Old Trade Thread (no longer need to post all trades here)

[Bricklayer]

Playmaker...you just go all silly every single time anything is mentioned which in any way compromises Reef as starter on this team. You've got a real problem.

In this half season you have asked for Bibby to be traded, Miller to be traded, Kenny to be traded, Bonzi to be traded, all for better people to work around your man, or to get people out of his way. Oh yeah, Rick to be fired. the offense to be changed to a Reef in the post centric one. Its just silly.

And now you would turn down an:
C- Miller
PF- Garnett
SF- Artest
OG- Martin
PG- Bibby

6th- Garcia
7th- KT

lineup for the same reasons. Because it doesn't involve Reef. Do you know how many people in the NBA without ulterior motives turn down that deal? None. Zero. Zip. That's just a flat out nasty lineup.

Its just silly. I think the best thing that will happen for your basketball analytical ability is when Reef finally retires and frees you up to look at things without the goggles.

 

[piksi]

Playmaker...you just go all silly every single time anything is mentioned which in any way compromises Reef as starter on this team. You've got a real problem.

In this half season you have asked for Bibby to be traded, Miller to be traded, Kenny to be traded, Bonzi to be traded, all for better people to work around your man, or to get people out of his way. Oh yeah, Rick to be fired. the offense to be changed to a Reef in the post centric one. Its just silly.

And now you would turn down an:
C- Miller
PF- Garnett
SF- Artest
OG- Martin
PG- Bibby

6th- Garcia
7th- KT

lineup for the same reasons. Because it doesn't involve Reef. Do you know how many people in the NBA without ulterior motives turn down that deal? None. Zero. Zip. That's just a flat out nasty lineup.

Its just silly. I think the best thing that will happen for your basketball analytical ability is when Reef finally retires and frees you up to look at things without the goggles.

Bench looks kinda thin considering the injury to Garnett which we all know that would happen

 

[Bricklayer]

Bench looks kinda thin considering the injury to Garnett which we all know that would happen

Injury sarcasm noted.

Nonetheless. Nothing's changed. KT starts. Corliss steps up into a larger role. Skinner didn't play even with Reef out. Sampson can not play just as well.

And while its not happening, there is not a single better lineup that we could possibly acquire this year. So you go with it. And add a few depth players in the offseason. We already have firsthand experience with the "bench isn't winng a title" thing anyway. So who cares.

 

[piksi]

Injury sarcasm noted.

Nonetheless. Nothing's changed. KT starts. Corliss steps up into a larger role. Skinner didn't play even with Reef out. Sampson can not play just as well.

And while its not happening, there is not a single better lineup that we could possibly acquire this year. So you go with it. And add a few depth players in the offseason. We already have firsthand experience with the "bench isn't winng a title" thing anyway. So who cares.

final question - Why would Wolves do it ?

 

[Bricklayer]

final question - Why would Wolves do it ?

Because of my letter silly.

I can be very persuasive.

 

[piksi]

Because of my letter silly.

I can be very persuasive.

so how many McHale family members are You holding hostage at the moment ?

 

[Kev.in]

Artest and Garnett together, playing their home games at ARCO would be too intense for the rest of the NBA to handle. A petition declaring "No Fair!" would be passed around the front offices of the Western Conference, signed and sent in to David Stern.

 

[playmaker0017]

Playmaker...you just go all silly every single time anything is mentioned which in any way compromises Reef as starter on this team. You've got a real problem.

All I've said is that I think this team can succeed as it is AND that this trade isn't even worth discussing.

In this half season you have asked for Bibby to be traded

And cited reasons. Mainly defensive liability and not enough PG type play.

Miller to be traded

Defensive liability.

Kenny to be traded

Do I need to actually justify that one?

Bonzi to be traded

I don't remember wanting Bonzi gone except for any other reason than to get us Ron Artest.

And now you would turn down an:
C- Miller
PF- Garnett
SF- Artest
OG- Martin
PG- Bibby

6th- Garcia
7th- KT

Yeah, probably.

The bench is weak and Garnett can't make up for that. He hasn't been able to do it on talented teams. His salary is TOO loaded.

This isn't Reef-centric. I'd love Reef to get traded to where he has no choice but to be a primary option ... so I'm not arguing from that perspective.

I think it wouldn't necessarily make this team that much better than using the 3 roster spaces that Garnett's salary would take up to get some solid Doug Christie-like roleplayers.

I think the best thing that will happen for your basketball analytical ability is when Reef finally retires and frees you up to look at thing without the goggles.

That's probably true.

 

[nbrans]

The real question is, would you do it if Bibby were included?

