63royals
Bench
There you go being logical again.
Luka Doncic (the 'LET'S RE-LITIGATE THE PICK UNTO PERPETUITY~!' thread)
- Thread starter Hansel
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Gotta be a contender for the rookie to be good, good thing Fox lead us to a winning record last year or we’d be in trouble
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
To be fair, Fox and Bagley might sorta be on the same paths where their first seasons aren't that individually great but they wind up being fantastic players.
iowamcnabb
Hall of Famer
I've come around on Bagley after a decent start to the season but I still enjoy following Luka and will probably continue to do so more than I normally would with other non Kings players. He is on his way to being one of the top stars in the game imo and I like seeing average athletic players dominate using skill and BBIQ. Dirk really seems taken aback by him and I've always admired his style and attitude towards the game.
Love Dirk one of the most underrated players of all time, I’d take him over Kobe
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
With all due respect, this is one of dumbest takes I’ve ever heard and I’m saying this as a guy who thinks Kobe is immensely overrated
I probably let the hate get ahead of me but I do take Tim Duncan over Kobe 7 days a week
I wouldn't even make that statement, and my hatred of Kobe Bryant is legendary.
Kangztillidie
Bench
Guys, guess what!!!! I built a time machine!!!! We can go back and draft Doncic!!!!
63royals
Bench
Why don't you go forward in time and find out who had the better career? That's the only way this is going to be resolved. Oh, and you can find out whether one of them will be in a car accident in 4 years and wreck his knee. And if anyone wants to chime in with other ways a career can go off the rails ...
Kingsfan23
All-Star
And to this point that would have been much better for the franchise, and thus someone needs to be held accountable IMO if that continues to be true.
Are you the one making those silly Ball disses on RealGM, when a lot of NBA fans/pundits think the same about this situation so far?
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
If Bagley goes on to be a key cog in this run'n'gun Kings system over the next decade, no one is going to be worried about who needs to be held accountable regardless of how well Luka does.
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Kingsfan23
All-Star
Maybe, brother. But, Luka can be so talented as to supersede the question... really. And let's see some better hints from Bags than this last stretch
ACK! No, no, no, no, no. I have a standing rule of almost 18 years that nobody talks about potential injuries. Karma and all that...
Kangztillidie
Bench
The script hasn't been written on their careers not even 20 games in. I still dont get this narrative.
And I dont post on realgm. Dont have an account.
Tetsujin
The Game Thread Dude
You'd think that as Kings fans, we'd be particularly sensitive to conversations about burgeoning young stars getting into horrific car crashes.
Kangztillidie
Bench
Images of Bobby Hurley and what could have been are now flashing across my mental screen....
Sac.1989
Starter
Views to embrace:
- Bagley & Fox, will lead us to the promised land. Both are very young and have done more to hold their own against grown men. Bagley is a ready made running mate for Fox, a legitimate athletic big to put next to our all star point guard. They are core pieces who we are able to build around for the next 10 years legitimately.
- Fox is better then Doncic, now and for the forseeable future. Having Fox rendered contemplating drafting Doncic redundant. The two would have taken away from each others strengths. Anyone who argues otherwise is just arguing for the sake of it. Doncic is literally a younger version of Bogdanovic who adds more to us now then Doncic would have.
- Doncic might not be the best guard in his class. Young has hit the ground running and is lighting it up
I am not hating on Doncic, he has amazing skill and youth on his side and will be an all star. We have our own star blooming and its worth embracing and building around. We couldnt do it with Cousins but ill be damed if we dont do it with Fox. Drafting Bagley was the first step this franchise took to build in a foundationally correct manner around a star.
- Bagley & Fox, will lead us to the promised land. Both are very young and have done more to hold their own against grown men. Bagley is a ready made running mate for Fox, a legitimate athletic big to put next to our all star point guard. They are core pieces who we are able to build around for the next 10 years legitimately.
- Fox is better then Doncic, now and for the forseeable future. Having Fox rendered contemplating drafting Doncic redundant. The two would have taken away from each others strengths. Anyone who argues otherwise is just arguing for the sake of it. Doncic is literally a younger version of Bogdanovic who adds more to us now then Doncic would have.
