Kings waiving papa morphed into Vlade sucks

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#91
In hindsight, a bad decision on the Kings part was bringing Papa over to the NBA the year they drafted him.

He would had been better served staying in Europe for 2-3 years and develop his game and body before coming over, plus he wouldn't had taken up a big league roster spot.


At this point, I think Papa may be signed to the Reno team after he clears waivers.
Could not agree more with this. The kid was super raw even for European standards. He was getting garbage time minutes in Europe. He did what a lot of players do when they get drafted....go to the NAB straight away and flame out quickly.

Bogdan and a few others have done it the right way. Stay in Europe, work on your game in a professional setting, play in some really competitive, real, big games, gain the experience so when you do come over, you are a productive player on the NBA court. I guess many players can't resist becoming instant millionaires.
 
#92
Haven't been following but will say I'm shocked and saddened a bit. Thought I saw something guess I was wrong he's still set for life financially if he at all has any sense though so good for him. Best of luck.
 
#94
In hindsight, a bad decision on the Kings part was bringing Papa over to the NBA the year they drafted him.

He would had been better served staying in Europe for 2-3 years and develop his game and body before coming over, plus he wouldn't had taken up a big league roster spot.

At this point, I think Papa may be signed to the Reno team after he clears waivers.
Astute observation and agreed. Badly developed.
 

hrdboild

Hall of Famer
#95
I disagree. I think Vlade has spent a lot of time assessing the value and potential of our young squad. He's seen the good and I think he's also decided what players simply will not be part of the plan going forward. It doesn't matter where Papa was drafted. That's a sunk cost. It matters that Vlade dumped the two players that I, quite frankly, had little interest in. Papa just didn't seem to get it and Malachi couldn't find a way to stay on the court.

Those of you who keep saying Vlade is doing a crappy job do so and yet also seem to be in favor of what players we got rid of today and what it garnered us in cap space.

If we get the group that we need, I don't care how we got them. We got Bogs, and to me that was the important part of that deal anyway. We got Fox. We got Hield, who although he drives me nuts still looks like a potential excellent 6th man. We got Jackson, who seems to be maturing before our eyes. Skal? Still a question but at least has potential. WCS? A lot better, I think, than some here give him credit for. We've got Mason, who is another good pick and we've got Giles, who could end up being the best of all. All in all, I think Vlade has done about as well as could have been expected...and we're not carrying a bunch of dead wood around. We'll have some really good expiring contracts next season as well.
I'm fine with the sunk-cost argument. You draft players to give them a shot and they don't all pan out. But here's where I diverge from your take -- if he burned assets like crazy (including an unprotected pick next year which will almost certainly be in the lottery and a top 3 pick last year due to swap rights and two first round picks in 2016 one of which was in the lottery) to get to where he is now and mismanaged the cap space he had available every single year how am I supposed to trust that he'll make smart decisions from here on out? I'm not upset because I believed in Papagiannis and Malachi and we lost them for nothing. I'm upset because Vlade obviously believed in them... until he didn't. And that only took a year and a half. I'm upset because past actions predict future behavior. Yes Vlade has gotten us to a point where we have some young talent to grow with but the way he got there absolutely matters if we hope to progress in the future beyond drafting in the lottery every single year and hoping for the best..

Look at it this way... We have an important decision to make with this year's draft and Vlade's track-record in the draft is pretty shaky so far. We know Fox can play but he was also a top 5 pick. That was a no-brainer. Willie has some potential. So does Skal and possibly Giles. Everyone else he drafted is a fringe NBA player. Hield is a decent player but when you trade a Hall of Fame level talent one would hope you can at least get 1 decent player in return. That's not setting the bar very high. We have an important decision to make with cap space too and Vlade has previously used cap space to sign Caron Butler (then waived him), Marco Belinelli (then traded him), Matt Barnes (then waived him), Anthony Tolliver (then paid his buyout), Arron Afflalo (then paid his buyout), George Hill (then traded him for expiring deals including a buyout of Joe Johnson).... That's a heck of a lot of sunk-cost he's piled up in a short amount of time. None of it fit together very well or propelled us to more wins either. You could actually field an entire lineup from just the sunk-cost on our roster this year. None of this is crippling -- he hasn't committed us to some absurd back-breaking multi-year contract yet -- but none of it is pushing us out of lottery hell either.

When the dust settles we're still a bottom 5 team in the league this year. A whole lot of heavy lifting is left to be done. Based on everything I've seen so far I'd feel a lot better if Vlade wasn't the one tasked with doing that heavy lifting.
 
