Bajadens 1st mindless mock draft for 2020:

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#1
I struggled with whether to do a mock on how I thought it would actually go, or do a mock listing the players the way I would pick them. Instead I decided to do a mock of how I thought each of the teams should choose based on their current roster needs. So it's a subjective opinion, and one I doubt they would listen to. I will do the 2nd rd as well, but it's far more difficult because of the talent equality. There are players that will go undrafted that will end up being better players than some taken in the 2nd rd. So, without further ado:

1. Warriors, Anthony Edwards: 6'5", 225 lbs, Georgia, SG, Freshman.
First, I think there's a good chance they trade out of this pick for a more experienced player, but if not, Edwards probably has the most upside of anyone in the draft. That doesn't mean that he's currently the best player in the draft. He's a poor perimeter shooter that takes a lot of bad, contested shots. He only plays defense when he wants to, and that's not often. So there are some red flags with him. On the positive side, he's an elite athlete with an NBA body. So all the tools are there, and the Warriors are a team that will teach him some dicipline.

2. Cavaliers, Obi Toppin: 6'9", 220 lbs, Dayton, PF, Sophmore.
The Cav's need a star. They need an impact player, and Toppin may have been the best player in college this season. I don't remember how many of his games I watched, but I can't for the life of me remember a bad one. He was simply dominate all year long. He's a terrific athlete who does it all. If the Warriors don't take Edwards, then they should take Toppin, and for me, he should be the 1st pick in the draft.

3. Timberwolves, Isaac Okoro: 6'6", 225 lbs, Auburn, SF/SG, Freshman.
The T-Wolves need someone that can play defense, and that's Okoro's speciality. He's an elite athlete with an NBA body who was one of the best defenders in college. He has a good wingspan which enables him to defend multiple positions. His weakness is his jumpshot, which doesn't look broken, so he'll likely improve in that area.

4. Hawks, Deni Avdija: 6'9", 215 lbs, Maccabi Tel Aviv, SF, 19 years old.
The only major knock on Avdija was his poor 3pt shot (33.6%) and his terrible free throw shooting (52.0%). Most scouts seem to think that was an aberration and if so, the Hawks get themselves a heck of a player. He's an excellent facilitator with good handles and excellent BBIQ who can run the offense if needed.

5. Pistons, James Wiseman: 7'1", 240 lbs, Memphis, Center, Freshman.
Wiseman is a bit of a mystery man since he only played in three games before being suspended by the NCAA. But, he was pretty darned good in those three games. The only game that made me sit up and take notice was his third game against Oregon, the first major conference team he faced. After averaging 22.5 pt's and 4 blocks a game in his first two games, he fell off to 14 pt's and 1 block against Oregon. Hey, he might have had the flu, who knows. At the moment he's a throw back center, but if he can develop a game away from the basket he could be an impact player.

6. Knicks, LaMelo Ball: 6'7", 181 lbs, Illawarra (NBL), PG, 18.6 yr's old.
Most mocks have LaMelo going higher, but I think a lot of teams will look at him and see a big headache coming along with him. New York is one of those towns that's used to bigger than life people. If Ball had a decent 3pt shot, he would be the most talented player in the draft. But right now, he's Rubio 2.0. Other than that, he's a terrific passer with great court vision. If he can get his shot straightened out, the Knicks will have a star. Boy do they need one.

7. Bulls, Tyrese Haliburton: 6'5", 175 lbs, Iowa St., PG, Soph.
This is the player I had targeted for the Kings, but I have to be honest here, he won't last that long. I think Haliburton was one of the best players in college until he got injured. This is a jump shooter that averaged 50.4% overall and 41.9% from the three, while grabbing 5.9 rebounds along with 6.5 assists and 2.5 steals. He can create for others, create for himself, and defend. His only flaw, if you can call it one, is his lack of strength. He definitely needs to get stronger, but despite that, he's not afraid to go in among'st the trees and bang.

8. Hornets, Onyeke Okongwu: 6'9", 245 lbs, USC, PF/C, Freshman
Frankly, Onyeke was a surprise to me. He was much better around the basket than I thought he would be. He has a very good motor and is an above average athlete. He's a very good weakside shot blocker averaging 2.7 a game. He's also a very good rebounder with a good 2nd leap. Like a lot of the big's, he needs to work on his game away from the basket. He mostly played center, and looks the part of a small ball center, but if he can improve his jumper, he then becomes a multi-position player.

9. Wizards, Killian Hayes: 6'5", 190 lbs, Ratiopharm ULM, PG/SG, 18.7 years old.
I've watched a lot of film as well as a couple of complete games on Hayes, and I was impressed. He has a funky looking jumpshot that needs some tweaking, but other than that, he's a very skilled player with a good feel for the game. He sees the floor well and always seems to make the right pass. He has great size for the position which will allow him to guard 2's as well as 1's. I'm a little concerned about his 3pt shot, but he did shoot 87.6% from the line, which bodes well for improvement.

10. Suns, Nico Mannion: 6'3", 190 lbs, Arizona, PG, Freshman.
I struggled with this one. I'm not sure Mannion deserves to be picked this high. He's a very good passer with terrific BBIQ. He certainly puts out the effort defensively, but lacks length with a 6'2.5" wingspan. His 3pt shot was very inconsistent. He would go 3 for 4 one game, and 0 for 5 the next. If he can straighten out his shot, I think he can be a starter in the NBA. If not, well then........


