[Game] 30/82: Kings vs. Pacers 22 DEC 2024, 3pm PT/6pm ET

[Srzly]

Malik just doesn’t look right right now either. He’s not moving well laterally, just sorta walking the ball up the court, and doesn’t seem to have consistent push on his shots. Some guys just aren’t meant to play starters minutes and that’s okay.

Yeah he has 14 TOs in the last 3 games and 6/27 from 3.

Then again, the whole team seems off since the Denver game. Something weird going on. Maybe a road trip is needed to get away from home and reset.

I’m not panicking but concerned about the coaching a little bit. The defensive philosophy, everyone seemingly overthinking, offense looks stagnant, and not playing Keon.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Showcasing players is pure fantasy

Well he's either doing that or he has just checked out and is trying to get fired.

At least the fantasy is minor grounds for optimism.

 

[megapoxy]

We sucked in the preseason... "it's too early", we sucked in the start of the season despite having a 0.500 record most of the time "it's too early...wait for the first 20 matches of the season", we sucked reaching 20 games "the schedule, injuries, no rest, had no actual training", we had many days of rest all players come back healthy and hey we are even worse, well now... "it's too late".
Merry Christmas everyone, hope Santa brings us something nice or take something from us that is not nice at all!

 

[Caccia]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1871011114626269185

If anything, Malik has been pressing too hard. But using his voice more in the locker room and on the court, that he can do.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

I feel Monte has given orders to showcase players for trades (dating back to around this time last year) but everyone is to blame.

Have you changed your mind? I thought you said recently that the only player you believe was "showcased" was Haliburton

 

[Caccia]

Mike Brown is NOT the problem. He is cornered with an incomplete deck of cards. He has no more buttons to push on his own. Any coach would eventually fall into the same trap.

Monte has his work cut out for him to save all their jobs. Hopefully he can lift the bat off his shoulder.

I disagree. Mike Brown has done a poor job this season in putting together a squad that emphasizes the players' strengths and minimizes their weaknesses. He has done a poor job in managing rotations and adjusting his strategies both during and between games. If you have not read this recent analysis, it is worth a look:

https://kingsherald.com/articles/sacramento-kings-record-stats-head-coach-rumors/

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Have you changed your mind? I thought you said recently that the only player you believe was "showcased" was Haliburton

I have said they were showcasing Huerter for a long time?

 

[pdxKingsFan]

I disagree. Mike Brown has done a poor job this season in putting together a squad that emphasizes the players' strengths and minimizes their weaknesses. He has done a poor job in managing rotations and adjusting his strategies both during and between games. If you have not read this recent analysis, it is worth a look:

https://kingsherald.com/articles/sacramento-kings-record-stats-head-coach-rumors/

The complete lack of a serviceable "PF" for the last 2 seasons isn't really Brown's fault it's Monte's.

 

[captain bill]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1871011114626269185

Our best players should take notice this is what a leader says not that klutch script he was given

I’m happy Fox is making it known publicly that he’s not happy with this situation. It’s very clear that he wants to win here (why else name his kid after the team) but things won’t change if there’s no pressure for it

I’m also with Malik in not liking the booing. The energy going totally out of the building and the 4th being dead quiet is all the message that needs to be sent. Idk what fans booing think they accomplish

 

[kingsboi]

Can’t imagine what Brown is thinking of right now. Team is slumping bad. I wouldn’t say it’s for lack of effort either. But now you really risk losing the team. Let’s see if Brown could turn this around and actually keep them engaged and motivated these next few weeks. I imagine some major change will happen if we lose to the Pistons

Kings have one more win than the Pistons, who beat the Suns last night.

 

[iowamcnabb]

I know the game was crap but how did Lyles look at the 5?

 

[HndsmCelt]

I know the game was crap but how did Lyles look at the 5?

undersized. He had little rust on his shot but played with nice flow and energy. I’ve complaints about him playing at the five. They have nothing to do with him. It’s just a size thing.

 

[MizzouKing]

I get everyone wants to focus on their one individual issue, but 30+ MPG of Keon isn't saving this team. A rotation player trade (Jval/Cam Johnson/DFS) isn't saving this team. I think it's just done; team has quit on Brown and possibly on each other. What made the Beam team so fun is we legitimately looked like a TEAM out there. Guys were playing for each other, we were passing the rock around like the Golden era Kings, guys weren't sitting around ball watching. We did not quit on a single game that year, even if we were down big. Virtually every time we'd storm back and at least make it a game. That's the sort of squad you loved to spend 3 hours a night watching.

That team is just gone. We saw signs last year of that joy the 22-23 team had start to dissipate and there's just none of that anymore. We don't play with fire, we aren't flying up and down the court, running teams out of the gym. We don't pass the ball nearly as much. Everything that led to our breakout is gone.

So what happened? What changed from then to now? When did the fam Malik took a pay cut for turn into this listless mess? DDR is a solid vet and good human, not a toxic influence. Fox is Fox, Domas is Domas... is Jordie Fernandez the key variable here?

