Boston perspective on Rondo trade rumors

[Kings Faithful]

I'd trade for him anyway i think. We'd have all of next season with him to build relationships. That plus we can offer more than everyone else... the thought of leading us through the playoffs for years to come with a new building on the way and a huge payday might just sway him. Who knows.

 

[Gilles]

Show NBA player the money, and he'll sign for a team from Alaska. Anyway too little information still, will get more information soon.
P.S. I know this might turn the thread into debate usual for the last two months, but I'm glad FO is reasonable enough to not consider certain player as not a big part of the future.

 

[Kings Faithful]

Show NBA player the money, and he'll sign for a team from Alaska. Anyway too little information still, will get more information soon.
P.S. I know this might turn the thread into debate usual for the last two months, but I'm glad FO is reasonable enough to not consider certain player as not a big part of the future.

The trick is getting said NBA player to Alaska first... A free agent would never go there but if they are traded realize it isn't the end of the world they are more than likely to resign.

 

[ParniValjak]

Rondo
Thornton
Gay
Thompson
Cousins

Thats a good starting 5 even in the west. With IT gone, Thornton's shots will increase making him more effective especially with Rondo getting him better looks. You would still be looking at getting a shot blocker at PF and moving JT to 3rd tall role where he is very effective. Also some bench depth would be much needed

 

[Entity]

Rondo
Thornton
Gay
Thompson
Cousins

Thats a good starting 5 even in the west. With IT gone, Thornton's shots will increase making him more effective especially with Rondo getting him better looks. You would still be looking at getting a shot blocker at PF and moving JT to 3rd tall role where he is very effective. Also some bench depth would be much needed

I don't know bench of Jimmer, Mccallum, Williams, Acy, and Landry

 

[Chubbs]

The message buried in the tweets is that the Kings were offering IT and Ben plus picks but weren't willing to take the risk of Rondo not re-signing because they highly valued Ben and weren't willing to lose him on a Don Quixote like attempt at wooing Rondo in re-signing. To me that means they were willing to lose the picks and IT but not Ben. Too much of a risk. IT can't feel good about that. The FO apparently doesn't agree with a lot of us who see Ben as disposable and IT as part of the Big 3. The FO doesn't agree. Ben >> IT

If I were the FO I wouldn't have shared that info as, although it might reassure Ben, it sure doesn't make IT feel good. I find this interesting.

I presume others will not agree with my interpretation.

Ben clearly has more upside and is in theory a better fit as a spot up shooter around cuz. His performance in half a season certainly raises red flags, but the FO isn't giving up on him. Of course, his spot up shooter skills are wasted with the current team structure. His development is also stunted. I see them much more willing to build with Ben in mind than our pg. Especially since the pg would cost somewhere close to twice as much. One is signed, one isn't. They may already know our pgs demands will be out of the range of possibility.

There's seems to be some major dysfunction in the locker room and on the court. Cuz is either mad we didn't get rondo, he didn't make the all star team, or he's mad we are trying to trade his little buddy. If it's the first, as someone mentioned, it could be a situation where he feels no one wants to help him and he's going to be stuck in nba Siberia while our pg and gay walk this offseason. If his solution is to prove what a malcontent he can be, I have to question his resiliency. If it's the second, grow the **** up. If it's the third, well, that's toxic as well. If there's a little man and cuz faction in the locker room and gay opts out, this team is kinda stuck in neutral. 3 seasons of those two and we've yet to reach mediocrity. Enough already.

That said, if this cuz injury turns into a bad one, our pick starts looking a lot better. Top 6, and with some luck, you never know. I know people will disagree, but a lingering long term cuz injury might be the best thing that could happen. The season is lost anyway. The 4 games before the break looked like no one wanted to play. What else is new, right?

 

[Hadlowe]

That said, if this cuz injury turns into a bad one, our pick starts looking a lot better. Top 6, and with some luck, you never know. I know people will disagree, but a lingering long term cuz injury might be the best thing that could happen. The season is lost anyway. The 4 games before the break looked like no one wanted to play. What else is new, right?

Realistically, the team has been out of the playoff hunt since the Rudy trade. It's just too difficult to make up ground in the West. If the team can land a top five pick this year, it almost makes the losing worth it. Almost.

