Never-ending idiotic Cousins trade rumors thread

Hoovtrain said:
Shoulda woulda coulda....this team is 7-11 and 206-434 since 2008 and those are concrete #'s. We are past the point looking for silver linings or what could be. That's something that may have been ok about 8 years ago....but today it just comes off as sad
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Our record in 2008, 2010, or 2012 has absolutely nothing to do with this year's team. Nothing. Cuz is the only holdover (unless you count Casspi returning), and he's the best he's ever been. The rest of the players are new, the coach is new, the GM is new, hell, even the owner is new.

The reason the fanbase is so muddled about this team is because there is this heavy and excessive bleed over from years past staining every perception. But the past is past, and as long as the lone holdover does not hold it excessively against us, and his dogged loyalty suggests he may not, the past is also largely irrelevant going forward. Will make signing free agents harder until the demons are exorcised. Otherwise the main damage it causes going forward are precisely the fans not responding to what is here today because of ghosts long past. If we won a title 4 years ago, or if we won 28 games 4 years ago, its irrelevant for this squad today. Marcus Thornton isn't walking through that door tomorrow. Neither is Chuck Hayes, nor Calvin Booth.
 
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Giannis Antetokounmpko is rumored to be unhappy with the Bucks organization. Why? It's cold as eff there. He's rumored to want to come to Sacramento because of the sunny weather and Demarcus Cousins. Expect a deal sending him to Sac for Willie Cauley-Stein, Ben McLemore and Darren Collison.
 
Bricklayer said:
Our record in 2008, 2010, or 2012 has absolutely nothing to do with this year's team. Nothing. Cuz is the only holdover (unless you could Casspi returning), and he's the best he's ever been. The rest of the players are new, the coach is new, the GM is new, hell, even the owner is new.

The reason the fanbase is so muddled about this team is because there is this heavy and excessive bleed over from years past staining every perception. But the past is past, and as long as the lone holdover does not hold it excessively against us, and his dogged loyalty suggests he may not, the past is also largely irrelevant going forward. Will make signing free agents harder until the demons are exorcised. Otherwise the main damage it causes going forward are precisely the fans not responding to what is here today because of ghosts long past. If we won a title 4 years ago, or if we won 28 games 4 years ago, its irrelevant for this squad today. Marcus Thornton isn't walking through that door tomorrow. Neither is Chuck Hayes, nor Calvin Booth.
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Sure it does. It points to a long standing pattern of losing and this franchise, outside of Petrie catching lightening in a bottle for those 6 years, has been a loser franchise . but you are right that the past is the past and the present is the present...and in the present this team is 7-11.
I would also venture to say the fan bases pessimistic nature has some to do with the past, but I think more so has to do with the bleak outlook as to how this team is going to build a formidable team around DMC...as you can see from this and other threads.
 
@mr_jasonjones: No matter where I go, I'm asked if Cousins wants to be traded. I tell folks no. No matter how frustrated, he's never told me he wants out.

@mr_jasonjones: Cousins genuinely wants to be a King for things to turnaround. I believe him. Lying isn't his strong suit. Honest to a fault at times
 
dude12 said:
@mr_jasonjones: No matter where I go, I'm asked if Cousins wants to be traded. I tell folks no. No matter how frustrated, he's never told me he wants out.

@mr_jasonjones: Cousins genuinely wants to be a King for things to turnaround. I believe him. Lying isn't his strong suit. Honest to a fault at times
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He might be one of the last real dudes left that doesn't seek all the glamour, glitz and rings. No talk about joining a super team, only to recruit one here and nothing else.
 
dude12 said:
Giannis Antetokounmpko is rumored to be unhappy with the Bucks organization. Why? It's cold as eff there. He's rumored to want to come to Sacramento because of the sunny weather and Demarcus Cousins. Expect a deal sending him to Sac for Willie Cauley-Stein, Ben McLemore and Darren Collison.
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Is there a source for this?
 
ESP47 said:
Ha ok couldn't tell because it didn't seem right but wasn't completely off the wall obvious either.
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As a forum we should try and see of we can get a trade sourcesicked up on twitter and it goes nationally or regionally.

