Will Vlade Be Fired/Step Down?

Will Vlade Be Fired/Step Down?

  • Yes, during the 2019-20 season

  • Yes, during the 2020 off-season

  • Yes, during the 2020-21 season

  • Yes, during the 2021 off-season

  • Yes, during the 2021-22 season

  • Yes, during the 2022 off-season

  • Yes, during the 2022-23 season

  • No, but we won't extend/resign him

  • No, and we will extend/resign him


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bajaden

Hall of Famer
Basically a vulture, eating on the carcasses of someone else's misfortune. Wouldn't it be ironic if that's what happened to him and his control over the team.
To be fair, many times those vultures save companies and save jobs. At the end of the day it's private enterprise saving private enterprise, which is better than the government bailing them out with tax payers dollars.
 
Having all the teams coming into the bubble and making the Kings look like a G-League team has to have Vivek pissed. Vlade's days as GM are numbered. You can't just keep botching pick after pick and keep your job in the NBA. If I were Vivek, my blood would be boiling right now watching Luka dominate in the bubble.

The team looks so lost and out of sync, it has been embarrassing. I wished the Kings season would had ended when the league shut down in March. That would have left us Kings fans with a better taste in our mouths. This debacle makes the Kings look pathetic and directionless.

I've said it before and I will say it again. The Kings need to bring in a real talent evaluator as GM to replace Vlade. Move Vlade to a non-basketball decision making position, such as VP and bring in a real GM.

Heck, the Kings have a former GM that built a championship team in Detroit on the payroll right now. Promote Joe Dumars to GM and slide Vlade over to a VP position or ambassador role. Vlade is just not qualified to be an NBA GM. The Kings need to make a move on Vlade before the draft and free agency this off-season.
Problem is Bagley.

Until he gets any sort of run in the team Vlade and Vivek can say "we didn't botch the pick the kids a star he just ain't played"

I see a lot of fans peddling this line too
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
The bigger picture problem is firing Vlade doesn't solve the issue of hiring the right replacement.

And a new GM should bring in his guy for coach, given Luke isn't a good coach. And he should bring in his own assistant GM under him.

So that's a lot of turnover.

And it will once again be Vivek hiring the replacement GM. He's shown he is incapable of hiring a good GM and he cannot tell a good coach from a bad coach.

And the GM position now is less attractive than it has been in years. Stuck in a middling space without high draft picks, lack of cap space and little roster flexibility. Trading Buddy on his contract which kicks in will be tough to do. Especially as the cap will decrease next season. No one wants Barnes either. Bagley has little value until he shows his foot isn't a long term liability. There is something serious going on there.

And I'm a fan of Bogi. But you either have to pay him a substantial amount or you lose one of the team's top 3 players for nada. But if you extend and keep him, the Buddy contract looks far worse. As of now they guy who is going to get 24M next yr is getting spot mins off the bench and the coach won't even run a few plays to get him looks off the ball?

It is a complete mess.
I think that if you resign Bogi, then Buddy has to go, which is fine with me. As for running some plays for Buddy, I think when your making that much money, you should be able to get your own shot. Buddy has the BBIQ of a brick at times and he's a God awful defender. I lost count of the mistakes he made in the Houston game. Three times he didn't switch when he was supposed to, and the team ended up with two players guarding one player. four times that I counted he left his man and cheated toward the ball, leaving his man wide open on the perimeter. Oh yeah, two of those times his man was some dude named Rivers.

Whether he's lusted after by some other teams or not i'll leave up to people smarter than I. A year ago Joerger kept Buddy on a tight leash where he took mostly catch and shoot shots. He wasn't asked to handle the ball much or make any creative decisions. Walton has given Buddy a green light to do whatever he pleases him and that was a huge mistake. It's one thing to have a vision for a player, but it's another to not realize your vision isn't going to work. Can you imagine Buddy playing the way he plays under Pop's?

As far as Vlade goes, regardless of Dave's opinion, I'll be shocked if Vivek lets him go. If memory serves, Vlade just signed an extension through the 2022/23 season, and in a down financial year is he willing to eat the salaries of both Walton and Vlade. Remember, that if you fire both of them, your probably firing every person in the front office and the entire coaching staff. And you would be doing all this in the chaos of a very short free agent period that follows a couple days after the draft.

By no means am I saying that Vlade doesn't deserve to be fired, I just don't see it happening. My preference would be to keep Vlade for at least another year but fire Walton, who I think is a terrible coach. Yeah, I know, Vlade hired him. As you stated, it's a mess...
 