Cuz and Embiid would be a helluva frontcourt pair.

 

[Chubbs]

Realistically, the team has been out of the playoff hunt since the Rudy trade. It's just too difficult to make up ground in the West. If the team can land a top five pick this year, it almost makes the losing worth it. Almost.
.

I'm not arguing that. I'm being nice. Some saw the rudy trade as a win now move. I wasn't one of them. The playoff ship had sailed before we got rudy.

 

[Entity]

Realistically, the team has been out of the playoff hunt since the Rudy trade. It's just too difficult to make up ground in the West. If the team can land a top five pick this year, it almost makes the losing worth it. Almost.

Cuz and Embiid would be a helluva frontcourt pair.

I didn't say that

 

[Hadlowe]

I didn't say that

Bah, cached quotes getting me in trouble. Fixed it.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Actually this rumor says both teams agreed on some type of deal in principal, but Kings wanted a promise of extension or an actual one (not sure, if it is available in the middle of the season).

Yet again there was this from the Boston Globe today:

Multiple league sources said that while several teams have inquired about Rondo, the Celtics have only had only one realistic conversation about potentially moving him — the one that involved Paul.

That would seem to suggest that we would not have had a deal in principle for Rondo. Honestly, I don't really think more than about 20% of the stuff ot there right now is accurate, and it's basically impossible to tell which is which.

 

[sidney]

Rondo
Thornton
Gay
Thompson
Cousins

Thats a good starting 5 even in the west. With IT gone, Thornton's shots will increase making him more effective especially with Rondo getting him better looks. You would still be looking at getting a shot blocker at PF and moving JT to 3rd tall role where he is very effective. Also some bench depth would be much needed

I think you take the deal (if it is there) to get the lineup above. Finally we field a serious team. It's time. Draft picks are often most valuable before the pick is selected - all the hope and promise without seeing the warts of the actual player selected.

Next year Cousins should be an all star and Rudy is already saying positive things about staying. That gives us a great shot to keep Rondo.

 

[bajaden]

Promise of an extension? I just read that he didn't want to re-sign. Maybe the FO just wanted to hear he was open to the idea of staying and he said he wasnt

I think t ha

Ben clearly has more upside and is in theory a better fit as a spot up shooter around cuz. His performance in half a season certainly raises red flags, but the FO isn't giving up on him. Of course, his spot up shooter skills are wasted with the current team structure. His development is also stunted. I see them much more willing to build with Ben in mind than our pg. Especially since the pg would cost somewhere close to twice as much. One is signed, one isn't. They may already know our pgs demands will be out of the range of possibility.

There's seems to be some major dysfunction in the locker room and on the court. Cuz is either mad we didn't get rondo, he didn't make the all star team, or he's mad we are trying to trade his little buddy. If it's the first, as someone mentioned, it could be a situation where he feels no one wants to help him and he's going to be stuck in nba Siberia while our pg and gay walk this offseason. If his solution is to prove what a malcontent he can be, I have to question his resiliency. If it's the second, grow the **** up. If it's the third, well, that's toxic as well. If there's a little man and cuz faction in the locker room and gay opts out, this team is kinda stuck in neutral. 3 seasons of those two and we've yet to reach mediocrity. Enough already.

That said, if this cuz injury turns into a bad one, our pick starts looking a lot better. Top 6, and with some luck, you never know. I know people will disagree, but a lingering long term cuz injury might be the best thing that could happen. The season is lost anyway. The 4 games before the break looked like no one wanted to play. What else is new, right?

So, everything that's wrong now is Cousins fault! Well done there! Great out of the box thinking. Very objective... Where do I keep the booze?

 

[Chubbs]

I think t ha


So, everything that's wrong now is Cousins fault! Well done there! Great out of the box thinking. Very objective... Where do I keep the booze?

Where did I say that? I said no such thing. But it was hard to miss the lack of effort, the barking at teammates, etc. the last games before the break. He reacted poorly to SOMETHING. It's just speculation. At no point did I blame everything on cuz.

I'm on the record many times saying who I think the problem is.

As I write this a rumor pops up about a MT or JT for Jarrett jack swap.

