Kings salaries for next year:

bajaden

bajaden

Hall of Famer
Perhaps someone can help me here. I'm trying to figure out where we are for next year on guaranteed salaries.

Nocioni - $7,500,000.00
Martin - $10,180,170.00
Moore - $2,000,000.00
Udith - $6,031,800.00
Hawes - $2,332,800.00
Garcia - $5,800,000.00
Thompson - $2,035,920.00
Greene - $1,044,000.00
Thomas - $8,775,000.00

By my figuring, if we don't resign any of the expirings, that leaves us with a grand total of. $45,699,690.00. Or in short, $45.7 mil. The cap for the current year is $58.68 mil. That would put us $13 mil under the cap based on the current cap. I know that next years cap is a grey area, since its even been rumored to go down instead of up.

Something doesn't smell right to me. I know that there's some tricky stuff with the MLE, but I don't remember exactly what it is. Something like, it counts against the cap or you can't use the MLE if your under the cap. So maybe someone can help here. Hello Capt!!
 
Well:

1) you need to take into account holds on the cap for any restricted free agents who's right we want to retain, could add a bit

2) with two first round draft picks, one of them high, that should be another $4mil off the cap or so.

3) you don't get an MLE if you are under the cap...or is just further under the cap than the size of the MLE? I forget, but anyway, if you are $8mil under the cap, you just get $8 mil to spend, not $8mil and the MLE too.
 
bajaden said:
Something doesn't smell right to me. I know that there's some tricky stuff with the MLE, but I don't remember exactly what it is. Something like, it counts against the cap or you can't use the MLE if your under the cap. So maybe someone can help here. Hello Capt!!
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You only get the MLE if you're over the cap (or under by less than the MLE), so it's pretty useless to be under the cap by an MLE-ish amount, because you still have the same signing power you would have if you were over.
 
However, if you're under the cap, even if by less than the amount of the MLE, you can also renounce the MLE, which gives you room to absorb salary in a trade.

The Kings would basically have to renounce all rights to everyone to be under the cap this year, but that's not out of the realm of possibility.

And actually, I think it's going to be more like $6-7 million for draft picks. The top couple of draft picks get around $4-5 million, a late pick gets $1, and a second rounder usually gets around $750k.
 
nbrans said:
However, if you're under the cap, even if by less than the amount of the MLE, you can also renounce the MLE, which gives you room to absorb salary in a trade.

The Kings would basically have to renounce all rights to everyone to be under the cap this year, but that's not out of the realm of possibility.

And actually, I think it's going to be more like $6-7 million for draft picks. The top couple of draft picks get around $4-5 million, a late pick gets $1, and a second rounder usually gets around $750k.
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What picks do we have this year?

Our first rounder (if we finish with the worst record in the league, we'd pick no worse than 4th, right?)

Houston's first rounder (could wind up being a lottery pick, shouldn't be any worse than low 20s)

What else do we have?
 
nbrans said:
However, if you're under the cap, even if by less than the amount of the MLE, you can also renounce the MLE, which gives you room to absorb salary in a trade.

The Kings would basically have to renounce all rights to everyone to be under the cap this year, but that's not out of the realm of possibility.

And actually, I think it's going to be more like $6-7 million for draft picks. The top couple of draft picks get around $4-5 million, a late pick gets $1, and a second rounder usually gets around $750k.
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Or as they sign with other teams their slots come off the cap.
 
Heuge said:
Not lottery because of restrictions.
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So we want them in the playoffs, but as the 8th seed. The best it could be is 17 (unlikely given the weakness of the East, and the current 8 seed in the West is on pace for 48 wins), more likely would be low 20s (22-24). It would be #23 if the playoffs started today.
 
Superman said:
What picks do we have this year?

Our first rounder (if we finish with the worst record in the league, we'd pick no worse than 4th, right?)

Houston's first rounder (could wind up being a lottery pick, shouldn't be any worse than low 20s)

What else do we have?
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Our own second rounder, which I'd imagine we'd actually keep this time around.
 