Sacramento Trade Breakdown
Outgoing
Corliss Williamson
6-7 SF from Arkansas
4.1 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.4 apg in 11.0 minutes
Bonzi Wells
6-5 SG from Ball State
14.6 ppg, 7.9 rpg, 3.1 apg in 34.4 minutes
Mike Bibby
6-1 PG from Arizona
20.9 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 5.5 apg in 38.3 minutes
Incoming
Earl Watson
6-1 PG from UCLA
7.9 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 3.6 apg in 22.3 minutes
Kevin Garnett
6-11 PF from Farragut Academy (HS)
21.8 ppg, 11.4 rpg, 4.5 apg in 39.1 minutes
Change in team outlook: -9.9 ppg, +0.2 rpg, and -0.9 apg.


Denver Trade Breakdown
Outgoing
Nene Hilario
6-11 PF from Brazil (Foreign)
0.0 ppg, 0.0 rpg, 0.0 apg in 2.0 minutes
Earl Watson
6-1 PG from UCLA
7.9 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 3.6 apg in 22.3 minutes
Incoming
Bonzi Wells
6-5 SG from Ball State
14.6 ppg, 7.9 rpg, 3.1 apg in 34.4 minutes
Change in team outlook: +6.7 ppg, +6.1 rpg, and -0.5 apg.


Minnesota Trade Breakdown
Outgoing
Kevin Garnett
6-11 PF from Farragut Academy (HS)
21.8 ppg, 11.4 rpg, 4.5 apg in 39.1 minutes
Incoming
Corliss Williamson
6-7 SF from Arkansas
4.1 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.4 apg in 11.0 minutes
Mike Bibby
6-1 PG from Arizona
20.9 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 5.5 apg in 38.3 minutes
Nene Hilario
6-11 PF from Brazil (Foreign)
0.0 ppg, 0.0 rpg, 0.0 apg in 2.0 minutes
Change in team outlook: +3.2 ppg, -6.3 rpg, and +1.4 apg.

 

[piksi]

The real question is, would you do it if Bibby were included?

Sacramento Trade Breakdown
Outgoing
Corliss Williamson
6-7 SF from Arkansas
4.1 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.4 apg in 11.0 minutes
Bonzi Wells
6-5 SG from Ball State
14.6 ppg, 7.9 rpg, 3.1 apg in 34.4 minutes
Mike Bibby
6-1 PG from Arizona
20.9 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 5.5 apg in 38.3 minutes
Incoming
Earl Watson
6-1 PG from UCLA
7.9 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 3.6 apg in 22.3 minutes
Kevin Garnett
6-11 PF from Farragut Academy (HS)
21.8 ppg, 11.4 rpg, 4.5 apg in 39.1 minutes
Change in team outlook: -9.9 ppg, +0.2 rpg, and -0.9 apg.


Denver Trade Breakdown
Outgoing
Nene Hilario
6-11 PF from Brazil (Foreign)
0.0 ppg, 0.0 rpg, 0.0 apg in 2.0 minutes
Earl Watson
6-1 PG from UCLA
7.9 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 3.6 apg in 22.3 minutes
Incoming
Bonzi Wells
6-5 SG from Ball State
14.6 ppg, 7.9 rpg, 3.1 apg in 34.4 minutes
Change in team outlook: +6.7 ppg, +6.1 rpg, and -0.5 apg.


Minnesota Trade Breakdown
Outgoing
Kevin Garnett
6-11 PF from Farragut Academy (HS)
21.8 ppg, 11.4 rpg, 4.5 apg in 39.1 minutes
Incoming
Corliss Williamson
6-7 SF from Arkansas
4.1 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 0.4 apg in 11.0 minutes
Mike Bibby
6-1 PG from Arizona
20.9 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 5.5 apg in 38.3 minutes
Nene Hilario
6-11 PF from Brazil (Foreign)
0.0 ppg, 0.0 rpg, 0.0 apg in 2.0 minutes
Change in team outlook: +3.2 ppg, -6.3 rpg, and +1.4 apg.

Kings would do it in a second

Nuggets would maybe do it if there is a draft pick

Wolves would not do it because they are giving a superstar for pretty much nothing - they are not getting better and they are not rebuilding -kinda like Knicks west

 

[playmaker0017]

The real question is, would you do it if Bibby were included?

While it is an interesting scenario - I just don't think I'd do it. Would the organization? Probably.

But, I still think that the salary just makes it undoable. By trading Bibby for Watson (even though Watson, imo, is a better true PG), you lose all outside threat. You'd rely on a maturing Martin and a sporadic Artest for your outside stroke.

Garnett would require either starting at PF or at C, which places either Reef or Miller on the bench. That's just a waste of salary in either case. And a lineup of: PG - Watson, SG - Artest, SF - Reef, PF - Garnett, C - Miller scares no one from outside. So the lane would become a clogged artery.

So, no, I probably wouldn't do it. Though, I will admit, I was excited at the possibility of Reef going to Minnesota last year.

