Don't you realize that you are interpreting what Willie said in his interview? It's not like he said "I'm a lazy dead-ass. But now I'm not anymore." Another interpretation is that he has (finally) found his extra gear. He was driving around using 4 gears, but now he's found he's got an overdrive gear and he's going to use it. That's not my interpretation, by the way. I'm a bit more skeptical, myself. But my point is, you are still pretending you know Willie through and through. You don't, and none of us do. He'd be well served to stop talking and show us what he can do on the court.
Future of Willie Cauley-Stein?
- Thread starter sergmatt
- Start date
Agreed, he has to and its a win - win situation for us.
We are not playing for picks and we want to get the best out of him. Unfortunately its only when money is on the line that we have seen his this engaged. In any case it is more or less a win win.
If he doesn't perform then hey we lose out on years of investing in his development but would be able to retain him at a cheaper price if we chose to do so.
If he lights it up then we can ride his play to a strong record and see where free agency takes us both
We are not playing for picks and we want to get the best out of him. Unfortunately its only when money is on the line that we have seen his this engaged. In any case it is more or less a win win.
If he doesn't perform then hey we lose out on years of investing in his development but would be able to retain him at a cheaper price if we chose to do so.
If he lights it up then we can ride his play to a strong record and see where free agency takes us both
I think Willie was pretty clear with his interview. It wasn't like reading a biblical passage that can have multiple meanings.
He said he went into the season looking to be the leader but said it would look bad if he was trying to lead guys that were working harder for him. Then it took him until the halfway point of the season to start working as hard as the other guys. To me, that's lazy. Can you interpret that in a more positive way? Maybe you could say that he thought his skills were good enough to not need to work that hard and by the halfway point he realized he needed to step it up a notch but that still tells me that he did not work hard enough in the off season up through the halfway point of the season. I see that as being lazy.
I just know that in the real world, your boss would laugh at you if he got on your ass about something and you told him you haven't put in the same effort as your coworkers because you haven't found your 5th gear yet. I don't see any other interpretation here that doesn't point to laziness and overconfidence in himself. He basically admitted it in that interview. If I said he was doing all the work because he wanted a fat contract, that could be construed as an interpretation because I would be guessing that's the reason even though he never admitted that in the interview but he absolutely admitted to not listening to his coaches and not working as hard as his teammates.
He said he went into the season looking to be the leader but said it would look bad if he was trying to lead guys that were working harder for him. Then it took him until the halfway point of the season to start working as hard as the other guys. To me, that's lazy. Can you interpret that in a more positive way? Maybe you could say that he thought his skills were good enough to not need to work that hard and by the halfway point he realized he needed to step it up a notch but that still tells me that he did not work hard enough in the off season up through the halfway point of the season. I see that as being lazy.
I just know that in the real world, your boss would laugh at you if he got on your ass about something and you told him you haven't put in the same effort as your coworkers because you haven't found your 5th gear yet. I don't see any other interpretation here that doesn't point to laziness and overconfidence in himself. He basically admitted it in that interview. If I said he was doing all the work because he wanted a fat contract, that could be construed as an interpretation because I would be guessing that's the reason even though he never admitted that in the interview but he absolutely admitted to not listening to his coaches and not working as hard as his teammates.
For those of you who don't like him increasing his efforts because of a contract year, I ask why? Have you never gotten a raise at work and felt compelled to prove that you deserved it, or maybe work even harder so that you can get another raise?
Don't be so naive about things. Most players play for money and he's due to get a lot more soon; it's an exciting time for him. I know I get excited when I get more money from my job haha some of you must be robots or something.
Don't be so naive about things. Most players play for money and he's due to get a lot more soon; it's an exciting time for him. I know I get excited when I get more money from my job haha some of you must be robots or something.
I can only say what I’ve been saying for three years now, IMO it’s beyond conscious control (motor).
So after being told to rim protect/rebound/defend the paint a flick is going off in his head that he will have it down pat now (irrespective of contract and controversial Baggz tweets)?!
