Poll: should the Kings match the offer for Bogi?

[sactowndog]

In addition, an attempt to get the most out of the diminished trade value for Bogi or Buddy, you have to showcase them. Which stunts the growth of the Haliburton.

good lord. How many times do we have to say 3 guard line-up which at this point we almost have to play anyway. Don’t know if you noticed but almost every free agent has been signed and we might struggle to fill a roster.

currently we have signed

Holmes (last year), Bagley (might decline option)
Bjelicia (last year), Parker (last year)
Barnes (declining contract), James.
Buddy (Declining contract)
Fox (Max deal), CoJo (last full guarantee)

it’s not like we don’t have plenty of contract space coming up

 

[The Effort Police]

One of the benefits of Bogi possibly leaving is that hopefully I won't have to read anymore of this childish, ignorant trash.

"Kings fans are the best in the league", yeah right. Go pat yourselves on the back.

I have never seen a fanbase become more toxic in regards to a player so quickly, when he hasn't even done anything wrong.

Be better.

I'm so happy we can retire that damn line.

About time we stopped acting like small market dunces. That's why we've swallowed everything this FO has put out for the last decade, never demanded anything better, and how we all got duped by a worthless PR hire like Vlade.

 

[Dime Dropper]

Mouth breather, huh? Glad we’re moving to name calling. Good post, friend.

LOL, playing the victim card after liking a post wishing for a Kings player to go back to FIBA and breakdown mid-season due to exhaustion, ill-will etc etc etc. You've posted enough vitriol over the last couple of days to take some criticism, don't go acting all sensitive now.

 

[Dime Dropper]

Again I will say I constantly defend boneheaded moves by this org so your mouth breather remark is over the top @Dime Dropper I used to have more respect for you.

Ditto, I was surprised to see you make such a spiteful post about Bogi.

 

[Dime Dropper]

There's a lengthy track record with this agent with prematurely agreeing to deals and then reneging when they sniff a better offer.

His agent is trash, that much we can agree on. However it's not at all clear that Bogi was the one that reneged on this deal and I'm not sure why it's being assumed as fact.

 

[steelevt]

One of the benefits of Bogi possibly leaving is that hopefully I won't have to read anymore of this childish, ignorant trash.

"Kings fans are the best in the league", yeah right. Go pat yourselves on the back.

I have never seen a fanbase become more toxic in regards to a player so quickly, when he hasn't even done anything wrong.

Be better.

Things are getting heated but these are your words. I’m on your side about stopping the hate but name calling weakens your stance.

 

[Tetsujin]

You couldn't be more wrong, and you didn't even address my point, but that's not a surprise. Par for the course.

First of all, check out my avatar, clearly this wouldn't be the first time it's happened to "a player I like", if what you're saying was even relevant (it's not).

Secondly, I didn't say this is the first or only time fans have had it in for certain players. What I said was, and try to read this slowly, is "I have never seen a fanbase become more toxic in regards to a player so quickly, when he hasn't even done anything wrong."

Would you care to try again, and tell me how literally any of Webber, Peja, Cisco, Moore, Cuz, or anyone else you can think of went from a generally well-liked, inoffensive player, to a detestable, hated figure seemingly overnight?

I don't even particularly like Bogi by the way, so that's a strawman. I'm just pointing out the absolute stupidity of people like you, SLAB and the other mouth-breathers who are foaming at the mouth to "like" every anti-Bogi post you come across.

First off, I breathe through my mouth because I broke my nose in an unfortunate trampoline accident when I was seven. (Watch where you’re jumping folks!)

Second, I contest that idea that Bogi and his camp have done nothing wrong in this situation.

Third, each of those dudes listed pretty much were getting trashed from the second they existed on the Kings so there wasn’t much of a chance for the shift from love to hate or whatever it is you think has happened with Bogi.

Fourth, for someone advocating against the “toxicity” of the fan base, you’re not doing much to be a force for positivity yourself.

Fifth, I’ve been driving the Bogi is overrated bandwagon for two seasons now so I’m not even trying to come at this from the stance of unbiasedness.

 

[Dime Dropper]

Things are getting heated but these are your words. I’m kinda on your side about stopping the hate but name calling weakens your stance.

