Kings Latest Trade Mumbo-Jumbo

[Lafayette]

League sources say the Kings continue to tell inquiring teams that they have no interest in moving Kevin Martin, especially in scenarios intended solely to create salary cap space by freeing them of his contract (three seasons and a combined $34.6 million remaining beyond this season). Houston is among those teams recently informed of that fact, with that possibility set to include Tracy McGrady and his expiring contract ($22.5 million) if talks had progressed. Sacramento Bee

They didn't, of course, but the chatter remains because of the chaotic context surrounding Martin and the team. Not only are the Kings losing, but Martin has struggled while failing to provide the lift Westphal and his staff hoped for upon his return. Since he came back Jan. 15 from left wrist surgery, he is shooting 36.4 percent overall and 34.5 percent from three-point range in 11 games while averaging 17.2 points. Sacramento Bee

No Kings player has seen a more drastic role change lately than Beno Udrih, the backup point guard whose playing time decreased significantly since the return of Kevin Martin on Jan. 15. But Wednesday night was something altogether different, as Udrih didn't play for just the second time this season while facing his old San Antonio team, and coach Paul Westphal opted for Sergio Rodríguez in the backup point guard role. And while Westphal continued to cite Udrih's sore right foot and plantar fasciitis that he believes has slowed him, Udrih said that's not the case. "(Trainer) Pete (Youngman) may have told (Westphal about his foot) for the first time (recently), but I had that problem the whole season," Udrih said. "It was in training camp with my heel and kept going with the plantar fasciitis and I've been playing." Sacramento Bee

Neither Westphal nor Udrih revealed the ailment until after Tuesday's practice, when the coach volunteered the information. Yet Udrih made it clear: He doesn't agree with his coach that he has lost a step because of it. "No, not really," he said. "I'm just not as involved anymore. Maybe that's how it looks, like I'm losing speed. But if I'm not involved, if I'm standing around in the corners, then I can't really do (anything) about it, right? … I didn't excuse myself (from playing). That's their excuse (for not playing him), maybe." Sacramento Bee

Read more: http://www.insidehoops.com/nba_rumors.shtml#ixzz0egWirN2a
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Read more: http://www.insidehoops.com/nba_rumors.shtml#ixzz0egWiuRxp
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[DocHolliday]

League sources say the Kings continue to tell inquiring teams that they have no interest in moving Kevin Martin, especially in scenarios intended solely to create salary cap space by freeing them of his contract (three seasons and a combined $34.6 million remaining beyond this season). Houston is among those teams recently informed of that fact, with that possibility set to include Tracy McGrady and his expiring contract ($22.5 million) if talks had progressed. Sacramento Bee

Well this if the rumors, and speculation have been bothering Kevin then this should put him at ease for now. Hey Kevn, we're less than 2 weeks to the trade deadline and Petrie is saying the organization has no interesting in moving you. Now play some damn ball, like we know you can.

 

[JJ22L]

Well this if the rumors, and speculation have been bothering Kevin then this should put him at ease for now. Hey Kevn, we're less than 2 weeks to the trade deadline and Petrie is saying the organization has no interesting in moving you. Now play some damn ball, like we know you can.

Ahh, the classic "Petrie waves his left hand over here to make everyone look, then moves the pieces with his right" maneuver.

Out of curiosity, (and I actually think this would be an interesting stat) how many times has Petrie said he absolutely is not looking to trade someone and then, poof, they get traded? Can someone generate a list? My list would only go back to about 2005.

 

[Merdiesel]

This is a good move on Petrie's part, imo.
Maybe this means if a trade does happen, we could possibly be on the recieving end just once.

 

[Arby's Roast Beef]

Marc Spears reports that Franky Garcia is also on our block. Not surprising, given that he's got a toxic contract and has been injured throughout the season, although if he gets healthy he's proven to be a serviceable cog player for a contending team. There's many permutations about this one--Garcia may be the price teams have to pay in order to attain KT's expiring, for example, or Garcia can be attached with Kevin, etc. I think we'll ultimately trade Noc first, but no one wants Noc, then Garcia should be the traded one.

