Artest trade stuff HERE!! (merged)

[frankie]

I think I mentioned before that I spend few years in Chicago, back when the Bulls sucked immensely (Hard to believe that they've had Artest, MIller and Brand there for over a year and still couldn't find their way out of the lottery) Back to my point: there is no question that Artest was a fan favorite on that team. There was nothing he couldn't do on the court. I don't have to repeat what everyone already mentioned: basketballwise, Peja-for Artest trade is a no-brainer. As good a shooter as Peja is, Artest is by far more complete basketball player.

Artest issues are to me water under the bridge. I truly believe that he learned something from the brawl and that he matured as a person. To me, the fact that he has on-the brim personality is really what I like about him. More importantly, that's exactly what makes him available to us.

Some other issues I would like to discuss:
1. Our biggest problem at this moment is our defense, and in particular, our frontcourt defense. As someone already mentioned, our lane is a freeway with 'Come, Have a Career Night' billboards on the sides. Artest is not going to stop that problem, as good of a defender as he is.

2. Our offense is, as we can all witness, not the easiest offense to learn. Bringing Artest in, and taking Peja out at this moment means at least another 10-15 games of adjustment for everyone. Can we really afford that right now, when players are already tuning out RA?

3. Didn't Artest mention just a few months ago that he intends to end his basketball career in couple of years? If that happens, we would end up giving up a good shooter for nothing.

As a side note, I believe that Peja would trive in the Carlile's structure system. After all, we are talking about the guy who won an MVP in the Greek league without ever needing to learn how to create his own shot. He is exactly the kind of personality Carlile wants: ultimately coachable because outside the system, he's got nothing. 99% of people on this board and elsewhere don't like Peja for this reason. (That's because they expect something else from him: something that he never had. As he himself mentioned in the interview in the beginning of the season, you can't all of a sudden change the way you played all your life. I like Peja for who he is: nice guy, great shooter and most importantly, great teammate).

If GP called me and asked me for opinion on this trade, I would give him thumbs up without much hesitation. I believe that in the end, even with all the uncertainties mentioned, there is fair chance that everyone would be better off: Kings, Pacers, Peja, Artest.

 

[Andriod_KiNg]

Its just too damn interesting a scenario not to suggest things:

Peja Stojakovic $7.6mil ending
Kenny Thomas $6.1mil
Kevin Martin $0.9mil
-------------$14.6mil

Ron Artest $6.5mil
Scot Pollard $6.3mil ending
Fred Jones $2.3mil
-----------$15.1mil

We get size and energy off the bench, along with an ending contract in a player familiar with teh system and popular amongst fans, and a potential Bobby replacement

Indiana cashes Pollard in for a better player and maybe Al Harrington replacement in KT, and gets a young skinny OG from the area with true OG height (given that they are waist deep in PGs now and Jones has to play OG for them) to try to make them forget Reggie (obviously not with QUITE the same shot ).

One of the better ideas i have heard in a while, and i think Indy will actually accept this idea... now we sit and wait

 

[foretaz]

Its just too damn interesting a scenario not to suggest things:

Peja Stojakovic $7.6mil ending
Kenny Thomas $6.1mil
Kevin Martin $0.9mil
-------------$14.6mil

Ron Artest $6.5mil
Scot Pollard $6.3mil ending
Fred Jones $2.3mil
-----------$15.1mil

We get size and energy off the bench, along with an ending contract in a player familiar with teh system and popular amongst fans, and a potential Bobby replacement

Indiana cashes Pollard in for a better player and maybe Al Harrington replacement in KT, and gets a young skinny OG from the area with true OG height (given that they are waist deep in PGs now and Jones has to play OG for them) to try to make them forget Reggie (obviously not with QUITE the same shot ).

lol...nice try...

we got a replacement for al....and u know it...his name is granger ...and we sure as hell dont want that albatross of a contract of kt's...we would come closer to probably wanting corliss over thomas...

freddie is a really good defender, and some of our guards arent, so he gets alot of playing time....hes shorter than normal but has an incredible wingspan and hops, so he plays a lot bigger....he actually plays the 3 for us fairly regularly...

i might be wrong, but i just dont think peja is nearly as attractive to the pacers anymore-not at the expense of artest...ive said before i think they would be interested in peja for jackson but not artest...peja doesnt need touches-hes primarily a spot up shooter who gets his shots off others...jack needs the ball more...and thats the problem we have right now...JO needs the ball...artest needs the ball...jack needs the ball...tins needs the ball....

and theres only one ball...

hence why we have ron questioning his worth to the team and saying the team might be bettter off without him...