It would be nice to see what WCS would be if he actually displayed some of the traits he did in college defensively. It’s a good thing now we have young bigs, Skal and Gabriel included, that I’m looking forward to that I can just let WCS do his thing without getting upset
So after being told to rim protect/rebound/defend the paint a flick is going off in his head that he will have it down pat now (irrespective of contract and controversial Baggz tweets)?!
It would be nice to see what WCS would be if he actually displayed some of the traits he did in college defensively. It’s a good thing now we have young bigs, Skal and Gabriel included, that I’m looking forward to that I can just let WCS do his thing without getting upset
Last edited:
What? There's a clear timeline difference here. One is working hard to prove you deserved the raise, or even consistently working hard for a raise. The other is working hard (when you haven't done so beforehand) just to get the raise, at which point you happily go back to your old ways. The latter is not that uncommon in the NBA.
Nobody is thinking he shouldn't work hard because he's in a contract year. They are thinking don't be fooled by him working hard in a contract year. Don't be so naive about things.
Nobody is thinking he shouldn't work hard because he's in a contract year. They are thinking don't be fooled by him working hard in a contract year. Don't be so naive about things.
How do you know how much work Willie has or has not put in? How do you know what will happen once he does get a pay increase? Seems to me you can't see past your nose and believe that only your opinion is the correct one.
Willie has improved his stats year after year since being in the league, and that's with coaching changes and all sorts of different offensive and defensive philosophies. Not everyone can be Anthony Davis. I'm not being naive about anything, I'm in a complete wait and see approach with him while being cautiously optimistic. I try not to let others cloud my judgment and I certainly don't try to predict the future...
Willie has improved his stats year after year since being in the league, and that's with coaching changes and all sorts of different offensive and defensive philosophies. Not everyone can be Anthony Davis. I'm not being naive about anything, I'm in a complete wait and see approach with him while being cautiously optimistic. I try not to let others cloud my judgment and I certainly don't try to predict the future...
That's the whole point, and nobody is claiming to know (or at least I'm not). What I'm saying is I'm not going to suddenly turn into a believer just because he starts working hard in a contract year. How do I know how much work he's put in? Well... Seeing how he plays, seeing his effort level game in and game out. I mean, reputation exists for a reason. When's the last time you heard someone saying Buddy Hield needs to play with more effort? And to top it all off, Willie pretty much just admitted to not doing what he was told to do.
Do I know for certain what would happen once he gets a raise? Of course not. But every single one of us here makes educated guesses, and my educated guess based on his body of work is that he's not the sort that will continue working hard. Could a flip be switched and suddenly he matures? Of course it could, but again, it's not the most likely outcome I foresee.
Do I know for certain what would happen once he gets a raise? Of course not. But every single one of us here makes educated guesses, and my educated guess based on his body of work is that he's not the sort that will continue working hard. Could a flip be switched and suddenly he matures? Of course it could, but again, it's not the most likely outcome I foresee.
Does any of that matter Mac if he comes in this year and becomes what all of us would like him to be. I know some people want to call him lazy because of what he said, but it's also possible that he actually thought he was working hard, or hard enough, and then had a come to Jesus moment. People want to say it's because it's a contract year, and I'm sure that enters into it to some extent, but in my opinion, a lazy person is a lazy person, and in most cases, contract years don't make much of a difference. Ask Donte Greene.
There are people on this forum that would love to have Clint Capela on the team instead of Willie, but last season, Capela's best, was his contract year and I don't see anyone holding that against him. And his 3rd year stats were very similar to Willie's 3rd year stats. That doesn't mean that Willie will take a quantum leap next season, but it might. If he doesn't, then demote him, or trade him. I just want to be as sure as possible what he is before we make any decisions on him. The last thing I want to see is us trading Willie, and him suddenly becoming a star.
