Anthony Randolph?

[Vlade4GM]

We all see what we want to see. I have no dog in this hunt and I'm not related to either of them. I'm just telling you what I've seen. I gave the edge to Randolph, but not by the degree your willing to give.

Also, I believe I stated at the begining of that post that the testing was in no way an indicator of how the player played the game. It was merely a starting reference.

Let me say something about lateral quickness. People confuse speed and quickness all the time. Its like the difference between a racehorse and a quarterhorse. One's fast and one's quick. Lateral quickness is god given. You either have it or you don't. There's also reflex action and the ability to anticipate. So its really a combination of god given physcial ability combined with good reflexes and mental anticipation. If you have all three, your Kobe or Jordan. Bird didn't have the first, but he had the others and was a good defender.

My point is, that you can have all the tools, but if you don't put in the mental work, your still just average. This is where my problem with Randolph arises. He has a reputation of having a bad work ethic. I'll admit that he could be getting a bad rap, but it is something you have to pay attention to.

I understand the difference between speed and quickness, and I stand by my statements. I've watched both of them play and athletically that's what I've determined. Just because you admit to a smaller talent gap doesn't mean you're being more objective than I am. I'm aware of the questionable attitude, but it hasn't been a big problem so far so I don't know why I should assume it is.

 

[NME]

Last night, Randolph got 26 minutes and put up 11 pts, 12 reb, and 3 blocks. Ho-hum.

 

[Kingster]

Has Nellie ever been involved with the Kings in a trade after the Richmond/Owens trade?

 

[LPKingsFan]

Yeah, I would think this is all for moot. The Warriors may not be all-out rebuilding, but they're certainly not winning now, either. I'm not sure we'd have anything that would interest them--at least, anything we're willing to part with.

 

[bajaden]

Just because you admit to a smaller talent gap doesn't mean you're being more objective than I am.

I never said that I was, and I'm not really arguing that either player will eventually be better than the other. You know why? Because I don't know! And, I don't care! I hope that they both become great players, especially Greene, because he happens to be a King at this moment in time.

My point is that I don't think you have to denigrate one player in order to praise another and thats you do when you say one player is head and shoulders above another. I think their both very talented players and I would love to have either or both on the Kings.

 

[Vlade4GM]

I never said that I was, and I'm not really arguing that either player will eventually be better than the other. You know why? Because I don't know! And, I don't care! I hope that they both become great players, especially Greene, because he happens to be a King at this moment in time.

My point is that I don't think you have to denigrate one player in order to praise another and thats you do when you say one player is head and shoulders above another. I think their both very talented players and I would love to have either or both on the Kings.

Well, it sounded like you were implying that with your first point. If not, then I take it back.

Denigrating Greene from what? It's not like I'm calling him a scrub. I haven't taken shots at him, saying Randolph is "head and shoulders" above Greene can say more about how talented I consider Randolph. Greene is a nice prospect, but I consider Randolph's talent, skillset, and upside to be much higher than Greene's. We differ on our opinions of Greene, that doesn't mean I'm denigrating him.

 

[bajaden]

Well, it sounded like you were implying that with your first point. If not, then I take it back.

Denigrating Greene from what? It's not like I'm calling him a scrub. I haven't taken shots at him, saying Randolph is "head and shoulders" above Greene can say more about how talented I consider Randolph. Greene is a nice prospect, but I consider Randolph's talent, skillset, and upside to be much higher than Greene's. We differ on our opinions of Greene, that doesn't mean I'm denigrating him.

I'll let you have the last word, and agree to disagree on the disagreement of the agreement.

 

[TaxMan]

Said it @ Draft day and ill say it again though, IMO id take him over Jason. More Athletic, good ball handler, better shot blocker, and younger with much more room to grow

lol, dude are you sure you don't have the two mixed up because that's just straight up wrong.

What about that statement do you find so clearly wrong? I'm not in love with Randolph's game, but he is clearly the better shot blocker of the two. He is also obviously a younger player. Hard to say if Randolph is more athletic and a better ball handler, but I would guess that's probably the case.

