What is Sacramento about anyway?

kupman

kupman

Starter
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_United_States_Metropolitan_Statistical_Areas

Take a look at this link of metro areas in the US. We are ranked 25th in size with about 2.1 million people. The cities around us all have pro sports teams, many cities have more than 1 pro sports team. But it goes well beyond sports teams. The cities of similar size all have significant things to offer above and beyond pro sports. We do not.

When the Kings leave and Arco is destroyed we will have no musical acts or shows of any type. If Arco stays, we get a few marginal shows each year. No major conventions of any type visit this city and will be unable to do so without a major arena.

But on top of no arena we have no amusement/theme parks. We have no major water parks. We have no aquarium. We have no science center. We have no downtown nightlife. Our zoo is nearly non-existent. We have a Cal Expo that is falling apart. Mass transit is sorely lacking. Shall I go on?

Beyond the Rivercats and the Crocker, what do we really have once Arco is gone? Perhaps the biggest collection of curmudgeons this side of the Atlantic? When I look at what other cities of similar size have to offer I am honestly embarrassed. Many cities ½ our size have more to show for their city than we do. Anyone else feel like I do?
 
kupman said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_United_States_Metropolitan_Statistical_Areas

Take a look at this link of metro areas in the US. We are ranked 25th in size with about 2.1 million people. The cities around us all have pro sports teams, many cities have more than 1 pro sports team. But it goes well beyond sports teams. The cities of similar size all have significant things to offer above and beyond pro sports. We do not.

When the Kings leave and Arco is destroyed we will have no musical acts or shows of any type. If Arco stays, we get a few marginal shows each year. No major conventions of any type visit this city and will be unable to do so without a major arena.

But on top of no arena we have no amusement/theme parks. We have no major water parks. We have no aquarium. We have no science center. We have no downtown nightlife. Our zoo is nearly non-existent. We have a Cal Expo that is falling apart. Mass transit is sorely lacking. Shall I go on?

Beyond the Rivercats and the Crocker, what do we really have once Arco is gone? Perhaps the biggest collection of curmudgeons this side of the Atlantic? When I look at what other cities of similar size have to offer I am honestly embarrassed. Many cities ½ our size have more to show for their city than we do. Anyone else feel like I do?
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LMFAO you said the crocker. it takes like 2 minutes to zip through it. When family from out of town come and wanna go do stuff, I gotta go take them out of town. It's pathetic in this city.
 
kupman said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_United_States_Metropolitan_Statistical_Areas

Take a look at this link of metro areas in the US. We are ranked 25th in size with about 2.1 million people. The cities around us all have pro sports teams, many cities have more than 1 pro sports team. But it goes well beyond sports teams. The cities of similar size all have significant things to offer above and beyond pro sports. We do not.

When the Kings leave and Arco is destroyed we will have no musical acts or shows of any type. If Arco stays, we get a few marginal shows each year. No major conventions of any type visit this city and will be unable to do so without a major arena.

But on top of no arena we have no amusement/theme parks. We have no major water parks. We have no aquarium. We have no science center. We have no downtown nightlife. Our zoo is nearly non-existent. We have a Cal Expo that is falling apart. Mass transit is sorely lacking. Shall I go on?

Beyond the Rivercats and the Crocker, what do we really have once Arco is gone? Perhaps the biggest collection of curmudgeons this side of the Atlantic? When I look at what other cities of similar size have to offer I am honestly embarrassed. Many cities ½ our size have more to show for their city than we do. Anyone else feel like I do?
Click to expand...

I moved to Sacramento from another country when I was a child and grew up loving the Kings and proud to be from Sacramento. I've been away the last few years and was just recently interviewing for jobs back in California including at Sacramento and it was quite embarassing when the recruiter main sale pitch was that Sacramento is close to the Bay and you can have all the nightlife/culture/sport you want in the bay. They literally had nothing to say about Sacramento outside of the Kings and how close the city is to other city in the vicininity. If the Kings leave i'd be truly dissapointed with this city and really question myself why I want to come back in the first place.
 
Well Sacramento does have a very nice railroad museum. And Old Sac is pretty cool. Of course if Sacramento Pols had their way it would have been razed for freeway expansion. Did Sutter's Fort survive the last budget crisis?

The zoo is ok, and fairy tale town.