#96
Could not agree more with this. The kid was super raw even for European standards. He was getting garbage time minutes in Europe. He did what a lot of players do when they get drafted....go to the NAB straight away and flame out quickly.

Bogdan and a few others have done it the right way. Stay in Europe, work on your game in a professional setting, play in some really competitive, real, big games, gain the experience so when you do come over, you are a productive player on the NBA court. I guess many players can't resist becoming instant millionaires.
Let's not forget. First round pick. That's guaranteed money right in your face. Millions. Kid is set for life but will still go on to make several million more. You stay in Europe making 100k for two years you get injured and what then? He made the smart, right move. He may still recover somewhere as well.
 
#97
Papa wasn't just a crapshoot in the draft. He had Vlade's fingerprints all over him. Also I always wondered if Vlade wanted to trade Cuz since the beginning and drafted Papa as a replacement. Just a really terrible move. I give a Vlade a C- so far.
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#98
...how am I supposed to trust that he'll make smart decisions from here on out?
You probably won't be able to because it's not in your nature. Me on the other hand? I think he's learned from his mistakes (although we differ on just how much of a "mistake" some of his decisions were) and I believe he's continuing to improve. I honestly have no problem at all with what he's done since the Cousins trade and as much as I hated that at the time, I have come to accept that what Vlade did probably saved us years of angst and disappointment.

People grow and change. Vlade is not a stupid man. He's learned and I believe he's also developed a network of reliable people he can trust with which to have open discussions about players, potential, etc. I've said it elsewhere, but when I look at our team today I'm pretty pleased with the overall improvement. Some of the moves being made are merely stepping stones. It's the next steps that could prove to be much more interesting.
 
#99
I'm fine with the sunk-cost argument. You draft players to give them a shot and they don't all pan out. But here's where I diverge from your take -- if he burned assets like crazy (including an unprotected pick next year which will almost certainly be in the lottery and a top 3 pick last year due to swap rights and two first round picks in 2016 one of which was in the lottery) to get to where he is now and mismanaged the cap space he had available every single year how am I supposed to trust that he'll make smart decisions from here on out? I'm not upset because I believed in Papagiannis and Malachi and we lost them for nothing. I'm upset because Vlade obviously believed in them... until he didn't. And that only took a year and a half. I'm upset because past actions predict future behavior. Yes Vlade has gotten us to a point where we have some young talent to grow with but the way he got there absolutely matters if we hope to progress in the future beyond drafting in the lottery every single year and hoping for the best..

Look at it this way... We have an important decision to make with this year's draft and Vlade's track-record in the draft is pretty shaky so far. We know Fox can play but he was also a top 5 pick. That was a no-brainer. Willie has some potential. So does Skal and possibly Giles. Everyone else he drafted is a fringe NBA player. Hield is a decent player but when you trade a Hall of Fame level talent one would hope you can at least get 1 decent player in return. That's not setting the bar very high. We have an important decision to make with cap space too and Vlade has previously used cap space to sign Caron Butler (then waived him), Marco Belinelli (then traded him), Matt Barnes (then waived him), Anthony Tolliver (then paid his buyout), Arron Afflalo (then paid his buyout), George Hill (then traded him for expiring deals including a buyout of Joe Johnson).... That's a heck of a lot of sunk-cost he's piled up in a short amount of time. None of it fit together very well or propelled us to more wins either. You could actually field an entire lineup from just the sunk-cost on our roster this year. None of this is crippling -- he hasn't committed us to some absurd back-breaking multi-year contract yet -- but none of it is pushing us out of lottery hell either.

When the dust settles we're still a bottom 5 team in the league this year. A whole lot of heavy lifting is left to be done. Based on everything I've seen so far I'd feel a lot better if Vlade wasn't the one tasked with doing that heavy lifting.
While I agree with most of this, the bottom paragraph baffles me a bit. Once Cousins got traded did people SERIOSULY expect a quick turnaround?

Rebuilding everything from bottom up takes time and also a fair bit of luck. From the 10 younger players we had on the roster to start the season, I expected about 3, maybe 4 to work out. If you get 4 long term players out of those 10 you are doing a pretty good job. Drafts by nature are a hit and miss proposition especially outside the top 5. Hell teams miss with top 5 picks....now that hurts.