You're right, I've edited my post and apologise to @SLAB, @Tetsujin, @pdxKingsFan for the insult, my frustration boiled over because I think people are being grossly unfair. It was uncalled for on my part to say that.

 

[SacTownKid]

good lord. How many times do we have to say 3 guard line-up which at this point we almost have to play anyway. Don’t know if you noticed but almost every free agent has been signed and we might struggle to fill a roster.

currently we have signed

Holmes (last year), Bagley (might decline option)
Bjelicia (last year), Parker (last year)
Barnes (declining contract), James.
Buddy (Declining contract)
Fox (Max deal), CoJo (last full guarantee)

it’s not like we don’t have plenty of contract space coming up

Wait did you just insinuate that they might decline Bagleys option? Even if his left leg falls off I wouldn't bet on it.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Ditto, I was surprised to see you make such a spiteful post about Bogi.

Please note I did not wish him a career ending injury, merely that he shows the same consistent level of inconsistency he has shown for us, and yes, that includes prioritizing national team play over NBA. I understand why that is of greater importance to non-USA players, but it still has been a net-negative for the Kings to have a guy never take an offseason to heal nagging injuries only to have his second half of the season drop off. When he is rested he always plays far, far better. It sucks.

 

[SLAB]

Please note I did not wish him a career ending injury, merely that he shows the same consistent level of inconsistency he has shown for us, and yes, that includes prioritizing national team play over NBA. I understand why that is of greater importance to non-USA players, but it still has been a net-negative for the Kings to have a guy never take an offseason to heal nagging injuries only to have his second half of the season drop off. When he is rested he always plays far, far better. It sucks.

Indeed that’s how I read it. In no way was I justifying/liking something on the basis of him to break down mid-contract and go running back to FIBA or whatever.

I just think the dude is vastly overrated and want him off the team. Lol

 

[The Effort Police]

Indeed that’s how I read it. In no way was I justifying/liking something on the basis of him to break down mid-contract and go running back to FIBA or whatever.

I just think the dude is vastly overrated and want him off the team. Lol

Same. I think he and his agent screwed us over with a dirty move, but I don't care what he does as long as he doesn't do it here. I don't like his playstyle but more important I don't like what his role portends to be in our rebuild.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

The second part of my rant was pure spite at the Atlanta org, which appears to have played a hand in pushing for the league to investigate the deal with MIL and they are as guilty of tampering in with what seems to be a pretty routine business matter as anyone. In fact if they somehow got word to Bogi or his agent that a larger offer would come, that IS tampering.

 

[The Effort Police]

I meant what I said about the fanbase though.

It's not really about whether or not we wish Bogi breaks down. Every so often when it gets a little heated that remark gets pulled out and imo it's always shifted the responsibility off the players, media, organization, etc.

That little source of pride hasn't really done anything for us other than brownie points from the org. and media who like to pat us on the head like some hyperactive puppy that's lacking in the brains department.

After the Bagley pick this fanbase grew a mean streak I've never seen before and the local media like Ham, Kayte, Matt George, etc didn't know what to do about it. The shilling and gaslighting was a lot less effective.

 

[funkykingston]

I think everybody needs to take a deep breath here.

The Kings new front office is in a bad position for sure.

There's a downside to losing Bogi for nothing and there's also a downside to paying $42 million a year for two 28 year old shooting guards on a team that hasn't had a winning record since George W Bush was president.

Ultimately one of (or likely both) Hield and Bogdanovic will have to leave the Kings. And likely without getting all that much in return.

 

[The_Jamal]

You can’t say that a guy sucks and want him off the team and then immediately turn around and assume that there will be a line of suitors waiting for him with assets in hand for a trade.

Can't wait for game 25 and everyone complaining about Haliburton playing 8 minutes a game.

 

[Livinthedream]

good lord. How many times do we have to say 3 guard line-up which at this point we almost have to play anyway. Don’t know if you noticed but almost every free agent has been signed and we might struggle to fill a roster.

currently we have signed

Holmes (last year), Bagley (might decline option)
Bjelicia (last year), Parker (last year)
Barnes (declining contract), James.
Buddy (Declining contract)
Fox (Max deal), CoJo (last full guarantee)

it’s not like we don’t have plenty of contract space coming up

No need to be frustrated with me because I'm not looking forward to a team with Bogi and Buddy on it again. The 3 guard lineup that included those 2 was used situationally throughout the season last season and it did not net a result that moved the needle.

