Do we trade Bogi? (split from FIBA thread)

[sactowndog]

Bogdan against Czech Republic 31 pts (3/5, 7/12, 4/4) 4 reb, 3 ast.. nice way to wrap up a WC..

22.9 ppg in this WC (without that Puerto Rico match it is more than 25 ppg) in 28 minutes average..

now let's see can he translate this into next season..

Bjelica did not play much, scored 3 points..

It’s going to be interesting how Bogi is used. Serbia played him off the ball, running through screens, mostly as a catch and shoot 2 guard.

Joeger played him on the ball, where too often Bogi was forced to make something happen off the dribble. In Joeger’s defense, he didn’t really have a back up point guard and Bogi was his best option but clearly not his game.

Ideally Bogi is the starting 2 in the role we have Buddy. Do we make a trade?

 

[Kangztillidie]

It’s going to be interesting how Bogi is used. Serbia played him off the ball, running through screens, mostly as a catch and shoot 2 guard.

Joeger played him on the ball, where too often Bogi was forced to make something happen off the dribble. In Joeger’s defense, he didn’t really have a back up point guard and Bogi was his best option but clearly not his game.

Ideally Bogi is the starting 2 in the role we have Buddy. Do we make a trade?

Do we wha? Hahahahahahahaha!!!

Ahahahahahahahahahahahah!!!!!

Stop it you're killing me.

 

[jcassio]

It’s going to be interesting how Bogi is used. Serbia played him off the ball, running through screens, mostly as a catch and shoot 2 guard.

Joeger played him on the ball, where too often Bogi was forced to make something happen off the dribble. In Joeger’s defense, he didn’t really have a back up point guard and Bogi was his best option but clearly not his game.

Ideally Bogi is the starting 2 in the role we have Buddy. Do we make a trade?

I don't want to trade Bogi. He's potentially our most valuable 6th man, given his versatility and clutch play, and if (or when) Buddy is injured, he can step right into the SG position and we don't miss a beat. The fact that his sophmore year was a bit of a disappointment works in our favor. One, it gave Buddy a chance to reach his potential. Two, it gives us an excellent chance to sign him and Buddy to extensions (rather than having to choose between them).

 

[rosa u podne]

It’s going to be interesting how Bogi is used. Serbia played him off the ball, running through screens, mostly as a catch and shoot 2 guard.

Joeger played him on the ball, where too often Bogi was forced to make something happen off the dribble. In Joeger’s defense, he didn’t really have a back up point guard and Bogi was his best option but clearly not his game.

Ideally Bogi is the starting 2 in the role we have Buddy. Do we make a trade?

It would make sense if we still had a hole at the SF position. However, right now we have a good starter in each position or at least a young player with a great upside. So, what improvement we get for him?

 

[sactowndog]

It would make sense if we still had a hole at the SF position. However, right now we have a good starter in each position or at least a young player with a great upside. So, what improvement we get for him?

Who knows? I didn’t say absolutely trade him. I’m not down on Bogi or Buddy. I think both are starter level 2 guards. But if you get an offer for a good younger wing I think you have to consider it.

I don’t think Boston would do it but I would absolutely consider a Brown/Bogi trade. I think both teams would be better teams as a result. Boston needs Bogi’s shooting and BBIQ and Bogi would fit well in Brads system. Brown would flourish as a 3 in our up tempo offense.

 

[midtowner]

Probably better to keep all our good players. I think the Bogi/Vlade/Serbia NT help our chances of retaining him on a 4 year/$64 million deal.

 

[Dime Dropper]

It'd be absolutely idiotic to trade Bogi at this point, barring a stupid offer from another team.

 

[L'Optimisme]

It’s going to be interesting how Bogi is used. Serbia played him off the ball, running through screens, mostly as a catch and shoot 2 guard.

Joeger played him on the ball, where too often Bogi was forced to make something happen off the dribble. In Joeger’s defense, he didn’t really have a back up point guard and Bogi was his best option but clearly not his game.