Not really sure what you're objecting to.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

As I write this a rumor pops up about a MT or JT for Jarrett jack swap.

That Jack contract is pretty ugly - basically the same size as the Landry contract (thought the last year is unguaranteed). MT for Jack would mean we pick up extra money (almost $4M, though the prorated salary from this year would bring that down about $500-750K) and spread it over an extra year. Not so hot if we're looking for a 2015 free agent splash. JT for Jack would leave us really thin up front unless we truly believe that Carl Landry is both the the right answer and ready to play.

Now Landry for Jack I could get behind (as could, I assume, most everybody around here). Which is why it would never happen.

 

[Chubbs]

Hard to argue with Landry for jack. Why clevekand would do that I don't know.

 

[SacKings2002NBAChampions]

How the hell did we get stuck with Landry, Thornton, D-Will and JT
Offload all these guys. Opening cap space is the most important thing right now bar none. There's plenty of good free agents upcoming in the next year. Draft a shot blocker. Trade for a pass first PG. hope Ben Mac improves but if not sign a guy like Klay Thompson next season. Sign a couple vets and we're set. It should not be this hard.

J. Jack? No thx.
Deng? No thx.
Lowry? I'd take but not what they're asking for...
Rondo? Sure but I wouldn't give up Ben Mac or at least give IT Ben Mac and a second rounder
No first round draft picks any more
Who knows where we will be come 2017...
Plus, I believe there's a lot of good talent come that generation. Like my boy Seventh

Cousins needs to grow up. He is expecting to win the NBA championship next year. Not gonna happen dude and never will if you keep acting like a baby.

I must say, Rondo-Gay-Cousins
Sounds like a formidable trio. If there was a way to keep Ben Mac, I'd do it. Otherwise, just sign a big in draft. Resign rondo next season for max. Hope to get a D n 3 SG in the offseason next year.
Or somehow move gay to 2 and D-Will to 3
Then we have to offload the other losers and account that D-Will's contract is increasing as well

 

[Rain man]

Here is a three team deal that works salary-wise for Toronto, Boston, and Sacramento, where we give up a whole lot less- http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=nydrqnr

In essence:

Toronto receives:
Rondo

Sacramento receives:
Lowry

Boston receives:
IT
Patrick Patterson (expiring) OR Grevis Vazquez (expiring)
Jimmer (expiring)
Aaron Gray (expiring)
Toronto First round (currently 19, but could be anywhere from 17-23)
Right to swap draft picks with Sacramento in 2014 or 2015

Why Toronto does it:
No brainer. Rondo is better than Lowry. Rondo solidifies their chances at the 3 seed and makes the first round draft pick less valuable. Rondo is locked up for an extra season, so they have less risk of losing a high level point guard. They do lose Patterson, who has carved out a nice niche, but I think they would stomach that to get Rondo. It also works with Vasquez instead of Patterson.

Why Sacramento does it:
If we can't get Rondo, Lowry is the next best prize. You aren't giving up as much as you do in the Rondo trade, so it mitigates the risk that Lowry walks. You are essentially swapping IT for Lowry, and giving up expiring contracts and a right to swap picks to make it work. Maybe the right to swap picks burns you, but both Boston and Sac are headed to the lottery. Worst case, you give up a 1-3, or 6, in order to draft 8-9. You get to keep McLemore and JT.

Why Boston does it:
Everyone you get back is an expiring contract, meaning that you free up $12 million next year. With Humphries coming off the books, that gives you flexibility to pursue a free agent and the ability to resign the Pizza Guy if you want. You also double your odds of a top 3 pick by having the right to swap with Sacramento, and pick up an extra first round pick from Toronto.

 

[Glenn]

Jack is rumored with several teams and the rumor with the Kings is that we trade Jimmer for Jack.

 

[funkykingston]

Here is a three team deal that works salary-wise for Toronto, Boston, and Sacramento, where we give up a whole lot less- http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=nydrqnr

In essence:

Toronto receives:
Rondo

Sacramento receives:
Lowry

Boston receives:
IT
Patrick Patterson (expiring) OR Grevis Vazquez (expiring)
Jimmer (expiring)
Aaron Gray (expiring)
Toronto First round (currently 19, but could be anywhere from 17-23)
Right to swap draft picks with Sacramento in 2014 or 2015

Why should the Kings do all the heavy lifting to get Rondo to Toronto simply to trade for Lowry who can bolt elsewhere at season's end? If Boston would accept that package then I'd say it'd be far better for the Kings to trade for a late 1st round pick and a small expiring contract and make that deal themselves.