 

[Kingster]

It's not the coach, a lack of effort, or the rotations. Frankly, I feel sorry for this team right now. They have been playing hard. They had high hopes for the season and are coming to grips with the shortcomings of this team. They look to be a downcast bunch that doesn't really believe in themselves. It's tough when you are outsized on a nightly basis and when the parts don't mesh. A great effort and some great shooting can sometimes overcome the disadvantages, but it's bound to knock the stuffing out of you over the long haul.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

It's not the coach, a lack of effort, or the rotations. Frankly, I feel sorry for this team right now. They have been playing hard. They had high hopes for the season and are coming to grips with the shortcomings of this team. They look to be a downcast bunch that doesn't really believe in themselves. It's tough when you are outsized on a nightly basis and when the parts don't mesh. A great effort and some great shooting can sometimes overcome the disadvantages, but it's bound to knock the stuffing out of you over the long haul.

The story of the season is how many good shooting games have the Kings had....vs how many have the opponents had

 

[twslam07]

The Pacers/Kings games are really the only games I skip out on each year since I live in Indiana. They’re blacked out on my league pass for 3 days and I don’t have access to the local channel to watch it live.

Looks like my geography helped save me from banging my head against a wall…

 

[Kingster]

The story of the season is how many good shooting games have the Kings had....vs how many have the opponents had

That's the superficial story. The deeper story involves the reasons behind the bad shooting. It's critical that McNair figures it out; otherwise he's learned nothing and he could easily repeat the mistakes of the past. If, for example, the bad shooting is purely by chance, then there is no reason to change anything on this team; wait for a while and it will rectify itself like a long winter finally turning to spring. If, on the other hand, it is due to a poorly structured roster, then the structure has to be changed for the shooting and the winning percentages to change.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

That's the superficial story. The deeper story involves the reasons behind the bad shooting. It's critical that McNair figures it out; otherwise he's learned nothing and he could easily repeat the mistakes of the past. If, for example, the bad shooting is purely by chance, then there is no reason to change anything on this team; wait for a while and it will rectify itself like a long winter finally turning to spring. If, on the other hand, it is due to a poorly structured roster, then the structure has to be changed for the shooting and the winning percentages to change.

Is DeRozan to blame for everyone's bad shooting?

 

[The_Jamal]

So what happened? What changed from then to now? When did the fam Malik took a pay cut for turn into this listless mess? DDR is a solid vet and good human, not a toxic influence. Fox is Fox, Domas is Domas... is Jordie Fernandez the key variable here?

Again, the point of that post is we have no idea. We automatically look for one "bad guy" or one quick fix, but I think it's just multiple things all stacking up and going wrong at the same time.

-Brown diverting from his 10-man deep rotations to basically playing 7 guys a night.
-Brown not trusting Keon
-Keegan and Huerter being among the best shooters in basketball 2 years ago to probably being among the worst this season among guys with their volume
-Fox going on a podcast talking about his contract situation.
-Klutch leaking reports they're meeting with Monte/ownership to discuss Fox. Stuff like that can't be great for the locker room
-We started the year off great and then Monk/Domas/DDR all went down at the same time to injury and we haven't been the same since.
-DDR starting the year off great and hasn't looked the same since coming back from injury
-Blowing that DEN game after roaring back from being down huge early.
-We're losing the 3pt War, badly.
-24th in 3PA, 24th in 3pt%
-24th in 3PA allowed, 28th in 3pt% allowed

 

[Kingster]

Is DeRozan to blame for everyone's bad shooting?

He's part of the puzzle. But we all know it's just not "bad shooting." It's the lack of athleticism and length at the wings that is contributing toward the bad defense.

DDR wasn't a bad acquisition in and of itself. He was bad because the primary need of this team was length, athleticism and 3 point shooting, which is exactly what DDR is not. Moreover, DDR is high usage 2-point player. Is that what this team needed given they already had a high usage 2-point player in Fox? Whose game exactly was he supposed to enhance? By shrinking the floor and not being the fastest player on the floor, he shrinks Fox's game. By not being a catch, shoot, cut guy he diminishes Sabonis's game. On defense he doesn't help anyone's game. It was a bad acquisition because it was a bad fit, like pickles and ice cream, and because it didn't address the primary needs of the team.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

He's part of the puzzle. But we all know it's just not "bad shooting." It's the lack of athleticism and length at the wings that is contributing toward the bad defense.

DDR wasn't a bad acquisition in and of itself. He was bad because the primary need of this team was length, athleticism and 3 point shooting, which is exactly what DDR is not. Moreover, DDR is high usage 2-point player. Is that what this team needed given they already had a high usage 2-point player in Fox? Whose game exactly was he supposed to enhance? By shrinking the floor and not being the fastest player on the floor, he shrinks Fox's game. By not being a catch, shoot, cut guy he diminishes Sabonis's game. On defense he doesn't help anyone's game. It was a bad acquisition because it was a bad fit, like pickles and ice cream, and because it didn't address the primary needs of the team.

They had volume 3pt shooters in Murray and Huerter. They're not shooting at an even mediocre level. They have a 3 and D guard in Keon Ellis who has shot well....and they won't play him regularly or enough.