Ideally Bogi is the starting 2 in the role we have Buddy. Do we make a trade?

He's an ideal sixth man as he can play 1, 2, or even 3 in small ball three guard line up. He can easily be on the floor with Fox and Buddy. Jamal Crawford could essentially do the same thing, though I'm not comparing the scoring prowess of the two.

Bogi should be a 25-30 minute player indefinitely for this team. Giles is that version for bigs. Can back up either position. There's your top seven for this team. Though, we'll likely play a 9-10 man rotation due to how much we'll run. The speed of the game is one reason for having depth and that is dictating how our roster is currently constructed. Even our starters likely won't top 35 minutes, probably 30-35. 7-10 will get 15-25 minutes. Our roster is more well balanced than at any time since, dare I say, before the Weber injury. So 02-03. We don't have any holes. 7-10 are all high scrap/hustle players and good to great defenders. This is deliberate and allows our firepower to rest without blowing big leads. Many people underestimate Vlade's vision. Vlade has been tracking for and arranging for this roster (type) for 3 years. It's go time now.

 

[Sactown ExPat]

If I thought Mo Bamba had a future, that’s the type of trade I might think about. But I don’t. Luke Walton and Cory Joseph are going to really clarify Bogi’s role and put him in position to shine this year. I don’t think there is any advantage to trading Bogi, and he is an integral part of the team and team chemistry.

 

[ockingsfan]

It’s going to be interesting how Bogi is used. Serbia played him off the ball, running through screens, mostly as a catch and shoot 2 guard.

Joeger played him on the ball, where too often Bogi was forced to make something happen off the dribble. In Joeger’s defense, he didn’t really have a back up point guard and Bogi was his best option but clearly not his game.

Ideally Bogi is the starting 2 in the role we have Buddy. Do we make a trade?

Bogdan has a chance to become the "NBA 6th Man of the Year" winner year in and year out.

If we show him the proper respect, pay him accordingly and he embraces his role, he would be an Elite 6th Man.

No way we trade him now, he's too valuable to the team.

 

[Sluggah]

What is an example of a realistic trade that would make the answer yes?

 

[pdxKingsFan]

If we can keep him happy in his role and he plays to his abilities we must keep him, if he's not happy then you probably have to deal but I'd try to get him on a reasonable second contract first. He's a guy who is going to have value around the league as opposed to some of our more recent malcontents.

 

[sactowndog]

He's an ideal sixth man as he can play 1, 2, or even 3 in small ball three guard line up. He can easily be on the floor with Fox and Buddy. Jamal Crawford could essentially do the same thing, though I'm not comparing the scoring prowess of the two.

Bogi should be a 25-30 minute player indefinitely for this team. Giles is that version for bigs. Can back up either position. There's your top seven for this team. Though, we'll likely play a 9-10 man rotation due to how much we'll run. The speed of the game is one reason for having depth and that is dictating how our roster is currently constructed. Even our starters likely won't top 35 minutes, probably 30-35. 7-10 will get 15-25 minutes. Our roster is more well balanced than at any time since, dare I say, before the Weber injury. So 02-03. We don't have any holes. 7-10 are all high scrap/hustle players and good to great defenders. This is deliberate and allows our firepower to rest without blowing big leads. Many people underestimate Vlade's vision. Vlade has been tracking for and arranging for this roster (type) for 3 years. It's go time now.

Bogi can play 1, 2, or 3 but I believe he is a much better 2 playing off the ball.

Bogi shot 10% better as a catch and shoot 3 point shooter versus shooting off the dribble. The majority of Bogi’s shots in FIBA were running of screens, catch and shoot.

Bogi as a 3 is a poor rebounder. We saw the problems with that line-up last year.

Bogi as a 2 running off screens is likely a top 100 player who scores +17 points. I’m not sure we can fully realize his potential with Buddy already in the 2 spot. Now I only trade Bogi if I get a wing with starter potential. It’s unlikely but given his play in FIBA a small probability.

