Why did we trade Hawes?

jcwkings

jcwkings

All-Star
The guy would have made a great frontcourt pair with Cousins. Especially if were doing high post sets, Hawes is one of the best passing big men in the league. I think Westphal is to blame, he didn't know how to use Hawes, he had him shooting 3 pointers on a nightly basis. Hawes is proving this season that hes a legit double double center with great passing, and hes only 23. If we don't get a new coach that can teach young players, you will see all our players leave the team only to flourish under a new coach that knows how to use them. Why trade a 22 year old 7 footer with alot of skills and high basketball iq for, a 31 year old center who didn't want to be here and left after one season? Just another minor move that set us back. That and at least we know that Hawes has a good head on his shoulders, unlike Cousins.
 
jcwkings said:
The guy would have made a great frontcourt pair with Cousins. Especially if were doing high post sets, Hawes is one of the best passing big men in the league. I think Westphal is to blame, he didn't know how to use Hawes, he had him shooting 3 pointers on a nightly basis. Hawes is proving this season that hes a legit double double center with great passing, and hes only 23. If we don't get a new coach that can teach young players, you will see all our players leave the team only to flourish under a new coach that knows how to use them. Why trade a 22 year old 7 footer with alot of skills and high basketball iq for, a 31 year old center who didn't want to be here and left after one season? Just another minor move that set us back. That and at least we know that Hawes has a good head on his shoulders, unlike Cousins.
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Soft, and no doesn't really have a good head on his shoulders either. Problem personality of a different sort that is just looking good now in the rearview mirror.
 
I think dumping Nocioni's contract was a big pat of it. Still, not the best idea to trade away your young talent just to shed salary.
 
RookieOfTheDay said:
I think dumping Nocioni's contract was a big pat of it. Still, not the best idea to trade away your young talent just to shed salary.
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We of course did not. You were just never able to recognize the abilities of what we got back.

Hawes's time with us was done. We got back a starting center wiht 400 career starts under his belt. We did fine there all things considered. Shedding some long term salary was just the cherry.
 
Did you not remember how dysfunctional Hawes was when he was here? Sure, some could be coaching (in retrospect, a lot) but Hawes didn't show up for many games, physically and emotionally.
 
Bricklayer said:
Soft, and no doesn't really have a good head on his shoulders either. Problem personality of a different sort that is just looking good now in the rearview mirror.
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Brad Miller was "soft", doesn't mean he wasn't effective. Hawes wasn't a complete flake, the coach just didn't know how to use him and most importantly develop him. Now under Collins hes putting up double doubles every night. Also didn't help that his frontcourt partners were the likes of Kenny Thomas, Sean May, rookie Jason Thompson, tough to be a tough frontcourt player when you have those guys at your side.
 
The guy was lazy, soft and appeared to be something of a contrarian. His numbers were down last year. We got Dalembert and rid of Nocioni in the process. There is no reason to question the move.

He has a "good head on his shoulders" in the sense that he played bad enough to not get his rookie deal extended for 3 seasons at which point he'd be out of the league and instead will be unrestricted next season.
 
jcwkings said:
Brad Miller was "soft"
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Prior to joining the Kings Brad Miller was the guy who took it to Shaq and almost goaded him into a full on fight. He only became soft in our system. I don't think PW was the coach back then either so it must be something in our water.
 
Spike said:
Did you not remember how dysfunctional Hawes was when he was here? Sure, some could be coaching (in retrospect, a lot) but Hawes didn't show up for many games, physically and emotionally.
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His issues were with Westphal, Collins has nothing but positive things to say about Hawes, isn't obivous our problem is our coach, nobody likes or respects him, he sucks at working with young players. Hawes in his prime will be 15pt, 10-12 rbd, 4-5 ast on a contending team. He has high basketball IQ, something you don't teach.
 
Jose said:
Not to mention that Hawes himself has admitted that he's playing for a contract:

http://basketball.realgm.com/wireta...s_Strong_Start_Admits_To_Playing_For_Contract

How lame... full effort now so he can get a better contract. I'm sure he'll go back to being lazy and undisciplined once he gets the $$$
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What young player doesn't play for a contract?, most players will step up their game on a contract year, most of them have the integrity to keep working hard once a team gives them money, its called being professional. You don't think Marcus Thornton wasn't playing his *** off last season to get a contract? He got the contract and looks to be working hard.
 
It has been 4 games. Lets wait a few weeks before we worry that we traded away an all-star center. He will regress to his averages. He is shooting almost 70%!!! He played even worse last year than he ever did for us.
 
The problem with saying you'd rahter have Hawes now, is that I doubt he'd be the same player growing under Westy as he is growing under Collins. Right there is an example of our organization not being able to develop a young talent. Philly has done better with Hawes. Playing for Collins last year might have been the best thing which could have happened to him.

Still don't think he'd be the answer here, though. But, we trade him for Daly, and and a salary dump. How has that gone? Daly played great for us down the stretch last year, he and Cousins formed a potent duo on both ends of the court, and we let him walk. We either didn't offer him enough, and value what he brings, or there was a reason why he didn't want to return to this organization, which is an all too familiar scenario. It's one or the other imo. Think we're seeing why with this Cousins/Westy relationship.