 

[swisshh]

Am I the only one who thinks the craziest part of the whole Artest thing is that he wants to go to New York? What the? The Knicks are horrible and Starbury isn't exactly know for getting his teammates shots.

If he had just said "I want to be traded" then I'd be more interested. But he said "I want to be traded to bottom dwelling cap loaded lottery bound New York."

I don't know, in my world, that's crazier than the TRU WARIER haircut.

 

[Gargamel]

I read that, its just we dont know how he will adjust here, what if he has a monster season and loves the Arco fans, then i think he will have a choice to make.

There's no way he'd stay in Sacramento for the rest of his career.

 

[foretaz]

Am I the only one who thinks the craziest part of the whole Artest thing is that he wants to go to New York? What the? The Knicks are horrible and Starbury isn't exactly know for getting his teammates shots.

If he had just said "I want to be traded" then I'd be more interested. But he said "I want to be traded to bottom dwelling cap loaded lottery bound New York."

I don't know, in my world, that's crazier than the TRU WARIER haircut.

it has nothing to do with the state of the team...it has everything to do with isiah thomas and new york is home...

 

[Coach]

Yes. Artest grew up there and also attended St. John's.

 

[DeAtHrOw]

After we get Artest, please please please trade for Danny Fortson

We can be Sacramento Thugs

 

[thesanityannex]

There is the potential for serious bodily injury to an innocent bystander.

Why so pessimistic? Anyone watching the game could get hurt by a player diving for a ball. A banner could fall off the roof of arco and crush a kid. Someone could slip on some peanuts and tumble down the stairs. A finger could be pinched in the folding seats. A cheerleader's high kick could break a nose. Worse case scenario, Artest just quits playing basketball, don't think that would ruin a franchise.

 

[piksi]

After we get Artest, please please please trade for Danny Fortson



We can be Sacramento Thugs

Artest
Fortson
Massenburg
Spreewell
Staudamire (Damon)

Man - we would be in the news all the time

 

[BMiller52]

ron artest is my favorite basketball player...and im not a hip hop guy...im 40 years old and white...

he brings it every nite, every moment hes on the floor....there are very few that do that-let alone with his talent....

as far as im concerned he belongs in a category of kg and tim duncan when it comes to all around game....he can literally take over a game at both ends...his offense doesnt get talked about because of his defensive prowess, but its almost as good....hes developed a fantastic shot from anywhere on the floor and noone and i do mean noone can guard him one on one....the closest is ak47 because of his length but ron just powers right thru him....

ron is ron though....hes not crazy...well i guess it might depend on ur definition...i like vf so ive laid off all the shots shes taken at him, but shes a bit off on the depiction....ron is a great guy...the ultimate family guy...but he does have issues, make no mistake...

one of the biggest things is u cant pay attention to what ron says...first of all hes one of the very worst uve ever met at verbalizing what he means....and doesnt realize the impact or the consequences of the things he says....

but in this particular case, as other cases, its tough to ignore what hes saying....and thats what u get with ron....ron is far too open sometimes and that combined with his inability to properly verbalize gets him into some big problems....like now....

ron wont go into the stands again....rest assured....ron doesnt complain to refs...but ron is competitive....and ron gets his attention fix and self worth fix thru basketball....