The case to be made for Jason is he may be more fundamentally sound, probably had a better head on his shoulders, and currently has a more typical PF body. However, I don't find it far fetched at all that Randolph has the potential to end up the better of the two. That said, I doubt I would trade Thompson for Randolph straight up right now, but that's probably more because of an emotional tie that is created by being on the Kings.

 

[Vlade4GM]

nvm, I misunderstood you. I was thinking you were saying that about Jason and not AR. My bad.

 

[bajaden]

What about that statement do you find so clearly wrong? I'm not in love with Randolph's game, but he is clearly the better shot blocker of the two. He is also obviously a younger player. Hard to say if Randolph is more athletic and a better ball handler, but I would guess that's probably the case.

Thompson is a better ball handler and passer than Randolph. Thompson is a late bloomer who shot up from 6'4" to 6'11" in a three year period. So what you have is 6'11" player with guard skills. He also was up for defensive player of the year in his conference two years in a row and was one of the leading shot blockers in his conference. So far the shot blocking hasn't reared its head much, but then Hawes didn't block many shots last year

Anyway, this takes nothing away from Randolph, who in my opinion is a SF who, like Greene, can play some PF in the right match-up. Thompson is a true PF who can play a little center in the right match-up. Their both good athlete's and both have excelent foot speed. Thompson is simply bigger and has the frame to carry more weight.

 

[TaxMan]

Their both good athlete's and both have excelent foot speed. Thompson is simply bigger and has the frame to carry more weight.

I can't disagree with that statement.

 

[Kevin_Martin_23]

JT>Randolph

 

[bajaden]

I've been thinking a little more about this deal for Randolph. Right now the Warriors are a team in disaray. I'm not sure who's really in charge right now. But if we could pry Randolph loose from them without giving up any of our young bigs, I would be all for it. Douby plus Houston's 1st round pick would probably work money wise. I Don't know if that would be enough to intice them.

 

[Vlade4GM]

I've been thinking a little more about this deal for Randolph. Right now the Warriors are a team in disaray. I'm not sure who's really in charge right now. But if we could pry Randolph loose from them without giving up any of our young bigs, I would be all for it. Douby plus Houston's 1st round pick would probably work money wise. I Don't know if that would be enough to intice them.

That doesn't do it, even with all their problems Randolph was still their lottery pick, and Douby (while he'd be an interesting player for their system) has been a scrub so far in his career and the 1st is late. Some team would like Randolph enough to offer a better deal than that. I give up Greene in a heartbeat.

 

[bajaden]

That doesn't do it, even with all their problems Randolph was still their lottery pick, and Douby (while he'd be an interesting player for their system) has been a scrub so far in his career and the 1st is late. Some team would like Randolph enough to offer a better deal than that. I give up Greene in a heartbeat.

Not sure what the difference between Greene and Houston's late pick are, since Greene was a late pick. Perhaps I'm greedy but I would like to have them both. I was trying to stay away from a multiplayer deal. Obviously Randolph doesn't make much money, so what you can trade for him straight across, is limited.

Personally, if I were the Warriors, I keep Randolph and Wright and try and unload some of the vets. They're in serious trouble right now, if they don't like the team they have, because they're capped out with no relief in sight. The best move they could make is to get rid of Nellie, who appears to be in a power struggle with Mullins, and looks likely to win.

All I know is that the front office of the Warriors is in total chaos, and the team is headed nowhere but down. Nellie's down on Randolph. Not sure why, and you never know for sure with Nellie. He's mentioned Randolph's work ethic and poor practices. Right now, Randolph may be undervalued, and If so, I say try and snag him. Hey, if its wishful thinking on my part, so be it. But who thought that Pau Gasol could have been had that cheaply last year. Its Christmas. Give me my gift.

 

[Vlade4GM]

I was thinking Greene instead of Douby. But if they would take Douby, sure why not? I just can't imagine some team not liking Randolph enough to offer a better deal than Douby and a late first. I guess you never know though.