That's my top ten. The next ten will follow tomorrow....

 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#2
11. Spurs, Aleksej Pokusevski: 7'0", 205 lbs, 7'3" wingspan, Olympiacos, PF/C/SF, 18.3 years old (youngest player in the draft)
I almost picked Pokusevski for the Kings, but whereas he's a high risk/high reward pick, I'm not sure Vlade would be willing to take a gamble. Pokusevski is a very good ballhandler for a seven footer, and a deceptively good athlete as well. His three point shot looks good even is his percentages don't leap out at you. Right now, I would call him a sort of Porzingis light. He's a terrific rebounder despite only weighing 205 lbs. He's an excellent passer with high BBIQ. His lateral quickness will surprise you. He has a very high ceiling, but he could easily crash and burn as well.

12. Kings, Saddiq Bey: 6'8", 215 lbs, Villanova, SF, Sophmore.
Bey was another of my favorite players this season. He's a very good shooter, shooting 47.7% overall, and 45.1% from the three. He's a good, but not an elite athlete, and was the best defensive player on the Nova team. He was asked to guard the best player on the other team regardless of position. That doesn't mean he'll be a lock down defender at the next level, but it does mean he can defend. Bey is also a consummate team player who will make the extra pass. I think he'll be the perfect backup behind Barnes who will bring defense, and some firepower to the 2nd unit.

13. Pelicans, Devin Vassell: 6'7", 195 lbs, Florida St., SF/SG, Sophmore
Like Bey, Vassell is a very good shooter and a very good defender who can play both the SF and SG positions. He shot 41.5% from the three and a very good 46.1% overall. He's a good athlete with good anticipation on defense. He was also a player I considered for the Kings.

14. Trailblazers, Theo Maledon: 6'4", 175 lbs, ASVEL, PG, 18.8 yr's old.
This is purely an upside pick for the Blazers, and Maledon has a lot of upside. He's a very good athlete who can guard multiple positions. Right now he does most of his scoring at the basket or with a variety of floaters etc. When left open on a catch and shoot, he's a pretty good 3pt shooter. Off the dribble, not so much. He has a quick first step off the dribble and some nice spin moves in the lane to either attack the basket or dish.

15. Magic, Tyrese Maxey: 6'3", 198 lbs, Kentucky, SG/PG, Freshman.
Maxey this year reminded me of his running mate Quickley's Freshman year, where he struggled with his perimeter shot, and then came back strong this year. The major difference is that Maxey is an elite athlete who is lightning quick with above the rim hops. Maxey shot the ball well in highschool, so like Quickley, I think this was a year of adjustment for him. He's and excellent freethrow shooter at 83.3% so it's likely he'll bounce back. Maxey is another player with great upside.

16. Timberwolves, Jaden McDaniels: 6'9", 200 Lbs, Washington, SF/PF, Freshman.
McDaniels is another upside pick. He's not NBA ready in my opinion, but has a lot of tools in his tool box. He started the season playing well, and then started fading as the season went on. I think the best word I would use to describe him is sloppy. He gets careless, almost like his mind is somewhere else at times. And then he'll make a play that reminds you of why you liked him in the first place. He should be better than he is, and that's what the team that drafts him is hoping he'll become.

17. Celtics, Vernon Carey Jr.: 6'10", 270 lbs, Duke, Center, Freshman.
This was a tough one. I think Carey is a good fit and the Celtics haven't been quite the same since losing Horford. Carey has shown he can shoot the three, he rebounds, and is a pretty good post defender. He's been all over the place on mock drafts. Who knows if the Celtics will actually use all their picks as they have three in the first rd.

18. Mavericks, Aaron Nesmith: 6'6", 213 lbs, Vanderbilt, SG/SF, Sophmore
Nesmith is another of my favorites, and another I considered for the Kings. He would have been insurance against Buddy leaving. Nesmith is the best shooter in college shooting an incredible 52.2% from the three, and he took a lot of them, so it wasn't a fluke. Give him an open shot, and he was almost automatic. He needs to work on his handles, but he's ready to step on the floor and shoot right now.

19. Bucks, Jalen Smith: 6'10", 225 lbs, Maryland, PF/C, Sophmore.
I love Smith. He has a terrific motor. He runs the floor on both ends. He has excellent footwork in the post, and he can step out and shoot the three well enough that you have to guard him. He'll only get better. He's a good athlete and a tenacious rebounder averaging 10.5 a game. He also contributed 2.4 blocks a game.

20. Nets, Precious Achiuwa: 6'9", 225 lbs, Memphis, PF/SF, Freshman.
I think Precious would have put up better numbers if Wiseman had been allowed to play the season. Without Wiseman, Precious became the focus of the other teams defense. He's probably more of a 4 than a 3, but I think he's capable of playing the 3 in some situations. He needs to improve his perimeter shot and his poor free throw shooting. He's a very good rebounder however grabbing almost 11 a game. He's also a good weakside shotblocker blocking almost 2 a game.


The final 10 tomorrow:
 
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bajaden

Hall of Famer
#3
21. Nuggets, R J Hampton: 6'5". 188 lbs, New Zealand Breakers, PG/SG, 19 yr's old.
I'm not as high on Hampton as some others. He decided to play in the New Zealand pro league in lieu of college. Personally, I think he made a mistake, but water under the bridge now. Hopefully it was a learning experience. Going to an already established team like the Nuggets will help him. There won't be any pressure or great expectations on him. He's a very good athlete who really didn't do much in the way of creating for others. He didn't shoot the ball very well either. Most of his points came at the basket on dunks or layups.

