New Plan Could be Gamechanger for Sacramento Kings

[Warhawk]

I've never been a regular reader of the Bee but the many times I have read it I haven't noticed the degree of anti Kings or anti Maloofs sentiment that people often talk about. Can anyone name any specific stories where they crossed the line or engaged in character assassination? I'm just curious what exactly folks like Napear are referring to when they the say Bee is responsible for turning people against the Maloofs and the Kings.

AV, Marcos Breton, and RE Graswich all hammered the Kings over the years. IIRC, you are a young feller where I am pushing 40. I grew up reading the Bee articles. A lot of the negative stuff is older, but I know that stuff sticks with newspaper readers. Frankly, it seems like the last year or two the Bee seems to have realized that if the Kings leave they lose the major sports franchise in town and backed off the negativity a bit.

Do you remember AV "misquoting" Landry before he was traded? That was mild by comparison. MSE was hammered over the burger commercial (come on, really? a commercial for a burger joint?). They were always hammered for being "billionares" when they were not. They were hammered for not being local. Webber was hammered. Bibby was hammered. JWill was hammered. You couldn't avoid negative pieces. AV wrote about Peja's "rippling, glistening muscles" and basically continued to embarass herself professionally. It was just pathetic.

But the memory of those articles sticks with folks, especially those that might not have a strong opinion on the Kings to begin with. That is part of what you are seeing in the Bee article responses now.

 

[RookieOfTheDay]

AV, Marcos Breton, and RE Graswich all hammered the Kings over the years. IIRC, you are a young feller where I am pushing 40. I grew up reading the Bee articles. A lot of the negative stuff is older, but I know that stuff sticks with newspaper readers. Frankly, it seems like the last year or two the Bee seems to have realized that if the Kings leave they lose the major sports franchise in town and backed off the negativity a bit.

Do you remember AV "misquoting" Landry before he was traded? That was mild by comparison. MSE was hammered over the burger commercial (come on, really? a commercial for a burger joint?). They were always hammered for being "billionares" when they were not. They were hammered for not being local. Webber was hammered. Bibby was hammered. JWill was hammered. You couldn't avoid negative pieces. AV wrote about Peja's "rippling, glistening muscles" and basically continued to embarass herself professionally. It was just pathetic.

But the memory of those articles sticks with folks, especially those that might not have a strong opinion on the Kings to begin with. That is part of what you are seeing in the Bee article responses now.

I wish I was a young feller. Let's just say i'm closer to 40 than I am to 30...yikes! I've just never been a big newspaper reader. Even when i worked for the bee and got free papers i only occasionally bothered to read them. I am familiar with the Carl's Jr. thing, though. If I'm not mistaken, wasn't the criticism over that because folks thought they used poor judgment in how they portrayed themselves? That seems like a legit criticism to me. Class envy is a very real thing and they should have known that an ad like that could alienate a lot of working class people. Or at the very least, their advisors should have known it.

 

[Larry David]

Thursday, Jim Crandel seemed to back away from “the money is in place” talking point and clarified the group knows where to get the money. That’s a pretty huge distinction. For example, the convergence plan wasn’t funded, but they knew where to get the money – from Cal Expo. We’ve seen this before – the tax payers, the city, rezoning farm land to residential, an Native American tribe … all of plans knew how to get the money – if somebody else put up the funds.

I think the story in the Bee today, shows that the money is not in place. This plan has been around for over a year. Today, Mark Kreidler said people had vaguely talked to him about this plan before this week – and because it appears to require funding from the “city of Sacramento, the county, and perhaps other counties” it’s a huge long shot … and he’s the positive Rise Guy on the arena issue

This plan would appear to require – not just a vote by the city and county. But a string of votes – where most, or all, would need to fall our way. It’s a great idea, because the group isn’t asking the city or one county to carry the full burden. At the same time, it becomes a huge long shot, because you need a series of long shots to break your way. It’s like a parlay card with 4-5 long shot bets.

Therefore, this has to be proposed, studied, and voted on several times. Maloofs go the board of governors in three weeks, and this group doesn’t have anything scheduled for a meeting, let alone a vote, before the City, Sacramento County, Placer County, Yolo County, ect. ect. This was probably the right way to fund the arena, but beyond its likelihood for success, there is no way this will be ready by April.