We're not going to have any meaningful cap space in terms of outright signing a free agent. In a trade it could be helpful. I doubt we use it though.
 
bajaden said:
Perhaps someone can help me here. I'm trying to figure out where we are for next year on guaranteed salaries.

Nocioni - $7,500,000.00
Martin - $10,180,170.00
Moore - $2,000,000.00
Udith - $6,031,800.00
Hawes - $2,332,800.00
Garcia - $5,800,000.00
Thompson - $2,035,920.00
Greene - $1,044,000.00
Thomas - $8,775,000.00

By my figuring, if we don't resign any of the expirings, that leaves us with a grand total of. $45,699,690.00. Or in short, $45.7 mil. The cap for the current year is $58.68 mil. That would put us $13 mil under the cap based on the current cap. I know that next years cap is a grey area, since its even been rumored to go down instead of up.

Something doesn't smell right to me. I know that there's some tricky stuff with the MLE, but I don't remember exactly what it is. Something like, it counts against the cap or you can't use the MLE if your under the cap. So maybe someone can help here. Hello Capt!!
Click to expand...

Also remember that if we renounce all rights, we have only 8 players on contract next year. Add 3 draft picks, we still have only 11. I would assume the team would like to keep the number at around 13 (to account for injuries; plus some kids might be sent to D-league). Minimum level guys won't eat up much, but if we go anything better, that further reduces the cap space available.
 
kingsfan101 said:
Also remember that if we renounce all rights, we have only 8 players on contract next year. Add 3 draft picks, we still have only 11. I would assume the team would like to keep the number at around 13 (to account for injuries; plus some kids might be sent to D-league). Minimum level guys won't eat up much, but if we go anything better, that further reduces the cap space available.
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Is that true about the minimum guys? I always thought minimum salary guys didn't count against cap space but maybe I'm off on that. Seems like teams often use their full MLE on someone and then sign minimum contracts to fill out roster spots whenever they want even though they are over the cap and have used their MLE.
 
Bricklayer said:
Well:

1) you need to take into account holds on the cap for any restricted free agents who's right we want to retain, could add a bit
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There are apparently cap holds for unrestricted free agents as well. For instance, Gooden would have a cap hold of 150% his current salary, or about $10.5M, unless we were to renounce him.

2) with two first round draft picks, one of them high, that should be another $4mil off the cap or so.
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Under the "worst case scenario" (as far as money goes) we would have the 1st and 15th pick. (Actually, some reports have said the Houston pick is top-15 -- rather than lottery -- protected, but 15 is in any case the highest it could be.) Those two picks will be paid $4.15M and $1.40M respectively, for a total of $5.55M worst case. These two salaries will count against the cap, even before the players are signed. However, it's not clear that there would be any cap hold for our unsigned high-2nd round pick - I don't think so.

3) you don't get an MLE if you are under the cap...or is just further under the cap than the size of the MLE? I forget, but anyway, if you are $8mil under the cap, you just get $8 mil to spend, not $8mil and the MLE too.
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The MLE counts against the cap if you are under the cap. Again, the only way around that is to renounce the exception.

So with Bajaden's numbers, we're at $45.7M now, with up to $5.5M obligatorily on top of that - about $51M. That would leave us potentially about $8M to spend - a million more or so if our picks are lower - but that much is only available if we renounce the MLE, and all of our free agents.

It looks like we won't really have that much cap room after all. This might actually suggest Gooden could stay in town - including both first rounders, we'd be at 10 players. Plus we could sign our high-2nd with no cap repercussions, so 11. We can renounce all of our FAs and MLE and have about $9M tops to spend on a big free agent (and then some LLE) or we could blow $6M worth of MLE on a middling FA, spend enough to resign Gooden, Jackson, maybe Diogu, maybe McCants...it's the easier, though slightly more expensive, way to fill out the roster.