He's the kind of player that could be something in a couple of years and the Nuggets have the time to wait for him to develop. I expect he'll spend some time in the G-League.

22. 76'ers, Josh Green: 6'6", 206 lbs, Arizona, SG, Freshman.
Green was my favorite player to watch on the Arizona team. I think he has a lot of growth left. He shot a respectable 36.1% from the three. I think with some work and a little tweaking, he can become a solid three point threat. He surprised me with his passing ability. He's a solid athlete with good BBIQ. He probably deserves to go higher.

23. Heat, Patrick Williams: 6'8", 225 lbs, Florida St., PF, Freshman
Williams is an elite athlete who right now has little game away from the basket. He has the athleticism to play the SF position, but not the handles. The Heat might be the perfect team for him to start his career with. They seem to be able to squeeze talent out every player they draft, and Williams could be a good one. He brings the athleticism and a skill set that fits perfectly into how the Heat play.

24. Jazz, Kira Lewis Jr: 6'3", 165 lbs, Alabama, PG, Soph
Lewis was one of the best PG's in college this season racking up 5.2 assists, 1.8 steals and 4.8 boards while scoring 18.5 points a game. He shot a respectable 36.6% from the three, and just for Sactowndog, he shot 80.2% from the line. Obviously he needs to get stronger, weighing only 165 lbs. He played in the tough SEC conference against the Kentucky's of the world, so he was seriously tested.

25. Thunder, Paul Reed: 6'9", 225 lbs, DePaul, PF, Junior.
Reed was a double/double machine for DePaul this season, and whatever success they had they can give him credit for. Reed did a little of everything for DePaul, scoring 15.1 ppg, grabbing 10.7 rebounds a game along with 1.9 steals and 2.6 blocked shots. He even shot the three ball well for half a season until every team made Reed the focus of their defense. Most mocks have him going in the 2nd rd, and nothing would make me happier than to have him sitting there when we make our first pick in the 2nd.

26. Celtics, Jahmi'us Ramsey: 6'4", 195 lbs, Texas Tech, SG, Freshman.
Ramsey sort of lived in the shadows this year putting up one of the better seasons for a Freshman guard. He averaged 15 points a game and shot 42.6% from the three, all while playing good defense.

27. Knicks, Isaiah Stewart: 6'9", 250 lbs, Washington, PF/C, Freshman.
Stewart was one of my favorite big's this season. He's a good but not an elite athlete with a good motor. Very strong player who can hold position in the post. He averaged over 2 blocks a game and he runs the floor well. He can play some small ball center, but I think his best position is at the 4, and if so, he needs to improve his 3 pt shot.

28. Raptors, Tre Jones: 6'3", 185 lbs, Duke, PG, Soph.
For some reason many teams don't think Jones shooting will translate to the NBA. I'll admit it was borderline respectable at just over 36% from the three, but if he can maintain that, the rest of his game is excellent. He's a tenacious defender averaging 1.8 steals, that will dog you all over the floor. He's a good passer with good court vision averaging 6.4 assists. He does need to get stronger, but there's a lot to like.

29. Lakers, Zeke Nnaji: 6'11", 240 lbs, Arizona, C/PF, Freshman.
I thought Nnaji had a fairly solid Freshman campaign, scoring 16.1 ppg while grabbing 8.6 boards a game. He's still a little rough around the edges, but I liked what I saw from him. By the way, this is the 3rd Arizona player I have in the 1st rd. Makes you wonder why they wern't a better team.

30. Celtics, Jordan Nwora: 6'7", 225 lbs, Louisville, SF/PF, Junior.
Nwora might have been the best player on Louisville this year. The knock on Nwora is that he's just an average athlete and some wonder if he's capable of guarding NBA SF's. He's an excellent 3 pt shooter who averaged 40.2% this season, and he rebounds the ball well. I think he can play PF in today's league. He's smart and he has a good feel for the game.

I had five players listed on my imaginary white board that I wanted for the Kings.

1. Obi Toppin. Of course we have no chance of getting him without trading up, or winning the lottery
2. Tyrese Haliburton. Probably no chance, but maybe a miracle will happen
3. Saddiq Bey. Excellent chance he'll be available when we pick.
4. Aaron Nesmith. Almost certain to be there when we pick.
5. Devin Vassell. Again, almost certain to be there when we pick.

Other players of interest for me in the 1st rd.
1. Aleksej Pokusevski
2. Jalen Smith
3. Killian Hayes
 
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#4
10. Suns, Nico Mannion: 6'3", 190 lbs, Arizona, PG, Freshman.
I struggled with this one. I'm not sure Mannion deserves to be picked this high. He's a very good passer with terrific BBIQ. He certainly puts out the effort defensively, but lacks length with a 6'2.5" wingspan. His 3pt shot was very inconsistent. He would go 3 for 4 one game, and 0 for 5 the next. If he can straighten out his shot, I think he can be a starter in the NBA. If not, well then........
This guy was supposed to lead them to the promised land and in the end I was relieved when they killed the NCAA season.
Suns may as well do another "oh let's take the guy from Arizona".

I think I'm officially over Miller.

Speaking of the cancellation of the tourney, what do you think the odds of players waiting a year that might normally declare are?
 