DeRozan isn't the main reason for the bad record. He's not the move that could have made them a contender, but he's not to blame him for the other stuff going on. If by some chance he is the reason that these guys have fallen apart, then this collection of players wasn't good enough to make another playoff series in the first place

 

[Kingster]

They had volume 3pt shooters in Murray and Huerter. They're not shooting at an even mediocre level. They have a 3 and D guard in Keon Ellis who has shot well....and they won't play him regularly or enough.

DeRozan isn't the main reason for the bad record. He's not the move that could have made them a contender, but he's not to blame him for the other stuff going on. If by some chance he is the reason that these guys have fallen apart, then this collection of players wasn't good enough to make another playoff series in the first place

If DeRozan is going to minimize Fox and Sabonis, how could he not minimize Murray and Heurter? Do you think if the two best players on the team are non-complementary with DDR that it would help Murray and Huerter in the process? I don't think so.

DeRozan minimizes Murray and Heurter in the offense. He subtracts the motion of the overall offense by ball stopping, which subtracts from Murray and Heurter. Instead of becoming moving targets, they become guys who watch DDR "go to work." And by minimizing Sabonis's game with his high usage 2-point game, he also minimizes the looks that go to Murray and Heurter from Sabonis. By shrinking the floor with Fox he leads to less assists from Fox to Murray and Heurter. Think about the *ideal* fit for this team from a conceputal point of view: 3 point shooter, long, athletic, moves without the ball, average usage. Is DDR any one of those? If the Kings could get a merry Christmas wish and steal a guy like Aaron Gordon and use DDR in a bench role, we wouldn't be having this discussion. And voila, miraculously, Murray and Heurter would find their 3-point shooting touch and on our merry way we would go.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

If DeRozan is going to minimize Fox and Sabonis, how could he not minimize Murray and Heurter? Do you think if the two best players on the team are non-complementary with DDR that it would help Murray and Huerter in the process? I don't think so.

DeRozan minimizes Murray and Heurter in the offense. He subtracts the motion of the overall offense by ball stopping, which subtracts from Murray and Heurter. Instead of becoming moving targets, they become guys who watch DDR "go to work." And by minimizing Sabonis's game with his high usage 2-point game, he also minimizes the looks that go to Murray and Heurter from Sabonis. By shrinking the floor with Fox he leads to less assists from Fox to Murray and Heurter. Think about the *ideal* fit for this team from a conceputal point of view: 3 point shooter, long, athletic, moves without the ball, average usage. Is DDR any one of those? If the Kings could get a merry Christmas wish and steal a guy like Aaron Gordon and use DDR in a bench role, we wouldn't be having this discussion. And voila, miraculously, Murray and Heurter would find their 3-point shooting touch and on our merry way we would go.

I agree that someone else at the 4 is a better fit, but don't agree that the shots that Murray and Huerter are getting and missing, is because of DeRozan. They've had lots of open shots consistently, so it's not a lack of good looks.

We're all looking for reasons or excuses, but to say that previously world class shooters, can't shoot now, because they play with DeRozan is not a good excuse

 

[joemama]

WE SUCK
Possession after possession . . .

 

[Caccia]

Minnesota, San Antonio, the LA Lakers, and the Phoenix Suns all lost on Monday. The Kings are still only two games out of the play-in. The fierce competition in the Western Conference means that only nine teams have a winning record as of this writing.

 

[TaxMan]

Minnesota, San Antonio, the LA Lakers, and the Phoenix Suns all lost on Monday. The Kings are still only two games out of the play-in. The fierce competition in the Western Conference means that only nine teams have a winning record as of this writing.

It’s nothing a 5 game win streak can’t solve…problem is I don’t think we can win 5 straight. It is really really tough to be as bad as the kings are at home and expect to make the play in, let alone the playoffs.

 

[Kingster]

I agree that someone else at the 4 is a better fit, but don't agree that the shots that Murray and Huerter are getting and missing, is because of DeRozan. They've had lots of open shots consistently, so it's not a lack of good looks.

We're all looking for reasons or excuses, but to say that previously world class shooters, can't shoot now, because they play with DeRozan is not a good excuse

So if the structure of the team isn't contributing to the bad shooting, what is the reason? And given the reason that you come up with, what is the answer going forward? If it's really just a bad shooting slump, players come out of slumps eventually. So under that reasoning, what do you do? Stand pat and wait for the slump to be over? What exactly is the solution that is derived from your diagnosis?

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

So if the structure of the team isn't contributing to the bad shooting, what is the reason? And give the reason that you come up with, what is the answer going forward? If it's really just a bad shooting slump, players come out of slumps eventually. So under that reasoning, what do you do? Stand pat and wait for the slump to be over? What exactly is the solution that is derived from your diagnosis?

I expect them to start shooting better at some point. Players go through slumps, even in an ideal fitting lineup. I don't see this current roster as a real threat for the playoffs, even with better shooting.

This means they need another piece in trade and I would also readjust the lineups. Keon as a starter. Monk back to his best 6th man role. They only gave Keon 2 games as a starter, because they panicked too soon.