There is still hope that the Maloofs might say – this is a good plan – lets give them another year … but you’ve got to assume that you’ll get funding from several counties … who at this point, haven’t moved forward an inch over a decade. If I were the Maloofs, I wouldn’t risk having to lower my offers to Fox and the Honda center next spring to bid under the Hornets, who might also be able to move and looking at Anaheim. Thus, unless Anaheim drops the ball, I don’t think we get another year.

Therefore, based upon the limited information at this time, this is another unfunded plan, and it won’t be funded before April 18.

 

[kennadog]

I don't think we can judge this mystery plan when we have no details at all. While I'd like it to be something realistic, I'm not holding my breath.

However, if it is multi-jurisdicational, what would be most lilkely would be to create some kind of joint powers authority. Its been done for various purposes, including building sports venues. The venue would then be financed and owned by the joint powers authority. Such an authority could authroize and sell tax-exempt bonds to raise financing.

Somehow, I don't think this plan can be that complicated, however. Not if they really think they can offer the Maloofs a good enough reason not to leave.

 

[Larry David]

Kenna, once again, for helping focus my point. While I did judge the plan, my primary point was the Bee Story seems to point to a JPA. If that's the case, and it's the only "facts" we have right now, the plan is not currently funded and has almost no shot of being funded before mid-April.

 

[Larry David]

Should we get one more year, we've got two plans with good people going forward and people speeding to a hard deadline. But it remains to be seem if we get another year.

 

[JB_kings]

Kenna, once again, for helping focus my point. While I did judge the plan, my primary point was the Bee Story seems to point to a JPA. If that's the case, and it's the only "facts" we have right now, the plan is not currently funded and has almost no shot of being funded before mid-April.

Well now I assume that those who are working on this do know all those very obvious pitfalls. And they wouldn't waste their time or the Maloofs. Maybe in the absence of actual details from the source, I'll wait on bringing all my guns out. Sorry but the only facts I took away from Voison's article was names. The rest was probably drawn from conversations that could have taken place long ago and may not even be relevant.

 

[pshn80]

Well now I assume that those who are working on this do know all those very obvious pitfalls. And they wouldn't waste their time or the Maloofs. Maybe in the absence of actual details from the source, I'll wait on bringing all my guns out. Sorry but the only facts I took away from Voison's article was names. The rest was probably drawn from conversations that could have taken place long ago and may not even be relevant.

I agree. Nothing new since the Crandall original report.

Incedentally, a number of people on here need to apologize to Crandall.

I'm hopeful despite the late date that some real work that is going on will sway the Maloofs. Good reporting Crandall and Voison. Thanks. Keep it up, I'm waiting.

 

[pshn80]

Well now I assume that those who are working on this do know all those very obvious pitfalls. And they wouldn't waste their time or the Maloofs. Maybe in the absence of actual details from the source, I'll wait on bringing all my guns out. Sorry but the only facts I took away from Voison's article was names. The rest was probably drawn from conversations that could have taken place long ago and may not even be relevant.

I agree. Nothing new since the Crandall original report.

Incidentally, a number of people on here need to apologize to Crandall.

I'm hopeful despite the late date that some real work that is going on will sway the Maloofs. Good reporting Crandall and Voison. Thanks. Keep it up, I'm waiting.

 

[John Galt]

Incedentally, a number of people on here need to apologize to Crandall.

For what? I stand by every criticism I've leveled at Crandell. He is just showboating with non-news, all dressed up to appear as "big news"... all the while building up plausible deniability.

He should not have tried to "break the story" until he was prepared to "tell the story".

 

[Larry David]

For what? I stand by every criticism I've leveled at Crandell. He is just showboating with non-news, all dressed up to appear as "big news"... all the while building up plausible deniability.

He should not have tried to "break the story" until he was prepared to "tell the story".

Yup.

After all of the extended Voison is a bad jouralist over the Landry story talk and blind item ESPN bashing over the years here, the support of Crandell blind item no fact rumor... leads me to believe some people either don't understand what real news reporting is ... or the pump up or knock down news just to fit the news into their view of the team.

 

[Tomcat]

Interesting...


Kings owner: No contact with group behind Sacramento arena plan

Read more: http://blogs.sacbee.com/sports/kings/archives/2011/03/kings-owner-no.html#ixzz1HdVEBuW4
​

 

[pdxKingsFan]

He flat out came clean and said why he "broke the story" without "telling the story" last night - it was to drive the narrative which had gone completely to the Sacramento Kings are now the Anaheim Royals and will be playing in Honda in October. The new media understands that they are capable of making the news these days - a decade of negative media coverage of the Kings is what doomed us to this outcome to begin with. At least he's honest about it, frankly I applaud him for it.

