Rehashing Joerger...again (split)

SLAB

Hall of Famer
#3
Yeah, he had it coming, being the Kings coach with the most wins in over a decade and playing to the players strengths and all that.
Second team in two tries he tried to pull a petty stubborn headstrong power-play with the front office. I have as many questions and concerns about the front office as everyone else, but when the same head coach gets fired from two jobs in in a relatively short amount of time for the same reasons... you have yourself a pattern. Good riddance.
 
#4
Second team in two tries he tried to pull a petty stubborn headstrong power-play with the front office. I have as many questions and concerns about the front office as everyone else, but when the same head coach gets fired from two jobs in in a relatively short amount of time for the same reasons... you have yourself a pattern. Good riddance.
Second team in two tries he tried to pull a petty stubborn headstrong power-play with the front office. I have as many questions and concerns about the front office as everyone else, but when the same head coach gets fired from two jobs in in a relatively short amount of time for the same reasons... you have yourself a pattern. Good riddance.
That's news for me. Do you have a source on that?
 
#5
That's news for me. Do you have a source on that?
It’s pretty common knowledge. I don’t know of any direct quotes but I believe he butted heads in Memphis so much they allowed him to seek another job while with them. But if you search there should be some articles. While here there was the Brandon Williams saga. Stuff recently reported by amick, and you can see it in plenty of his post game interviews. The guy is a good coach, but just seems like kind of a jerk to some.
 
#6
That's news for me. Do you have a source on that?
I second that motion. Petty power play? Or is it meddling front office / owner? Joerger kicked ass in Memphis and he was on his way in Sacramento. Sure he is abrasive but he Has been successful everywhere he has coached. Joerger had to deal with a front office crapshow when B Williams was here meddling. Joerger >>>>>>> Luke Walton
 
#7
It’s pretty common knowledge. I don’t know of any direct quotes but I believe he butted heads in Memphis so much they allowed him to seek another job while with them. But if you search there should be some articles. While here there was the Brandon Williams saga. Stuff recently reported by amick, and you can see it in plenty of his post game interviews. The guy is a good coach, but just seems like kind of a jerk to some.
The story that Brandon Williams was working hard to push Joerger out because Joerger wasn't willing to start Bagley, and Joerger pushed back? The same Brandon Williams who was allegedly the main guy to promote picking Bagley over Luka and the guy to get Youngman fired? Wasn't that in the same report by Amick?

Yeah, I would almost call him an unwilling victim of the powerplay by someone who carnies a much bigger amount of blame in that saga and the current state of the franchise than Joerger. But your mileage may vary.
 
#8
Second team in two tries he tried to pull a petty stubborn headstrong power-play with the front office. I have as many questions and concerns about the front office as everyone else, but when the same head coach gets fired from two jobs in in a relatively short amount of time for the same reasons... you have yourself a pattern. Good riddance.
But what if both front offices were wrong and he knows wtf he's doing? At some point you need to choose between a guy overstepping his boundaries and a guy who doesn't tolerate incompetence and is right. I'd rather have a coach like a Pop or Nelson who has major front office sway that a "shut up and coach" mentality for somebody who ended up being right
 

SLAB

Hall of Famer
#9
But what if both front offices were wrong and he knows wtf he's doing? At some point you need to choose between a guy overstepping his boundaries and a guy who doesn't tolerate incompetence and is right. I'd rather have a coach like a Pop or Nelson who has major front office sway that a "shut up and coach" mentality for somebody who ended up being right
If David was so right potentially, then why wasn’t he immediatly hired by one of the other openings? Or even on the list of guys getting interviewed?
 
#10
If David was so right potentially, then why wasn’t he immediatly hired by one of the other openings? Or even on the list of guys getting interviewed?
The Kings are still paying him, right?

But yes, his exit here followed a similar pattern as what transpired in Memphis...
 
#11
Joerger will get hired again when the situation is right. Strong front office, strong ownership that will let him do his thing without meddling. Let him do his thing and he will win. He’s accomplished this his whole life.
 
#12
If David was so right potentially, then why wasn’t he immediatly hired by one of the other openings? Or even on the list of guys getting interviewed?
Maybe he is waiting for the right situation, maybe he gets hired next year. Way too many variables involved to just say “Why didn’t he get hired right away?”
 
#13
Joerger started burning bridges at/around the time the Williams spat became public and I think he tanked the team after the ASB. Good coach but lacks the professional skills to survive long term in any destination. I do not see him lasting with a "strong" FO.

Williams was a total tool too. This isn't a picking sides thing, it's a keep your dirty laundry in the laundry room thing.
 