and fact of the matter is, carlisle is one of the most difficult coaches to play for in the league...ron isnt the only one whos felt this way...many pistons players said the same thing....and many pacer players have said it as well....he micromanages and simply holds the reigns so tight, that it drives guys like ron, tinsley, jackson, and others crazy...he just ends up wearing on them so much...like ron said he likes rick, he just feels he cant play for him anymore....and i promise u hes not the only one that feels that way....and truth be said, carlisle is probably not the right coach for this team....this team has far too much talent and depth to fit ricks coaching style...

rick would be perfect for the kings right now....pretty good starters with a lacking bench...rick plays a structured game that limits possessions ...which is great for teams like sac and detroit where all their talent is in the starting lineup...

i will always root for ron....and unless he gets traded to the pistons, ill probably root for his team as well, though ill always eat and breath pacers...have for nearly 40 years...i would prefer he get traded to the west....for obvious reasons...but most importantly i hope he gets traded to the right situation-which there are no guarantees....its gonna take the right situation or it will go south on that team as well...and i want him to go to a team that is able to assist the pacers in the potential trade...

im still not sure about all of this, as we dont have nearly all the facts...and like i said with ron, the first take on a situation from only one side is usually gonna be very distorted...

ron got booed the other nite for missing free throws....it was as much about how the team had been playing as anything...then the peja rumor hit....and jermaine spoke out regarding retooling...then the pacers won without him and jackson had a great game and had a big writeup in the paper about jackson....

my guess is when ron took all this in and a reporter with an agenda-which is the case-asked the right questions it came out like it did...

the only real damaging things said were about not wanting to play for carlisle...he didnt say he wanted a trade...he said it might be a good thing for the team...i really think hes feelings were hurt and he was responding from that frame of reference....thing is he didnt say anything with regard to carlisle that many others on the team probably dont feel the same about...

should be interesting the next few days to see how this all plays out...and to find out the whole story...

Oh, I see.

Well it's not like ron said he dislikes the pacers organization, he just doesn't like playing for carlisle and doesn't feel like he fits anymore. The personality adelman has would be great for Ron though.

 

[target]

The more i think about it, the more i get back into the idea of peja/artest, despite ron's latest comments. Peja is going to demand a pretty big contract this year, and he does have some suiters. Ron is locked up for 2 more. Unless Peja has a time machine, he probably isn't going to be worth the amount of money he will command on the market this summer. Considering that, it would be pretty hard to not gamble here and pray Ron is not immune to sacto fever, which was the perfect remedy for webb, jwill, the bonz, vernon maxwell, etc. At least with this trade, we wouldn't have to worry about tying on another cement block to the teams financial situation in the summer or worry about peja walking for nothing. With Peja gone and Ron locked up, we'd only have to worry about Bonzi this summer. I suppose in that way, some sense of security can come out of picking up artest.

 

[HndsmCelt]

Am I the only one who thinks the craziest part of the whole Artest thing is that he wants to go to New York? What the? The Knicks are horrible and Starbury isn't exactly know for getting his teammates shots.

If he had just said "I want to be traded" then I'd be more interested. But he said "I want to be traded to bottom dwelling cap loaded lottery bound New York."

I don't know, in my world, that's crazier than the TRU WARIER haircut.

And you for soem reason EXPECT a sane rational decision form Ron Artest? Lets be real here the guy is indeed a fist class nut job, I would not be shocked to hear him decide to leave the NBA to persue a career in Ballet, or Monster Trucks... or to be pulled over for drivne aMonster truck wearing a Tu Tu.

 

[VF21]

Hey foretaz if artest came to sac would you still like for him and root for him? You sound like a pretty smart guy when it comes to basketball and it sounds like you know artest pretty well. Also, who would you want him to be traded to the most if he has to be traded?

VF21: I understand your views, and part of me agrees with you. It's a big risk. But if it worked, and artest isn't as crazy as we're led to believe, it could have a BIG payoff too. A move like that IF it doesn't backfire would probably actually HELP the maloofs get a new arena because it'd show that they care about the team in the W colum. If we did and we are close to contender status again, I'm sure people would try a lot more to keep the kings in northern california. Still a tough decision though I guess. You seem to hate Ron pretty badly, so if he came to the kings would you still love them like you do? Or would you consider it as bad as us getting someone like Ruben Patterson(if we brought that guy on board I'm not sure what I would do, I like the blazers franchise but hate him with a passion).