So we trade Hawes for Daly, who is no longer here, and cap space. The cap space gained from Noc and Daly not resigning went to.........Chuck Hayes and Travis Outlaw. Although I don't want Spencer here, not sure I would have done all that to get Hayes and Outlaw either. Both sides of the argument have a strong case. Neither side can say either scenario worked out well.
 
Hawes SUCKED last year playing for a different coach. This season, he turned up in shape and even his coach has said he's happy that Hawes is putting in the effort to get a big payday. He's had the best 4 game stretch of his career.

Watching Hawes play made me upset. He was pathetic. I'll regret it when he puts up double-doubles for an entire season.

I was happy to wash my hands of him.

Blaming PW for everything is getting old. If Hawes didn't have the pride to put effort into his game; that's his fault.
 
mr. moustache said:
Hawes SUCKED last year playing for a different coach. This season, he turned up in shape and even his coach has said he's happy that Hawes is putting in the effort to get a big payday. He's had the best 4 game stretch of his career.

Watching Hawes play made me upset. He was pathetic. I'll regret it when he puts up double-doubles for an entire season.

I was happy to wash my hands of him.

Blaming PW for everything is getting old. If Hawes didn't have the pride to put effort into his game; that's his fault.
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Do you get tired of saying that when players under Westphal leave and do much better under different coaches?
 
He skipped out 2 years didn't he? 2nd year was mandatory and he had an excuse, family emergency or something. 3rd year was voluntary but the other young players were there. The revisionism on this guy based on a 5 game start is hilarious.
 
TehSwimGuy said:
Do you get tired of saying that when players under Westphal leave and do much better under different coaches?
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Sigh. Are you referring to last year Hawes under Collins or this year Hawes under Collins?

Are you referring to Casspi, Beno, or SamD?

Players aren't leaving the Kings and excelling unless you count Hawes and I think it's ridiculous to think the conversation is finished a week into this season, not to mention he was TERRIBLE last year for the sixers.

Do you think they gave him a 1 year deal because they liked how he was playing?

If Hawes finally found his game, it had more to do with $$ than PW.

Just because PW sucks doesn't mean our overly inflated opinions of our players are valuable.
 
pdxKingsFan said:
He skipped out 2 years didn't he? 2nd year was mandatory and he had an excuse, family emergency or something. 3rd year was voluntary but the other young players were there. The revisionism on this guy based on a 5 game start is hilarious.
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Yes, skipped two years. Didn't even tell the Kings he wasn't going to show up the second year, until the summer league was officially started.

Hawes seemed intimidated by other big men in the paint. Supposedly he had good moves indside, but he kept jacking up jumpers. Wasn't really playing like a big man at all. I was really disappointed in him. He also came in and seemed to think he already knew everything and didn't need to pay attention to anybody else. Didn't like that attitude either.

Maybe he's finally maturing, becasue he sure didn't behave in a mature manner in Sacramento. So see, maybe we just need to give Cousins time, too. If Cousins matures, he'll be a far better center than Hawes could ever be.
 
"He took the qualifying offer and said, ‘You know what, I'm going to come back, be in shape, play my tail off and you're going to pay me a lot of money,' " Collins said. "I love that. I love the fact that he's putting it out there that he's going to have a great year this year and make some money."

It's a bummer these guys can't motivate themselves before it gets *almost* too late, but maybe he finally did put it together. The guy was a complete no it all. I sat next to one of his Seattle teammates on a plane once and they said he was a good guy, but just thinks he has nothing to learn.
 
Why? Really? Is that question really being asked?

He was TERRIBLE..
 
whoa ... guys sorry I'm late... whew! so what are we talking about here?
 
mr. moustache said:
Sigh. Are you referring to last year Hawes under Collins or this year Hawes under Collins?

Are you referring to Casspi, Beno, or SamD?

Players aren't leaving the Kings and excelling unless you count Hawes and I think it's ridiculous to think the conversation is finished a week into this season, not to mention he was TERRIBLE last year for the sixers.

Do you think they gave him a 1 year deal because they liked how he was playing?

If Hawes finally found his game, it had more to do with $$ than PW.

Just because PW sucks doesn't mean our overly inflated opinions of our players are valuable.
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I mean they're not excelling, they're not "All star caliber". Maybe it's just the team they play with, but when I watch them, they look much better, like they've been improving, since they were with the Kings.
 
jcwkings said:
The guy would have made a great frontcourt pair with Cousins. Especially if were doing high post sets, Hawes is one of the best passing big men in the league. I think Westphal is to blame, he didn't know how to use Hawes, he had him shooting 3 pointers on a nightly basis. Hawes is proving this season that hes a legit double double center with great passing, and hes only 23. If we don't get a new coach that can teach young players, you will see all our players leave the team only to flourish under a new coach that knows how to use them. Why trade a 22 year old 7 footer with alot of skills and high basketball iq for, a 31 year old center who didn't want to be here and left after one season? Just another minor move that set us back. That and at least we know that Hawes has a good head on his shoulders, unlike Cousins.
Click to expand...
You seem to like the player Hawes more than Cousins or Dalembert for this seemingly perpetually soft-in-defense Kings.

You are unbelievable.
 
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