For small market teams like the Kings, rebuilds at the ABSOLUTE best take 3-4 years and that is with a LOT of things going right for you. Expecting something here and now is just wishful thinking. Sure the franchise hasn't made play offs in 12 years but that is because of the botched rebuild. The moment franchise traded Cousins away is the moment the rebuild began again. That rebuild will take time. Its why I never believed the 2 year time frame Vlade gave. Its interesting how that two year time frame has now been pushed to 2019-2020 season instead of 2018-2019 season. These things really do take time if you want to do it right. If you don't then you end up with what you have seen with the Kings since 2006.

But you are right, cap management and asset management has not exactly been great by the franchise in the last 2-3 years.
 
Let's not forget. First round pick. That's guaranteed money right in your face. Millions. Kid is set for life but will still go on to make several million more. You stay in Europe making 100k for two years you get injured and what then? He made the smart, right move. He may still recover somewhere as well.
Look you make valid points but I am not sure the decision is right.

I look at Bogdan as an example, he earned millions before he signed an NBA deal and even when he signed with the NBA team it was for a lot more lucrative contract. I also look at Bogdan's good friend Nemanja Nedovic as an example. He was a more talented youngster than Bogdan coming through the ranks. he gets drafted by GSW at pick 30 and comes straight over despite not being ready. Bounced around the D League and eventually got cut by the Warriors and now played in Spain. Had he taken a similar path to Bogdan and stayed in Europe another 3 season, he would be a better player than Bogdan in the NBA. Nemanja himself said recently that he made the wrong decision going to the NBA straight away and should have done what Bogdan did and Nemanja at the time was earning more money in Europe than Bogdan was.

Papa is a big men. Big men take a while to develop so the above hold especially true for big guys that get drafted young.
 

SLAB

Hall of Famer
I truly hope PapaG goes Whiteside on the league down the line just to spite this team.

(Not that I expect that. Being a solid role-player will suffice for him.)
 
Vlade gave up on him way to soon... hes only 20... He at least has Kofous Potential.. Why couldnt they keep him on the D League team for a cuple years.. .
 
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Look you make valid points but I am not sure the decision is right.

I look at Bogdan as an example, he earned millions before he signed an NBA deal and even when he signed with the NBA team it was for a lot more lucrative contract. I also look at Bogdan's good friend Nemanja Nedovic as an example. He was a more talented youngster than Bogdan coming through the ranks. he gets drafted by GSW at pick 30 and comes straight over despite not being ready. Bounced around the D League and eventually got cut by the Warriors and now played in Spain. Had he taken a similar path to Bogdan and stayed in Europe another 3 season, he would be a better player than Bogdan in the NBA. Nemanja himself said recently that he made the wrong decision going to the NBA straight away and should have done what Bogdan did and Nemanja at the time was earning more money in Europe than Bogdan was.

Papa is a big men. Big men take a while to develop so the above hold especially true for big guys that get drafted young.
How about traditional big guys in 2018? In a league that favors guards and wings now? The guy really had a lot of factors working against him but I sure wish him the best at his next stop, whatever that may be. Always seemed to be a good kid and I can’t imagine moving to a new country to have your dreams crushed, although I’m sure a few million here and there may ease the pain if only a bit
 

hrdboild

Hall of Famer
While I agree with most of this, the bottom paragraph baffles me a bit. Once Cousins got traded did people SERIOSULY expect a quick turnaround?

Rebuilding everything from bottom up takes time and also a fair bit of luck. From the 10 younger players we had on the roster to start the season, I expected about 3, maybe 4 to work out. If you get 4 long term players out of those 10 you are doing a pretty good job. Drafts by nature are a hit and miss proposition especially outside the top 5. Hell teams miss with top 5 picks....now that hurts.

For small market teams like the Kings, rebuilds at the ABSOLUTE best take 3-4 years and that is with a LOT of things going right for you. Expecting something here and now is just wishful thinking. Sure the franchise hasn't made play offs in 12 years but that is because of the botched rebuild. The moment franchise traded Cousins away is the moment the rebuild began again. That rebuild will take time. Its why I never believed the 2 year time frame Vlade gave. Its interesting how that two year time frame has now been pushed to 2019-2020 season instead of 2018-2019 season. These things really do take time if you want to do it right. If you don't then you end up with what you have seen with the Kings since 2006.

But you are right, cap management and asset management has not exactly been great by the franchise in the last 2-3 years.
I think you just misread my intent a bit. I expect us to be bad for quite awhile too. As you said we're starting over and that takes time. I was just trying to point out for the "all's well that ends well" crowd that we're not in all that great of a place right now either. There's potential but we have that every year, my level of trust has been depleted to zero. Unless you're an eternal optimist like VF21 (God bless her :) ) there's not a lot of reason for hope based on our current situation. Especially since our main strategy since Vlade took over has been to make short-sighted moves and then undo them a year later. We have one draft pick this year that we absolutely need to get right. Seems like we've been in that position for the last 10 years. Trading Cousins re-set the rebuild back to square one, that doesn't mean Vlade's slate gets wiped clean too. Not for me anyway.
 