We drafted 3 guards and I would prefer they get the playing time. Second round picks aren't usually in the rotation, but in a down year where the Kings are not pushing for the playoffs, it's the perfect opportunity to see what you have.

It's ideal to get assets back for Bogi. That's not where we are at at this point in time. In order to hold onto him, we have to swallow a contract with a poison pill. My OPINION is that Bogi is not worth it. If Monte wants to run a 3 guard lineup with Bogi, so be it. But that's not what I want to see, so I'm not going to jump on that train unless the Kings force me to.

 

[LPKingsFan]

If Monte wants to run a 3 guard lineup with Bogi, so be it. But that's not what I want to see, so I'm not going to jump on that train unless the Kings force me to.

but what if we called it the “3-guard Monte” lineup?

 

[sactowndog]

but what if we called it the “3-guard Monte” lineup?

well played.

 

[hrdboild]

I'm definitely more mad at the Atlanta front office for being the biggest jerks in the room at the end of the day than all other parties involved, but that's kindof just how business works in this country isn't it? And now that they've blown every scrap of salary cap space they had putting together a mediocre team which is going to lose in the playoffs every year, I guess they've neatly orchestrated their own punishment. Well done guys. I feel bad for Omyeka Okongwu for getting drafted into a team who lacks the patience to develop their young players and then add talent intelligently. He deserves better.

Milwaukee comes out smelling of desperation with their flurry of spending basically amounting to a very expensive swapping of deck chairs. I couldn't tell you if they're better or worse right now than they were last season but on paper I'm leaning toward worse. Holiday and Bogdanovic wouldn't have struck fear into the likes of Boston and Miami, but it was a backcourt pairing that made sense and probably the best they could do given their win-now or else ultimatum. They got screwed even worse than we did but going out and dropping $21 million on DJ "that guy is still in the league?!" Augustin was not the right way to deal with it. At least get a designated driver before leaving the bar guys, please!

So ultimately, I think we come out of this as the one team who doesn't have egg on their face. Yes losing a talented player sucks (assuming that's what happens here) but aside from leaving Bogdanovic and Giles dangling in the wind and the spectre of another season's worth of Luke Walton deer in the headlights stares from the sideline, Vlade hasn't really left much of a mess to clean up. Everyone comes off the books at the end of this season except for Barnes, Hield, Fox, Bagley, and a small chunk of Corey Joseph's last partially guaranteed year. Those Barnes and Hield contracts are mercifully front-loaded which means suffering through another season of mediocrity but it also means they become movable as early as next off-season if we choose to go that direction. In the meantime we have a slew of great prospects to prop up what might otherwise be a pretty dreary slog toward yet another draft lottery. And more importantly, we have the renewed sense of hope that comes with replacing the GM who clearly couldn't put a winning team together with a different GM who... might? We shall see. All in all, I'm pretty satisfied with our off-season so far. These are baby steps but I think we're moving in a positive direction.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

I'm definitely more mad at the Atlanta front office for being the biggest jerks in the room at the end of the day than all other parties involved, but that's kindof just how business works in this country isn't it? And now that they've blown every scrap of salary cap space they had putting together a mediocre team which is going to lose in the playoffs every year, I guess they've neatly orchestrated their own punishment. Well done guys. I feel bad for Omyeka Okongwu for getting drafted into a team who lacks the patience to develop their young players and then add talent intelligently. He deserves better.

Milwaukee comes out smelling of desperation with their flurry of spending basically amounting to a very expensive swapping of deck chairs. I couldn't tell you if they're better or worse right now than they were last season but on paper I'm leaning toward worse. Holiday and Bogdanovic wouldn't have struck fear into the likes of Boston and Miami, but it was a backcourt pairing that made sense and probably the best they could do given their win-now or else ultimatum. They got screwed even worse than we did but going out and dropping $21 million on DJ "that guy is still in the league?!" Augustin was not the right way to deal with it. At least get a designated driver before leaving the bar guys, please!