- Doncic might not be the best guard in his class. Young has hit the ground running and is lighting it up
I am not hating on Doncic, he has amazing skill and youth on his side and will be an all star. We have our own star blooming and its worth embracing and building around. We couldnt do it with Cousins but ill be damed if we dont do it with Fox. Drafting Bagley was the first step this franchise took to build in a foundationally correct manner around a star.
Sac.1989
Starter
Refer to my first point. Fox > Doncic
This line of thinking is so flawed, I can't believe you guys are still talking about it. Almost all the best teams have multiple ball handlers.
The only way your argument would hold any water would be if either one of Fox or Doncic couldn't shot the ball. At the moment Fox is shooting 44% from deep and Doncic 39% from deep. They would play together perfectly fine. If Fox isn't running the play, he's a good shooter to kick the ball out to. If they run a play with Doncic and they can't get anything off, Fox would be an excellent emergency outlet to give the ball to with a few seconds left on the shot clock to try and eek out a basket.
It works both ways. Would you rather have Luka in the corner shooting 3s or JJ? If they have nothing going on offense, would you rather have Doncic with the ball at the end of the shot clock or JJ?
There is no such thing as redundant play making abilities. The more guys you have that have good court vision and can pass, the better your team is going to be period. The only real arguments against it that make a lick of sense would be if one of the players couldn't shoot or if one of the players was a major liability on defense to the point where it negates his offensive abilities. Otherwise there is no case to make against it and if you do you're basically saying the early 2000s Kings, the Warriors dynasty and last years Rockets all made mistakes by having multiple players on the team that could handle the ball.
Sac.1989
Starter
I would rather Bagley on the floor with Fox then Doncic.
It’s embarrassing that people still think that way that’s been false for a decade now and Luka is doing fine with smith having a higher usage rate
Lol comparing Bogdan you luka is an insult at the same age there not even comparable players. Matter fact Luka rookie year looks better than Bogies rookie year. So you’d rather have Bagley in there instead of another ball handler who is shooting 38% from 3 on 7 attempts. Fox-Buddy-Luka-Bjlecia-WCS than go small with Fox-Buddy-Bogdan-Luka-WCS would have been lethal.
How is Young lighting it up? Luka is having a better year and this is with Atlanta running everything thru Young ala Tyreke.
Trae: 16ppg-3rpg-8apg-4TPG (49/25/80)
Luka: 19ppg-6rpg-4apg-4TPG (52/39/75)
Trae can only guard 1 position and that’s if he could guard Luka will be able to switch 1-4 and has shown that in clutch situations
If the Kings were 3-11, Fox was still looking lost and Bags looked like he did in Summer League in the games Fox didn't play, some of y'all might have something to crow about.
But if you still can't appreciate that Fox is looking great, the Kings are playing above even the rosiest fans' expectations and Bags is putting up solid PER numbers while being eased in, if you can't look at 2-3 years future, smile and say "Damn", then I'm just sorry for you.
But if you still can't appreciate that Fox is looking great, the Kings are playing above even the rosiest fans' expectations and Bags is putting up solid PER numbers while being eased in, if you can't look at 2-3 years future, smile and say "Damn", then I'm just sorry for you.
I tend to be of the opinion that most (all?) of these sorts of speculative discussions are pointless, and a waste of time, but this message board would operate really weirdly if we attempted to enforce this as a policy. I mean, not talking about how a player compares to another player until both their careers are over is certainly... an option, but I don't know how viable it is for this format.
It's not that it's a sentiment that's been false for a decade, because it's actually not. But it's definitely a sentiment that hearkens back to a particular era in the NBA when "ball handler" was synonymous with "ball hog," and had no other connotations pertaining to NBA basketball. Like, you don't want two ball handlers on a team if they're both ball-stoppers, who need to dribble for nineteen seconds of the shot clock. But, as far as having multiple ball handlers who want to keep the ball moving... who doesn't want that?
That being said, my personal ethos means that I have no interest in rooting for a team whose best player is a guard.
Why bother arguing? Have you met us? This is KingsFans.com We'll argue about pretty much anything.
Why would a good start affect the Doncic-Bagley debate when Bagley really is helping the cause. We all love our start and Fox but we still need a wing scorer/playmaker
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