If a player like Jaylen Brown were available for Bogi (or maybe Buddy) he provides a young 3 and D player who can play 2 or 3 and provide great defense. He would also fill the lane nicely on the break.

 

[sactowndog]

If we can keep him happy in his role and he plays to his abilities we must keep him, if he's not happy then you probably have to deal but I'd try to get him on a reasonable second contract first. He's a guy who is going to have value around the league as opposed to some of our more recent malcontents.

Bogi could well be offered starter money and then we will have to make a call.

 

[sactowndog]

What is an example of a realistic trade that would make the answer yes?

I think the question is what type of trade would say yes... realistic is in the eye of the holder.

The trade I like is Jaylen Brown for Bogdan. Boston in my mind needs more shooters/play makers for others and JB doesn’t have the TS, handle or BBIQ to play the 2 where Boston plays him. Boston already has Smart and Ojele as defensive wings. JB is the quintessential 3 and D guy who would fill a gap for the Kings as another perimeter defender athletic wing.

A JB type of player is what it would take to trade Bogdan.

 

[L'Optimisme]

Bogi can play 1, 2, or 3 but I believe he is a much better 2 playing off the ball.

Bogi shot 10% better as a catch and shoot 3 point shooter versus shooting off the dribble. The majority of Bogi’s shots in FIBA were running of screens, catch and shoot.

Bogi as a 3 is a poor rebounder. We saw the problems with that line-up last year.

Bogi as a 2 running off screens is likely a top 100 player who scores +17 points. I’m not sure we can fully realize his potential with Buddy already in the 2 spot. Now I only trade Bogi if I get a wing with starter potential. It’s unlikely but given his play in FIBA a small probability.

If a player like Jaylen Brown were available for Bogi (or maybe Buddy) he provides a young 3 and D player who can play 2 or 3 and provide great defense. He would also fill the lane nicely on the break.

Your points are valid but I don't think it's worth the frictional cost of roster shake up and the risk inherent in bringing on a new player, tangibles and intangibles included. Vlade is really good at understanding the human element of the game and that there is value in that. That's always been his secret sauce. Any new player would need a character evaluation and even then there's risk. I just don't see enough upside (or where that upside would be applied). Bogi's much more than "good enough" but that's essentially all that is needed from his role. He's quite good and he also knows our guys. The hidden costs and risks of a marginally better player on a roster where all other roles are set is what stops me from even considering. Plus, he's still getting better, and coming off a year with nagging injuries.

 

[rosa u podne]

Your points are valid but I don't it's worth the frictional cost of roster shake up and the risk inherent in bringing on a new player, tangibles and intangibles included. Vlade is really good at understanding the human element of the game and that there is value in that. That's always been his secret sauce. Any new player would need a character evaluation and even then there's risk. I just don't see enough upside (or where that upside would be applied). Bogi's much more than "good enough" but that's essentially all that is needed from his role. He's quite good and he also knows our guys. The hidden costs and risks of a marginally better player on a roster where all other roles are set is what stops me from even considering. Plus, he's still getting better, and coming off a year with nagging injuries.

There are two reasons I might consider a trade:

1. Bogdan doesn't rest during the summer. He always plays for the NT. Next year Serbia will play qualifying tournament for Olympics and probably OG. That increases the risk of fatigue and injuries.

2. If he plays well before the trade deadline, his trade value could be very high and might drop if fatigue causes the injury later.

I remember how Petrie traded a few players just a week or two before an injury ended their career.

 

[sactowndog]

There are two reasons I might consider a trade:

1. Bogdan doesn't rest during the summer. He always plays for the NT. Next year Serbia will play qualifying tournament for Olympics and probably OG. That increases the risk of fatigue and injuries.

2. If he plays well before the trade deadline, his trade value could be very high and might drop if fatigue causes the injury later.

I remember how Petrie traded a few players just a week or two before an injury ended their career.