Well, yeah Vlade has been an utter failure for the most part as GM. Again, two things can be true:

The 2016 draft trade was probably his best move as a GM
He's made head-scratching move after head-scratching move that's hampered us for years. And we haven't even felt the full force of it yet, depending on where our UNPROTECTED pick ends up next season.

I wonder if he wasn't a Kings Hero if he would still have a job.

As far as actually evaulating the draft, it's still too early to really tell, but there have been plenty of guys who have shown some promise drafted after 13:

Denzel Valentine (who I wanted)
Dejounte Murray
Juan Hernangomez
Malik Beasley
Caris Levert
Timothe Luwawu
Pascal Siakim
Deyonta Davis
Malcolm Brogdon

All of whom have a good shot at sticking as rotation players at the very least with a couple good starters thrown in there.
I like Vlade’s judgement on players. You can’t have winners like he has had without he chance of fald packs. He s own man and he has a keen eye. I’ll stick with hm as GM of the Kings as long as he wants to keep it. It’s sad to see so much negative judgement by our members.
 
I'd rather take a flyer on Caboclo than Papagiannis but I don't like the asset management from Vlade.

Caboclo is an interesting SF/PF prospect who is still only 22 years old and has a 7'7" wingspan. I wouldn't be afraid to give him a 2 year, $4-6 mil deal with the 2nd year being a team option to really see if this guy with such a unique physical profile can become a player in the league.

He can literally almost touch the rim standing and is a superb asset for his size. His shot is decent and looks like he has good form (34% from 3 and 83% from the line). And again, the guy is only 22. Cauley-Stein & Hield are both two years older than him. If we give him another two years to develop on a $2-3 mil/year deal, we could end up having a steal in a couple years. Low risk, high reward.
Let's see what he does over the remainder of the season before jumping to conclusions. Knew absolutely nothing about him, and looked up his stats. In 3.5 years in Toronto, he played in only 25 games, averaging just 1.1 points, in 4.5 minutes per game, shooting 26.2%. That's pretty horrible.

If the Raptors thought he was a keeper, they wouldn't have traded him for Malachi. They obviously had no plans to re-sign him, but instead of losing him for nothing, decided to take a chance on another guy. In some ways the trade makes sense for both teams. We wanted cap space for the summer (not a very smart idea according to me), whildoue they wouldn't have had cap space, so they used their expiring to get a low cost player.

Personally, I wish Vlade had kept Papa and waived Bruno. Maybe Bruno proves me wrong (hopefully), but his performance (based on stats) doesn't offer much hope. Papa is two years younger. We didn't save any money by waiving him. Worst case, we could have done it over summer. Else, he could have been used as a filler in another/multi team trade, and we could have picked a minor asset for our trouble. Now we lose that chance in the hopes of getting a look at a player who hasn't shown anything in 3.5 years.

The team also must really value the locker room leadership of Vince not to have cut him to create a spot. I thought Vince might get a chance to go to a contender (might still happen), but if we do that and lose Papa for nothing, it's a bad plan.
 
Could not agree more with this. The kid was super raw even for European standards. He was getting garbage time minutes in Europe. He did what a lot of players do when they get drafted....go to the NAB straight away and flame out quickly.

Bogdan and a few others have done it the right way. Stay in Europe, work on your game in a professional setting, play in some really competitive, real, big games, gain the experience so when you do come over, you are a productive player on the NBA court. I guess many players can't resist becoming instant millionaires.
My question then is why we even bothered drafting him if he wasn't even a rotation player in Europe...
 
My question then is why we even bothered drafting him if he wasn't even a rotation player in Europe...
Because he was one of the best U18s players in the world. He showed a lot of promise in under age tournaments including against USA team. That doesn’t guarantee that he will be any good but there was obviously something there to work with. Or at least Vlade thought so at the time.
 
One thing I will give Vlade credit for is making a quick and firm decision to bail out on Papa and Malachi. Look how long the Kings stuck with Ben McLemore!

Every GM makes mistakes. Not all draft picks hit. Once the time comes that you feel you missed, I think it's wise to punt and play for the next series. I guess that's what Vlade is doing.