Don't hit. I'm just calling it as I see it.
 
Capt. Factorial said:
There are apparently cap holds for unrestricted free agents as well. For instance, Gooden would have a cap hold of 150% his current salary, or about $10.5M, unless we were to renounce him.



Under the "worst case scenario" (as far as money goes) we would have the 1st and 15th pick. (Actually, some reports have said the Houston pick is top-15 -- rather than lottery -- protected, but 15 is in any case the highest it could be.) Those two picks will be paid $4.15M and $1.40M respectively, for a total of $5.55M worst case. These two salaries will count against the cap, even before the players are signed. However, it's not clear that there would be any cap hold for our unsigned high-2nd round pick - I don't think so.



The MLE counts against the cap if you are under the cap. Again, the only way around that is to renounce the exception.

So with Bajaden's numbers, we're at $45.7M now, with up to $5.5M obligatorily on top of that - about $51M. That would leave us potentially about $8M to spend - a million more or so if our picks are lower - but that much is only available if we renounce the MLE, and all of our free agents.

It looks like we won't really have that much cap room after all. This might actually suggest Gooden could stay in town - including both first rounders, we'd be at 10 players. Plus we could sign our high-2nd with no cap repercussions, so 11. We can renounce all of our FAs and MLE and have about $9M tops to spend on a big free agent (and then some LLE) or we could blow $6M worth of MLE on a middling FA, spend enough to resign Gooden, Jackson, maybe Diogu, maybe McCants...it's the easier, though slightly more expensive, way to fill out the roster.

Don't hit. I'm just calling it as I see it.
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We don't have any cap room next season. Maybe a few million, but nothing to speak of. Unless we can move Kenny Thomas this summer, we're still looking at 2010.

I'm still not convinced that we're going to come out of 2010 with any significant free agent additions. We need to keep working on our young guys, keep looking at the draft, and by staying under the cap it will be easier to swing a trade for a good player. Maybe we go after Stoudemire next year.
 
Superman said:
We don't have any cap room next season. Maybe a few million, but nothing to speak of.
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Well, about $8-9M. But yes, not enough to make a serious splash, and we'd have to renounce our FAs and MLE to get that much.

Unless we can move Kenny Thomas this summer, we're still looking at 2010.
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It would be possible to move him in a sign-and-trade, but we can no longer move KT for expirings. By the time we can trade him again, all the expirings will have expired.
 
Capt. Factorial said:
Well, about $8-9M. But yes, not enough to make a serious splash, and we'd have to renounce our FAs and MLE to get that much.

It would be possible to move him in a sign-and-trade, but we can no longer move KT for expirings. By the time we can trade him again, all the expirings will have expired.
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Once we have cap room, we'd be able to trade him for a less expensive expiring, but I don't see why any other team would want to do that (unless they had a need for an undersized, overpaid [no]power forward).

Maybe we'll buy him out this summer so he can go sign somewhere else and actually play before he's forced to retire.
 
Superman said:
We don't have any cap room next season. Maybe a few million, but nothing to speak of. Unless we can move Kenny Thomas this summer, we're still looking at 2010.
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The Nocioni contract severely hurt our 2010 cap space. Unless we can move his contract or Beno's, there's no way we can offer a max contract to anyone in 2010.

We have 36M committed already in 2010, plus our 09 and 10 draft picks. That might be 8-10M. The cap is estimated to come down about 1.5M next year and could come down further putting it close to 55-56M. We'll be lucky to have 10M to offer anyone when half the teams in the league will be under the cap. Yay.

As small as it is 7-8M is a major advantage this summer since we can outbid MLE offers. If we don't use it, we will be losing the only real thing we gained with all these deadline moves.
 
sidney said:
Is that true about the minimum guys? I always thought minimum salary guys didn't count against cap space but maybe I'm off on that. Seems like teams often use their full MLE on someone and then sign minimum contracts to fill out roster spots whenever they want even though they are over the cap and have used their MLE.
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Yes they count. The deal is if you are over the cap you can only sign players to minimum salary deals.
 