Think that covers the list of attractions I'll share with my son on future trips to Sac if the Kings leave.
 
Big Cuz 15 said:
LMFAO you said the crocker. it takes like 2 minutes to zip through it. When family from out of town come and wanna go do stuff, I gotta go take them out of town. It's pathetic in this city.
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Yep, can pretty much do all of sacramento in 1 day maybe even Sutters mill in the foothills too.
 
MDM said:
The American River bike trail actually rivals anything of its type around the country in my opinion. But it is still just a bike trail.
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Portland and Boston both have very nice river bike paths/esplanades that are more "useful" for day to day life but I do agree that that bike trail is pretty special in its own right. As a bonus you can actually go in the water along those rivers in Sac :)
 
Big Cuz 15 said:
LMFAO you said the crocker. it takes like 2 minutes to zip through it. When family from out of town come and wanna go do stuff, I gotta go take them out of town. It's pathetic in this city.
Click to expand...
Actually, if you haven't been since the new wing opened, its well worth a visit and a very nice place. It would definitely take a lot longer than two minutes. I spent a good 8 hours just going through the new wing.

Right now there''s a rather spectacular special exhibit there.

But Sacramento really doesn not have much that make it really stand out. And there's a reason NBA players hate coming here as the visiting team. The usual comment is no nightlife. Its pretty embarrassing when your own players look a little blank when asked what they like about Sacramento (ala Cousins recently).

I love Sacramento as I consider it my home town. There are nice things about it, but its not a very exciting town especially if you're young. Before the Kings came, I used to have to explain where Sacramento is when I traveled around the country. Some folks knew it was the capital, but that's a "so what." I know that Pierre is the capital of South Dakota. That doesn't mean I can tell you any other reason to visit there or live there, for that matter.
 
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I have to say that when I was home for Christmas this year I did go to some of the newer bars and restaurants downtown and had a good time. It was far nicer than the usual spots I would hit the summer I turned 21 like the Zebra Room. Not enough to get me to move back or anything, but it seemed like a very nice start that attracted some young hip people that could only grow once the railyards got developed and if public transit were expanded.
 
The funny thing about this list is that the metro most similar to Sacramento in the 20-30 range is probably Kansas City.

The other teams on that list are former industrial powerhouses in decline, which have the advantage of having been heavily developed in the 20th Century (and largely facing decline in the last 30 or so years): Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Cincinatti

Two of them are major tourists destinations that have a consisted influx of money to support their economy (and inherently favor expansion of services and attractions): Orlando and Vegas.

Others have strong economic engines in technology and energy: San Jose and San Antonio.

Portland has a little bit of everything: it has the timber industry (analogous to the rustbelt cities), a solid tourism base, and a thriving base of technology and major corporations (Intel, Nike, Adidas)


Sacramento and Kansas City seem to have the most in common: both started as transportation hubs, as both were at the confluences of major rivers, and both had significant railroad ties. Neither city has anything to really set it apart today, and both are seen as the ugly stepchildren of their states. KC is propped up by a decent local economy, Sac by the state government. Both cities are likely blank spots in the consciousness of the country as a whole, and both have reputations as cow towns.


Anyways, Sacramento stands for the people who live and/or grew up in the area, and who have pride in the region that produced and supported them, just like any city does. It also seems to be defined by a nagging inferiority complex.
 
Relocation extension app has been filed:

http://blogs.sacbee.com/sports/kings/archives/2011/02/kings-file-exte.html

Just like that, it's over. And regardless of what you think of my past posts, a piece of me just died.

SacramentoWarriorsFans.com?

Go ahead and blame me if you want, but I did not influence the decision to leave in any way. But when you extend to the day after the season ends, but before the Taylor-ICON negotiation period ends, what else are we supposed to think?

No more games for me. I'm done.
 
captain bill said:
The funny thing about this list is that the metro most similar to Sacramento in the 20-30 range is probably Kansas City.

The other teams on that list are former industrial powerhouses in decline, which have the advantage of having been heavily developed in the 20th Century (and largely facing decline in the last 30 or so years): Pittsburgh, Cleveland, Cincinatti

Two of them are major tourists destinations that have a consisted influx of money to support their economy (and inherently favor expansion of services and attractions): Orlando and Vegas.

Others have strong economic engines in technology and energy: San Jose and San Antonio.