I doubt Boston goes for it in either case but if they did it means the Kings would have a trio of Rondo/Gay/Cousins while still keeping a top ten pick even if they end up swapping with Boston.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Jack is rumored with several teams and the rumor with the Kings is that we trade Jimmer for Jack.

That definitely wouldn't work under salary cap rules unless we included more salary.

Good thing, because I think the worst thing we could possibly do would be to take on another $6M+ sixth man for a couple of years without getting rid of one of the ones we have.

 

[twslam07]

Here is a three team deal that works salary-wise for Toronto, Boston, and Sacramento, where we give up a whole lot less- http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=nydrq

In essence:

Toronto receives:
Rondo

Sacramento receives:
Lowry

Boston receives:
IT
Patrick Patterson (expiring) OR Grevis Vazquez (expiring)
Jimmer (expiring)
Aaron Gray (expiring)
Toronto First round (currently 19, but could be anywhere from 17-23)
Right to swap draft picks with Sacramento in 2014 or 2015

Why Toronto does it:
No brainer. Rondo is better than Lowry. Rondo solidifies their chances at the 3 seed and makes the first round draft pick less valuable. Rondo is locked up for an extra season, so they have less risk of losing a high level point guard. They do lose Patterson, who has carved out a nice niche, but I think they would stomach that to get Rondo. It also works with Vasquez instead of Patterson.

Why Sacramento does it:
If we can't get Rondo, Lowry is the next best prize. You aren't giving up as much as you do in the Rondo trade, so it mitigates the risk that Lowry walks. You are essentially swapping IT for Lowry, and giving up expiring contracts and a right to swap picks to make it work. Maybe the right to swap picks burns you, but both Boston and Sac are headed to the lottery. Worst case, you give up a 1-3, or 6, in order to draft 8-9. You get to keep McLemore and JT.

Why Boston does it:
Everyone you get back is an expiring contract, meaning that you free up $12 million next year. With Humphries coming off the books, that gives you flexibility to pursue a free agent and the ability to resign the Pizza Guy if you want. You also double your odds of a top 3 pick by having the right to swap with Sacramento, and pick up an extra first round pick from Toronto.

I have been drafting up something very, very similar to this. I like the premise a lot, but Toronto would need to give up some more salary. This trade puts them above the luxury tax level which comes with a ton of stipulations.

If Toronto sends Vazquez to Boston as well, it will keep both Boston and Toronto under the luxury tax level.

I think Toronto should give the Kings' 2014 second round pick to Boston to entice them a little more. That would set them up very nicely for a rebuild.

• Boston would have the option of swapping their pick with the Kings thus having a better shot at landing a star (Kings are currently 4th worst and Boston is 6th worst)
• Boston would have the least favorable pick of the Hawks or Nets (which would currently be the Hawks pick at #18)
• Boston would have Toronto's 1st round draft pick (which would currently be #20)
• Boston would have the Kings' 2nd round pick (which would currently be #34)

That's a very good collection of picks for this strong 2014 draft. Not to mention everyone would be an expiring (saving them 13 mil in cap space next year). Three of those expirings have QO's. If they want to resign them, they can go ahead and do so, or they can possibly work out a sign and trade for some of them netting them even more assets.

I think this deal has a pretty good ROI for Boston. However, I'm not sure I'm on board yet with swapping our 2014 pick with Boston just to get Lowry for maybe just a half year. If we made it a swap in 2015, I would definitely be on board with that because I'm pretty sure we will be better than Boston next year. So in essence, we would get Lowry for Thomas, Fredette, and Gray which is fine by me! Unfortunately, I think having the option to swap might be something that interests Boston.

Edit: If you resign Lowry and draft Vonleh, we'll be looking very good next year.