#5
I struggled with whether to do a mock on how I thought it would actually go, or do a mock listing the players the way I would pick them. Instead I decided to do a mock of how I thought each of the teams should choose based on their current roster needs. So it's a subjective opinion, and one I doubt they would listen to. I will do the 2nd rd as well, but it's far more difficult because of the talent equality. There are players that will go undrafted that will end up being better players than some taken in the 2nd rd. So, without further ado:

1. Warriors, Anthony Edwards: 6'5", 225 lbs, Georgia, SG, Freshman.
First, I think there's a good chance they trade out of this pick for a more experienced player, but if not, Edwards probably has the most upside of anyone in the draft. That doesn't mean that he's currently the best player in the draft. He's a poor perimeter shooter that takes a lot of bad, contested shots. He only plays defense when he wants to, and that's not often. So there are some red flags with him. On the positive side, he's an elite athlete with an NBA body. So all the tools are there, and the Warriors are a team that will teach him some dicipline.

2. Cavaliers, Obi Toppin: 6'9", 220 lbs, Dayton, PF, Sophmore.
The Cav's need a star. They need an impact player, and Toppin may have been the best player in college this season. I don't remember how many of his games I watched, but I can't for the life of me remember a bad one. He was simply dominate all year long. He's a terrific athlete who does it all. If the Warriors don't take Edwards, then they should take Toppin, and for me, he should be the 1st pick in the draft.

3. Timberwolves, Isaac Okoro: 6'6", 225 lbs, Auburn, SF/SG, Freshman.
The T-Wolves need someone that can play defense, and that's Okoro's speciality. He's an elite athlete with an NBA body who was one of the best defenders in college. He has a good wingspan which enables him to defend multiple positions. His weakness is his jumpshot, which doesn't look broken, so he'll likely improve in that area.

4. Hawks, Deni Avdija: 6'9", 215 lbs, Maccabi Tel Aviv, SF, 19 years old.
The only major knock on Avdija was his poor 3pt shot (33.6%) and his terrible free throw shooting (52.0%). Most scouts seem to think that was an aberration and if so, the Hawks get themselves a heck of a player. He's an excellent facilitator with good handles and excellent BBIQ who can run the offense if needed.

5. Pistons, James Wiseman: 7'1", 240 lbs, Memphis, Center, Freshman.
Wiseman is a bit of a mystery man since he only played in three games before being suspended by the NCAA. But, he was pretty darned good in those three games. The only game that made me sit up and take notice was his third game against Oregon, the first major conference team he faced. After averaging 22.5 pt's and 4 blocks a game in his first two games, he fell off to 14 pt's and 1 block against Oregon. Hey, he might have had the flu, who knows. At the moment he's a throw back center, but if he can develop a game away from the basket he could be an impact player.

6. Knicks, LaMelo Ball: 6'7", 181 lbs, Illawarra (NBL), PG, 18.6 yr's old.
Most mocks have LaMelo going higher, but I think a lot of teams will look at him and see a big headache coming along with him. New York is one of those towns that's used to bigger than life people. If Ball had a decent 3pt shot, he would be the most talented player in the draft. But right now, he's Rubio 2.0. Other than that, he's a terrific passer with great court vision. If he can get his shot straightened out, the Knicks will have a star. Boy do they need one.

7. Bulls, Tyrese Haliburton: 6'5", 175 lbs, Iowa St., PG, Soph.
This is the player I had targeted for the Kings, but I have to be honest here, he won't last that long. I think Haliburton was one of the best players in college until he got injured. This is a jump shooter that averaged 50.4% overall and 41.9% from the three, while grabbing 5.9 rebounds along with 6.5 assists and 2.5 steals. He can create for others, create for himself, and defend. His only flaw, if you can call it one, is his lack of strength. He definitely needs to get stronger, but despite that, he's not afraid to go in among'st the trees and bang.

8. Hornets, Onyeke Okongwu: 6'9", 245 lbs, USC, PF/C, Freshman
Frankly, Onyeke was a surprise to me. He was much better around the basket than I thought he would be. He has a very good motor and is an above average athlete. He's a very good weakside shot blocker averaging 2.7 a game. He's also a very good rebounder with a good 2nd leap. Like a lot of the big's, he needs to work on his game away from the basket. He mostly played center, and looks the part of a small ball center, but if he can improve his jumper, he then becomes a multi-position player.

9. Wizards, Killian Hayes: 6'5", 190 lbs, Ratiopharm ULM, PG/SG, 18.7 years old.
I've watched a lot of film as well as a couple of complete games on Hayes, and I was impressed. He has a funky looking jumpshot that needs some tweaking, but other than that, he's a very skilled player with a good feel for the game. He sees the floor well and always seems to make the right pass. He has great size for the position which will allow him to guard 2's as well as 1's. I'm a little concerned about his 3pt shot, but he did shoot 87.6% from the line, which bodes well for improvement.

10. Suns, Nico Mannion: 6'3", 190 lbs, Arizona, PG, Freshman.
I struggled with this one. I'm not sure Mannion deserves to be picked this high. He's a very good passer with terrific BBIQ. He certainly puts out the effort defensively, but lacks length with a 6'2.5" wingspan. His 3pt shot was very inconsistent. He would go 3 for 4 one game, and 0 for 5 the next. If he can straighten out his shot, I think he can be a starter in the NBA. If not, well then........