First, thanks to foretaz for the nice words.

Now, about this post:

I do NOT hate Ron Artest the person. I don't know Ron Artest the person. From what foretaz has said, he's probably a nice enough guy.

I do NOT hate Ron Artest the player. I don't really know Ron Artest the player except for the few games I've seen him play AND all the stuff I've seen on the evening news.What I do really dislike is his penchant for stupidity and I think I've really made it pretty clear that I'm afraid of his "stability." I have also explained that I simply do not think the risk is worth taking. That's just my opinion.

If Geoff Petrie pulled the trigger on a deal to bring Ron Artest to Sacramento, it would be because he DID consider the risk worth taking. And I would respect his decision because he's making REALLY big bucks to do those kinds of things.

As far as my love of the Kings go, it would NOT be affected by Ron Artest coming to the team. Players come and go; it's the name on the front that matters the most to me, not the name on the back.

As far as Ruben Patterson goes, I don't play "what if" to try and prove or disprove a point. Patterson isn't coming to the Kings, so I'm not going to wonder about what I would do if he did. IF it happened, that would be when I'd have to consider it.

 

[BMiller52]

First, thanks to foretaz for the nice words.

Now, about this post:

I do NOT hate Ron Artest the person. I don't know Ron Artest the person. From what foretaz has said, he's probably a nice enough guy.

I do NOT hate Ron Artest the player. I don't really know Ron Artest the player except for the few games I've seen him play AND all the stuff I've seen on the evening news.What I do really dislike is his penchant for stupidity and I think I've really made it pretty clear that I'm afraid of his "stability." I have also explained that I simply do not think the risk is worth taking. That's just my opinion.

If Geoff Petrie pulled the trigger on a deal to bring Ron Artest to Sacramento, it would be because he DID consider the risk worth taking. And I would respect his decision because he's making REALLY big bucks to do those kinds of things.

As far as my love of the Kings go, it would NOT be affected by Ron Artest coming to the team. Players come and go; it's the name on the front that matters the most to me, not the name on the back.

As far as Ruben Patterson goes, I don't play "what if" to try and prove or disprove a point. Patterson isn't coming to the Kings, so I'm not going to wonder about what I would do if he did. IF it happened, that would be when I'd have to consider it.

I see, anyways thanks for taking the time to answer my question. Part of me really wants to have this happen, and another part of me isn't so sure. Also read somewhere that miami likes peja and peja likes miami.

"Not that Peja doesn't have other suitors; the Heat, his first choice (he owns a South Beach condo and fantasizes about finishing his career living off the open looks Shaq would create) surely have made a bid, and that goes for the Bulls, as well. But, as far as I can tell, they can't come up with such a savage." Vecsey/New York Post

"Is there a Peja-Artest offer on the table at this time? "No," I'm informed. Nor is it currently being considered. Have there been conversations along that line? My source could not tell me that." Vecsey/New York Post


- http://www.insidehoops.com/nba_rumors.shtml


and I'm also thanking god that ruben patterson won't be a king.

 

[GreenKing]

I hope the kings dont trade Peja for artest. With such an amazing talent as Latrine Spreewell on the market why not just sign him? LOL. If we could get Artest to play off the bench behind peja then I'd take the trade. But besides giving the pacers a draft pick and martin, KT, scoreless or garcia I wouldn't pull the trigger.

 

[kingsfan916]

How can anyone want to have than guy on the team ?

Selfish, crazy, unstable, imature etc,etc

Atleast he plays defense! Do it Petrie! Do it!!!!!

 

[VF21]

I see, anyways thanks for taking the time to answer my question. Part of me really wants to have this happen, and another part of me isn't so sure. Also read somewhere that miami likes peja and peja likes miami.