I'm not trying to make excuses for him. I like him, and he seems to be a very nice, if not a bit quirky person. But all I care about are results, and I've said from the get go that on average it takes 3 to 4 years for a big man to develop into whatever he's going to be. If he's not there at the end of 4 years, then historically, he'll never be. There are exceptions in both directions of course. I hope and pray for the Kings sake that the light bulb has finally gone on in Willie's head because he has the tools to be a difference maker. Or not!
There are people on this forum that would love to have Clint Capela on the team instead of Willie, but last season, Capela's best, was his contract year and I don't see anyone holding that against him. And his 3rd year stats were very similar to Willie's 3rd year stats. That doesn't mean that Willie will take a quantum leap next season, but it might. If he doesn't, then demote him, or trade him. I just want to be as sure as possible what he is before we make any decisions on him. The last thing I want to see is us trading Willie, and him suddenly becoming a star.
I'm not trying to make excuses for him. I like him, and he seems to be a very nice, if not a bit quirky person. But all I care about are results, and I've said from the get go that on average it takes 3 to 4 years for a big man to develop into whatever he's going to be. If he's not there at the end of 4 years, then historically, he'll never be. There are exceptions in both directions of course. I hope and pray for the Kings sake that the light bulb has finally gone on in Willie's head because he has the tools to be a difference maker. Or not!
so if a lazy person is a lazy person does that make Willie naive to the fact that he had a humbling experience and didn't realize it until he looked back upon his season? I don't want to call the guy lazy but something is missing when I watch him play, whether its the effort or the heart. I don't know if a contract year will all of a sudden change him as a player but one thing he won't become is a star, in my opinion.
It somewhat does matter if you asked me. Because then you do need to figure out which WCS you're going to be offering a contract to: an invigorated, talented one, or one who's comfortable living in his own lalaland and doesn't listen to what coaches tell him to do. If it's the former, very good situation for us. If it's the latter, offering him a big sum could be a very big mistake. I don't think you and I are too different in our thinking over this, and I doubt you would say the previous 3 years don't matter if he puts it together in year 4. The difference between us is that you view his first 3 years much more favourably while to me his work ethic and willingness to put the team first has been questionable.
To further illustrate my opinion, if this were Ben McLemore we were talking about who struggled for 3 years and then in his 4th year finally "got" it I'd have far less concerns, because hlthe issue for him was never about work ethic or coachability, but about understanding the game.
To further illustrate my opinion, if this were Ben McLemore we were talking about who struggled for 3 years and then in his 4th year finally "got" it I'd have far less concerns, because hlthe issue for him was never about work ethic or coachability, but about understanding the game.
Well, this may surprise you, but Willie frustrates me far more than McLemore did. The reason is that I've seen enough glimpses of Willie in his three years at Kentucky and his three years with the Kings to know that he's underachieving. The question is, did he realize that he was underachieving, and it appears that he didn't think he was. Now we can argue whether that signifies being lazy or simply being in denial. Frankly I don't care at this point what the reason was, and I'm willing to accept that he's finally seen the light. At least I hope so.
My intent was never to defend his first three years in the league, but to ask for patience with a player that has unusual tools in the hope that he comes to the realization that he can be far more than he's shown so far. To be fair, he has improved every year he's been in the league. I believe the problem that most people have with Willie, is that they can see he's capable of much more. No one ever, well I shouldn't say no one, but most never had that problem with JT because I think most of us thought that he had reached his ceiling.
I agree that if your going to resign Willie to an extension, you want to be sure of who your signing. I wish I had a crystal ball to get a guarantee, but unfortunately, there isn't one, so I'm not sure how you can get that guarantee. All anyone can do is make their best judgement at the end of the year, or perhaps at the trade deadline if it becomes necessary. So I'm hopeful that Willie blows the lid off this year. A successful Willie will make the Kings a better team and give the Kings a desirable asset as well.