To be fair, many times those vultures save companies and save jobs. At the end of the day it's private enterprise saving private enterprise, which is better than the government bailing them out with tax payers dollars.
Oh, I understand it completely. I have done auctions on a few occasions. Is it really any different?

Right now Mr. Vivek and his management team for the Kings aren't held in very high regards to me, not that my opinions matter much, not being a direct paying customer. I don't want to wish ill will on someone/something but I sometimes I still do. Something about a sin nature and battling the flesh.
 
I think that if you resign Bogi, then Buddy has to go, which is fine with me. As for running some plays for Buddy, I think when your making that much money, you should be able to get your own shot. Buddy has the BBIQ of a brick at times and he's a God awful defender. I lost count of the mistakes he made in the Houston game. Three times he didn't switch when he was supposed to, and the team ended up with two players guarding one player. four times that I counted he left his man and cheated toward the ball, leaving his man wide open on the perimeter. Oh yeah, two of those times his man was some dude named Rivers.

Whether he's lusted after by some other teams or not i'll leave up to people smarter than I. A year ago Joerger kept Buddy on a tight leash where he took mostly catch and shoot shots. He wasn't asked to handle the ball much or make any creative decisions. Walton has given Buddy a green light to do whatever he pleases him and that was a huge mistake. It's one thing to have a vision for a player, but it's another to not realize your vision isn't going to work. Can you imagine Buddy playing the way he plays under Pop's?

As far as Vlade goes, regardless of Dave's opinion, I'll be shocked if Vivek lets him go. If memory serves, Vlade just signed an extension through the 2022/23 season, and in a down financial year is he willing to eat the salaries of both Walton and Vlade. Remember, that if you fire both of them, your probably firing every person in the front office and the entire coaching staff. And you would be doing all this in the chaos of a very short free agent period that follows a couple days after the draft.

By no means am I saying that Vlade doesn't deserve to be fired, I just don't see it happening. My preference would be to keep Vlade for at least another year but fire Walton, who I think is a terrible coach. Yeah, I know, Vlade hired him. As you stated, it's a mess...
This is why I was suprised when people said no to a trade around buddy for Myles Turner. Like big deal buddy can score but at that price he’s no worth it and you include his low IQ and terrible defense you’re asking for disaster.
 
Dave brought up a point I generally agree with this morning. The Kings have arguably the worst roster in the West going into next season.

Minn is the other but they have two young All Stars to build around.

GS will be back.
Not true at all. Not in theory at least. This team is deep, has defensive potential role players, has scoring ability, has high potential young players. It's just amazing that Sac continues to be the place where players watch their potential die. In this type of era of basketball skill can triumph over talent to at least make you a decent squad that is a playoff contender if you check all the boxes. In theory this team should be checking a ton of boxes yet we watch the same failed play calls game after game. Some times after they finally commit to playing small and playing 4/5 out spread pick and roll.
 
This is why I was suprised when people said no to a trade around buddy for Myles Turner. Like big deal buddy can score but at that price he’s no worth it and you include his low IQ and terrible defense you’re asking for disaster.
In todays league a Buddy Hield could be much more valuable than a player like Turner. Unless you play Buddy at PG like Luke does. Then you just might as well put a big white flag over the arena and sit it out until sanity returns.
 
Carmichael Dave saying the chances are 30/70 for Vlade to stick around, is huge. Even from a PR standpoint, i can’t imagine how they’ll sell us on keeping most of these players along with Vlade and Walton.

There’s just no way.
If there isn't at least some commotion then something points to a completely unsolvable problem. If I'm an owner I'm seething. Unfortunately the owners will look to Vlade for the way the team played on the floor. However, there is a person responsible for what happens on the floor and it isn't Vlade. Now, if Vlade is directing the play calls, etc. then it's on him. In the end he went with his boy and his boy just dotted the i on his own coaching career most likely so that alone will probably take Vlade down with him. Walton needs to see if he can get a coaching gig in the college game. His go with the flow attitude and offense will fit much better there. In the NBA you play to the strengths of your best players then get out of the way. Every once and awhile put a boot in an *** and most other times just a slap on the back and an atta boy.

Worst case scenario is Vlade goes, Walton stays. You're literally just wasting time, value, and risk completely incinerating your locker room if so. If Vivek has any sense or isn't completely hands off then he's been formulating contingency plans. Scary, perhaps, but now maybe he realizes he has to bring in someone with a legit track record and experience. No more first timers.
 