I also have mixed feeling. I would love to see what Artest and Bonzi could do together. I am just very leery about the "worst case scenario." As I said, though, I have faith in Petrie. If HE agrees to do a deal like this, he's got a lot more at stake than I do.

As far as those rumors you posted links to? They're from Peter Vescey so I wouldn't put much credence in them. He mentions his "sources"... a lot of us around here are pretty sure that's what he calls the voices in his head that only he can hear.

 

[kingsfan916]

I guess - it means that You don't really like his "music'

Trust me. it sucks!

 

[Kings113]

Cleveland - Indy wouldn't be getting LeBron or Z, and Hughes' contract is huge. No one else is worthy. In the same division.

Miami - Indy wouldn't be getting Wade or Shaq, Walker maybe? I doubt it. Maybe a Posey package. Conference rival as well.

New York - Marbury? Doubt it, becuase of his contract. They aren't trading away Frye. The conference point may not be as strong here, though.

Its just too damn interesting a scenario not to suggest things:

Peja Stojakovic $7.6mil ending
Kenny Thomas $6.1mil
Kevin Martin $0.9mil
-------------$14.6mil

Ron Artest $6.5mil
Scot Pollard $6.3mil ending
Fred Jones $2.3mil
-----------$15.1mil

We get size and energy off the bench, along with an ending contract in a player familiar with teh system and popular amongst fans, and a potential Bobby replacement

Indiana cashes Pollard in for a better player and maybe Al Harrington replacement in KT, and gets a young skinny OG from the area with true OG height (given that they are waist deep in PGs now and Jones has to play OG for them) to try to make them forget Reggie (obviously not with QUITE the same shot ).

Sounds like a deal, Brick.

Artest issues are to me water under the bridge. I truly believe that he learned something from the brawl and that he matured as a person. To me, the fact that he has on-the brim personality is really what I like about him. More importantly, that's exactly what makes him available to us.

Basically how I've felt on that.

3. Didn't Artest mention just a few months ago that he intends to end his basketball career in couple of years? If that happens, we would end up giving up a good shooter for nothing.

That was likely just Artest talking though.

If GP called me and asked me for opinion on this trade, I would give him thumbs up without much hesitation. I believe that in the end, even with all the uncertainties mentioned, there is fair chance that everyone would be better off: Kings, Pacers, Peja, Artest.

I tend to agree.

 

[anarchis]

offensifely peja is better than artest but artest is better in the defensive side, but have you guys noticed that he comparing himself with t-mac and kobe and he wants to be a scorer not a defensive player like what he does in indiana, that's not what kings need right now, everyone in the team can score, we don't need anymore player who can score, besides who knows how long artest gonna take to make himself comfortable and adapt with the team to have the chemistry, it takes time for sure.

 

[piksi]

I see, anyways thanks for taking the time to answer my question. Part of me really wants to have this happen, and another part of me isn't so sure. Also read somewhere that miami likes peja and peja likes miami.

"Not that Peja doesn't have other suitors; the Heat, his first choice (he owns a South Beach condo and fantasizes about finishing his career living off the open looks Shaq would create) surely have made a bid, and that goes for the Bulls, as well. But, as far as I can tell, they can't come up with such a savage." Vecsey/New York Post

"Is there a Peja-Artest offer on the table at this time? "No," I'm informed. Nor is it currently being considered. Have there been conversations along that line? My source could not tell me that." Vecsey/New York Post


- http://www.insidehoops.com/nba_rumors.shtml


and I'm also thanking god that ruben patterson won't be a king.

Please, please tell me that You have got more than P. Vecsey !

Can't be all You have got - can it ?

 

[SLAB]

offensifely peja is better than artest but artest is better in the defensive side, but have you guys noticed that he comparing himself with t-mac and kobe and he wants to be a scorer not a defensive player like what he does in indiana, that's not what kings need right now, everyone in the team can score, we don't need anymore player who can score, besides who knows how long artest gonna take to make himself comfortable and adapt with the team to have the chemistry, it takes time for sure.