You know...... According to my sources, Rudy Gay has been linked blah, blah, blah
 
CelticsFan said:
In honor of the Celtics squaring off with the Kings tonight here is a article on what some in Boston think it would take to trade for Cuz

http://www.boston.com/sports/boston...s-to-trade-for-demarcus-cousins?event=event51
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Celtics trade Jaylen Brown, Marcus Smart, Amir Johnson, the 2017 Brooklyn first round pick swap and Brooklyn’s 2018 unprotected first round pick for DeMarcus Cousins, Omri Cassipi and Ben McLemore
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That is the minimum it would take to get him. I think the Kings, if they were willing to deal him, would at least consider that package. I think the would probably negotiate throwing in one or our other worse salaries instead of Ben and Omri, but whatever.
 
macadocious said:
That is the minimum it would take to get him. I think the Kings, if they were willing to deal him, would at least consider that package. I think the would probably negotiate throwing in one or our other worse salaries instead of Ben and Omri, but whatever.
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That's a laughable offer. Not a hope in hell would Vlade do that unless he wants half the fanbase out with pitchforks.

Celtics can continue overvaluing their chips and undervaluing Cousins all they want - it doesn't make it any more likely.
 
macadocious said:
That is the minimum it would take to get him. I think the Kings, if they were willing to deal him, would at least consider that package. I think the would probably negotiate throwing in one or our other worse salaries instead of Ben and Omri, but whatever.
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I would assume that trading the pick swap actually means the Celtics are trading their first round pick to the Kings which carries with it the ability to swap it for Brooklyn's pick. I can't imagine it works another way.

IF the Kings decide to trade Cousins, this is a somewhat reasonable deal.

I would ask for Rozier to be included. I'm not big on Smart and would rather have a PG prospect that the Kings would have on a rookie deal for two additional seasons instead of Smart who they'd have to decide whether to re-sign after next year.

I'd also insist that Afflalo go to Boston rather than McLemore and Casspi who are free agents this summer. That would require Boston to throw in Jerebko (who is an ending contract) to make the salaries work though the Kings could agree to waive him and he could likely return to Boston for the remainder of the year.

That sort of deal (along with trading Gay and Koufos for whatever they might fetch in terms of young players and/or picks) would certainly leave the Kings in a position to keep their pick this year meaning they'd probably end up with a pick in the 1-5 range and another in the 6-9 range.

It also means they'd almost certainly have another pair of lottery picks in 2018 before having to give up their 2019 1st rounder to Philadelphia.

Is that good value for Cousins? No, not really. The Kings have had 10 lottery picks in the last decade and only one of them gave them a star player - Cousins. One became Tyreke who showed a lot of early promise but the others have been rotation players (Hawes, Thompson, McLemore, maybe Cauley-Stein) and busts (Fredette, Robinson, maybe Stauskas). That says more about the Kings poor drafting than anything, but it also highlights that the Kings could trade away maybe the most talented player they've had in the Sacramento era and end up with nothing to show for it but Rozier as a decent PG.

It's also why I'd rather see the Kings take one more shot at building around Cousins before throwing in the towel and trading him. But of course, if they wait until next year's trade deadline and Boogie has decided he's ready to move on after the season, the Kings would get pennies on the dollar and go into the 2018 offseason with a lot less chance to rebuild.

It's a gamble either way. And not a good gamble.
 
dude12 said:
Laughable....Celtics are delusional
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This year's #4 draft pick, two players drafted in the early and mid first round from the last two drafts and two consecutive likely lottery picks.

That's about market value for a star player being traded when a team is forced to move him and rebuild.

It's not GOOD value, but I can't imagine the Kings can get a ton more if they decide to move Boogie. And if they wait a year, they'll almost certainly get less.

That's the punishment for drafting a top 10 player in the NBA and failing to build a winner around him. You get a handful of magic beans (unproven youngsters and future picks) instead of the perennial contender you should have if you didn't screw the pooch for several seasons after landing your cornerstone.

I'm all for Vlade taking one more swing at building a winner around Boogie, but Kings fans have to realize what kind of deal to realistically expect if the team decides to trade him.
 
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dude12 said:
Laughable....Celtics are delusional
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Two high lottery picks, Jaylen Brown, and stuff. I don't think you can get much more than that. Maybe you try for Bradley with Brown, maybe you try for another pick, but that's in the range of what I would expect would be a fair offer - IF we decide to trade him.
 
That's close to the value we'll probably get in a Cousins trade, if you change Smart to Rozier and throw in one of the euros they got the rights to in the draft (Zizic is averaging around 20&10 with 1.5 blocks this year, and Yabusele has good potential as a PF with size that can also stretch the floor) it doesn't look bad.

My main reservation is that I'm not a huge fan of Brown and he is the main guy we're getting back, but it's hard to think realistically of many teams that can put together a better package.
 