That's my top ten. The next ten will follow tomorrow....
Piston’s have the Christian Wood as a young center whom they like a lot and the intend to resign him. If Ball falls to them at 5 they are taking ball.

But the New York post agrees with you.
 
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bajaden

Hall of Famer
#7
Re: Killian Hayes....some prominent draft guys like Kevin O’Connor are listing him at #1. Any thoughts on that?
Yeah, it's a crap shoot. You have as good a chance of figuring out where everyone is going to be drafted this year as you do picking the winning bracket of the NCAA tournament. All these players are talented, but none leap out and say I'm the clear number one or two etc. To me, the two best players are Toppin and Haliburton, and that's based on what they did on the court this season. So it's pick what is versus what could be.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#8
Piston’s have the Christian Wood as a young center whom they like a lot and the intend to resign him. If Ball falls to them at 5 they are taking ball.

But the New York post agrees with you.
Well, you could be right. But everyone I talk to has reservations about Ball because of his father and all the drama that comes with him. Without that, I think Ball is a top three pick. That along with his inability to shoot the ball is likely going to slide him down a bit. I've always like Wood going all the way back to the draft. I thought he was a better prospect than Looney, who was taken before him. However, with Wood's ability to step out and shoot the three, he might be better at the PF position next to Wiseman.
 
#9
Yeah, it's a crap shoot. You have as good a chance of figuring out where everyone is going to be drafted this year as you do picking the winning bracket of the NCAA tournament. All these players are talented, but none leap out and say I'm the clear number one or two etc. To me, the two best players are Toppin and Haliburton, and that's based on what they did on the court this season. So it's pick what is versus what could be.
exactly. I don’t think I have seen such variation. But given this is a Kings board I most interested in who you think the Kings will get.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#10
This guy was supposed to lead them to the promised land and in the end I was relieved when they killed the NCAA season.
Suns may as well do another "oh let's take the guy from Arizona".

I think I'm officially over Miller.

Speaking of the cancellation of the tourney, what do you think the odds of players waiting a year that might normally declare are?
Well if you've read my comments over the years, you'd know that I'm not a big fan of Millers. His teams are known for going out in the first round of the tournament. He's a good recruiter, but not so good at developing talent into a team. My personal pick for the Sun's would be considered a reach, but I would take Kira Lewis Jr. I think he was one of the best PG's in college this last season. He definitely needs to get stronger, but he's a talented kid.

Also, remember they still have Rubio for a couple of more years. Do they want two PG's that can't shoot the ball? As far as some players waiting another year to play in the tournament, I think it really depends on the individual player's circumstance. If he comes from a poor background, or if he believes he's a 1st rd pick or perhaps even a high 2nd rd pick, he's likely to stay in the draft. If he wants to get a degree, or borderline going undrafted, then why not stay another year.

Ultimately, most players that have the ability want to play in the NBA, and I think their decision will always be centered around that, not the NCAA tournament.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#11
exactly. I don’t think I have seen such variation. But given this is a Kings board I most interested in who you think the Kings will get.
Well, your about to find out because I'm in the process of doing the next 10.. And in that regard, it wasn't an easy decision. I had 3 or 4 players that I really liked, and once again, it came down to what is, or what will be......
 
#12
Well if you've read my comments over the years, you'd know that I'm not a big fan of Millers.
No, we've definitely discussed and I think last time around I wasn't there yet. With this team that was as highly rated as it was coming into the season to be middle of the Pac-12? I think I'm done. He hasn't evolved.

Ultimately, most players that have the ability want to play in the NBA, and I think their decision will always be centered around that, not the NCAA tournament.
I understand that - but it seems the tournament elevates a lot of players, other times it knocks them down a few pegs. I think the one-and-doners are always one and done but what about guys who stuck around for sophomore and junior seasons and didn't get a chance to shine and may be lucky to go second round without their one shining moment?
 
#13
Well, your about to find out because I'm in the process of doing the next 10.. And in that regard, it wasn't an easy decision. I had 3 or 4 players that I really liked, and once again, it came down to what is, or what will be......
yeah I would be interested in your thoughts. I think if the Kings go Hampton then a Buddy trade is likely. He may be BPA also depending on your draft. Other BPA could be a SF like Vassell, Williams or Balmaro.
 
#14
At 11, I think the Spurs go with one of Bey, Nesmith or Vassell. They are really lacking in young wing talent. The plan sure seems to be to hand the team off to Becky this summer (we’ll see if that changes due to the postponement of the Olympics), and they need guys who can play right now. Their defense has also been surprisingly bad—they have to get guys that can address wing defense. They are likely to lose DeRozan in free agency, as well, and will need some immediate scoring pop.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#15
No, we've definitely discussed and I think last time around I wasn't there yet. With this team that was as highly rated as it was coming into the season to be middle of the Pac-12? I think I'm done. He hasn't evolved.


I understand that - but it seems the tournament elevates a lot of players, other times it knocks them down a few pegs. I think the one-and-doners are always one and done but what about guys who stuck around for sophomore and junior seasons and didn't get a chance to shine and may be lucky to go second round without their one shining moment?
You bring up a good point, and it's going to be a little more difficult this year because of the virus lockdown. The teams will still get to talk to a player for a total of 4 hours electronically in some fashion, so the players will get some feedback. The problem is, as I see it, and I don't have any official knowledge of the process, is that a team would have to include said player on their list of calls, which means, what do you do if no team calls you.