I suppose the smart thing to do here is try and package KT and Beno/Nocioni to try and land a big timer making around 12 million this summer. Maybe Tyson Chandler. Who knows of anyone else around that stratosphere?
 
ryanandty said:
I suppose the smart thing to do here is try and package KT and Beno/Nocioni to try and land a big timer making around 12 million this summer. Maybe Tyson Chandler. Who knows of anyone else around that stratosphere?
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What good is Tyson Chandler without Chris Paul? No thanks.
 
hmmm......

this is kind of a sticky situation. What exactly is the plan of attack here? Maybe we have to exceed the cap. if we plan to rebuild via free agency.

So we're stuck turning to the draft.
 
sidney said:
The Nocioni contract severely hurt our 2010 cap space. Unless we can move his contract or Beno's, there's no way we can offer a max contract to anyone in 2010.

We have 36M committed already in 2010, plus our 09 and 10 draft picks. That might be 8-10M. The cap is estimated to come down about 1.5M next year and could come down further putting it close to 55-56M. We'll be lucky to have 10M to offer anyone when half the teams in the league will be under the cap. Yay.

As small as it is 7-8M is a major advantage this summer since we can outbid MLE offers. If we don't use it, we will be losing the only real thing we gained with all these deadline moves.
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I don't know, Jasper. I know the Nocioni trade was bad for us, but I'm looking at the salaries we have on the books right now for 2010, and we're only committed at $26.3 million, assuming we don't offer anything to Cedric Simmons (am I right about that?) Add in two first rounders this summer (approx $7 million), one first rounder next summer (approx $4 million), and we're at $37 million. Throw in second rounders and roster fillers, and we're only at $42-44 million. If the cap is at $55 million, we could potentially have $13 million in space.

I guess it's not as nice as I thought it would be, but it's not as bad as you think it is, either.
 
ryanandty said:
I suppose the smart thing to do here is try and package KT and Beno/Nocioni to try and land a big timer making around 12 million this summer. Maybe Tyson Chandler. Who knows of anyone else around that stratosphere?
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Even if some other team bites on an offer like this, it won't happen over the summer. Might during the trade deadline, but the other team has absolutely no incentive to do this trade this summer. They won't be reducing salaries for 09-10 season, but only for the 10-11 season. Why would they give us something decent for our trash for over half a season?
 
sidney said:
Unless we can move his contract or Beno's, there's no way we can offer a max contract to anyone in 2010.
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Um, I don't think I want to offer the max to anyone.

There isn't anyone worth the max who would want to come here.
 
ryanandty said:
I suppose the smart thing to do here is try and package KT and Beno/Nocioni to try and land a big timer making around 12 million this summer. Maybe Tyson Chandler. Who knows of anyone else around that stratosphere?
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Bosh, especially if Toronto stinks next year and he will be a free agent.
 
Superman said:
I don't know, Jasper. I know the Nocioni trade was bad for us, but I'm looking at the salaries we have on the books right now for 2010, and we're only committed at $26.3 million, assuming we don't offer anything to Cedric Simmons (am I right about that?) Add in two first rounders this summer (approx $7 million), one first rounder next summer (approx $4 million), and we're at $37 million. Throw in second rounders and roster fillers, and we're only at $42-44 million. If the cap is at $55 million, we could potentially have $13 million in space.

I guess it's not as nice as I thought it would be, but it's not as bad as you think it is, either.
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This is how I'm figuring it out from
http://hoopshype.com/salaries/sacramento.htm


Kevin 11.1
Nocioni 6.9
Beno 6.7
Garcia 5.5
Hawes 3
Thompson 2.2
Greene 1

09 2 firsts 6
10 1 first 4

That's 46.4 M if we have no one else on the team. Fill out some roster spots and we're back in the low 50s which gives us no cap space advantage over the MLE.
 
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