 

[whozit]

Like that one better. But don't know if Brick has any room for more "guests."

Brick?

 

[kingkung]

I've said this before... chances are, we'll have to wait a year before the Wolves will consider trading Garnett. They have some new players, and they'll want to see how the team works. When it inevitably fails (something that happens when Mark Blount is your starting center), then maybe discussions will be semi-legit.

Minnesota trading Garnett is similar to the Pacers trading Reggie Miller (which never happened), or the Hawks training 'Nique (which, surprisingly, did happen)... superb franchise players for not-so-exalted franchises. Does Garnett want to leave the T-Wolves? It's tough to say.

 

[Kings113]

Star Tribune - The Wolves still are trying to make a deal for a big man who can help Kevin Garnett rebound inside.

Guard Marko Jaric, who hasn't played in the past two games, could be part of a deal. The Wolves have nine of their next 11 games at home.

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/39074/20060210/wolves_trying_to_get_bigger_offering_jaric/

Might be too bad because he is wanted for what we need another of. Unless they'd take KT.

 

[Bricklayer]

Like that one better. But don't know if Brick has any room for more "guests."

Brick?

Nope. Well, you still do it because you basically trade anybody and everybody to team up Artest and KG. But the first way is far preferable.

KG/Reef/KT all stacked makes no sense, and you trade Bibby you lose a lot of the balancing outside shooting. Not to mention clutch ability and big game experience.


In any case, its a seller's market when it comes to KG. I merely wrote a letter proposing the best that a buyer could hope for. Its the move you make without hesitation, and then you patch any holes afterward. But Minnesota can ask and receive offers from every single team in the league for a man who is a first ballot HOFer and soon to join the 60 best to ever play the game list. We simply remain a team with spare assets, a messed up PF position, and the remnants of an offensive system perfectly tailored to KG. In other words the team where he is a perfect fit for US, although he's pretty much a perfect fit wherever he goes.

 

[foretaz]

im not sure if its been mentioned....but i wonder if denver would consider trading nene and lenard for bonzi....

 

[ParniValjak]

im not sure if its been mentioned....but i wonder if denver would consider trading nene and lenard for bonzi....

I am not sure whether Nene and Lenard has been mentioned but there have definetly been a few mentions of Nene and Watson for Bonzi.

 

[foretaz]

I am not sure whether Nene and Lenard has been mentioned but there have definetly been a few mentions of Nene and Watson for Bonzi.

that would probably be wishful thinking....just dont see any way denver gives up both those guys for bonzi....

could also consider trading bonzi and KT for martin and watson....maybe throw in hart....that might be one of the few deals that KTs contract would actually be acceptable....

 

[BMiller52]

that would probably be wishful thinking....just dont see any way denver gives up both those guys for bonzi....

could also consider trading bonzi and KT for martin and watson....maybe throw in hart....that might be one of the few deals that KTs contract would actually be acceptable....

That's awesome. I would seriously do that deal, in fact, I've been wanting that deal or something similar for a while. Kenyon is awesome, I would love to get him.

 

[Bricklayer]

Kenyon is a 6'8" undersized tweener like all the rest of our guys, with a bum knee and a ridiculous contract. There is a reason nobody really wants him. That's a tremendous risk.

 

[BMiller52]

His health is better now. The reason he didn't play thursday was because he and Karl are pissed at eachother(atleast what I've heard from Denver fans). Kenyon is 6'9'' with tons of athleticism, swagger, etc. He is a great post defender and shotblocker, not to mention he's one of the best dunkers in the league. He's not a bad rebounder, it's that he's had bad health earlier in the year and plays with Camby. His RPG would probably go up since Brad isn't exactly a Camby when it comes to rebounding.

 

[foretaz]

Kenyon is a 6'8" undersized tweener like all the rest of our guys, with a bum knee and a ridiculous contract. There is a reason nobody really wants him. That's a tremendous risk.

cmon brick...

while one might be able to argue hes undersized, hes definitely not a tweener and definitely not like the rest of ur guys...

hes a power forward...with the emphasis on power....hes one of the better post defenders in the league....that is nothing like SAR and KT...

while his contract might be ridiculous, its no more ridiculous than KT's...and if u could manage a swap involving both it would not be so bad....

a front line of miller, martin and artest would definitely be formidable...

and if u get watson and martin u pretty much have become a very, very solid defensive team....

of course its a risk...but thats the position the kings are in.....look at artest...look at bonzi....now they could very well lose bonzi....if u could ship him out along with KT and get watson and martin, u do it quick before anyone changes their minds

 

[ParniValjak]

Kenyon is a 6'8" undersized tweener like all the rest of our guys, with a bum knee and a ridiculous contract. There is a reason nobody really wants him. That's a tremendous risk.

Well said.