As you stated, the tournament gives all players a chance to shine, and every year, there are players that were previously considered undraftable, that move up into the 2nd rd, and players that were previously considered 2nd rd picks that move into the 1st rd. That opportunity is gone! By the same token, the tournament can have a detrimental effect as well. I think some of the fringe players decision will be based on economics, and some on letting their desire for an NBA career override common sense.

I think a players coach can have a huge influence on a players decision. Some like Calipari are trusted by their players. He'll be the first to tell a player that it's in the players best interest to declare for the draft, which may be against Calipari's best interest. As a result, the players trust him when he says it's in their best interest to stay another year. Ask Nick Richards who went from undraftable to a likely high 2nd rd pick or P J Washington who went from a 2nd rd pick to a lottery pick.

The bottom line is that if your on most teams top 100 list you'll probably be playing somewhere next year and getting paid for it. If your outside that group, you might want to stay another year. If your a senior, hire a good agent!
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#17
yeah I would be interested in your thoughts. I think if the Kings go Hampton then a Buddy trade is likely. He may be BPA also depending on your draft. Other BPA could be a SF like Vassell, Williams or Balmaro.
I watched a lot of film on Hampton, and while his athleticism and ability to get to the basket stood out at times, he didn't blow me away with the rest of his game. He didn't shoot the ball well (29.5% from the three), and didn't create for others as much as I would have liked. There's talent there, but I have to go on what is, not on what might be. At least as far as the Kings are concerned. The Kings need someone that's ready to contribute right now, and I don't think Hampton is that player.

I think Hampton made a mistake not going to college where he would have gotten more minutes, and been on national TV on a regular basis. It's possible that the experience he got playing in a pro league will help him long term, but I think it hurt him short term, at least with me, and we all know how important that is. :p

Williams is another player that's not going to help in the short term. He's a very good athlete who needs to stay another year in college to polish his game a bit more. He has little game away from the basket, which isn't good for a slightly undersized PF. There's a lot of potential there, but once again, I don't think the Kings are in the market for players that aren't ready to play in the league right now. Vassell his running mate is an entirely different story and a result of staying in college another year.

I had three players at the top of my list for the Kings and one additional high risk/high reward player. The top three were Bey, Nesmith, and Vassell. My high risk player would be Pokusevski, who is a very unique player and could be a star if everything falls into place. So my point is, if I'm going to go with a project player, I want to see star potential in that player, and I don't see that in Williams. That doesn't make me right! Just my opinion...
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#18
At 11, I think the Spurs go with one of Bey, Nesmith or Vassell. They are really lacking in young wing talent. The plan sure seems to be to hand the team off to Becky this summer (we’ll see if that changes due to the postponement of the Olympics), and they need guys who can play right now. Their defense has also been surprisingly bad—they have to get guys that can address wing defense. They are likely to lose DeRozan in free agency, as well, and will need some immediate scoring pop.
Actually, I agree with you. Those were my top three players for the Kings, and of course I went with Bey. My original choice for the Spurs was Vassell who would be insurance against DeRozan leaving, but I thought they might go with someone that had star potential, but was a risky choice. By the same token, I almost took Nesmith for the Kings as insurance against Buddy leaving.
 
#19
I watched a lot of film on Hampton, and while his athleticism and ability to get to the basket stood out at times, he didn't blow me away with the rest of his game. He didn't shoot the ball well (29.5% from the three), and didn't create for others as much as I would have liked. There's talent there, but I have to go on what is, not on what might be. At least as far as the Kings are concerned. The Kings need someone that's ready to contribute right now, and I don't think Hampton is that player.

I think Hampton made a mistake not going to college where he would have gotten more minutes, and been on national TV on a regular basis. It's possible that the experience he got playing in a pro league will help him long term, but I think it hurt him short term, at least with me, and we all know how important that is. :p

Williams is another player that's not going to help in the short term. He's a very good athlete who needs to stay another year in college to polish his game a bit more. He has little game away from the basket, which isn't good for a slightly undersized PF. There's a lot of potential there, but once again, I don't think the Kings are in the market for players that aren't ready to play in the league right now. Vassell his running mate is an entirely different story and a result of staying in college another year.

I had three players at the top of my list for the Kings and one additional high risk/high reward player. The top three were Bey, Nesmith, and Vassell. My high risk player would be Pokusevski, who is a very unique player and could be a star if everything falls into place. So my point is, if I'm going to go with a project player, I want to see star potential in that player, and I don't see that in Williams. That doesn't make me right! Just my opinion...
I agree with your assessments though I think Williams lack of 3’s is more role with Vassell on the team than ability. Williams shot over 80% from the line on 3-4 attempts a game. You don’t shoot .838 from the line as a poor shooter. Vassell by contrast shot .738.

What does concern me is your statement, which I have heard echoed by others, of drafting for who helps you now versus who you believe will be the best player in 3-4 years. Kings have followed this philosophy far too often. I believe and it’s one of the key reasons we have been out of the playoffs for so long.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#20
I agree with your assessments though I think Williams lack of 3’s is more role with Vassell on the team than ability. Williams shot over 80% from the line on 3-4 attempts a game. You don’t shoot .838 from the line as a poor shooter. Vassell by contrast shot .738.