 

[Nighthawk1]

That doesn't do it, even with all their problems Randolph was still their lottery pick, and Douby (while he'd be an interesting player for their system) has been a scrub so far in his career and the 1st is late. Some team would like Randolph enough to offer a better deal than that. I give up Greene in a heartbeat.

This is where we disagree, some players do better once they get the chance to start over... Maybe warriors are willing to take a chance on this - but me personally would rather see what Greene developes into then deal him currently... Douby + Houston's late 1st would be fine with me...

 

[bajaden]

I was thinking Greene instead of Douby. But if they would take Douby, sure why not? I just can't imagine some team not liking Randolph enough to offer a better deal than Douby and a late first. I guess you never know though.

Well you could be right. I'm sure there are other teams out there that would take a flyer on him. I know Petrie liked him and had him on his list right behind Thompson. Well, I don't really know. I read thus. I do think were reaching a point where some continuity is going to become important. We're going to have to settle on a core group of players and let them play together. We're not quite there yet, but at some point you have to quit changing one player for another.

 

[Vlade4GM]

This is where we disagree, some players do better once they get the chance to start over... Maybe warriors are willing to take a chance on this - but me personally would rather see what Greene developes into then deal him currently... Douby + Houston's late 1st would be fine with me...

I'm not a big Douby fan, but my point wasn't to dig on him, but rather show he doesn't really have much established value. Even if the Warriors like Douby as a salvage case they're still going to want the best value they can get; Douby doesn't have much. Yeah, I'd rather keep Greene and trade Douby too, but I'm more than willing to see Greene go instead if it means getting Randolph.

 

[Vlade4GM]

Well you could be right. I'm sure there are other teams out there that would take a flyer on him. I know Petrie liked him and had him on his list right behind Thompson. Well, I don't really know. I read thus. I do think were reaching a point where some continuity is going to become important. We're going to have to settle on a core group of players and let them play together. We're not quite there yet, but at some point you have to quit changing one player for another.

Greene has only been on the team for a few months though, and are we really willing to call him heir to the starting SF spot? If not, then I don't think continuity is a big concern here.

 

[Entity]

I think most of the excitment over Greene stems from summer league play and Jerry Reynolds comments on him. Aside from that he looks as comfortable on the court at 20 years old than any rookie I have seen for the Kings in quite some time. Martin, Garcia, Douby, all had the deer in headlights look and Hawes and Thompson both try to hard. With Greene he just looks comfortable.

 

[bajaden]

Greene has only been on the team for a few months though, and are we really willing to call him heir to the starting SF spot? If not, then I don't think continuity is a big concern here.

I believe I said, Were not there yet!!!!! But at some Point!!!!

 

[Smills91]

I think most of the excitment over Greene stems from summer league play and Jerry Reynolds comments on him. Aside from that he looks as comfortable on the court at 20 years old than any rookie I have seen for the Kings in quite some time. Martin, Garcia, Douby, all had the deer in headlights look and Hawes and Thompson both try to hard. With Greene he just looks comfortable.

Yeah I totally agree, and that's why I think he's a keeper and will be a semi-star level player.

 

[Kingster]

Greene has only been on the team for a few months though, and are we really willing to call him heir to the starting SF spot? If not, then I don't think continuity is a big concern here.

I agree. I wouldn't mind making a trade for Julian Wright and have Greene and him fight it out. Let the best man win. I think it's very important to let these young guys know that they are not the anointed ones quite yet.

 

[bajaden]

I agree. I wouldn't mind making a trade for Julian Wright and have Greene and him fight it out. Let the best man win. I think it's very important to let these young guys know that they are not the anointed ones quite yet.

I agree with you to a certain extent. For instance, I agree with the senario of letting Julian Wright and Greene, or lets say, Greene and Randolph fight it out. What I don't want to see is greene fighting it out with a 33 yr old vet who isn't going to be here in a year or two anyway.

First off, it gives an unfair advantage to the vet. He's has the experience and he usually has the support of the coach, who usually figures he has a better chance to win with the vet.

Thats why I favor two young guys fighting it out. Its a win win for the team. Either way you end up with a young starter, and hopefully a young backup on the bench.