Portland has a little bit of everything: it has the timber industry (analogous to the rustbelt cities), a solid tourism base, and a thriving base of technology and major corporations (Intel, Nike, Adidas)


Sacramento and Kansas City seem to have the most in common: both started as transportation hubs, as both were at the confluences of major rivers, and both had significant railroad ties. Neither city has anything to really set it apart today, and both are seen as the ugly stepchildren of their states. KC is propped up by a decent local economy, Sac by the state government. Both cities are likely blank spots in the consciousness of the country as a whole, and both have reputations as cow towns.


Anyways, Sacramento stands for the people who live and/or grew up in the area, and who have pride in the region that produced and supported them, just like any city does. It also seems to be defined by a nagging inferiority complex.
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Kansas city has the Royals and Chiefs. They have a brand new state of the art arena downtown. They have Worlds of Fun and Oceans of fun. They have a pretty decent zoo. This is just of the top of my head.

Point being, this is a city that is kind of making us look ridiculous.
 
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captain bill said:
Portland has a little bit of everything: it has the timber industry (analogous to the rustbelt cities), a solid tourism base, and a thriving base of technology and major corporations (Intel, Nike, Adidas)
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I actually moved here because of its resemblance to the East Sac neighborhood that I grew up in combined with parts of downtown reminding me of the area of Boston I resided in. Aside from Intel, Nike and Adidas we don't have a huge corporate base and are skyline is much closer to Sac's than SF/SEA/LA. I quite like that. We're even situated near the confluence of two rivers just like Sac. We don't have flashy amusement parks though we have a world class zoo, children's museum and science center which are things that Sacramento should be able to have. And our natural parks are a huge draw, they are all over the city here at least one in each of our many neighborhoods, which is kind of like where I grew up but obviously quite different than Sac as a whole.

We are also a NBA only town, though we've just added MLS. I always thought MLS would be a good fit for Sac too, but it seems the general attitude is that if it isn't MLB or NFL it isn't good enough.
 
Arena Skeptic said:
Relocation extension app has been filed:

http://blogs.sacbee.com/sports/kings/archives/2011/02/kings-file-exte.html

Just like that, it's over. And regardless of what you think of my past posts, a piece of me just died.

SacramentoWarriorsFans.com?

Go ahead and blame me if you want, but I did not influence the decision to leave in any way. But when you extend to the day after the season ends, but before the Taylor-ICON negotiation period ends, what else are we supposed to think?

No more games for me. I'm done.
Click to expand...

Um, if you're deteremined to see it that way you will see it that way, but it also gives Sac another 6 weeks to get its own proposals in gear and try to sell the Maloofs on staying. This is clearly the last stand, but who wins that last stand is still up in the air.

Come on, the hot guy with the fancy car is after your girl, and she's given you another 6 weeks before she makes up her mind. You can either shuffle around in your bath robe and go woe is me that she would even look, or you can go bust your butt to show her why she has everytihing she needs right in front of her. I know which option I take. Plenty of time for woe is me later.
 
Bricklayer said:
Um, if you're deteremined to see it that way you will see it that way, but it also gives Sac another 6 weeks to get its own proposals in gear and try to sell the Maloofs on staying. This is clearly the last stand, but who wins that last stand is still up in the air.
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That's how I see it, they're gone if this Taylor-ICON deal doesn't go through, whether it be this year or the next. No more extra chances. This buys time. That makes it a good thing.
 
pdxKingsFan said:
I actually moved here because of its resemblance to the East Sac neighborhood that I grew up in combined with parts of downtown reminding me of the area of Boston I resided in. Aside from Intel, Nike and Adidas we don't have a huge corporate base and are skyline is much closer to Sac's than SF/SEA/LA. I quite like that. We're even situated near the confluence of two rivers just like Sac. We don't have flashy amusement parks though we have a world class zoo, children's museum and science center which are things that Sacramento should be able to have. And our natural parks are a huge draw, they are all over the city here at least one in each of our many neighborhoods, which is kind of like where I grew up but obviously quite different than Sac as a whole.

We are also a NBA only town, though we've just added MLS. I always thought MLS would be a good fit for Sac too, but it seems the general attitude is that if it isn't MLB or NFL it isn't good enough.
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Portland also has the best Japanese garden in the United States and a highly respected local music scene.