This rookie crop is shaping up to be really bad. Embiid is saving it from being embarrassingly bad right now and depending on how Simmons looks when he hits the court the Sixers could well have the three top rookies this season if Saric breaks out of his slump and nobody else makes a strong move.

Anyway, I think Jaylen Brown has just hit an early rookie wall -he's barely done anything the last few games and had a quick hook but when he's gotten extended playing time he's produced decently.

His defense seems to be coming around and early on he was shooting from outside reasonably well, especially when his jump shot was questionable. His big problem is the same one he had last year at Cal - there's just no one thing he does well enough to hang his hat on or (in the NBA) to deserve extra playing time.

Anyway, one more note about the possibilty of trading Cousins. I'm not enthusiastic about the idea, but if it happens, this is a good season to have two lottery picks. This is shaping up to be a strong draft up top and Markell's Fultz especially looks like the real deal.
 
Amit149 said:
That's close to the value we'll probably get in a Cousins trade, if you change Smart to Rozier and throw in one of the euros they got the rights to in the draft (Zizic is averaging around 20&10 with 1.5 blocks this year, and Yabusele has good potential as a PF with size that can also stretch the floor) it doesn't look bad.

My main reservation is that I'm not a huge fan of Brown and he is the main guy we're getting back, but it's hard to think realistically of many teams that can put together a better package.
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I agree with Rozier over Smart and I'd forgotten about Zizic. I liked Zubac's potential more but Zizic was the more productive player in last year's draft. Between he and Papagiannis you'd hope one of them would turn into a productive starting center.
 
CelticsFan said:
In honor of the Celtics squaring off with the Kings tonight here is a article on what some in Boston think it would take to trade for Cuz

http://www.boston.com/sports/boston...s-to-trade-for-demarcus-cousins?event=event51
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Rethinking it, the Nuggets actually got a crap-ton for Melo at the time..
Nuggets received:
  • rising 23 yearold star Gallinari (15.9pts 4.8rebs 1.7asts, decent shooting #)
  • rising 24 yearold star W. Chandler (16.4pts 5.9rebs 1.7asts, good shooting #)
  • breaking out 26yearold PG Felton (17.1pts 9asts 3.6rebs, decent shooting #)
  • Mozgov+future 1st round pick as fillers. (Used 1st round pick in a later trade for Iggy)
Without hindsight, no one could predict that Gallo and Chandler wouldn't improve a lot since being 23/24. Felton was a FA, and fell off a bit. At the time being, it was actually a really good haul because the Nuggets were getting 2 young and proven NBA players. They were also getting an above average PG too.

Utah traded Deron Williams at this time of the year before deadline, and got a lot less for him
  • promising, but unproven 19yearold Favors
  • proven 26yearold PG Harris (15pts 7.6asts 2.4rebs , decent shooting #)
  • Nets current 1st round pick, which turned into #3 overall (Drafted Kanter)
  • Nets future 2014 1st round pick, (21 overall, traded)
Favors was in the same position as Jaylen Brown is right now. The Jazz also received a guaranteed bottom 5 pick for that year's draft. However, fast forward a little bit, and the haul was just meh. It took Favors 5 years being in a Jazz jersey to ultimately break out. Kanter turned into a decent player, but didn't work out extremely well for the Jazz. Harris left after 2 years, and declined.

The Celtics lack what the Knicks had: Young, rising, and talented players. No, Marcus Smart would not qualify under this....
However, the Celtics do have what the Nets had. However, one could argue that the Kings don't need a proven player like Devin Harris since they're looking to rebuild. Nets pick turned into #3 overall. Question time, can the Nets 2017 pick turn into #3 overall or better? That's the only problematic thing. Mavs and 6ers are looking like bottom feeders. Nets are also missing Jeremy Lin.

I think a fair trade for both sides could be:
Jaylen Brown+rights to Ante Zizic+Guerschon Yabusele+2016 Nets pick+2017 nets pick. For Cousins+Filler
 
The only trade scenario I've heard for Cousins that I can talk myself into involves Jaylen Brown and the two Nets picks from Boston. I'm pretty sure we don't want Marcus Smart -- nowhere to play him and he's not that good anyway. I'd rather have Avery Bradley. They can throw in the Amir Johnson expiring contract too if they want to get Casspi and McLemore or just leave it at Brown, Bradley, and picks. Jaylen Brown is the guy I wanted in this year's draft anyway and the Nets picks are likely to be in the lottery. I'd much rather build around Cousins, but if we have to trade him that's a fair offer.