 

[Larry David]

Maybe a JPA remodel? Yeesh

http://blogs.sacbee.com/sports/kings/archives/2011/03/kings-owner-no.html#

As for a Crandell apology. The Bee story seems to cast a lot of doubt on talking point 2 - that "the money is in place."

While they've talked, the most recent report and the idea of a remod makes the "Maloofs are interested talking point very questionable.

If Jimmy said, there is another plan out there, the people pushing it have talked to the Maloofs, and they might be able to get funding.

 

[ArcoKings]

When I first saw the Fox report video I got very excited. Now that I've absorbed the little information that we have to examine my excitement has shrunk considerably because the main issue here is time. The clock is ticking. I would assume that a funding plan cannot be implemented in less than 30 days. Only a plan for financing and then everything must be checked to verify the feasibility of such a plan. The proposed plan might require that the Kings stay in Sacramento for one more season to see if it would work unless a plan has already been drafted for some time but it was shelved due to political reasons or whatever. My thinking is that at the same time the Maloofs may lose their chance at moving to Anaheim because they might have some competition with other teams like the Hornets, Grizzlies. I doubt Samueli would not invite the Maloofs back to reopen negotiations in a year but terms may change with the 'present' deal especially if another franchise wants to move to Anaheim. Big time decisions for the Kings.Anyways. What an emotional rolle-rcoaster. I wish we had more information but these things are very complex and expensive.

 

[Tomcat]

I guess Jim Crandall is in the process of writing something for fox40.com:


I just got up...I know it's almost 11!...to find the Bee has chased down my Wednesday story on the alternative plan to save the Kings..
http://twitter.com/JimCrandell/statuses/51339786123886592

 

[JB_kings]

For what? I stand by every criticism I've leveled at Crandell. He is just showboating with non-news, all dressed up to appear as "big news"... all the while building up plausible deniability.

He should not have tried to "break the story" until he was prepared to "tell the story".

So enlighten me on why Crandell deserves your criticism. Run down his whole history of showboating incorrect info. Go back to before he was a sports guy and before he anchored the news and when he did sports after he came here from Wisconsin. Share with me why you have him pegged. I've only been around Sacramento for almost 50 years. So I don't have as much on him as you claim.

 

[Larry David]

So enlighten me on why Crandell deserves your criticism. Run down his whole history of showboating incorrect info. Go back to before he was a sports guy and before he anchored the news and when he did sports after he came here from Wisconsin. Share with me why you have him pegged. I've only been around Sacramento for almost 50 years. So I don't have as much on him as you claim.

You don't have to have a track record to have engaged in poor journalism on one occasion. That's what we are saying ... not that he's a bad reporter, bad person or had bad intent ... but that on Wednesday he was a bad journalist.

And why he was a bad journalist has been posted in this topic.

 

[JB_kings]

So why no outrage at the Bee for putting up a story yesterday basically calling Crandell a liar and then the PULL it off and Voison prints a confirmation. So who is doing right here and who is doing wrong? Is there one person left that thinks he made the whole thing up?

 

[Larry David]

So why no outrage at the Bee for putting up a story yesterday basically calling Crandell a liar and then the PULL it off and Voison prints a confirmation. So who is doing right here and who is doing wrong? Is there one person left that thinks he made the whole thing up?

Maybe you should stop. The Bee didn't call him a lair, they said they called a few relevant people, who couldn't confirm his story. That's not calling him a liar. Or keep making up facts to fit your take

I don't think he made up the story. I think he reported a blind item rumor ... and based upon what I've read this morning, I think he way oversold the viablity and the Maloof interest. But we'll see about that.

 

[JB_kings]

Maybe you should stop. The Bee didn't call him a lair, they said they called a few relevant people, who couldn't confirm his story. That's not calling him a liar. Or keep making up facts to fit your take

I don't think he made up the story. I think he reported a blind item rumor ... and based upon what I've read this morning, I think he way oversold the viablity and the Maloof interest. But we'll see about that.

How can it be a blind item rumor when he got it right from the source? Look up rumor in the dictionary... it says talk or opionion widely disseminated with no discernable source. You are telling us that he should not do a story if he has agreed to not divulge the source? That is your opinion and it's not shared by real journalists. So maybe you should stop because your view of this seems slanted.