Well a third reason is it might be best for the player (Vlade does this often). Bogi would excel playing in Boston’s half court sets and off the ball with Kemba or Smart. Stevens looks for players with high IQ and can you imagine what Stevens could do with Bogi in a ATO? Bogi running screens through Boston’s bigs would play just like at FIBA and give Boston a 17+ point scorer.

Meanwhile, Brown would give us a defensive stopper that Ariza used to be before getting old. We could go small with Fox, Buddy, Jaylen, Barnes and Bagley. Brown could also swing down to the 2 when we needed defensive stops as Buddy isn’t a great defender.

Whether either team would do it is an open question but I think both teams become better.

 

[kingsboi]

the only reason to trade Bogs is if he requests a trade because he feels he could start elsewhere, otherwise, if you can convince him to keep coming off the bench and playing a Ginobili role as a super sub then this team will only be that much better and in return you give him a 2 or 3 year extension.

 

[ESP47]

When he gets back to the Kings, just have him do whatever it is that he's doing on the Serbia team because it's working.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Bogi could well be offered starter money and then we will have to make a call.

Yes, we pay him starter money if he is 6th man of the year level and content. No brainer. As long as Fox and Bagley are superstar level guys you keep these guys until someone offers you something stupid to move them. You don't let starting caliber talent walk.

 

[gunks]

Lol what?

6MOTY if his health/play holds up. Let's not trade that.

 

[sactowndog]

Yes, we pay him starter money if he is 6th man of the year level and content. No brainer. As long as Fox and Bagley are superstar level guys you keep these guys until someone offers you something stupid to move them. You don't let starting caliber talent walk.

Who said let him walk. I proposed a Jaylen Brown / Bogdanovic trade because I think it makes both teams better.

 

[chief bromden]

Wait, you don’t want to pay Bogi starter money but you want to pay Jaylen Brown starter money a year earlier? Bill Simmons believes he wants at least 25/year.

 

[Cojc]

I thought about maybe we should move him last year at the trade deadline but my judgment was tainted by 2 years of hope that he can come in healthy or rested.

But that gave way to believing that we needed him as our backup with the knowledge of what he gives us if rested and healthy. He is the kind of player who our opponents will hate and have to worry about.

I just hope with our two point guards now he will be able to play off the ball and give us a deadly threat from the shooting guard position.

Man I am looking forward to seeing the season start.

 

[DesertFox]

I'm really interested inseeing how the bench unit pans out before making any moves.

Giles, Belly, and Joseph are all talented passers who could rely on a more dominant scoring option. Ariza and Joseph can handle the tougher defensive assignments. Belly can stretch the floor, and if Giles or Holmes can become good screeners, Bogi can really breakout.

 

[upinsmoke]

Do we wha? Hahahahahahahaha!!!

Ahahahahahahahahahahahah!!!!!

Stop it you're killing me.

I don't think it's this cut and dry. I factor in Bogi's contract into the equation, how much do we want to pay our backup 2 guard? For the right deal I would absolutely do it.

 

[tastyburger]

No question we'd all love to keep bogi as a backup. The reality is there are going to be plenty of teams who would start him and pay him well to do so. Having a core of fox, buddy and bagley, we have to be very careful about overpaying role players, especially after overpaying for barnes. I would look into trying to get some picks for bogi so long as the price is right.

 

[SacTownKid]

What you also saw from Bogdan in the WC was pick and roll play. As a pick and roll player he's dangerous. Last year they wanted him to be an attack guard which they rarely had spacing for and probably isn't his strong suit anyway not even considering his nagging knee issues last year. More pick and rolls and more spot ups next year and Bogdan should look terrific.

 

[Sactown ExPat]

I don’t see anyway he’s traded this season. Not with the playoff push they’re trying to make. Next summer, we’ll see how RFA goes. I would say we’d want a young stretch big (keep an eye on MPJ’s health and Bamba’s GAS) or promising bench combo guard (Derrick White type player).