In todays league a Buddy Hield could be much more valuable than a player like Turner. Unless you play Buddy at PG like Luke does. Then you just might as well put a big white flag over the arena and sit it out until sanity returns.
You can replace what buddy does go get a 3 point specialist, Turner would bring elite defense and would allow Bagley to play PF with a spacing center.
 
In todays league a Buddy Hield could be much more valuable than a player like Turner. Unless you play Buddy at PG like Luke does. Then you just might as well put a big white flag over the arena and sit it out until sanity returns.
Normally, I'd agree, but Turner is as close to a unicorn big in the NBA without being an actual unicorn because of his ability to space. He's a very good rim protector (does struggle with size in the post), good shooter, knows his role offensively and has anchored very good Indy defenses for years now. I think he might actually be available for the right price too; especially with how great Warren has looked as a small-ball 4 and that Sabonis extension kicks in next season as well. They have to know that playing them together just isn't going to work long-term, so finding a really good wing like Bogdan or Buddy for him seems like a super reasonable deal. Dipo is also headed for UFA after next season, so being able to slot in a Buddy or Bogdan if they lose Dipo makes sense for them as well.

Adding on to the fact that our franchise is tied to Fox and Bagley, getting a 5 who can protect the rim, good rebounder and a floor spacer who's 24 is an excellent move towards building this core up.
 
I think that if you resign Bogi, then Buddy has to go, which is fine with me. As for running some plays for Buddy, I think when your making that much money, you should be able to get your own shot. Buddy has the BBIQ of a brick at times and he's a God awful defender. I lost count of the mistakes he made in the Houston game. Three times he didn't switch when he was supposed to, and the team ended up with two players guarding one player. four times that I counted he left his man and cheated toward the ball, leaving his man wide open on the perimeter. Oh yeah, two of those times his man was some dude named Rivers.

Whether he's lusted after by some other teams or not i'll leave up to people smarter than I. A year ago Joerger kept Buddy on a tight leash where he took mostly catch and shoot shots. He wasn't asked to handle the ball much or make any creative decisions. Walton has given Buddy a green light to do whatever he pleases him and that was a huge mistake. It's one thing to have a vision for a player, but it's another to not realize your vision isn't going to work. Can you imagine Buddy playing the way he plays under Pop's?

As far as Vlade goes, regardless of Dave's opinion, I'll be shocked if Vivek lets him go. If memory serves, Vlade just signed an extension through the 2022/23 season, and in a down financial year is he willing to eat the salaries of both Walton and Vlade. Remember, that if you fire both of them, your probably firing every person in the front office and the entire coaching staff. And you would be doing all this in the chaos of a very short free agent period that follows a couple days after the draft.

By no means am I saying that Vlade doesn't deserve to be fired, I just don't see it happening. My preference would be to keep Vlade for at least another year but fire Walton, who I think is a terrible coach. Yeah, I know, Vlade hired him. As you stated, it's a mess...
I think at this point, Walton and Vlade have to be a packaged deal. I don't want to give Vlade another coaching hire, only to fire him the next season and then we have a GM who may or may not like the new coaching hire and not have "his guy".

I want a "all or nothing" sort off-season where we give everyone 1 more year, or we totally clean house and let the new GM pick his staff from scratch. Doing anything in-between just leads to more potential chaos and confusion down the line.
 
I think at this point, Walton and Vlade have to be a packaged deal. I don't want to give Vlade another coaching hire, only to fire him the next season and then we have a GM who may or may not like the new coaching hire and not have "his guy".

I want a "all or nothing" sort off-season where we give everyone 1 more year, or we totally clean house and let the new GM pick his staff from scratch. Doing anything in-between just leads to more potential chaos and confusion down the line.
Personally, I can see the Kings give Walton another year to see if he can turn this team around. 1 year is usually not long enough to implement a new system and have everything clicking, for most coaches. Both Malone and Joeger didn't see team improvement until year 2 and 3, respectively.

Vlade, on the other hand has had over 5 years to turn this franchise around and we are no better than the day he took over (and he was starting from a very low point). Botching pick after pick (except for Fox) isn't going to cut it for a small market franchise.

I could see the Kings making a move to replace Vlade as the GM and telling the new GM that he will need to give Walton a year to see if he can turn the team around. If Walton still blows by the end of next year, the Kings would give the GM free reign to make a coaching change next summer. With the amount of money the Kings still owes Walton, they should give him one more season to prove his worth.
 
As far as Vlade goes, regardless of Dave's opinion, I'll be shocked if Vivek lets him go. If memory serves, Vlade just signed an extension through the 2022/23 season, and in a down financial year is he willing to eat the salaries of both Walton and Vlade. Remember, that if you fire both of them, your probably firing every person in the front office and the entire coaching staff. And you would be doing all this in the chaos of a very short free agent period that follows a couple days after the draft.