Just because he wants to score more, dessn't mean he'll stop playing his D.

The guy wants as much money as he can get, and knonwing he is probably the best defender in the league, he wants to also play more offense in able to get all the money he can...If he continues to play his D, and inflates his offensive game...I predict a max contract in his future.

And not what the Kings need?...He seems like he wants to be the leader of an offense...I'm really not convinced that the reighns should be handed to him, because who wants to trust a team to Artest, but it definatly would give the Kings the leader they so sorely need...I've said it before, but all the Kings need is a star/leader, and they will be much better...Artest may not fit the 'star' level yet, but if he can do what he wants to his offensive game...Who knows.

If we could do Peja/Artest...I'd take the gamble...I think it's definatly worth it.

 

[piksi]

I predict a max contract in his future.

Only [SIZE=-1]Scott Layden would be retarded enough to put the future of a NBA franchize in hands of Ron Artest.

And he is unemployed for a reason
[/SIZE]

 

[SLAB]

Only [SIZE=-1]Scott Layden would be retarded enough to put the future of a NBA franchize in hands of Ron Artest.

And he is unemployed for a reason
[/SIZE]

If he can behave well, even just by his standards, play his usuall D, and up his offense to where he wants it to be...

Someone in the NBA will give him the money.

 

[Kings113]

offensifely peja is better than artest but artest is better in the defensive side, but have you guys noticed that he comparing himself with t-mac and kobe and he wants to be a scorer not a defensive player like what he does in indiana, that's not what kings need right now, everyone in the team can score, we don't need anymore player who can score, besides who knows how long artest gonna take to make himself comfortable and adapt with the team to have the chemistry, it takes time for sure.

Artest hasn't said he wants to be an offensive-player. Artest has become a balanced player. Besides, Kobe's balanced too.

 

[rhuber]

I have to admit... bringing Artest to Sac just doesn't strike me as being that risky of a proposition, and I'm really struggling to see why it would so adversely effect any possibilty of an arena deal. Maybe I'm clueless, but it honestly strikes me as one of the safer deals I've seen on the table lately.

We’re talking truly ridiculous bang for the buck that almost guarantees a higher level of intensity on the floor - that fans, quite frankly, are starving for (that includes me). Seems to me that such a move could be an enormous asset not only to the team, but the to the value of the franchise in Sacramento.

I'm not suggesting there's no risk at all... certainly there is, but I think that risk lies more in his reputation than any real danger of something he might do (again). He has done some incredibly stupid things… granted. He knows it, acknowledges it, and no doubt recognizes the effect it has on him as a marketable athlete. Do I expect him to to impress us with impeccable self-restraint? Of course not. But I personally find it equally unlikely that he's up for any repeat performances of charging fans, or anything of that nature. If he turns out to leave a bad taste, then bad rep or not... he's an extremely movable piece. And even then, I would applaud the organization for at least giving it a shot.

In the end, if we're just weighing risks vs. benefits, it sure seems to me that the potential benefits are phenomenally greater than any real risks I can fathom. I would have to say that I would be pretty disappointed if they didn’t at least take a shot at this. Not because I think Artest is some great fit for the kings (I have a few reservations there), but if they just let a ship like this pass without so much as a signal flare… then I have to wonder what in the world ARE they hoping for – KG to pop out of a birthday cake?

Just my measly 1.5 cents.

 

[piksi]

If he can behave well, even just by his standards.

does this include a season long suspensions because that his a main part of his standards

 

[Bricklayer]

does this include a season long suspensions because that his a main part of his standards

Only happened once. people are too hung up on it. Been in the league 7 years.

I would be far more concerened about other random disruptive behavior than season-eneding stuff.

 

[grandmastapoop]

does this include a season long suspensions because that his a main part of his standards

A guy is allowed to make a mistake in his life. Funny Ben Wallace got basically a free pass when he started it and kept it going. Artest was unfairly villified and the suspension was completely over the top. If he were traded to Sacramento I would welcome him with open arms, as would most fans.