Who would best complement Havoc?

[hammystyle]

The draft seems to have 2 guys that would compliment Evans quite well in Evan Turner and Willie Warren. Both are bigger combo guards with good ball handling, passing, and jump shot.. Warren especially has a shot that will extend to the nba 3 and the tools to be the defender we need next to reke

I like both those guys and agree that Warren is the clearer fit. Turner is averaging 15 rebounds a game so far...what a monster. He needs to prove more of a jump shot to really match up perfectly.

Its been said, and will be said again...but what an amazing start for John Wall. Talk about living up to the hype. 20ppg 7 assists, 3 steals 1 block, 56% shooting and a game-winner through three games. There have been concerns on this board that Tyreke and Wall might not fit together perfectly, but I think Tyreke's play alongside Beno, and Wall playing with another talented PG in Bledsoe at least minimize those concerns. Plus I can't really say WHY it would help, but it seems helpful to me that they were both coached by Calipari. Maybe we'll be too good to get him, but I still have hopes!

 

[Arby's Roast Beef]

I've always been a huge advocate of imposing athleticism on both ends of the court, and I've said that Rondo and Evans on the court could pose matchup problems. Strength and speed. Steals, slashes, passes. But that probably comes at the expense of floor spacing because neither guy can shoot.

So that's what I'm going with--a floor-spacer who knows is role in the offense and can play D. The DC comparison would be apt. Game would easily gel with Tyreke's as said player would easily feast off wide open three point looks. It's tough to find a pure shooter who also defends as an upper-echelon player, but lower level roleplayers that could fit the bill include James Posey, Shane Battier and some such.

 

[bajaden]

I like both those guys and agree that Warren is the clearer fit. Turner is averaging 15 rebounds a game so far...what a monster. He needs to prove more of a jump shot to really match up perfectly.

Its been said, and will be said again...but what an amazing start for John Wall. Talk about living up to the hype. 20ppg 7 assists, 3 steals 1 block, 56% shooting and a game-winner through three games. There have been concerns on this board that Tyreke and Wall might not fit together perfectly, but I think Tyreke's play alongside Beno, and Wall playing with another talented PG in Bledsoe at least minimize those concerns. Plus I can't really say WHY it would help, but it seems helpful to me that they were both coached by Calipari. Maybe we'll be too good to get him, but I still have hopes!

I really doubt we'll have a shot at Wall. Unless we pull a Clippers and jump ahead of everyone in the lottery. But for the most part, I'm looking for a good defensive big in the draft. I'm not willing to commit to anyone yet at this point. Way too early. As far as Warren and Turner. I'm leaning toward Turner right now. He has that It factor. His 3pt shot may be suspect right now, but he has a good mid-range pull up jumper. He handles the ball better than Warren and passes the ball better. He's a very good defender and always gives 100%. About the only hole in his game is his 3pt shot, and his inclination toward unforced turnovers. Other than that, he's a pretty polished player. I won't turn down Warren though. I think both of these guys will go in the top ten..

 

[beb0p]

I really doubt we'll have a shot at Wall. Unless we pull a Clippers and jump ahead of everyone in the lottery. But for the most part, I'm looking for a good defensive big in the draft. I'm not willing to commit to anyone yet at this point. Way too early. As far as Warren and Turner. I'm leaning toward Turner right now. He has that It factor. His 3pt shot may be suspect right now, but he has a good mid-range pull up jumper. He handles the ball better than Warren and passes the ball better. He's a very good defender and always gives 100%. About the only hole in his game is his 3pt shot, and his inclination toward unforced turnovers. Other than that, he's a pretty polished player. I won't turn down Warren though. I think both of these guys will go in the top ten..

Turner is a player I am paying close attention to coming into the college season. I love the fact that he is a true all-around player, offense and defense; and he's big enough to play SF (assuming his 6'-7 is legit). Turner can be a second ball-handler/point forward next to Evans and KMart, someone who can free KMart of all ball-handling duties and guard the opposing team's best offensive wing player. I think you can hide KMart's weakness if you have both Evans and Turner in there, unless you run into the Celtics with killer PG, SG and SF; but those teams are very rare.

Turner is reportedly switched to playing PG this season, which will be scary if he can pull it off. I'll be watching Ohio next time they're on TV. But with that said, I'm not completely sold on Turner yet, but I'm ready to be.

Warren is just an awesome all-around player, at least offensively. I love watching him play but at the end of the day, he's undersized at 6'-3 and in general I don't like undersized guys. But Evans may just be the oversized PG that an undersized SG like Warren needs, they may in fact be the perfect match. But my preference is still Turner.