By no means am I saying that Vlade doesn't deserve to be fired, I just don't see it happening. My preference would be to keep Vlade for at least another year but fire Walton, who I think is a terrible coach. Yeah, I know, Vlade hired him. As you stated, it's a mess...
This. In such a down year with an uncertain future (who knows when we'll get through COVID? And that affects how we resume next season), Luke should be very safe with the, what, 4-year contract? Vlade also just extended. Plus who else out there you can bring in with high certainty to be successful?

I do agree 100% that Luke is a terrible coach. I said that from the very beginning. He's been riding on the GSW wave out to LA and was pretty much deemed "unlucky" for what happened at the Lakers. Although if you've watched the young Lakers without Lebron, you can tell he is terrible for that younger roster. They barely ran any sets, and if Luke did set up anything, there is usually no follow-up after the first action collapsed (you can make a case that his plays are more suitable for vets who can make a play), which led to mostly relying on Ingram freelance trying to bail them out.

I don't think they will be let go, but when Vlade hired Luke Walton without even interviewing another candidate, for me, his tenure was over then.
 
Normally, I'd agree, but Turner is as close to a unicorn big in the NBA without being an actual unicorn because of his ability to space. He's a very good rim protector (does struggle with size in the post), good shooter, knows his role offensively and has anchored very good Indy defenses for years now. I think he might actually be available for the right price too; especially with how great Warren has looked as a small-ball 4 and that Sabonis extension kicks in next season as well. They have to know that playing them together just isn't going to work long-term, so finding a really good wing like Bogdan or Buddy for him seems like a super reasonable deal. Dipo is also headed for UFA after next season, so being able to slot in a Buddy or Bogdan if they lose Dipo makes sense for them as well.

Adding on to the fact that our franchise is tied to Fox and Bagley, getting a 5 who can protect the rim, good rebounder and a floor spacer who's 24 is an excellent move towards building this core up.
And with Fox/Bagley not being good defenders or shooters Turner would be more impactful to them reaching there ceiling than buddy.

Buddy’s shooting is good but he doesn’t have an impact on the game like Turner.
 
And with Fox/Bagley not being good defenders or shooters Turner would be more impactful to them reaching there ceiling than buddy.

Buddy’s shooting is good but he doesn’t have an impact on the game like Turner.
It’s beyond funny to me that in your world Fox is a subpar defender and Russell Westbrook is a good one.
 
If there isn't at least some commotion then something points to a completely unsolvable problem. If I'm an owner I'm seething. Unfortunately the owners will look to Vlade for the way the team played on the floor. However, there is a person responsible for what happens on the floor and it isn't Vlade.
Vlade hired "the person responsible for what happens on the floor", and on top of that without a decent coaching search or interviewing other candidates (as if someone else would swoop in and beat the Kings to Walton). How is Vlade not responsible?
 
Vlade hired "the person responsible for what happens on the floor", and on top of that without a decent coaching search or interviewing other candidates (as if someone else would swoop in and beat the Kings to Walton). How is Vlade not responsible?
Being responsible and being held responsible are two different things. He is but will he be? And that will be up to Vivek who hired the man who should be held responsible making him ultimately responsible.
 
Being responsible and being held responsible are two different things. He is but will he be? And that will be up to Vivek who hired the man who should be held responsible making him ultimately responsible.
That is a good, but different point. I think we see very little accountability in this franchise. It starts from the top and trickles down to the bottom.

As long as that does not change, as long as there is no clear, defined mid-term and long-term plan with KPI's and timetables and evaluations and accountability, it feels as if we are relying on sheer luck to turn this franchise around.
 
From the sound of Carmichael Dave's interview with Amick this morning, Sam doesn't think Vlade will resign or get fired as of now.
Vlade needs to go, but just don't see it happening. Vivek/minority owners are staring at a fat loss for this and next year. No way they eat the contracts of Vlade and Luke.

Vlade and Luke, on the other hand, don't think they had a full year to do their thing. Covid, the bubble.

We're stuck with them.
 
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Normally, I'd agree, but Turner is as close to a unicorn big in the NBA without being an actual unicorn because of his ability to space. He's a very good rim protector (does struggle with size in the post), good shooter, knows his role offensively and has anchored very good Indy defenses for years now. I think he might actually be available for the right price too; especially with how great Warren has looked as a small-ball 4 and that Sabonis extension kicks in next season as well. They have to know that playing them together just isn't going to work long-term, so finding a really good wing like Bogdan or Buddy for him seems like a super reasonable deal. Dipo is also headed for UFA after next season, so being able to slot in a Buddy or Bogdan if they lose Dipo makes sense for them as well.