PG - Lowry/McCallum
SG - McLemore/Thornton
SF - Gay/Williams/Outlaw
PF - Vonleh/Landry/Acy
C - Cousins/Thompson

That team has a solid starting lineup, and a very good bench. We could probably use a cheap, veteran PG to round out the roster, but that's about it.

 

[Hadlowe]

Jack is rumored with several teams and the rumor with the Kings is that we trade Jimmer for Jack.

Just such a terrible idea overall. I don't dislike Jack as a player, despite being dreadful in Cleveland this year, but I do not want to take on his contract.

 

[Rain man]

Why should the Kings do all the heavy lifting to get Rondo to Toronto simply to trade for Lowry who can bolt elsewhere at season's end? If Boston would accept that package then I'd say it'd be far better for the Kings to trade for a late 1st round pick and a small expiring contract and make that deal themselves.

I doubt Boston goes for it in either case but if they did it means the Kings would have a trio of Rondo/Gay/Cousins while still keeping a top ten pick even if they end up swapping with Boston.

I guess the question is what assets are you using to acquire another expiring contract and a mid-first rounder?

My preference is to go after Rondo with McLemore, IT, and our first rounder (if we can free it for trade). That trade would also require moving some ugly contracts to make things work. Failing that, my preference is to see if we can move IT for a reasonable return, while keeping McLemore and our pick. The only other options seem to be Teague or Lowry. It seems like Toronto wants to trade Lowry for an upgrade (i.e. Rondo), so we need a third team.

I understand that you want Rondo, and so do I. This offer is an attempt to find another move IF we cannot get Rondo or think the price is too high (i.e. don't want to trade Ben).

 

[rainmaker]

I don't like Jarret Jack at all. Not his style of play, nor his contract. And despite a few here claiming he's a good locker room guy, I heard otherwise when he was in GS. Right now he's part of one of the more toxic locker rooms in the league.

There's not even a little part of me which wants Jack on this squad.

 

[rainmaker]

Rumor we talked with Cle about JT. If that was part of a deal to bring us Varejao, that might be interesting. Still think potentially he pairs pretty well with Boogie.

 

[Jose]

Maybe it's a good thing that I'm not a GM? But I think that any lottery team, especially one in our situation, that trades away a potential 1-3 pick in a draft like this for anything other than a top tier superstar in return is just CRAZY. Sure, it's something the Maloofs would have done in exchange for garbage & cash considerations, but not something that any reasonable front office would do. We need to keep our pick, and clear some cap space so we can make some meaningful signings. IMHO, of course.

 

[Glenn]

I wouldn't pull the trigger on any trade until the results of the MRI on Boogie return. There is an outside chance he will play no more this year. If that worst case scenario occurs, that makes our pick very valuable. We'll know today so there is no rush.

 

[funkykingston]

A trade for Rondo may not be feasible for the Kings, but

Maybe it's a good thing that I'm not a GM? But I think that any lottery team, especially one in our situation, that trades away a potential 1-3 pick in a draft like this for anything other than a top tier superstar in return is just CRAZY. Sure, it's something the Maloofs would have done in exchange for garbage & cash considerations, but not something that any reasonable front office would do. We need to keep our pick, and clear some cap space so we can make some meaningful signings. IMHO, of course.

If Petrie were still the GM I'd agree with you. Geoff had his share of flaws but on draft day it was (at least pre Jimmer and pre Thomas Robinson) pretty much a certainty that he would stand pat, not engage in any wheeling and dealing involving draft picks and patiently wait to select one of the best players available when the Kings were on the clock.

With PDA I have no real gauge for his acumen at selecting players. Our only indication is Ben McLemore in one of the worst drafts in NBA history where the #1 pick was being considered for a D-League stint.

This draft is good and deep and also overhyped. There will be some very good players to come from it and there will be some busts. If I was certain that D'Alessandro had an eye for talent then I'd be against pick swapping or making a deal with Chicago to make our pick unrestricted etc. But as it stands I'm not absolutely opposed to those notions because I fear we may not get good return on what could potentially be a franchise changing lottery pick. We'll see.

 

[VF21]

If Rondo doesn't want to come then he doesn't want to come.. I don't want an a-hole player just playing out his contract here and not trying.

Does the name Chris Webber ring any bells?