I just don't like the Hill deal. It didn't need to be done right now and for only a future 2nd rounder. But if Vlade and staff feel Malachi and Papa G don't have a future and they couldn't get much for them, I'm ok with those moves.
 
One thing I will give Vlade credit for is making a quick and firm decision to bail out on Papa and Malachi. Look how long the Kings stuck with Ben McLemore!

Every GM makes mistakes. Not all draft picks hit. Once the time comes that you feel you missed, I think it's wise to punt and play for the next series. I guess that's what Vlade is doing.

I just don't like the Hill deal. It didn't need to be done right now and for only a future 2nd rounder. But if Vlade and staff feel Malachi and Papa G don't have a future and they couldn't get much for them, I'm ok with those moves.
I don't think many of us mind the deals themselves, just the necessity of making them.

While we didn't lose much, we didn't gain much either. We can only speculate if Hill's value could have been higher in the summer or next trade deadline, if Malachi/Papa could have shown some improvements, or at least used as fillers in some trade to get a small asset.

I supported the Hill signing (and also the other vets), since I didn't think that throwing the kids to the wolves was good for their development. The experiment clearly failed however. Else, there was no need to ship him out. That's the sole reason we lost Papa for absolutely nothing. If he ends up like T-Rob, no big loss. If he ever becomes even a fraction of Whiteside, we'll regret.
 
You're not getting it. Yes, we all get this was a win trade for us with Bogdan and Skal looking solid. That does NOT excuse the fact that we wasted a #13 lottery pick that we gave up on a year and a half later.

We won the trade with PHX (still probably early to call this, but comfortable with Bogdan/Skal over Chriss)
Vlade completely and utterly wasted a #13 pick and #22 pick as evidenced of us giving up on them a year and a half later.

Both things can be (and are) true.
I think you are looking at it wrong. On draft day the Kings thought that the 16 draft was week in the mid and later round. So Vlade and company hedged their bets and got three players for the price of one. Probably knowing one or two players wouldn't turn out. It was smart asset management.
 
I disagree. I think Vlade has spent a lot of time assessing the value and potential of our young squad. He's seen the good and I think he's also decided what players simply will not be part of the plan going forward. It doesn't matter where Papa was drafted. That's a sunk cost. It matters that Vlade dumped the two players that I, quite frankly, had little interest in. Papa just didn't seem to get it and Malachi couldn't find a way to stay on the court.

Those of you who keep saying Vlade is doing a crappy job do so and yet also seem to be in favor of what players we got rid of today and what it garnered us in cap space.

If we get the group that we need, I don't care how we got them. We got Bogs, and to me that was the important part of that deal anyway. We got Fox. We got Hield, who although he drives me nuts still looks like a potential excellent 6th man. We got Jackson, who seems to be maturing before our eyes. Skal? Still a question but at least has potential. WCS? A lot better, I think, than some here give him credit for. We've got Mason, who is another good pick and we've got Giles, who could end up being the best of all. All in all, I think Vlade has done about as well as could have been expected...and we're not carrying a bunch of dead wood around. We'll have some really good expiring contracts next season as well.
If you can just repeat your argument over and over (and over and over), you will have begun to balance out the Vlade haters who feel no shame in repeating their post over and over (and over and...).
 
I think you are looking at it wrong. On draft day the Kings thought that the 16 draft was week in the mid and later round. So Vlade and company hedged their bets and got three players for the price of one. Probably knowing one or two players wouldn't turn out. It was smart asset management.
I would have thought that much was pretty clear. Trade back and get 3 players, plus trade Bellineli for another chance for a young player. Fact that he got pick 22 for Bellineli should tell everyone just how much other teams rated that draft. It was flagged as one of the weakest drafts in years and so far it’s lived up to its reputation.

Kings got Bogdan and if it pans out, Skal out of that draft. So far that is a LOT better than many other teams out there.
 
My question then is why we even bothered drafting him if he wasn't even a rotation player in Europe...
Vlade saw his former self in Papa G. A fairly skilled guy with huge size. What I saw was potentially a Steven Adams-like player. I thought Papa G could become as good as Steven Adams, another prospect I liked at Pitt. The difference is the mobility and agility and lateral quickness. You have to have reaction time. First to the ball wins!

This is hard to discern unless you see a player up close, something Vlade did on multiple overseas trips pre-draft. Size becomes an advantage when coupled with requisite quickness. Look at a guy like Steven Adams or Nurkic. They tower over the competition and create their space in the key, two things that Papa G can do, but they are also mobile enough to keep up with the pace of the game.

