Rebuild around Ron?
- Thread starter fnordius
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fansinceday1
Starter
agree with what keena said.
I can't continue to watch a kings team with Ron Artest on it. It's an excercise in futility. It's extending the kings run at mediocrity. The sooner Artest leaves the sooner we can really start the rebuilding process. It feels like the Giants and Barry Bonds. This year it has been stated on more than one occasion by more than 1 player that it is a breath of fresh air to have that egomaniac Barry Lamar Bonds off the team once and for all. I'll bet anyone a case of beer we will hear the same from the kings. IMO his negatives far outweigh his positives. Rebuild a team around him? HELL NO, what are you smoking?
I can't continue to watch a kings team with Ron Artest on it. It's an excercise in futility. It's extending the kings run at mediocrity. The sooner Artest leaves the sooner we can really start the rebuilding process. It feels like the Giants and Barry Bonds. This year it has been stated on more than one occasion by more than 1 player that it is a breath of fresh air to have that egomaniac Barry Lamar Bonds off the team once and for all. I'll bet anyone a case of beer we will hear the same from the kings. IMO his negatives far outweigh his positives. Rebuild a team around him? HELL NO, what are you smoking?
Kingsgurl
Starter
For most of the same reasons already laid out, I do not think it wise, nor do I want us to 'rebuild around Ron' Ron will be here next year, barring his sudden desire to seek his fortune elsewhere, foregoing guaranteed money (not likely). A year in which I hope he remains on his best behavior, gets back to being the defensive presence he used to be (or can be when he wants to) and we go away from playing Ron Ball, which I find boring more often than not.
agree with what keena said.
I can't continue to watch a kings team with Ron Artest on it. It's an excercise in futility. It's extending the kings run at mediocrity. The sooner Artest leaves the sooner we can really start the rebuilding process. It feels like the Giants and Barry Bonds. This year it has been stated on more than one occasion by more than 1 player that it is a breath of fresh air to have that egomaniac Barry Lamar Bonds off the team once and for all. I'll bet anyone a case of beer we will hear the same from the kings. IMO his negatives far outweigh his positives. Rebuild a team around him? HELL NO, what are you smoking?
That's funny because Kevin Martin actually said he wanted to play with Ron as long as they could, and that he thinks they could be like Melo/AI. But hey, what does he know? He just plays for the team
It's one thing to want Ron traded because you want the team to get on with a rebuild and you don't like his 1 on 1 play at times(which Salmons is even worse at btw, if Ron hogged the ball that much he'd be crucified here) but it's another to say "I bet anyone we will hear the same from the Kings(that playing without Ron is a breath of fresh air".
Kingsgurl
Starter
Don't get me started on Shelfish.....err Salmons
Anyhow, no one is saying Ron is not a good player, rather that he is NOT a piece to build around at this point in his career, despite the player he may once have had the potential to be. Building around him would infer going out and getting players to fit HIM and his style of play and you do that with players who are going to be as productive as they are for a number of years AND who you know, or at least hope, will not implode and take your franchise with them.
Don't get me started on Shelfish.....err Salmons
Anyhow, no one is saying Ron is not a good player, rather that he is NOT a piece to build around at this point in his career, despite the player he may once have had the potential to be. Building around him would infer going out and getting players to fit HIM and his style of play and you do that with players who are going to be as productive as they are for a number of years AND who you know, or at least hope, will not implode and take your franchise with them.
I agree with you actually. I just don't agree with the guy's statement comparing Artest to Bonds about teammates wanting him gone. Especially not when Reggie went out and campaigned for him to come back and Kevin said what he did. I mean Kevin could have gave an answer like "well Ron is a good player I enjoy playing with" instead of something like "I want to play with Ron as long as we can. I think we can be like Carmelo and AI... and I'm being real honest about that". But I don't think we should build the team around him. I have no problem with not wanting to build around him(which I actually don't want to either, I think that if he stays we need him to not be the #1 option even though I like him), I just have problems with the comments people make acting like he's a bad teammate(the Bonds comparison and other comments made here in the past). That's closer to a personal attack than why we shouldn't build around him(which there are valid reasons for not wanting to do IMO, so I agree with you) IMO.