So ultimately, I think we come out of this as the one team who doesn't have egg on their face. Yes losing a talented player sucks (assuming that's what happens here) but aside from leaving Bogdanovic and Giles dangling in the wind and the spectre of another season's worth of Luke Walton deer in the headlights stares from the sideline, Vlade hasn't really left much of a mess to clean up. Everyone comes off the books at the end of this season except for Barnes, Hield, Fox, Bagley, and a small chunk of Corey Joseph's last partially guaranteed year. Those Barnes and Hield contracts are mercifully front-loaded which means suffering through another season of mediocrity but it also means they become movable as early as next off-season if we choose to go that direction. In the meantime we have a slew of great prospects to prop up what might otherwise be a pretty dreary slog toward yet another draft lottery. And more importantly, we have the renewed sense of hope that comes with replacing the GM who clearly couldn't put a winning team together with a different GM who... might? We shall see. All in all, I'm pretty satisfied with our off-season so far. These are baby steps but I think we're moving in a positive direction.

Is that not the silver lining in all this? I'm cheesed we couldn't flip Bogi for a player who would be a net-positive, but basically we just have to endure one bad year during a global pandemic to get a near complete reset, with Fox being the only mega deal on the books. I will just say that if all this is too much to stomach for some, I don't know how they would have dealt with a Hinkie type scenario, and yet so many folks pushed for just that.

 

[ESP47]

Can't wait for game 25 and everyone complaining about Haliburton playing 8 minutes a game.

Well, that's depressing to think about.

But it's probably realistic. It's kind of akin to keeping Vlade around last year. We could have gotten something for Bogdan, but that would have required Vlade admitting he failed with his rebuild. That was never going to happen and now we have to either lose him for nothing or pay big bucks for mediocrity.

Fast forward to now, we have a coach on the hot seat who is going to play the players he thinks are going to win him more games this season, rather than the players who need to develop and win games for us in the future. He's not going to be coaching for development, but rather to save his job.

Both decisions are terrible for the franchise and continue to set us back year after year.

 

[mac]

I’m guilty of it and don’t even care, but I don’t know if I’ve ever seen a player given less of a chance than Bagley. Lmao

I don't know if I've ever seen a player play less than Bagley

 

[KingsFanSince85]

IMO, anybody responding “no” to this poll just can’t see the forest for the trees.

It’s not about whether you think Bogdanovic is a good player or not. It’s not about whether you think he’s worth the new contract or not.

It’s about not allowing a player — who clearly has value to numerous teams — to leave without compensation.

Successful businesses don’t give value away for free.

Keep the guy and figure out a way make it work. If he’s not a good fit, they can trade him down the line. Whenever rules permit it.

Or trade another player of value who is less of a fit than Bogdan.

What you don’t do is allow a player whose skill set is highly valued in today’s game walk away for nothing.

Find a way to get a return.

 

[sactowndog]

His agent is trash, that much we can agree on. However it's not at all clear that Bogi was the one that reneged on this deal and I'm not sure why it's being assumed as fact.

actually Amick said Milwaukee changed it. Not sure why people are mad at Bogi. His value was clearly more than we could offer under the CBA. Everyone knew this day was coming. We should all be thankful it’s not 20-22M which it easily could have been.

 

[sactowndog]

Well, that's depressing to think about.

But it's probably realistic. It's kind of akin to keeping Vlade around last year. We could have gotten something for Bogdan, but that would have required Vlade admitting he failed with his rebuild. That was never going to happen and now we have to either lose him for nothing or pay big bucks for mediocrity.

Fast forward to now, we have a coach on the hot seat who is going to play the players he thinks are going to win him more games this season, rather than the players who need to develop and win games for us in the future. He's not going to be coaching for development, but rather to save his job.

Both decisions are terrible for the franchise and continue to set us back year after year.

Bogi at 18M is not paying big bucks or an overpay. We payed Buddy over 20 with incentives for similar numbers

this fan base is the most fickle least fact base I have seen.

We are about to pay Fox $32M a year and he has a 114 defensive rating with a 51.3 EFG%. Hopefully it’s a good return but it is a way bigger risk than Bogi’s deal. But not a peep about that let’s all pile on Bogi instead.

 

[hrdboild]

We've arrived at the place all rebuilding teams eventually arrive at which is the "something's gotta give" phase. We could stay the course, pay everybody, and keep building or if we're closer to a rebuild than a championship we'll have to prioritize and plan for the future. If we didn't already have Barnes and Hield signed to big money contracts this is an easy match. If we didn't just draft a combo guard and extend Fox for 4 more years this is probably still an easy match. But taking both of those circumstances together, I don't see how we can afford to handicap our payroll flexibility while simultaneously burying our young potential stud in the rotation. That's the forest I'm looking at right now.