#15
Joerger started burning bridges at/around the time the Williams spat became public and I think he tanked the team after the ASB. Good coach but lacks the professional skills to survive long term in any destination. I do not see him lasting with a "strong" FO.

Williams was a total tool too. This isn't a picking sides thing, it's a keep your dirty laundry in the laundry room thing.
I believe he’s similar to Malone.....but definitely more stubborn. The thing is though, he can learn from this and be better.
 
#16
Joerger started burning bridges at/around the time the Williams spat became public and I think he tanked the team after the ASB. Good coach but lacks the professional skills to survive long term in any destination. I do not see him lasting with a "strong" FO.

Williams was a total tool too. This isn't a picking sides thing, it's a keep your dirty laundry in the laundry room thing.
How did he tank the team? Bjelica's play fell off and that caused the entire team to fall off. He was top 30 in many advanced metrics for the first half of the year and then just played like garbage after that. Go back and look at the Kings stretch where they just won 6 of 8 over the last couple weeks. Bjelica played highly efficient "point forward" games in many of those wins. He's the unsung hero of this team and many people don't notice it but when he plays well, the Kings win way more often than not. Problem is that he's not that high level of a player and he can't sustain it for an entire season so the Kings will never win relying on him.

Joerger played it perfectly. Bjelica fell off and the Kings fell out of contention. After that he ramped up the minutes for Bagley and Giles and let his young players develop.

If the rumors are correct and a lot of the tension was because Joerger wanted Doncic.....I don't know how anyone could argue with that.
 
#17
If the rumors are correct and a lot of the tension was because Joerger wanted Doncic.....I don't know how anyone could argue with that.
Everyone wanted Doncic. Some of us have just accepted it and moved on.

I do think the last 10 games of the season featured about 7 that were extremely winnable including 2 of the last 3 that we dropped ... especially the last game that everyone wanted to win to get 40 wins and the Blazers were tanking until Joerger decided to throw that game. He blatantly lost us that game in the second half. And f him for doing so.
 
#18
It’s pretty common knowledge. I don’t know of any direct quotes but I believe he butted heads in Memphis so much they allowed him to seek another job while with them. But if you search there should be some articles. While here there was the Brandon Williams saga. Stuff recently reported by amick, and you can see it in plenty of his post game interviews. The guy is a good coach, but just seems like kind of a jerk to some.
He wanted a pay raise in Memphis that they were unwilling to do.
 
#19
Everyone wanted Doncic. Some of us have just accepted it and moved on.

I do think the last 10 games of the season featured about 7 that were extremely winnable including 2 of the last 3 that we dropped ... especially the last game that everyone wanted to win to get 40 wins and the Blazers were tanking until Joerger decided to throw that game. He blatantly lost us that game in the second half. And f him for doing so.
You're mad because he let his bench guys go out and get a bunch of run in the final game of the season when the team was 8 games out of the playoffs?

The team struggled until the playoffs weren't in reach and at that point you could tell they didn't play with the same tenacity they had early in the season. The final game of the season was pointless and on the road so it's not like he was depriving the fans of anything. He simply sat his starters and let guys like Swanigan and co, who hadn't played a lot, get some run in the final game of the season.

If anything I respect him for it because he could have played his starters 35min a piece and cemented himself as the first coach in umpteen amount of years to win 40 games or finish .500 in Sacramento. Instead, he let his players that didn't get to see a lot of court time, actually go out and play some bulk minutes in the final game of the season. That's a selfless coach who cares more about his players than he does these random arbitrary moral victory awards that we try to hand out.
 
#20
Who says he was even looking to get back into work? I remember hearing he wanted a break from coaching for a bit.
Exactly this. I am pretty sure I remember him saying he wanted to take some time, that he planned to stay in Sacramento with his family. Isn't he into horses or farming or something like that? There's nothing to suggest he wants to go back into coaching at this point, especially while the Kings are paying him. I believe he will get another head coaching job down the line if he wants it.

It absolutely amazes me that apparently 99% of Kings fans have bought into the PR spin by the Kings. Joerger might have been prickly and stubborn, but he was a good coach and had us overachieving. The issues he reportedly butted heads with Williams/Vlade on, it turns out he was completely right about. Shame he wasn't in a position to make the decisions and fire Williams/Vlade, because the franchise would likely be in a much better position than it is. But let's ignore all of that because apparently he's a big fat meanie.
 

SLAB

Hall of Famer
#21
Also; Once the league figured out how to play the Kings and that FAST AT ALL TIMES stopped working, the Kings crashed down to reality. Hard. Their style of play that brought one glorious half-season of mild success wasn’t sustainable.