Sac.1989
Starter
Is there a difference between having ron in the starting 5 as opposed to building around ron. Does anyone have an issues with him being with us if were paying him a measly 8 mill a year for what he does? There are issues if we give him a long term contract but i think for now everythings fine. There are a few quality free agents this year that could help us. if GP can clear enough cap space we could be playoff bound before everyone here expects.
Yes. Building around him means making him your centerpiece. I wouldn't want to build this team around Beno (for instance), either. Whether they are on the team is an entirely different question.
Aenadin
Starter
rebuilding around a player who is a monster on the offensive and defensive end YES....
BUT there is a problem with artest hes a little unstable... and a lil schizo imo no disrespect with him but hes got that gangster /thug aura around him not saying hes a bad person but having a person like him is not a pretty good idea to have a team rebuilding project on
if artest still played the same way he did before that pistons brawl... man he was a darkhorse for MVP before that..
if only he can get his act together and realize to pass the ball too
BUT there is a problem with artest hes a little unstable... and a lil schizo imo no disrespect with him but hes got that gangster /thug aura around him not saying hes a bad person but having a person like him is not a pretty good idea to have a team rebuilding project on
if artest still played the same way he did before that pistons brawl... man he was a darkhorse for MVP before that..
if only he can get his act together and realize to pass the ball too
silky johnson
Prospect
Build around HIM? As in him being the centerpiece? NO!
Build with him as a nice piece to the equation? Hell yeah! He's the best defender in the NBA, bar-none!
And he does create some mismatches on offense, but I do not want him as the primary scorer, especially since we have no real low-post threat to take heat off of him.
Build with him as a nice piece to the equation? Hell yeah! He's the best defender in the NBA, bar-none!
And he does create some mismatches on offense, but I do not want him as the primary scorer, especially since we have no real low-post threat to take heat off of him.
Löwenherz
Starter
If we could somehow conjure a 20/10, tough as nails "face of the franchise" Power Forward along with a pass-first, floor general, veteran Point Guard who could run the pick and roll and take big crunch time shots then we'd be a contender with Miller, Artest and KMart.
Hmm, Stockton and Malone aren't doing anything these days. Let's give them a call.
Otherwise, rebuild, Rebuild, REBUILD from the ground up. And that includes shipping out Artest and Miller.
Hmm, Stockton and Malone aren't doing anything these days. Let's give them a call.
Otherwise, rebuild, Rebuild, REBUILD from the ground up. And that includes shipping out Artest and Miller.
Big Cuz 15
All-Star
i can't wait til this guy is outta sac. i'd take a expiring and a 2nd rounder for him.
Honestly, if we somehow wound up with a top-tier power forward like Elton Brand or Amare Stoudemire, we'd be a really solid team, even with Artest.
But we don't have the pieces or draft picks to get that elite big man without giving up at least one - if not, two - of our three most accomplished players. I'd still give up any two of the three of them for a prime-time big man, but that's probably a pipe dream.
Well, no telling whether they will fulfill their potential, but the top two players from this draft happen to be a 4 and a 1...
upinsmoke
All-Star
exactly also his style of play can fit in many differant styles of play. Also I dont think enough people see that he is the player who brings the intensity every night. Shoot I love the crazy side of the guy he's the guy that will man up to anyone and take on all challengers, I dont want any alter boys on the squad. I dont know how many of you actually played the game but sometimes a dirty type player is needed especially when the star player is a finesse player like kevin.
DirtyAcres
G-League
Until Artest can be replaced with a better player I don't see the problem with keeping him here. He is easily the best player on this mediocre team.
That's a horrible criteria. He's not the right fit for the team; keeping a player whose game runs counter to the way the coach wants to run the team and takes all the rest of his teammates out of the offense, just because he may happen to have the most talent, is faulty logic at its best.
upinsmoke
All-Star
He is not taking anyone out of the offense case and point k-mart was 7th in scoring this year, does he shoot the ball more than he should yes but I feel it was out of necessity because of the all around weaknesses the team dealt with this last year.
Unfortunately, Ron also justifies shooting too much by thinking it's necessary. And that's one of the major problems with having Ron Artest on the team. For whatever reason, he forgets things like game plans and coach's directions and takes matters into his own hands. And because he occasionally has success while doing it, he's convinced his value to the team is for him to try and out-Kobe Kobe Bryant.
That's apples and rutabagas. When Artest goes Kobe, NO ONE else touches the ball. Or, even worse, he tries to iso for about 20 seconds and then dumps it out, once it's too late for anyone else to do anything.