What does concern me is your statement, which I have heard echoed by others, of drafting for who helps you now versus who you believe will be the best player in 3-4 years. Kings have followed this philosophy far too often. I believe and it’s one of the key reasons we have been out of the playoffs for so long.
I think how you draft depends on what your team looks like, and what your expectations are for the coming season. If your a contending team with an established core of players, your in a position to take a more high risk/high reward player, or a project player with a high ceiling. Similar to what the Kings did when they drafted Gerald Wallace. Or if your a bottom dweller in a rebuild, in sort of a nothing to lose situation, you can take project players with a lot of potential, hoping for a future star.

But if your a team like the current Kings, and your trying to make the playoffs, you need players that are more ready to play and fit your team. You don't need to choose a player that might spend half his rookie year in the G-League. Now that doesn't mean you would pass up a player that your convinced will be a star in a couple of years. Where the Kings are picking, I can name a few players that I think could be stars in a few years, but am I convinced? No!

As I said, I like Williams. I saw a lot of his games, and every time I watched Florida St. play, I thought the better player on the floor was Vassell. Vassell isn't just a one trick pony. He's a very good defender and a good rebounder (he out rebounded Williams) for his position. One of my knocks on Williams was his rebounding. I think he's capable of more than 4 boards a game. Finally, I don't put free throw percentage as the be all/end all for how good a shooter a player can be. I think it can be a indicator, but it's not an absolute. If it was then Rubio would be one of the best 3pt shooters in the league.

I've seen college players that shot 65% from the free throw line their freshman year and shot 83% their senior year. A lot of young players don't work on it until they get to college, or if one and done, the NBA. In general, if a player has good form, good rotation, and a effortless looking shot, I think he'll eventually become a decent to good perimeter shooter, if he puts the work in. In general I try to not let one thing override what my eye's tell me. Buddy Hield shot around 28% from the three his freshman year, and he never broke 40% until his senior year. Vassell shot 67.9% from the line his freshman year, and he shot 73.8% this season. Vassell improved, and that's what your looking for.

Here's the thing, Williams is a very good athlete, but so is Vassell. Williams has a lot of potential, but then, so does Vassell. Williams is an inch taller and a year younger. Who cares, both are young. Am I convinced that Williams will be the better player down the road? No! Am I convinced that Vassell is the overall better player right now? Yes! So I take Vassell. At the end of the day, could you end up being right? Yes! That's why its a crap shoot...
 
#21
I think how you draft depends on what your team looks like, and what your expectations are for the coming season. If your a contending team with an established core of players, your in a position to take a more high risk/high reward player, or a project player with a high ceiling. Similar to what the Kings did when they drafted Gerald Wallace. Or if your a bottom dweller in a rebuild, in sort of a nothing to lose situation, you can take project players with a lot of potential, hoping for a future star.

But if your a team like the current Kings, and your trying to make the playoffs, you need players that are more ready to play and fit your team. You don't need to choose a player that might spend half his rookie year in the G-League. Now that doesn't mean you would pass up a player that your convinced will be a star in a couple of years. Where the Kings are picking, I can name a few players that I think could be stars in a few years, but am I convinced? No!

As I said, I like Williams. I saw a lot of his games, and every time I watched Florida St. play, I thought the better player on the floor was Vassell. Vassell isn't just a one trick pony. He's a very good defender and a good rebounder (he out rebounded Williams) for his position. One of my knocks on Williams was his rebounding. I think he's capable of more than 4 boards a game. Finally, I don't put free throw percentage as the be all/end all for how good a shooter a player can be. I think it can be a indicator, but it's not an absolute. If it was then Rubio would be one of the best 3pt shooters in the league.

I've seen college players that shot 65% from the free throw line their freshman year and shot 83% their senior year. A lot of young players don't work on it until they get to college, or if one and done, the NBA. In general, if a player has good form, good rotation, and a effortless looking shot, I think he'll eventually become a decent to good perimeter shooter, if he puts the work in. In general I try to not let one thing override what my eye's tell me. Buddy Hield shot around 28% from the three his freshman year, and he never broke 40% until his senior year. Vassell shot 67.9% from the line his freshman year, and he shot 73.8% this season. Vassell improved, and that's what your looking for.

Here's the thing, Williams is a very good athlete, but so is Vassell. Williams has a lot of potential, but then, so does Vassell. Williams is an inch taller and a year younger. Who cares, both are young. Am I convinced that Williams will be the better player down the road? No! Am I convinced that Vassell is the overall better player right now? Yes! So I take Vassell. At the end of the day, could you end up being right? Yes! That's why its a crap shoot...
not all trying to argue Williams over Vassell. although It is an interesting discussion. I do think you left out wingspan as an important characterization.

My post is more about selecting strictly on who helps you immediately.

I can see choosing best in 3-4 years player available regardless of fit.

I can see choosing best in 3-4 years player available that fits with your existing team.

Both of the above are reasonable strategies that you might adjust year over year depending on your needs.

I can never see a winning organization choosing best player this year over either of the 2 philosophies above. But alas the Kings are not and haven’t been a winning organization in a while. Following this short term philosophy is likely a big reason why.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#22
not all trying to argue Williams over Vassell. although It is an interesting discussion. I do think you left out wingspan as an important characterization.

My post is more about selecting strictly on who helps you immediately.

I can see choosing best in 3-4 years player available regardless of fit.

I can see choosing best in 3-4 years player available that fits with your existing team.

Both of the above are reasonable strategies that you might adjust year over year depending on your needs.