We traded a legit star PF with a bad knee and a bad contract for 3 tweeners. Making a trade for Martin would be a huge step backwards and an enourmous risk.

Martin is NOT what we need. He is a tweener with bad knee and a huge contract. I'll pass thanks.

 

[BMiller52]

How the heck is he a tweener? He doesn't play small forward, I seriously doubt you guys ever watch the nuggets. He's pretty much a pure PF, but when Camby was out I saw him play a few mins at center. His knee is getting better, he had jumpers knee or somethin and had surgery on it in the offseason. For the first time this season, he is pretty much healthy. Let me ask you, could a gimpy guy do this:

I can't believe you guys honestly think that he is a gimpy 6'8'' tweener. He doesn't play small forward at all, he's 6'9'', same height as Reef, more athletic, etc. He is one of the best post defending PF's in the game. He's an awesome shotblocker and his rebounding is decent, but he plays next to Camby(much better rebounder than Brad).

 

[playmaker0017]

Wow.

Getting Kenyon would make this the most volatile team in the league.

Kenyon, Artest, Bonzi ...

hmmm...

Might as well just go pick up Rodman's contract and see if you could trade for one more freak.

 

[Kev.in]

How the heck is he a tweener? He doesn't play small forward, I seriously doubt you guys ever watch the nuggets. He's pretty much a pure PF, but when Camby was out I saw him play a few mins at center. His knee is getting better, he had jumpers knee or somethin and had surgery on it in the offseason. For the first time this season, he is pretty much healthy. Let me ask you, could a gimpy guy do this:

I can't believe you guys honestly think that he is a gimpy 6'8'' tweener. He doesn't play small forward at all, he's 6'9'', same height as Reef, more athletic, etc. He is one of the best post defending PF's in the game. He's an awesome shotblocker and his rebounding is decent, but he plays next to Camby(much better rebounder than Brad).

"Jumper's knee" haha. Good one. Do they always do that microfracture surgery for "jumper's knee"?

I think I'd prefer an awesome shotblocker that blocks more than 1.3 shots a game.

He's a pretty good player, but for that salary it's a stupid move. You people didn't learn over the summer. He's marginally better than Shareef who is marginally better than Kenny. Shareef wasn't making a difference and you're not getting a difference maker from a guy that's a micron better than him.

 

[LoungeLizard]

"I think I'd prefer an awesome shotblocker that blocks more than 1.3 shots a game.

Shawn Bradley is an awesome shot blocker that blocks more than 1.3 shots per game. Plus he's 7' 6" so we don't have to worry about him being a "tweener". I'm sure we could coax him out of retirement.

 

[Kings113]

St. Paul Pioneer Press - Timberwolves point guard Marko Jaric's frustration bubbled over, the former starter saying coach Dwane Casey hamstrung him with a lack of playing time that helped lead to his demotion.

"I feel like when he wanted somebody else to give the role to, he made me kind of give up the role …" Jaric said before Friday night's 94-80 loss to Utah at Target Center.

Jaric's comments came after he was informed of Casey's assertion that the veteran was given a fair chance to maintain the starting job.

Jaric didn't play in either of the previous two games after being demoted following a 109-77 loss last Saturday at Golden State. He started the first 46 games of the season but was averaging just 20.5 minutes a game in the first eight games since a multi-player trade with Boston on Jan. 26, not including Friday's meeting with the Jazz.

Jaric played seven minutes Friday night and did not score.

"When he wanted to give me a chance to play the point guard, I played the point guard position," Jaric said. "As soon as he thought that I'm not supposed to be the point guard for the team, he wanted to kind of prove to himself that I'm not supposed to play. I went from playing 30 minutes a game to 10 minutes a game. I couldn't even do anything in those 10 minutes a game."

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/39091/20060211/jaric_says_he_was_unfairly_demoted/

He gone

 

[Kings113]

ESPN - Lost amid all of the above was Denver's willingness to send Nene to the Magic in the proposed deal. The Nuggets clearly realize it'll likely be too expensive to match offers Nene receives in the offseason as a restricted free agent, with Chicago, Atlanta and Toronto all expected to make big bids even though the Brazilian is out for the season with a knee tear.

So the Nuggets are looking to move Nene now, with the backup hope that they'll be able to get something for him in a summertime sign-and-trade if nothing materializes before the deadline.

http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/39094/20060211/nuggets_look_to_move_nene_now/

 

[BMiller52]

Kenyon is marginally better than Shareef? LMAO. More like-much better than Shareef and Kenny. Shotblocking-Kenyon. Defense-Kenyon. Athleticism-Kenyon. Rebounding-Kenyon(well maybe not vs Kenny). It's not even if he's marginally better, it's that he fits better. This team has a ton of talent, our record should be reversed. But we have no shotblocker/rebounder/athletic post defender up front and that will lose you plenty of games.