My intent was never to defend his first three years in the league, but to ask for patience with a player that has unusual tools in the hope that he comes to the realization that he can be far more than he's shown so far. To be fair, he has improved every year he's been in the league. I believe the problem that most people have with Willie, is that they can see he's capable of much more. No one ever, well I shouldn't say no one, but most never had that problem with JT because I think most of us thought that he had reached his ceiling.
I agree that if your going to resign Willie to an extension, you want to be sure of who your signing. I wish I had a crystal ball to get a guarantee, but unfortunately, there isn't one, so I'm not sure how you can get that guarantee. All anyone can do is make their best judgement at the end of the year, or perhaps at the trade deadline if it becomes necessary. So I'm hopeful that Willie blows the lid off this year. A successful Willie will make the Kings a better team and give the Kings a desirable asset as well.
Your certainly entitled to your opinion, and I can't tell you that I think Willie will be a star. To be honest, I don't know what Willie will eventually be. I can tell your what I hope he'll be, and what i think he's capable of, but that's about it. I try not to talk in absolutes because the truth is, I don't know, you don't know, and I doubt that even Willie knows at this moment. However, having watched NBA basketball for over 50 years, what I'm seeing from Willie isn't a surprise, and if he does take a huge leap forward this season, that wouldn't be a surprise either.
Basketball aside, Willie has reached that age in his life, where a person starts to become completely mature. The average male's body tends to mature ahead of his brain, and at around age 25 his brain starts to catch up with his body. At age 25 most men become more introspective and start to question themselves as to what their goals in life are. So its not a surprise that many athletes tend to reach their peak around that age. Of course it is an individual thing that comes with no guarantee's. I guess we'll see!
Yeah I realize that there are exceptions and players that become stars or seemingly reach their peak earlier, but most of those players had been playing the game since they were kids. They grew up loving the game of basketball. Willie didn't start to really play the game until his junior year of highschool, so he didn't arrive with the same foundation as they did. Hopefully he's finally found that love of the game. I know I would have played baseball for nothing because I loved playing the game. The money wouldn't have been rejected though.
Basketball aside, Willie has reached that age in his life, where a person starts to become completely mature. The average male's body tends to mature ahead of his brain, and at around age 25 his brain starts to catch up with his body. At age 25 most men become more introspective and start to question themselves as to what their goals in life are. So its not a surprise that many athletes tend to reach their peak around that age. Of course it is an individual thing that comes with no guarantee's. I guess we'll see!
Yeah I realize that there are exceptions and players that become stars or seemingly reach their peak earlier, but most of those players had been playing the game since they were kids. They grew up loving the game of basketball. Willie didn't start to really play the game until his junior year of highschool, so he didn't arrive with the same foundation as they did. Hopefully he's finally found that love of the game. I know I would have played baseball for nothing because I loved playing the game. The money wouldn't have been rejected though.
No I didn’t that and he was spoon feed by elite playmakers
No case to case but I’d never overpay for a contract year guy especially when you drafted Bagley and have Giles. It’s like what took so long for you to play with effort and defense.
Not that he’s a bum but is he gonna be motivated again,
So what do you do let all contract year guys who have a good year walk?
let all contract year guys who have a good year walk?
Not that he’s a bum but is he gonna be motivated again,
Does laziness come from not realizing you are working hard enough, or does laziness come from, for want of a better word, lack of spirit? One is mental, like not understanding how to set a screen. The other is a matter of spirit or will. To me, you either have the drive within you to compete, "to strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield," or you just don't. It's not a matter of cognition. It goes much deeper than that. And because it goes much deeper than that, it is generally much more difficult to remedy.
From NBC...
On Monday afternoon, Willie Cauley-Stein sat in the hot seat and bared his soul. In midseason form, the fourth-year center said exactly what was on his mind.
“I’m ready to get paid,” Cauley-Stein told NBC Sports California. “This is what we’ve got to do, that’s what type of focus I’m on.