The Sacramento area has a lot of natural beauty and its own local charm if you're interested in the history of California. I would kill for a place like Apple Hill down here. A lot of the LA area has been steam-rolled for generic development projects. It's pretty depressing. Actually, I think most of the people who make fun of Sacramento don't really understand what they're missing. If you're from a primarily urban area to begin with, than you measure other cities based on how many and impressive it's buildings are. I still prefer trees to buildings.
 
I am not a local boy. I grew up in Brooklyn, Köln and Hamburg, lived in Cincinnati and Houston, tried to live in Portland and Philly and about 6 years ago I moved to Sacramento. I have seen and experienced a lot of things in different places in America. Yes, Sacramento is no Paris but if you think it is pathetic I have a simple question - have you been to other places? Sacramento has minuses but every city has them. We have a very good winter-free weather without annoying humidity, tornadoes, hurricanes. PT is actually decent by American standards. We have a very interesting racial and ethnic background and very healthy relationship between us. We are a short driving almost traffic free distance away from so many things. I do not want to have Sonoma or Lake Tahoe in my backyard, I want to be close to them. Every weekend I have a nice choice - I can go to Napa, Russian or American rivers, Tahoe, SF, SJ, coastal towns, national parks etc. I love SF but I love visiting SF. I do not want to live there 24/7 in a small old overpriced apartment or townhouse on a skinny noisy street. I can enjoy everything SF can offer when I have some free time but I want to go back to my big house with a big backyard where I can enjoy my family life. If I do not want to go outside of the town, I can spend a nice time in Old Sac, Midtown, Discovery park etc. and have a lunch, play softball or volleyball with my friends and family. We do not have many museums? Ohh, sorry, like we go to them every week and they make our life better and interesting. We still have some and California Rail Road museum is actually very cool and outsiders love it. We do not have amusement and water parks a-la Disneyland but we still have ok ones and if you want something super-puper special you can go to Orlando or Vegas. That's the reason these cities exists on Earth. The thing is that we have options - in the city and around the city and that's what you want - to have options. We have more options and choices than most people in this country.

Yes, our arena situation is very, very sad and I am very angry about it and it is not only the arena situation actually. There are many things make me sad today in Sacramento and America progress- and infrastructure-wise. But this Sacramento nothing-to-do-at-all and redneck-stupid-town bashing is becoming ridiculous.
I have a simple formula for you, my dear friends. If you have nothing to do in Sacramento on a regular day, it means that you probably have no real job. If you have nothing to do on weekends in/and around Sacramento, it means that you won't find that probably anywhere and it is not Sacramento, it is you.
 
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Ukraine: Thank you for taking the time to point out the good things about living in Sacramento. You touched on many of the reasons I love Sacramento. Its hard to explain it to outsiders, though. You have to take time to get to know Sacramento and the surrounding region and all that it has to offer. I can't think of a single city in California that has such a variety of close and wonderful places to go, that you can easily reach in one day. Bay Area; Bodega Bay and on up the coast; countelss fine wine regions; The coast from Monterey down through Big Sur; Tahoe; Napa-Sonoma valley; the gold rush towns along Highway 49; Apple Hill; Yosemite, Redwood forest; wildfowl sanctuaries; American River; plenty of white-water rivers; etc.

By the way, Sacramento's Railroad Museum is considered one of the two best in the entire world. We do have a children's museum called the Discovery Museum, which is very nice. There are actually a lot of interesting museums around Sacramento. It's generally been ranked as the third most treeful city in the world.

Its just not easy to explain those as big attractions to someone who wants to visit, or plan a convention.

I think it doesn't have as much night life as young folks would like, yet, although its improving. Sacramento has quite a vibrant art and music scene.

I remember that, as a teenager and young adult, my son couldn't wait to get out of Sacramento. After traveling pretty extensively around the US and Canada, he decided he liked it in Sacramento and likes the idea of raising his family here.
 
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this is the bull**** I'm talking about

One of the things I do is meet people at a small cafe or bookstore in midtown, walk through downtown, take them through capital park, down through the Plaza and the underpass, into old town and down to the river boats. It's a great date, it's a nice walk and it shows Sacramento to people.

Sometimes I go out and get away from city distractions and drive through the open land, stop and observe the little bits of nature and watch a sunset melt over a rice field.