It's one thing to be an Artest fan. It's another to be so blind to his faults that you cannot see the forest for the trees (so to speak). There were times when it looked as though Artest actually came to his senses, realized he was hogging the ball and made a concerted effort to get his teammates back into the game. Those moments, however, were few and far between.
Part of the blame has to go to the coaching staff, who at times seemed either in awe or fear of Artest and allowed him to dominate the offense way too much.
Regardless, the results of the poll seem to be pretty clear.
That's apples and rutabagas. When Artest goes Kobe, NO ONE else touches the ball. Or, even worse, he tries to iso for about 20 seconds and then dumps it out, once it's too late for anyone else to do anything.
It's one thing to be an Artest fan. It's another to be so blind to his faults that you cannot see the forest for the trees (so to speak). There were times when it looked as though Artest actually came to his senses, realized he was hogging the ball and made a concerted effort to get his teammates back into the game. Those moments, however, were few and far between.
Part of the blame has to go to the coaching staff, who at times seemed either in awe or fear of Artest and allowed him to dominate the offense way too much.
Regardless, the results of the poll seem to be pretty clear.
upinsmoke
All-Star
The poll was created so someone can say "look at that nobody wants ron around" with a question worded the way it is. However like people have stated before in this thread Ron is a great addition to the team. I have even read people's posts reading that they dont care if the kings dont get a fair value in return for Ron in a trade HAHA kings fans or Artest haters but hey im not here to judge.
I disagree. How do you think the question is worded incorrectly for an accurate response?
"Rebuild around Ron?"
Very simple and to the point without any bias.
The answer options are equally fair - 2 for, 2 against, one neutral.
I think you are looking for bias where there is none in this instance.
Entity
Hall of Famer
I think what upinsmoke is trying to say is. No don't rebuild around Ron but, still have Ron on the team. I don't want Ron to be the focal point of the team or the leader. But I still want him on the team. Ron could be a key cog in the machine if we get the rest of the machine right. Kevin also is a key cog but, I am not saying rebuild around Kevin either. I am saying rebuild using these 2 players along with Garcia and Hawes and maybe Beno. While none of the them should be rebuilt AROUND they all could be pieces in the rebuild.
Now I admit while all this sounds good it is all null and void if any of the aformentioned players decide upon themselves that they are the #1 guy. The truth is we don't have that #1 guy. could we be the like the Pistons and not have that #1 guy? Maybe but, that is a style and system that all the players have to buy into and accept their roles.
Now I admit while all this sounds good it is all null and void if any of the aformentioned players decide upon themselves that they are the #1 guy. The truth is we don't have that #1 guy. could we be the like the Pistons and not have that #1 guy? Maybe but, that is a style and system that all the players have to buy into and accept their roles.
But that is an entirely different question.
Make another poll asking such if you are interested in that poll result, but don't accuse this one of being worded incorrectly. I think this poll was clear, consice, asked only one question and gave plenty of response possibilities for everyone to register their opinion. I don't think it was a poorly worded question at all, in fact, it couldn't be more clear.
And if that is the way he feels, his answer to this poll should be a "no". Seeing on how his answer was one of the 3 who thought it would be a "wonderful idea", you may be incorrect in your assumption on what he was thinking.
Let's be realistic. Ron Artest is incapable of being a role player on a team, regardless of what we may want. And THAT is the real problem. If he's here, especially considering the current make-up of the team, he is going to step up into the "focal point" role. Theus seems to see it that way, which doesn't help very much.
If wishes were horses, beggars would ride. What you've just said is that we have to build a team around Ron Artest in order for him to be effective. Sorry but that is NOT the kind of team I want to see.
Entity said:
If wishes were horses, beggars would ride. What you've just said is that we have to build a team around Ron Artest in order for him to be effective. Sorry but that is NOT the kind of team I want to see.
upinsmoke
All-Star
Had to show support for the guy after the overwhelming NO'S haha. Listen I dont take anything around here serious but my opinion and i can only hope Gp's as well that Ron should be around for a long time. A commitment to defense is needed to succeed just ask S.A. And yes i do feel Ron should be one of the main options on both sides of the ball. PF'S are to slow to stop him and SF'S and SG'S get out muscled he is a damn good player.
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