I can never see a winning organization choosing best player this year over either of the 2 philosophies above. But alas the Kings are not and haven’t been a winning organization in a while. Following this short term philosophy is likely a big reason why.
While I agree with you to some extent, I also don't think it's all that easy to determine who will be the best player 3-4 years form now. I think from the Kings perspective, that's exactly what they thought Bagley would be, and who knows, he may still be. There's also nothing wrong with picking a player that will be the best player 3-4 years from now, but also immediately help you. I think that's how they looked at Fox. The way I look at it, is that if I have two players that in my opinion have a similar ceiling, but one can help right now, that's who I'm going with.
 
#23
While I agree with you to some extent, I also don't think it's all that easy to determine who will be the best player 3-4 years form now. I think from the Kings perspective, that's exactly what they thought Bagley would be, and who knows, he may still be. There's also nothing wrong with picking a player that will be the best player 3-4 years from now, but also immediately help you. I think that's how they looked at Fox. The way I look at it, is that if I have two players that in my opinion have a similar ceiling, but one can help right now, that's who I'm going with.
fair enough
 
#24
This is such a weird draft. I really like the guys at our current spot. I feel like there is great value at #10-#20 in comparison to historical norms. I think I’d actually be mad if we hit in the lottery. I just have no real interest to bring any of those guys in as a #3 pick. I like some of the top rated guys (although not Wiseman, at all), but none of them would sniff a top 5 pick in a normal draft. Edwards is a guy that, normally, some team would pick #6 and feel really good about it—a nice, frisky lead guard to excite the fans. Edwards at #1 is going to be interesting. I don’t know, Toppin and Okoro might sneak into the 4th or 5th pick in a standard draft, but I just don’t love either of them as a top 3 pick. Those guys will be walking into the locker room on a big dollar deal—could be really sub-optimal in certain locker rooms.

But, like I said, I love the guys at 10-20, and then our first two 2nd rounders could be real nice, too.
 
#25
This is such a weird draft. I really like the guys at our current spot. I feel like there is great value at #10-#20 in comparison to historical norms. I think I’d actually be mad if we hit in the lottery. I just have no real interest to bring any of those guys in as a #3 pick. I like some of the top rated guys (although not Wiseman, at all), but none of them would sniff a top 5 pick in a normal draft. Edwards is a guy that, normally, some team would pick #6 and feel really good about it—a nice, frisky lead guard to excite the fans. Edwards at #1 is going to be interesting. I don’t know, Toppin and Okoro might sneak into the 4th or 5th pick in a standard draft, but I just don’t love either of them as a top 3 pick. Those guys will be walking into the locker room on a big dollar deal—could be really sub-optimal in certain locker rooms.

But, like I said, I love the guys at 10-20, and then our first two 2nd rounders could be real nice, too.
I would almost be willing to trade back for multiple picks with Boston in this draft.
 
#27
My vote would be for Aleksej Pokusevski. In the limited video that I have seen, I think he has the CHANCE to develop into something very unique. In my opinion when you are drafting in the late lottery to mid first round, you draft for someone that has a very unique skill or a player that could be an anomaly. Pokusevski is a 7 footer with perimeter skills. He can shoot, pass, and handle. I agree with the "Porzingis light" comparison although his perimeter game looks to be more polished than Porzingis at the same age.
 
#28
By the way. I was looking for your draft at the bottom of the thread and missed it. I think Bey is a good choice as Villanova kids are well schooled. I think he has more the size and strength needed at that position.

if Boston would do it however, I would trade my first and a second for their 3 firsts and I would take Williams, Balmaro/Reed and the SDSU guard.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#29
My vote would be for Aleksej Pokusevski. In the limited video that I have seen, I think he has the CHANCE to develop into something very unique. In my opinion when you are drafting in the late lottery to mid first round, you draft for someone that has a very unique skill or a player that could be an anomaly. Pokusevski is a 7 footer with perimeter skills. He can shoot, pass, and handle. I agree with the "Porzingis light" comparison although his perimeter game looks to be more polished than Porzingis at the same age.
Well I think somewhere I mentioned that I almost went with him, and it wouldn't surprise me if Vlade picked him. He is a high risk guy, but he could also turn out to be a star. It's not often that you find 7 footers that can handle the ball the way he can. He didn't get much of a chance with Olympiacos. But really shined on the Serbian under 18 national team. It would interesting to have a seven foot SF. I guess the main question, at least right now is what position can he guard.

He'd be a good help defender in the post, but would struggle in face ups with most centers that would out weigh him by 40 pounds or more. But you know, similar questions were asked about a lot of players that are in the HOF. If your Vlade, and you pick him, and he turns into something resembling Porzingis, you look like a genius. But if he ends up being the next Dragan Bender, your looking for a job.
 
#30
At the moment, assuming we don't move up in the lottery, I'd be happy with any of the following guys:

Tyrese Haliburton
Deni Avdija
Killian Hayes
Tyrese Maxey
RJ Hampton
Aaron Nesmith

Those are my top guys at our spot, and there's a good chance more than one will be available. I realise it's almost all guards, but I'm interested in who I think will make the best NBA players, not in drafting for need.

Out of the bigs/wings that I like, it would be:

Daniel Oturu
Isaac Okoru
Aleksej Pokusevski

Admittedly I haven't formed strong opinions on the likes of Carey, Achiuwa, Perry, Stewart etc so my opinion is subject to change.