were to start next to Cousins instead of Thompson at the PF position, and then have Thompson come off the bench, were a better team. No, we wouldn't have the shotblocking player next to Cousins that we want. But sometimes what you want isn't attainable, so you go for the the next best thing that will improve your team.
My point is, we would be adding a quality player, and not another retread at a cheap price. The more quality players you have on your team, the better the team. With the added caveat, that we have a coach that knows how to utilize them. If were going to go forward with the idea that its all or nothing, then the odds show you usually end up with nothing. I'm not saying don't try for the player you want, but don't make that player an all or nothing player.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
Ray Allen and Mike Miller are different kinds of players. They can handle the ball better too. Apples and Oranges! But I get it, you don't like Ilyasova. I do! So we just have to disagree on this one.
I'm just saying he's a good shooter with great shot selection this season. 
He's also inconsistent. His 3pt% in 4 NBA seasons were .365, .314, .298, .455. His FT% were .787, .715, .894, .781. This year his 3pt attempts per game are lowest for his career. Maybe he improved his shot selection or maybe he's not taking tough ones. Haven't seen him enough to pass the judgement. Educated guess based on other contract year seasons makes me think that next year he won't be shooting .455 from three, more likely you get .390.
He's also inconsistent. His 3pt% in 4 NBA seasons were .365, .314, .298, .455. His FT% were .787, .715, .894, .781. This year his 3pt attempts per game are lowest for his career. Maybe he improved his shot selection or maybe he's not taking tough ones. Haven't seen him enough to pass the judgement. Educated guess based on other contract year seasons makes me think that next year he won't be shooting .455 from three, more likely you get .390.
bajaden
Hall of Famer
I'm just saying he's a good shooter with great shot selection this season.
Look, I don't have a crystal ball. To be honest, I wasn't even a Ilyasova fan until one night I had nothing better to do so I caught a Bucks game on NBA TV. One player really stood out to me. Ilyasova! I'm not a european expert by any means, so I didn't know a lot about him. So I started getting curious and did some research, and also started watching every Buck's game whenever I had a chance, once I found out he would be an unrestricted freeagent. Although I'll use stats as a sometime yardstick, I depend more on what my eyes tell me. For instance, if you just went on MKG's yearly stats, you wouldn't have a clue just how good this kid is.
My eyes tell me that Ilyasova is a better player right now than JT, and that he's just now finding his mojo. Now, I'm with you on one year wonders, especially in a contract year. So caution is the key word. At the same time, its usually a bigs 3rd or 4th year when they break out, and with the current system, in many cases, that usually means its in the players contract year. I've probably seen him play between 15 and 20 times this season (I've got nothing better to do with my DVR) and he seems like the real deal to me.
So I agree that his 3pt shooting this season has been the best of his short career at 45.5%. And that last season he shot a paltry 29.8%. However, his first year in the league he shot 36.5% at 2.2 attempts per game. His second year he had 3.0 attempts per game, but shot a lower percentage at 33.6%. His attempts per game this season and the previous season are very close. 2.0 attempts vrs 1.9 attempts. So overall, his 4 year aveage is 35.7%, which would make him one of the better shooters on a bad shooting Kings team.
So the question is, is the 45.5% the abberation, or is the 29.8% the abberation? I'm leaning toward the 45.5% as the true reflection of his abilities. Not because it enhances my argument, but because in every other area, rebounds, Assists, blocked shots, steals, freethrows, etc, he's improved every year. He has the look of a player on the rise. One of the main things I look for in a player whether its highschool, college or the NBA, is improvement from year to year. And, is the improvement in small steps or large steps.
People get caught up in wanting a homerun when looking at possible additions. I look at a player from the point of view of, is better than what I have now. If he is, and the price is right, then why not? I remember discussions on this fourm about Marc Gasol. Not many people liked him, and I'll admit, I didn't see the player I see now in him. In short not many people wanted him. I also remember discussions on this fourm about Zack Randolph. Again, most people didn't want him. Below the rim player. Didn't defend. Trouble maker! In short, we didn't want those guys because we didn't think they answered our needs, and they wern't good enough.
Now, we'll be watching them play in the playoffs for the second year in a row. Funny how players that aren't good enough to play on our bad team, are good enough, to not only play on a playoff team, but are two of the main players on that playoff team. Is the player your looking at better than any of the players you have at that position right now, and is the price right? If the answer is yes, then that player should be on your list of prospects.
Note: According to Yahoo.com sports, Ilyasova shot 33.6% his second year in the league from behind the line. And if 39.0% becomes his norm, that would still make him one of the better 3 pt shooters in the league, and the best 3 pt shooter on our team. Especially for a big man.
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He seems like a real good player, not great in any particular department, just very good all-around though he's not very good but still solid defender. Main thing is he's going to be paid, and yesterday I saw on Bucks' realgm.com board that Ilyasove was quoted "I will go where I get most money". He expects to be paid and most likely will highest paid Kings' player if he comes here. For that price he doesn't bring anything special or new for that matter. I remember many "Fire Adelman because he plays his 8-man rotation too much" threads. But players like to know they are trusted and they are guaranteed playing time. When coach doesn't have set rotation he can't build a cohesive team. So where Ilyasova comes in? Cousins is likely 32 mpg player next season. If JT retained he should get at least 25mpg. Will Ilyasova be team's 3rd big? Then team is again starving for paint protection and you expose Cousins to easy foul trouble all the time. Instead of JT? JT is better defender (not by much) and defensive rebounder - both areas where Kings need all the help they can get. Kings should rather go for serviceable paint protector like Camby (close to a courpse) or Dalembert (this ship is probably not just sailed, more likely it's somewhere in a Pacific ocean right now). So yes, that looks like two very distant options so maybe if you manage to ship HAyes out or Chuck is content to wait for spot minutes or injuries, it's an OK pickup but nothin to get excited.
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