That would give us two high lottery picks this season to add to a young core of J. Brown, Bogdanovic, Richardson, Labissiere, and Cauley-Stein. Maybe we could get another young player in trade for Rudy Gay. We'd also have two lottery picks in 2018 most likely -- and no swap rights owed to Philadelphia that year. If we're starting over, that's the way to do it. Wipe the slate clean and add a huge crop of young players before 2019 when our pick goes to the Sixers unprotected anyway.
 
funkykingston said:
I agree with Rozier over Smart and I'd forgotten about Zizic. I liked Zubac's potential more but Zizic was the more productive player in last year's draft. Between he and Papagiannis you'd hope one of them would turn into a productive starting center.
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Yeah, like you I'd rather not trade Cousins, but if this particular trade was to happen, I want no part of Smart. I'm not a huge Rozier fan either, but he would fit into Joerger's system better than Smart. Jaylen Brown has a lot of potential, but it's going to take a year or two for him to realize it. Not yet sure what position he's best at, SG or SF? Probably SF. And this coming draft is shaping up to be a very good one, especially if your looking for a PG. It's also loaded with SF's at the top.
 
I'm not as bullish on Rozier as some but I like him more than Smart (who I don't want) and his rookie deal goes for two more seasons after this one.

I thought the Kings had an option on Afflalo but a quick googling hasn't given me any real evidence that it's the case. If the Kings are on the hook for his salary next year I'd probably want Boston to take him just to clear him off the books. No big deal though as that following off-season would be the time to try and land vets as you'd essentially want to tank in 2017-2018.

It's also why I wouldn't want "young, rising players" I would want picks and guys with potential who are a year away from contributing.

Part of the strategy for the Kings if they deal Cousins would be to tank and not make a surprising run like Denver did after the Melo trade.

But while I clearly see the path to a successful rebuild I dont really want to see the Kings go that direction because (a) it means giving up the best center in the NBA and a guy who WANTS to be in Sacramento and turn things around and (b) I don't have any faith that the Kings front office and ownership would actually make the right moves to rebuild the team.
 
funkykingston said:
I thought the Kings had an option on Afflalo but a quick googling hasn't given me any real evidence that it's the case. If the Kings are on the hook for his salary next year I'd probably want Boston to take him just to clear him off the books. No big deal though as that following off-season would be the time to try and land vets as you'd essentially want to tank in 2017-2018.
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Amick reported at the time that only $1.5 million is guaranteed in the year two of the deal. So, not quite an option, but close. https://twitter.com/sam_amick/status/749361345695473664
 
If there is a trade to go down I think we should really look at Denver and try get a package built around Jamal Murray/Jokic (also have Nurkic/Beasley/Hernangomez/Harris to throw at us), Denver has so many solid veteran players on good deals (to make the numbers work) as well to throw in and help the younger players.

Murray can do some amazing things on the floor and I've heard a number of there commentary saying he's the best player (most talented) they have drafted in 30 years the kid could be anything.
 
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Here's the rules, not just for us now, but for every team ever:

There is NO such thing as a "good deal", "fair offer", or "value" in return for an in prime superstar. Its all crap. you take the best crap you can get when you are forced into it, but that's it.
 
Bricklayer said:
Here's the rules, not just for us now, but for every team ever:

There is NO such thing as a "good deal", "fair offer", or "value" in return for an in prime superstar. Its all poopoo. you take the best poopoo you can get when you are forced into it, but that's it.
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Fair in terms of equal talent? No. Fair in terms of "this is the going rate for a top 10 player with an expiring contract on a terrible team"? Sure. Remember what Dwight Howard did to Orlando on his way out of town? He wanted to be there, then he didn't want to be there, then he demanded they fire Stan Van Gundy, then he claimed that he didn't want Van Gundy fired, then he demanded a trade again but only to a specific team. Things got pretty ugly and that was all over the period of a few months. I'm not saying I want to trade Cousins -- I still don't want to trade him and I've never wanted to trade him. But we're quickly approaching the point where we need to suck it up and admit that a trade demand is coming whether we like it or not. Midway through this season if we're still below .500 there will probably be a Rudy Gay trade and maybe an Omri Casspi/Ben McLemore/Darren Collison trade. I know DeMarcus values loyalty, but 9 out of 10 players in his position would already be quietly planning their exit strategy. There's a chance Vlade can pull rabbits out of hats and get this thing turned around in record time but I certainly wouldn't blame him if he decided to cut his losses instead. He was dealt a losing hand to begin with.

We're just speculating here anyway. I think most of us are on board with you that we're going to get screwed no matter what if this goes down, it's just a matter of mitigating the level of toilet water involved.
 
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