I'm all for tanking one more season, but I don't expect the Kings to be aweful enough to be in the hunt for either player.

 

[beb0p]

And to answer the thread's question. I would keep KMart at the 2 and look for someone to compliment Evans at the 3. A young Scottie Pippen would be perfect - Someone who can handle the ball, be a playmaker, defend, athletic, rebound, shoot, slash, high bbIQ, and most importantly has no issue being a sidekick.

I think Evan Turner has Pippen's potential, even though he's probably closer to a Jalen Rose at this point in his career.

 

[hrdboild]

Someone who can handle the ball, be a playmaker, defend, athletic, rebound, shoot, slash, high bbIQ, and most importantly has no issue being a sidekick.

Well that should be easy to find.

 

[VF21]

And to answer the thread's question. I would keep KMart at the 2 and look for someone to compliment Evans at the 3. A young Scottie Pippen would be perfect - Someone who can handle the ball, be a playmaker, defend, athletic, rebound, shoot, slash, high bbIQ, and most importantly has no issue being a sidekick.

If that's all you're looking for, we already have him for the most part. He's currently spending his time behind the Kings bench in the nifty sweaters, pacing the sidelines when they let him and marking the hours until he can don #32 again.

 

[Bricklayer]

Indded, that's what I was thinking last year as we won 17 games -- that gee Kevin and Cisco sure are the perfect sidekicks for a high level team. Aside from being skinny one dimensional marshmellows of course.

Especially when you combine them withe same frontcourt form that 17 win team too. Mmm mm good. 17 win team, softest team in the league, add one Tyreke, rebuild complete!

 

[VF21]

Indded, that's what I was thinking last year as we won 17 games -- that gee Kevin and Cisco sure are the perfect sidekicks for a high level team. Aside from being skinny one dimensional marshmellows of course.

Especially when you combine them withe same frontcourt form that 17 win team too. Mmm mm good. 17 win team, softest team in the league, add one Tyreke, rebuild complete!

Look again, sir.

I bolded the parts I was responding to. I didn't say a word about Martin. I was talking solely about Cisco at the 3 and how he seemed to already possess most of the qualities the previous poster had deemed desirable.

I repeat, I didn't say a word about Martin nor did I bold the part I was quoting to even insinuate anything about Martin.

 

[beb0p]

If that's all you're looking for, we already have him for the most part. He's currently spending his time behind the Kings bench in the nifty sweaters, pacing the sidelines when they let him and marking the hours until he can don #32 again.

Well, you know I like Garcia and supported him thru the thick and thin, but I wouldn't go that far to say he's the best compliment to Martin/Evans. Ideally you want someone who can take care of the ball, share some PG duties, is athletic, can create for others and for himself. None of which applies to Garcia. Cisco can dribble but he is not a playmaker and he is very TO prone. He is one of those guys that the less time handling the ball the better. He is more smooth than athletic and he isn't a player that other teams worry about. The ideal SF should be someone that opposing teams will have to worry about, in a "pick your poison" scenario.

The one player that I think has that potential is Casspi. Obviously, he is a some ways away but Casspi has all the tools and skill. It's similar to when I first saw KMart in the summer league. I was scratching my head wondering how this guy fell to #26. Martin already has all the shots, the size, speed, athleticism, etc; he just had to improve on them to be dynamite, and indeed he did.

I believe it's easier to improve on an existing skill than to learn a new one. I don't know if Casspi will ever do the same to his game but if he can get a little stronger, play more under control, and improve his shots; all things that come with practice and PT, he can be scary good.

 

[VF21]

Well, you know I like Garcia and supported him thru the thick and thin, but I wouldn't go that far to say he's the best compliment to Martin/Evans. Ideally you want someone who can take care of the ball, share some PG duties, is athletic, can create for others and for himself. None of which applies to Garcia. Cisco can dribble but he is not a playmaker and he is very TO prone. He is one of those guys that the less time handling the ball the better. He is more smooth than athletic and he isn't a player that other teams worry about. The ideal SF should be someone that opposing teams will have to worry about, in a "pick your poison" scenario.

The one player that I think has that potential is Casspi. Obviously, he is a some ways away but Casspi has all the tools and skill. It's similar to when I first saw KMart in the summer league. I was scratching my head wondering how this guy fell to #26. Martin already has all the shots, the size, speed, athleticism, etc; he just had to improve on them to be dynamite, and indeed he did.

I believe it's easier to improve on an existing skill than to learn a new one. I don't know if Casspi will ever do the same to his game but if he can get a little stronger, play more under control, and improve his shots; all things that come with practice and PT, he can be scary good.