As for what the Bee did, I think it stands on it's own. They printed something that says they have no confirmation. What is the intent there? Don't play dumb, it is what it is. They are calling into question his reporting. Then they pulled it and printed something that backed it up. Again, why even print a story if they didn't dig deep enough to figure out there was something there? Media standards apply to only TV media? You are starting to sound like someone who has his own bias for print media.

 

[Larry David]

You said that I owed Crandall an apology for saying his report was bad journalism. I explained why I don’t. You responded by changing the subject from his Wednesday report to his body of work, and I explained that doesn’t address my point. So you stopped arguing that I owed Crandall and apology, and asked why I’m not outraged because the Bee for “basically calling” Crandall a liar. I’m not outraged, because that’s not what they did.

Yesterday, Crandall admitted he was just trying to raise hope, and Cordova indicated staff questioned whether he should be allowed to go forward. Crandall was able to raise hope, because he didn’t provide any facts. If he just said, “Hey, folks, I’ve heard from a source that another arena plan is in the works” … fine.

But he hammered home some very specific conclusions – without giving any idea what they really meant or the basis for them… and now it appears they are falling short.

The funding does not appear to be “in place.” Thus this is merely another unfunded plan. It won’t be ready for April, he must have known that and he left it out. And most importantly, if it’s a remodel, it’s a plan that neither the Kings nor city wants. Those are pretty huge distinctions … which are easily drawn from the Bee’s report, which contains – ya know – some facts.

The funding and Maloof interest were overstated, the nature of the project and the timeline were omitted, and I can’t see a reason why other that to simply raise hope. You can omit a source, while talking about what and when. Trying to report a story, while giving only conclusions without any facts, is not reporting. That was/is the problem.

 

[pshn80]

I think what is happening here is the media is simply reporting the news. Should a reporter say nothing if he doesn't have every bit of information that you want - hell no. Let's move on on this Kings fans site where we are interested in all that is going on the "move" front. Certainly, I don't have any sources of my own so I am happy when we get news reported by news agencies.

There's not much time before April 18. I hope that besides celebrating the 105th anniversary of the SF quake we don't hear another word about Anaheim.

 

[JB_kings]

You said that I owed Crandall an apology for saying his report was bad journalism. I explained why I don’t. You responded by changing the subject from his Wednesday report to his body of work, and I explained that doesn’t address my point. So you stopped arguing that I owed Crandall and apology, and asked why I’m not outraged because the Bee for “basically calling” Crandall a liar. I’m not outraged, because that’s not what they did.

Yesterday, Crandall admitted he was just trying to raise hope, and Cordova indicated staff questioned whether he should be allowed to go forward. Crandall was able to raise hope, because he didn’t provide any facts. If he just said, “Hey, folks, I’ve heard from a source that another arena plan is in the works” … fine.

But he hammered home some very specific conclusions – without giving any idea what they really meant or the basis for them… and now it appears they are falling short.

The funding does not appear to be “in place.” Thus this is merely another unfunded plan. It won’t be ready for April, he must have known that and he left it out. And most importantly, if it’s a remodel, it’s a plan that neither the Kings nor city wants. Those are pretty huge distinctions … which are easily drawn from the Bee’s report, which contains – ya know – some facts.

The funding and Maloof interest were overstated, the nature of the project and the timeline were omitted, and I can’t see a reason why other that to simply raise hope. You can omit a source, while talking about what and when. Trying to report a story, while giving only conclusions without any facts, is not reporting. That was/is the problem.

I didn't ask for an apology, that was pshn80. So correct yourself there.
I don't have a problem with Crandell going with the story. He framed it properly and I thought it was ok that he go on the air with it. I don't have all the facts on what this is right now and neither do you. Is he going with something and trying to build positive energy? Absolutley. Has other media in Sacramento been guilty of doing negative stories over the last decade or so? Absolutely. So to me I see nothing he should be sorry for because the naysayers don't own up to their roles either. It seems like you get really bent out of shape over Crandell even airing before all the facts have been rolled out.

As for this proposal, it has not been presented to the Maloofs yet. Since I don't see the point in going to them with the retrofit plan they already discussed a long time ago, I am assuming this one is different and has a better chance to fly. I don't see the point in guessing what it is until I hear more. I fully support these men for working on this and trying to so something. It's probably a long shot, but they deserve more support and not misplaced skepticism.