Adding on to the fact that our franchise is tied to Fox and Bagley, getting a 5 who can protect the rim, good rebounder and a floor spacer who's 24 is an excellent move towards building this core up.
Turner gets exposed in pick and roll from time to time though. I don't think you can truly go anywhere with bigs like that right now. Unless that player is anchoring your offense it's dicey. The reason Holmes is such an asset, well, when actually used properly, is he can guard pick and roll. That's one of the main reasons you see such a stark contrast when he plays over Giles and even Bagley. Bagley has the tools to get it done but even with him his offense is what will keep him on the floor. That was an issue considering in many ways he was afterthought.
 
Vlade hired "the person responsible for what happens on the floor", and on top of that without a decent coaching search or interviewing other candidates (as if someone else would swoop in and beat the Kings to Walton). How is Vlade not responsible?
I agree, but it still comes down to player usage. This team is failing on the floor. I can't look at the roster and say he didn't give his coach the tools to succeed. Hell, he even went out of his way to bring in Ariza (who he again misused, stats said Barnes/Ariza was the best combo for Walton in terms of net rating) and trade for his boy Baze. GM's don't always do that for their coach. But I do agree, and that's why I went to on to say that's why Vlade will probably go down in the same flames. He cleared the path for his boy and he has to pay for that now.
 
From the sound of Carmichael Dave's interview with Amick this morning, Sam doesn't think Vlade will resign or get fired as of now.
There are still games left. At the end of this Vivek will feel the pressure if he hasn't already especially as decision time comes around as he looks at the prospects of shelling out about 30 million or so to keep this garbage together. After this showing even though on paper it's worth it to anyone with basketball sense, even I can't justify doing that as someone who believes in the talent on the roster. Then comes another Kings appearance in the lotto as everyone continues to chuckle at Vlade and by proxy him for passing on Luka. While shortsighted IMO all those little cuts and jabs have to be leading to an oozing wound by now. That pressure is already everpresent with reports that his co-owners aren't the biggest fans of his leadership but it's the people out there looking for gigs putting out feelers that will likely get this thing moving. Some of them will probably go through the other owners to get to Vivek. Those exit interviews will tell the story as well. Before every game since about game 2 it's looked like a midnight cleanup crew heading into the building. You can see the energy or lack thereof. Jeez, hard to wonder why with cool hand Luke over there reading a magazine as his team goes down 20 points again who then panics and starts yanking players in and out in hopes of a miracle. It's like he's constantly reliving his Ivy league charter school nightmare of waking up on test day having forgotten to study LOL.
 
From the sound of Carmichael Dave's interview with Amick this morning, Sam doesn't think Vlade will resign or get fired as of now.
Well I don't know about the firing bit but there's really no impetus for Vlade to resign .. it's not like the Sacramento mainstream media actually holds the GM/coach accountable or crucifies them in any way, and fans certainly aren't turning up with paper bags over their heads.
 
I agree, but it still comes down to player usage. This team is failing on the floor. I can't look at the roster and say he didn't give his coach the tools to succeed. Hell, he even went out of his way to bring in Ariza (who he again misused, stats said Barnes/Ariza was the best combo for Walton in terms of net rating) and trade for his boy Baze. GM's don't always do that for their coach. But I do agree, and that's why I went to on to say that's why Vlade will probably go down in the same flames. He cleared the path for his boy and he has to pay for that now.
Yeah, I am not so high on the talent on our roster.

And you have to wonder whether Joerger made the players overachieve or Walton made them underachieve, and what their real talent is in the delta between the two.
 
There's no doubt in my mind that we're underachieving. Folks can say what they want, but i believe that's a big part of the reason why so many of us are so frustrated, angry, disappointed and every other negative adjective you can think of.
 
There's no doubt in my mind that we're underachieving. Folks can say what they want, but i believe that's a big part of the reason why so many of us are so frustrated, angry, disappointed and every other negative adjective you can think of.
I think it's because we feel like max level achievement is having a 33% chance at the 8th seed. That's just not a real promising ceiling after a full on rebuild.
 
I just think we should blow it all up

I'm not that high on anyone we have tbh.

Yeah itd be real sad to see Bogi and fox do well elsewhere because they will but hey ho... The object is to win a title. This team is never ever going to do that even if Bagley becomes a mythical 20 and 10.
 
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