It really isn't about Bogi either. A lot of people have said they're in favor of matching this offer if we can move Buddy Hield. I'm sure that's what McNair is exploring right now. The Fox deal is an overpay but the alternative is losing him as some other team will happily give him that contract. Given the choice between overpaying Fox and losing him, I'd prefer the overpay. And no I don't think trading him for draft picks is a good alternative either. Given our lottery history, there's no guarantee we'd draft a similar talent given a half dozen top 5 picks. So yeah I voted no but it's not because I'm mad at Bogi or because I think Buddy is significantly better. Our most prudent course of action right now in our current circumstance is to remain flexible enough to hit the eject button mid-season if things are looking dire and keep rebuilding with the draft. Haliburton slipping to us opened up the possibility of shifting our championship window a few years younger and I don't want to agree to a contract that takes that option off the table.

 

[Livinthedream]

Bogi at 18M is not paying big bucks or an overpay. We payed Buddy over 20 with incentives for similar numbers

this fan base is the most fickle least fact base I have seen.

We are about to pay Fox $32M a year and he has a 114 defensive rating with a 51.3 EFG%. Hopefully it’s a good return but it is a way bigger risk than Bogi’s deal. But not a peep about that let’s all pile on Bogi instead.

I will go on the record and say the Fox deal makes me nervous. Not saying we shouldn't have done it.

We knew that contract was coming though. The thing the team doesn't want to do is start stacking high dollar contracts on top of each other and continue to be a sub .500 team.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

We've arrived at the place all rebuilding teams eventually arrive at which is the "something's gotta give" phase. We could stay the course, pay everybody, and keep building or if we're closer to a rebuild than a championship we'll have to prioritize and plan for the future. If we didn't already have Barnes and Hield signed to big money contracts this is an easy match. If we didn't just draft a combo guard and extend Fox for 4 more years this is probably still an easy match. But taking both of those circumstances together, I don't see how we can afford to handicap our payroll flexibility while simultaneously burying our young potential stud in the rotation. That's the forest I'm looking at right now.

1000x this. And agree if we can somehow move Buddy it's a bit of a like for like that won't hamper Halliburton's development. But otherwise we're going to bury him behind two guys that are incompatible on the court together but "have" to get minutes because of their pay. Obviously Monte has a lot of work cut out for the next day and a half. But matching the deal just from a FOMO of some future deal is exactly the kind of move bad teams make.

 

[SacTownKid]

IMO, anybody responding “no” to this poll just can’t see the forest for the trees.

It’s not about whether you think Bogdanovic is a good player or not. It’s not about whether you think he’s worth the new contract or not.

It’s about not allowing a player — who clearly has value to numerous teams — to leave without compensation.

Successful businesses don’t give value away for free.

Keep the guy and figure out a way make it work. If he’s not a good fit, they can trade him down the line. Whenever rules permit it.

Or trade another player of value who is less of a fit than Bogdan.

What you don’t do is allow a player whose skill set is highly valued in today’s game walk away for nothing.

Find a way to get a return.

For me it's situation and fit. The SG spot debacle is just that, a debacle. Choosing the guy Vivek anointed the next Steph Curry and seeing if he can regain some value or lift this team to where it needs to be is the wise choice to me. We already know even without their supposed franchise altering draft pick it wasn't going to work. Bogdan could very well be worth his deal, the question that Vlade never asked himself when signing the George Hills and Dedmons of the world was how much is he worth here? That's all that matters if you are just going to end up trashing value somewhere anyway. If the Kings dominated the bubble and looked like they were playoff ready you do it in a heartbeat, they didn't. So the question is whether or not Bogdan is the difference maker. He wasn't last year, or the year before. So....

Simply looking at things from the perspective of "value" isn't doing you any favors if you are trying to field a competitive team. Doing so means you build around a core group. Fox is clearly the one they feel is the head of that core. They think they just drafted another part of it. I'm sure they want Bagley to live up to his potential. Where Buddy sits? We'll find out. All I know is from watching the other teams not suck his type is one of the most valuable in all of the NBA right now.