All your posts that I've ever read have a angle towards the team leaving. You can frame that any way you like, but in my book you are part of the problem. You actively have tried to poison the water as much as any of the worst of the Bee columnists. You might not see it that way, but I can assure that I am not alone in my opinion.

 

[John Galt]

This is my opinion: Crandell is a liar for saying funding is in place and the Maloofs are interested. That's it. A liar. And it is my opinion... my own interpretation of what Crandell said, what he meant, what he wanted us to think when he said it, and what is true.

It has become unfashionable to call a lie a lie. We call it a distortion... or an exaggeration, or a partially correct statement, or some other politically correct BS.

"... Crandell did confirm that the alternative plan does include a funding source, and that, "...the money is in place."
The Maloofs have confirmed they are interested in continuing to discuss it, and by all counts, moving the team to Anaheim is not a done deal."

This has been demonstrated to be bullshlt unless you really do a silly anti-logical dance like:

"the money is in place" ... indeed it is - its place is the account of the person who has it... by golly EVERYTHING is in place come to think of it.

or

"the Maloofs have confirmed they are interested in continuing to discuss it" ... define IT. by golly EVERYONE is interested in continuing to discuss "it" come to think of it.

I don't know how Crandell can be supported. He lied. He says he was lying for a good cause. That's not cool by me. I can't wait to read his next slippery excuse.

 

[Glenn]

I don't think we can judge this mystery plan when we have no details at all. While I'd like it to be something realistic, I'm not holding my breath.

However, if it is multi-jurisdicational, what would be most lilkely would be to create some kind of joint powers authority. Its been done for various purposes, including building sports venues. The venue would then be financed and owned by the joint powers authority. Such an authority could authroize and sell tax-exempt bonds to raise financing.

Somehow, I don't think this plan can be that complicated, however. Not if they really think they can offer the Maloofs a good enough reason not to leave.

You are the only one who can understand how this works but it should have been done 10 years ago. The idea is not novel but to us, it seems like a plan from outer space. The people with vision seem to have avoided living here.

Please hang around so we don't get side tracked by disussing the past writings of the local media. I don't care.

 

[Glenn]

Maybe you should stop. The Bee didn't call him a lair, they said they called a few relevant people, who couldn't confirm his story. That's not calling him a liar. Or keep making up facts to fit your take

I don't think he made up the story. I think he reported a blind item rumor ... and based upon what I've read this morning, I think he way oversold the viablity and the Maloof interest. But we'll see about that.

The Bee article said nothing. It sdin't ask who the Maloofs had talked to. It simply said they hadn't talked to a couple people. So?

 

[Catalyst]

ESPN, Marc Stein article about the Kings moving: http://espn.go.com/nba/dailydime/_/page/dime-110325-27/tabuse-making-play-japan

In the latest of many recent signals that the Sacramento Kings will be playing in Anaheim next season -- whenever next season starts -- sources close to the situation told ESPN.com that the Lakers privately see little hope of rallying the requisite support from other teams needed to block the Kings' move.

The Lakers and Clippers strongly oppose the Kings' move, sources say, because it would bring a third team into their market playing out of a building (Anaheim's Honda Center) that sits just 30 miles away from Staples Center.

Quoting anonymous team sources here, so take this as you may.

 

[Glenn]

This conversaion is absurd and yes IMO!!! Words are important. Meaning is slanted by the media and us. The media is competitive and so are we. The media is no longer responsible to anything but raising its own ratings. A new standard has been set. We do the same thing. We want to be rated well with the other readers. I do! I want people to think "yeah, that Glenn is a good guy to read. He makes sense"

Can we talk about th Kings. I saw nothing about the "money in place" being debunked. I saw it nowhere. For all I know, this is chump change for a few developers in the area. No taxpayer money is in place. Yes. No bond issue has been passed. Yes. Could a bond issue be passed. Maybe. Could it be passed if every credible developer was on board. Probably. We know next to nothing but I know one thing for sure: the Maloofs have not signed on any dotted line and the Kings are in Sacramento. I personally start my arguments with that mind set and see how things can be changed.

A lot start from the point that the Kings have left.

 

[Glenn]

ESPN, Marc Stein article about the Kings moving: http://espn.go.com/nba/dailydime/_/page/dime-110325-27/tabuse-making-play-japan



Quoting anonymous team sources here, so take this as you may.

Quite obviously this can't be true because no source is named.

Oh, Lord, take me now!