“I’m ready for it. I’ve seen everybody else - all my peers. Alright, I’m ready for that. What do I got to do to do that? That’s what they’re doing? Alright, I’m going to go ahead and do this now. I was doing it this way, obviously it wasn’t working, so now lets do it this way.”
“Regardless of anything, I need this, right now, to change everybody’s lives that are believing in what I’m doing,” Cauley-Stein said. “That’s money. It’s richer than money, but I just need the money to do what I really need to do.”
On Monday afternoon, Willie Cauley-Stein sat in the hot seat and bared his soul. In midseason form, the fourth-year center said exactly what was on his mind.
“I’m ready to get paid,” Cauley-Stein told NBC Sports California. “This is what we’ve got to do, that’s what type of focus I’m on.
“I’m ready for it. I’ve seen everybody else - all my peers. Alright, I’m ready for that. What do I got to do to do that? That’s what they’re doing? Alright, I’m going to go ahead and do this now. I was doing it this way, obviously it wasn’t working, so now lets do it this way.”
“Regardless of anything, I need this, right now, to change everybody’s lives that are believing in what I’m doing,” Cauley-Stein said. “That’s money. It’s richer than money, but I just need the money to do what I really need to do.”
Your certainly entitled to your opinion, and I can't tell you that I think Willie will be a star. To be honest, I don't know what Willie will eventually be. I can tell your what I hope he'll be, and what i think he's capable of, but that's about it. I try not to talk in absolutes because the truth is, I don't know, you don't know, and I doubt that even Willie knows at this moment. However, having watched NBA basketball for over 50 years, what I'm seeing from Willie isn't a surprise, and if he does take a huge leap forward this season, that wouldn't be a surprise either.
Basketball aside, Willie has reached that age in his life, where a person starts to become completely mature. The average male's body tends to mature ahead of his brain, and at around age 25 his brain starts to catch up with his body. At age 25 most men become more introspective and start to question themselves as to what their goals in life are. So its not a surprise that many athletes tend to reach their peak around that age. Of course it is an individual thing that comes with no guarantee's. I guess we'll see!
Yeah I realize that there are exceptions and players that become stars or seemingly reach their peak earlier, but most of those players had been playing the game since they were kids. They grew up loving the game of basketball. Willie didn't start to really play the game until his junior year of highschool, so he didn't arrive with the same foundation as they did. Hopefully he's finally found that love of the game. I know I would have played baseball for nothing because I loved playing the game. The money wouldn't have been rejected though.
Basketball aside, Willie has reached that age in his life, where a person starts to become completely mature. The average male's body tends to mature ahead of his brain, and at around age 25 his brain starts to catch up with his body. At age 25 most men become more introspective and start to question themselves as to what their goals in life are. So its not a surprise that many athletes tend to reach their peak around that age. Of course it is an individual thing that comes with no guarantee's. I guess we'll see!
Yeah I realize that there are exceptions and players that become stars or seemingly reach their peak earlier, but most of those players had been playing the game since they were kids. They grew up loving the game of basketball. Willie didn't start to really play the game until his junior year of highschool, so he didn't arrive with the same foundation as they did. Hopefully he's finally found that love of the game. I know I would have played baseball for nothing because I loved playing the game. The money wouldn't have been rejected though.
He's a clown. This is literally the first thing he says on media day?!?! lol! He's a joke. He's got no heart for anything but $ and I quote. "I just need the money"-WCS
His character has never been something I’ve questioned. Still don’t. I’ve known all along. Being surprised at this is like being surprised when a politician lies.
Willie’s DNA and mind set is not .... right.
Why can’t he “hate to lose” and be “sick and tired of the losing”???
I know I know, I rag on people for beating up Joerger and Vlade and I’m a hypocrite to hate WCS so much. I’m sorry
Willie’s DNA and mind set is not .... right.
Why can’t he “hate to lose” and be “sick and tired of the losing”???
I know I know, I rag on people for beating up Joerger and Vlade and I’m a hypocrite to hate WCS so much. I’m sorry
Last edited: