Youngman speaks out/Organizational handling of injuries (merged)

jcassio

jcassio

Starter
#1
#1
Section 101 said:
Shocker!

Marvin Bagley III (left foot soreness) and Richaun Holmes (right shoulder soreness) are OUT tonight in Detroit.
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Whatever.
It’s beginnng to feel that Marvin doesn’t recognize pain that he can/should play through vs pain that will get worse by playing through it. Of course, I could be wrong and Marvin is a warrior. But I don’t think so.
Whatever happens, do you think Giles will get some minutes?? Nah. Harrison can play center for us...
 
upinsmoke

upinsmoke

All-Star
#2
#2
jcassio said:
Whatever.
It’s beginnng to feel that Marvin doesn’t recognize pain that he can/should play through vs pain that will get worse by playing through it. Of course, I could be wrong and Marvin is a warrior. But I don’t think so.
Whatever happens, do you think Giles will get some minutes?? Nah. Harrison can play center for us...
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Not directed at you but some people can have a high tolerance for the pain of others.
 
VF21

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#4
#4
In case the tweet disappears, here's what it said:

Pete: "Juice, I have no doubt that you are better than me, but I'm not there anymore brother. Reach out to Teena Murray, the Kings decided a couple years ago that she was better suited to guide their sports medicine & performance departments. Continued success to you my man." (In answer to a question from someone wanting Pete's help in getting on the Kings training staff...)

Pete: "All good Ross, I left amicably and on my own accord. Essentially I decided I wasn't going to work under a person less qualified than myself to do the job I did successfully for a number of years. It was time for me to move on. I did not want to leave, but I also have no regrets." (In response to a question from Ross, who wanted to know why Pete left...)

I don't think I've ever seen Pete make comments like that publicly before.

My personal two cents? I'm pretty sure I can guess who forced Pete out and it wasn't Vivek or Vlade.
 
VF21

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#10
#10
steelevt said:
Wow local media spun it like it was his decision to leave. Well yeah, if you’re going to demote me why would I stay?
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Actually, local media was very vague - and I don't think any of them cared to dig deep enough. Plus Pete didn't say anything publicly ... until now. There have been rumbles/rumors for a very long time about MK and her influence. After all, she's been with the Kings for 22 years! She stayed on when the team was sold...and survived the purge of most of the Maloof employees, even the good ones.
 
kb02

kb02

All-Star
#11
#11
Been beating a dead horse, but the Kings haven’t developed their bodies like they should. Buddy, Giles, Bags all look the same. Buddy would benefit from getting slimmer n quicker while the bigs need to bulk up. Then there are the injuries, especially the ones that are training related like Bags feet or Bogi’s strains or Fox’s strain. Those are on the training staff.
 
Hoovtrain

Hoovtrain

All-Star
#12
#12
VF21 said:
In case the tweet disappears, here's what it said:

Pete: "Juice, I have no doubt that you are better than me, but I'm not there anymore brother. Reach out to Teena Murray, the Kings decided a couple years ago that she was better suited to guide their sports medicine & performance departments. Continued success to you my man." (In answer to a question from someone wanting Pete's help in getting on the Kings training staff...)

Pete: "All good Ross, I left amicably and on my own accord. Essentially I decided I wasn't going to work under a person less qualified than myself to do the job I did successfully for a number of years. It was time for me to move on. I did not want to leave, but I also have no regrets." (In response to a question from Ross, who wanted to know why Pete left...)

I don't think I've ever seen Pete make comments like that publicly before.

My personal two cents? I'm pretty sure I can guess who forced Pete out and it wasn't Vivek or Vlade.
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still a crap show
 
Hoovtrain

Hoovtrain

All-Star
#13
#13
VF21 said:
Actually, local media was very vague - and I don't think any of them cared to dig deep enough. Plus Pete didn't say anything publicly ... until now. There have been rumbles/rumors for a very long time about MK and her influence. After all, she's been with the Kings for 22 years! She stayed on when the team was sold...and survived the purge of most of the Maloof employees, even the good ones.
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if we are looking for 1 common denominator within an inept franchise....
 
macadocious

macadocious

Starter
#14
#14
VF21 said:
Actually, local media was very vague - and I don't think any of them cared to dig deep enough. Plus Pete didn't say anything publicly ... until now. There have been rumbles/rumors for a very long time about MK and her influence. After all, she's been with the Kings for 22 years! She stayed on when the team was sold...and survived the purge of most of the Maloof employees, even the good ones.
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go through his timeline from a few days ago, he basically said that Vivek has been getting bad advice from his lieutenant(s)

it’s like an MK dog whistle
 
upinsmoke

upinsmoke

All-Star
#15
#15
kb02 said:
Been beating a dead horse, but the Kings haven’t developed their bodies like they should. Buddy, Giles, Bags all look the same. Buddy would benefit from getting slimmer n quicker while the bigs need to bulk up. Then there are the injuries, especially the ones that are training related like Bags feet or Bogi’s strains or Fox’s strain. Those are on the training staff.
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I agree except in regards to Bogi. IMO we are paying his salary to play euro ball.
 
S

Sactown ExPat

Starter
#17
#17
I’m not sure who made the decision regarding Mr. Youngman, but the current director of the training team profile is chalk full of all the best buzzwords: “advanced data modeled” this and “incubated” that. It’s the stuff someone interested in sounding “smart” and making a “smart” hire would be really enamored with.

Analytics are a great tool, and can help the neophyte gain a better understanding of any particular subject, but they are no substitute for real expertise. It’s a facsimile of expertise. A true expert doesn’t need reams of data to make decisions. They have years of accumulated data already committed to memory. I think someone mistook fancy buzzwords for real expertise, and all of our soft tissue injuries show that our team is paying the price. I apologize to Harry—he did the right thing in following his own training plan.
 
KingsFanSince85

KingsFanSince85

All-Star
#20
#20
Honestly, I don’t understand why anyone is still up in arms over the freaking dancers. Has zero to do with basketball.

Now the training staff is another story altogether. And judging from all of he injuries and lack of development from the young kids, they aren’t doing a good job.
 
Iced Espresso

Iced Espresso

Starter
#21
#21
KingsFanSince85 said:
Honestly, I don’t understand why anyone is still up in arms over the freaking dancers. Has zero to do with basketball.

Now the training staff is another story altogether. And judging from all of he injuries and lack of development from the young kids, they aren’t doing a good job.
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Uhm maybe because cheerleaders have been around for 50+ years, some of the members are female, or have daughters etc.

And the replacement decor is dental office level + some fluoride.

And the notion of it in general is annoying,
 
kb02

kb02

All-Star
#22
#22
KingsFanSince85 said:
Honestly, I don’t understand why anyone is still up in arms over the freaking dancers. Has zero to do with basketball.

Now the training staff is another story altogether. And judging from all of he injuries and lack of development from the young kids, they aren’t doing a good job.
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I'll be honest, I miss the cheerleaders. It is one of those added bonuses of league pass when other team's cheerleaders are shown. That said, I like the new 916 dance team as well, but I'm not watching the Kings because of either dance crew.

That said, class is permanent, form is temporary. I think the biggest criticism is it felt like the Kings were making a move to be with the times. Sentiment is guaranteed to change, but is not guaranteed to move in the direction that you may assume it to move. The Kings (Matina) are trying to be revolutionary. They're trying to be the first, but may end up looking like idiots over the long term if they're the only team to not have cheerleaders. Time will tell.
 
KingsFanSince85

KingsFanSince85

All-Star
#23
#23
Iced Espresso said:
Uhm maybe because cheerleaders have been around for 50+ years, some of the members are female, or have daughters etc.
,
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Funny, my wife and I watched a Real Sports segment a year or so ago where they were questioning cheerleaders at pro games in this day and age. The topic of sexism and objectifying women came up. We thought it was a bunch of hogwash, for many reasons. But it does go to show that not all females or daughters feel the same way.

Regardless, I still contend that in the grand scheme of things it has zero to do with anything. If this team becomes a winner, the fact that they don’t have an all female dance team won‘t keep fans from paying attention. It may cheapen the game experience for you and some others, but it really is a very minor thing.
 
S

Sactown ExPat

Starter
#25
#25
He's really dialing it up. Whomever advised bringing in Vlade, Brandon Williams and the current training staff should be removed from any basketball ops conversations going forward. In regards to the cheerleader discussion, the decision remains relevant because it illustrates a decision-matrix based on something other than customer/fan experience, it demonstrated a lack of loyalty to hard working employees, and the manner in which it was communicated to those employees was ham-handed at best. The latter two points stick with me the most, as they show a severe lack in what I believe are ingrained Sacramento values.
 
Kings Faithful

Kings Faithful

Starter
#26
#26
Looks like a case of Diversity and Inclusion over all. The Kings resemble a community organization group more than a Basketball team these days. Unfortunately I watched them for the basketball. Sad.
 
KingsFanSince85

KingsFanSince85

All-Star
#27
#27
Sactown ExPat said:
He's really dialing it up. Whomever advised bringing in Vlade, Brandon Williams and the current training staff should be removed from any basketball ops conversations going forward.
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Totally agree.


Sactown ExPat said:
In regards to the cheerleader discussion, the decision remains relevant because it illustrates a decision-matrix based on something other than customer/fan experience, it demonstrated a lack of loyalty to hard working employees, and the manner in which it was communicated to those employees was ham-handed at best. The latter two points stick with me the most, as they show a severe lack in what I believe are ingrained Sacramento values.
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Its not relevant to basketball and creating a winning team. Has nothing to do with any of it. Which was my point from the beginning.

You’re labeling it relevant in another regard. That’s fine. But overarching decisions made on anything and everything that goes on in the arena isn’t what the original conversation was about.
 
J

jellyfish

Bench
#28
#28
Kings Faithful said:
Looks like a case of Diversity and Inclusion over all. The Kings resemble a community organization group more than a Basketball team these days. Unfortunately I watched them for the basketball. Sad.
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It's 100% this, once the cancers starts it never stops until the organization is completely crushed, convergence is well on the way.
 
whozit

whozit

Starter
#29
#29
KingsFanSince85 said:
.....

You’re labeling it relevant in another regard. That’s fine. But overarching decisions made on anything and everything that goes on in the arena isn’t what the original conversation was about.
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It does if those decisions are coming from a faction of ownership that has the clout to impact the decisions made about what goes on the court.

Remember it was inferred that Williams had the backing of said faction. It wasn't necessarily just Joerger and Williams, it had the appearances of a power play and coaching was just the proxy war. Who backed what player? Politics, they suck and often causes unnecessary damages.
 
whozit

whozit

Starter
#30
#30
whozit said:
It does if those decisions are coming from a faction of ownership that has the clout to impact the decisions made about what goes on the court.

Remember it was inferred that Williams had the backing of said faction. It wasn't necessarily just Joerger and Williams, it had the appearances of a power play and coaching was just the proxy war. Who backed what player? Politics, they suck and often causes unnecessary damages.
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To add to this, I would state the following:

There are calls in this or another thread about bringing Petrie back aa an adviser if he was willing. Petrie to a fault was loyal. But he was the head honcho. If one is to absolve him of blame of decisions made the last several years of his tenure because of the Maloofs then one maybe should consider what is going on above Vlade. No excuse just a possible explanation. Possibly entirely different context than public perception.

There are what twenty+ owners in the ownership group. Vivek only owns ~30% but has controlling interest. There are deeper pockets than him that are in the developer and telecommunications businesses. What is going on around the arena? What part of the ownership business is doing good? What did Vivek trade off in exchange of controlling interest? Who controls the successful parts? I don't have the answers but I have strong suspicions. I would think the successful parts would have more than a little leverage on the struggling part.

Vlade the peacemaker, Vlade the buffer. If my suspicions have any truth to them, I hope he can make lemonade out of lemons.
 
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