Sometimes I go out dancing then visit late night diner gathering spots.

Sacramento is not a place that has big neon signs telling you where to go for fun, and the places that do that normally suck. It is a city with some bit of valley feel left in it. I suggest enjoying that aspect before it is gone.
 
I like the Mayberry feel of Sactown as well. But that is really not the point. You can have a small city feel and still have reasons to leave your home. Most of the cities in the 1-3 million range accmplish it. We do not. Given that people are using fairy tale town and the train museum as examples of what sactown offers kind of makes my point for me.

I have lived many places and have visted many more. This is a great place to live, make no mistake about it. However, it mostly has to do with geographic location, weather and trees. It has little to do with the city itself that has built and maintained very little for its citizens and visitors. Given this, the loss of the Kings and then Arco is a much bigger deal that if Pittsburg lost the Pirates or if Indy lost the Pacers etc.
 
I don't want to diss Sacramento as I've made some of my complaints clear here before - mainly people's pathetic mentality (some of them - a lot of them) that live here. One of the biggest disasters to befall this community occured in late 1980s and early 1990s. At that time, two major and one small military base closed - Mather AFB, McClellan AFB and Army Depot. McClellan at its height had over 30,000 civilian workers, Mather only a few thousand, but was a major "top gun" school for Air Force navigators and more. After they closed Rancho Cordova was devastated and so was North Highlands/Antelope - none have ever come back to the level they once enjoyed. After Army Depot close the city gave Packard Bell a sweetheart deal to open a plant on that ground, but that didn't last very long. By any measure, overall private biz climate in Sac has been down for a long, long time - now with the Great Recession flat on its back.
 
kupman said:
I like the Mayberry feel of Sactown as well. But that is really not the point. You can have a small city feel and still have reasons to leave your home. Most of the cities in the 1-3 million range accmplish it. We do not. Given that people are using fairy tale town and the train museum as examples of what sactown offers kind of makes my point for me.

I have lived many places and have visted many more. This is a great place to live, make no mistake about it. However, it mostly has to do with geographic location, weather and trees. It has little to do with the city itself that has built and maintained very little for its citizens and visitors. Given this, the loss of the Kings and then Arco is a much bigger deal that if Pittsburg lost the Pirates or if Indy lost the Pacers etc.
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Everything I listed involves getting out of the house. Go to a 2nd Saturday. It's a street carnival. The city I live in now has an amusement park attraction but that isn't really the draw for anyone but average tourists. Cities are defined by their feel. Sacramento's problem is that it has let a lot of long time establishments go to the grave, and they have been replaced by character-less chain establishments or become empty lots. People see themselves surrounded by Olive Garden and Cheesecake Factory, then wonder where Disneyland is and end up finding nothing. That is where the identity issue comes from.
 
swisshh said:
Sacramento's problem is that it has let a lot of long time establishments go to the grave, and they have been replaced by character-less chain establishments or become empty lots. People see themselves surrounded by Olive Garden and Cheesecake Factory, then wonder where Disneyland is and end up finding nothing. That is where the identity issue comes from.
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That isn't unique to Sacramento, that's everywhere. Hell some people even see that as progress. My grandfather opened up one of Sacramento's fine dining institutions, by the 80s and 90s when my mom was running it, it seemed every critic in the area loved to give it a lukewarm review and prop up the flavor of the week. It is one of the reasons I am a big fan of revitalizing downtown which isn't chain free but certainly has a nice mix of established and fad of the moment locally owned operations. Frankly as much as I love the Kings the thought that this could nuke a downtown revitalization is even more scary to me. I do come home several times a year. I'd probably come home even more often if there was more going on.
 
Bricklayer said:
Um, if you're deteremined to see it that way you will see it that way, but it also gives Sac another 6 weeks to get its own proposals in gear and try to sell the Maloofs on staying. This is clearly the last stand, but who wins that last stand is still up in the air.

Come on, the hot guy with the fancy car is after your girl, and she's given you another 6 weeks before she makes up her mind. You can either shuffle around in your bath robe and go woe is me that she would even look, or you can go bust your butt to show her why she has everytihing she needs right in front of her. I know which option I take. Plenty of time for woe is me later.
Click to expand...


Amen brother.

Coming to an episode of Cheaters near you. ;)
 
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