If you are too slow to keep pace you are going to half step slow and get embarrassed and commit and-ones. You are going to get exposed. The pertinent question becomes how does a player like Steven Adams become one of the best centers in the league, relentless offensive rebounder, devastating pick setter, and reliable target on pick and dive whereas a guy like Papa G washes out?

The difference is size AND agility. It is not enough to be big. You have to be able to move! Adams doesn't have the same reaction time and agility of guards or wings but he has enough to go with his mass and force to be a formidable presence. This is what Vlade envisioned in Papa G and he whiffed. You can only bet on probabilities with any of these guys. There are no certainties. He bet Papa G had the required reaction time to be an impact player and he was wrong with tangible results to date.

This is where hindsight bias comes in and where fans say I knew it was a terrible pick all along. But drafting is a probability game. A 18 year old is an unfinished product at best a diamond in the rough at worst fools gold. What if Papa G was eye of the tiger sharp as a tack gym warrior? Would that have made a difference? I think so.

Papa G was (is) being made millions of dollars to take care of his body. In essence, his job is his body. I think DeMarcus development into fairly unstoppable force (pre-Achilles) prior to trade last year and this year with the Pelicans was directly correlated with being in the best shape of his career. He floundered with his efficiency before rising to 55% TS last two years. But that transformation was slow coming. It was delayed longer than it should have been. He was too heavy and out of shape at least the first five years of his career. He waddled up and down the court more than sprint.

Adams is a no nonsense workhouse who doesn't carry extra weight. You can't say that about Papa G or the early part of Cousins career. Could Papa G tenure turned out differently if he had seized on the opportunity with more urgency. I think so. I don't know how anyone could say otherwise. So yeah it was a bad pick in retrospect but the degree of awfulness is compounded by the said player not working hard enough.
 

Kingster

Hall of Famer
Within five minutes of Papa's first game as a King I was wondering: WHAT DOES DIVAC SEE IN THIS GUY? It was so bad I was wondering if Divac had actually seen him play. I also was wondering if Divac was up to date on today's NBA. Papa could probably make it in the 70s or the 80s. He could bang on people, he wouldn't have to concern himself with 3 point shots, and they could slow down the game for his offense inside. Vlade seems to have been thinking in those outmoded ways when he picked Papa. This is an early Divac mistake, a mistake born of a greenhorn GM with no experience in the league and for that matter I wonder if Divac had even kept up with the league when he was overseas. Surrendering the Kings 1st round draft pick in 2019 is another huge mistake, for which we will pay dearly. All that said, Fox, Bogs, Jackson, Skal, Mason, and most probably Giles are going to be legit players in this league. You've got to look at the positives as well as the negatives, and so far the positives outweigh the negatives.
 
The Kings don't retain and develop young Talent. We are incapable of doing so, its a Vlade thing currently as he is GM but it does go all the way back.

Exhibit A) Demarcus Cousins
Exhibit B) Papagiannis and Richardson

Not since Kevin Martin walked through the door have we done a decent job there.
 
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The Kings don't retain and develop young Talent. We are incapable of doing so, its a Vlade thing currently as he is GM but it does go all the way back.

Exhibit A) Demarcus Cousins
Exhibit B) Papagiannis and Richardson

Not since Kevin Martin walked through the door have we done a decent job there.
Exhibit A) Is looking like a bullet dodged right about now. Think of what our future would look like with DMC on year 1 of his super MAX and that achilles:eek:.
Exhibit B) is Richardson and Papagiannis.
 
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I have been reading messages on this board for a long time. Really enjoy it, by far the best Kings board out there. I decided to finally sign up and post.

The Kings move continue to baffle me.

1) I do not agree with trading back in any draft. How many times of all of pro sports have traded back recently? The Cleveland Browns and us? Donovan Mitchell?

2) The kings cannot afford to miss over and over in the draft. I was NOT a fan of taking Papa but we took him, so therefore Vlade needed to give him time. Skal is Skal, any Kentucky fan will tell you his story.

Vlade is clueless. How are we getting better? The light at the end of the tunnel is a freight train coming.
 
Exhibit A) Is looking like a bullet dodged right about now. Think of what our future would look like with DMC on year 1 of his super MAX and that achilles:eek:.
Its not about the hindsight. Demarcus is young, he is not an above the rim player, he'll be fine.

The Kings don't retain and develop young Talent. When Fox's time comes for a Max we'll ship him out too if he isn't smart enough and hasn't bolted by then.
 
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