We certainly didn’t fire a guy who’s going to be the next Mike Malone, or anything close. I would put anything on it.
 
#22
He leaked his agenda and started a PR campaign against the FO. It doesn't matter if he was right. This is thoroughly unprofessional.

And yeah firing Malone was clear classless stupidity. Joerger got himself fired.

And I'm sorry participation trophy or no, reaching .500 and then failing that the 40 win plateau was huge for the fan base and he flipped us off out the door. Damned right I am mad.
 
#23
Also; Once the league figured out how to play the Kings and that FAST AT ALL TIMES stopped working, the Kings crashed down to reality. Hard. Their style of play that brought one glorious half-season of mild success wasn’t sustainable.

We certainly didn’t fire a guy who’s going to be the next Mike Malone, or anything close. I would put anything on it.
As opposed to the coaching genius we've witnessed this season? Wasn't part of the PR spin that Walton was going to teach the team how to play in the half-court? Yeah, that didn't happen.

Regardless of whether Joerger's style was sustainable, he got the most out of a young squad that wasn't even expected to get to 38 wins. That's not an irrelevant point. And if he got who he wanted (he who can't be named), then the style of play would have been different. That's the thing about Joerger, he was actually capable of playing to his players strengths.

I'm actually more surprised at your take on this, Slab, than anyone elses. Joerger might not have been perfect but his firing was absolutely a Kangz move. Everything that has happened since then has only re-confirmed it. Just another drop in the bucket.
 
#24
He leaked his agenda and started a PR campaign against the FO. It doesn't matter if he was right. This is thoroughly unprofessional.
Link? Sorry but this is sensationalist hyperbole.


And I'm sorry participation trophy or no, reaching .500 and then failing that the 40 win plateau was huge for the fan base and he flipped us off out the door. Damned right I am mad.
Speak for yourself. I didn't feel it was huge for the fan base. If anything it's just a sign of how bad things have got in Kings land, that some arbitrary number would mean so much to some fans. It's irrelevant. I also don't believe he threw any games, I think that's a ridiculous assertion.
 
#25
How did he tank the team? Bjelica's play fell off and that caused the entire team to fall off. He was top 30 in many advanced metrics for the first half of the year and then just played like garbage after that. Go back and look at the Kings stretch where they just won 6 of 8 over the last couple weeks. Bjelica played highly efficient "point forward" games in many of those wins. He's the unsung hero of this team and many people don't notice it but when he plays well, the Kings win way more often than not. Problem is that he's not that high level of a player and he can't sustain it for an entire season so the Kings will never win relying on him.

Joerger played it perfectly. Bjelica fell off and the Kings fell out of contention. After that he ramped up the minutes for Bagley and Giles and let his young players develop.

If the rumors are correct and a lot of the tension was because Joerger wanted Doncic.....I don't know how anyone could argue with that.
It's amazing people don't see the correlation of how hard Bjelica carries the team when he plays well and how much they suck when he doesn't, even after over like 100 games of him playing it's still in total denial. You and a couple of others pick up on it, I don't think people realise how hard he's going to be to replace at his cost. He and Holmes are the only difference makers on the team this year.
 
#26
It's amazing people don't see the correlation of how hard Bjelica carries the team when he plays well and how much they suck when he doesn't, even after over like 100 games of him playing it's still in total denial. You and a couple of others pick up on it, I don't think people realise how hard he's going to be to replace at his cost. He and Holmes are the only difference makers on the team this year.
I called him a top 3 player on the team last season and got laughed at. Such is life.
 
#28
A team where Bjelica is a top-3 player isn’t a playoff team. He’s a good piece to have. A good complimentary piece. No way in hell is he a building block.
I'm not disagreeing there, but I was pointing out his value, because the team doesn't really have that many pieces that move the ball and pass like him, or have the range he does. Replacing him is going to be very difficult.
 
#29
Also; Once the league figured out how to play the Kings and that FAST AT ALL TIMES stopped working, the Kings crashed down to reality. Hard. Their style of play that brought one glorious half-season of mild success wasn’t sustainable.

We certainly didn’t fire a guy who’s going to be the next Mike Malone, or anything close. I would put anything on it.
You might want to educate yourself on his whole career.
 

SLAB

Hall of Famer
#30
You might want to educate yourself on his whole career.
Which part? Fighting his ways through the doldrums of minor league hoops, winning all the long, his Grit N Grind background in Memphis, or his amazingly successful 38 win season (seasons which legends are made here in Sac!) when he decided to play with wild pace here?