Again, I DIDN"T SAY ANYTHING ABOUT MARTIN!!! If you'll look at my post, I bolded a few phrases to respond to. It was to those highlighted portions that I made the comment about Cisco, not to the entire concept.

 

[beb0p]

Again, I DIDN"T SAY ANYTHING ABOUT MARTIN!!! If you'll look at my post, I bolded a few phrases to respond to. It was to those highlighted portions that I made the comment about Cisco, not to the entire concept.

Actually Evans/Martin was my point. I was the one who brought up a Sf to compliment Evans/Martin. I was just expounding on a topic that I started. Sorry if I dragged you into it.

 

[TheRaven]

Let me preface what I say with the obvious point that we haven't seen enough of 'Reke/Martin to really know how well that combo could work. Defensively it isn't ideal, but offensively it might work despite that on many nights.

Let me also say that it would be great to have the player I am about the describe and both Martin/Evans so you can get the best of both worlds. Since we are still at least one or two drafts away from deep postseason contention, it is possible we could draft this player in one of the two next drafts and a non-undersized defensive PF/C in the other.

Defensively: I would like the guard to be very quick and be able to compete and stay in front of quick guards defensively, yet not undersized. Quick hands to pick up a few steals a game, but not a gambler who gets out of position on defense. Not as big/strong/long as Evans, but not a string bean that gets overpowered regularly either.

Offensively: I would like the guard to shoot very well from 3, some midrange game being a bonus. Able to knock down the clutch shots in the 4th. Doesn't have to be a great passer, but able to make solid decisions with the ball when it is in his hands. Showing at least a limited ability to create own shot would be a big plus.


Pretty big wishlist. Having a guy to keep up with quicker guards defensively would be nice. When you go up against a Brooks or Parker you have a player that can cut off some of the dribble penetration and funnel them more into the trees instead of everyone collapsing and creating open looks for the opposing team. Evans takes the physical guard, this player takes the quicker guard. Then offensively this player takes the kickouts and runs off screens to knock down the daggers in close games.

I don't think players with that combination of offensive and defensive skills come around very often though. Maybe Billups when he was a little younger?

 

[Bricklayer]

Look again, sir.

I bolded the parts I was responding to. I didn't say a word about Martin. I was talking solely about Cisco at the 3 and how he seemed to already possess most of the qualities the previous poster had deemed desirable.

I repeat, I didn't say a word about Martin nor did I bold the part I was quoting to even insinuate anything about Martin.

Apologies.

I hereby transfer my mock over to those that think that last year's starting lineup, + Evans = has a long term future.

Cisco himself...not as a SF. He's soft as a SF. Like everybody else we had last year. Too skinny, too weak. No post game, terrible rebounder, no ability to defend against bigger guys. But as a SG...its long been my point that he could be the shooting guard next to Reke. Big enough that guarding him with a 6'1" midget PG would not occur to most people. Can hit those spot threes. Can handle the ball to help with the load there. Competitive + has leadership. Doesn't absolutely need the ball and shots to be effective. And at SG has good size. He could be a 15ppg starter at shooting guard fairly easily.

 

[ParniValjak]

Apologies.

I hereby transfer my mock over to those that think that last year's starting lineup, + Evans = has a long term future.

Cisco himself...not as a SF. He's soft as a SF. Like everybody else we had last year. Too skinny, too weak. No post game, terrible rebounder, no ability to defend against bigger guys. But as a SG...its long been my point that he could be the shooting guard next to Reke. Big enough that guarding him with a 6'1" midget PG would not occur to most people. Can hit those spot threes. Can handle the ball to help with the load there. Competitive + has leadership. Doesn't absolutely need the ball and shots to be effective. And at SG has good size. He could be a 15ppg starter at shooting guard fairly easily.

The only problem now is to find a star SF and/or a star PF/C

 

[venom_7]

Rondo is a "poison pill" contact because he signed an extension but it has yet to take effect. Details here, in the second half of the answer. This means that as far as Boston is concerned, Rondo's trade value is about $2.1M, but as far as the Kings are concerned it's a hint under $6M, if I've got all the numbers right. So Martin for Rondo + Allen is OK for us (we take in about "$8.5M" and give out about $9.7M), but for the Celtics it's a no-go, as they'd give out only about $4.5M to bring in $9.7M and violate the 125%+100K rule. Basically, the Celtics would have to give up about $7.7M in (actual) salaries to get Martin back. That would correspond to about $10.6M coming back to us...which would be more than we would be allowed to take back.

That's why it's called a "poison pill" - it can be done, but by rule it's really hard to trade.

You can be pretty confident Rondo won't be going anywhere until next year at the earliest.

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