 

[est.1999]

So I've heard that Arbys does not actually use 'real' roast beef. And that it's actually a solution or a mix

 

[OptimusRhyme]

Marc Spears reports that Franky Garcia is also on our block. Not surprising, given that he's got a toxic contract and has been injured throughout the season, although if he gets healthy he's proven to be a serviceable cog player for a contending team. There's many permutations about this one--Garcia may be the price teams have to pay in order to attain KT's expiring, for example, or Garcia can be attached with Kevin, etc. I think we'll ultimately trade Noc first, but no one wants Noc, then Garcia should be the traded one.

i dont get why we would trade Garcia.. Hes the vet we need for our young wing players untill they are fully ready.
He brings the intangibles that a winning team needs and the kids will learn something from that.

I would much rather trade martin & noc.

garcia will fit real nice next to Reke. They will cause defensive havoc.

 

[Kingsguy881]

I would actually like to see someone like Chris Douglas-Roberts in the backcourt with Tyreke. But thats just me.

 

[OptimusRhyme]

I would actually like to see someone like Chris Douglas-Roberts in the backcourt with Tyreke. But thats just me.

really why? hes a bad three point shooter and hes not very good at playmaking.. i think those are the two charicteristics we need beside reke.

 

[CruzDude]

There are 3 PG/SG scenarios that coach is trying:

1- Evans + Martin
2- Sergio + Evans
3- Beno + Evans

#1 doesn't appear to be working, oh yeah, it worked for 1-1/2 game but not since. Evans is a driver, scorer and now with a decent 3pt shot. Seems that is same description of Martin. Therefore, who runs the team in transition or from the half-court set? Hard to say from what I've seen......

#2 works sometimes but Sergio is like a windup toy run amok and tends to dribble too much. A pestering type defender but not as strong or big as Tyreke or Beno. But his windup toy running around does have a disrupting effect, if he can be a consistent distributor.

#3 seems to work the best as Beno is the best "stop & pop" scorer on the team, drives really well, handles the ball well and can distribute well without dribbling too much. His outside shot seems better than most and he is a good 3pt shooter, something Sergio is not. Sergio off the bench has worked really good several time recently.

The PF spot is biggest weakness at this point. JT, I love the guy, but his confidence seems shot and his game is in the tank. Sean May is a big time surprise and maybe he is one part of a solution. But then maybe Donte is the other part of a PF solution who can also play the 3 when needed. Then who do we have behind Hawes? JT? not really. Armstrong?? Big ? for me. A defender only with limited range shooting.

Kings trade, if any, needs to address the front line first. Martin is the best bargaining chip the Kings have but he is not getting a front line starter from a top 15 team, again IMHO. A backup or two from a top 10 team maybe: decent backup for Hawes and a scoring/defending type of PF. Hey, I can dream can't I?

 

[AriesMar27]

League sources say the Kings continue to tell inquiring teams that they have no interest in moving Kevin Martin, especially in scenarios intended solely to create salary cap space by freeing them of his contract (three seasons and a combined $34.6 million remaining beyond this season). Houston is among those teams recently informed of that fact, with that possibility set to include Tracy McGrady and his expiring contract ($22.5 million) if talks had progressed. Sacramento Bee
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http://www.insidehoops.com/nba_rumors.shtml#ixzz0egWiuRxp​

ive been pushing this trade since summer, dude... are you serious? that is the best move to make... we're already in full lose mode right now, what else do we have to lose? mcgrady doesnt even have to play for us... and we move martin and hopefully nocioni or beno. its a win-win situation...

 

[Kingsguy881]

really why? hes a bad three point shooter and hes not very good at playmaking.. i think those are the two charicteristics we need beside reke.

He's a big guard who can handle the rock and plays tough defense. He also has good shooting mechanics and can learn to spot up. He is also a beast in slashing and scoring, and can handle contact and use his athleticism. And he's cheap. And he's young.

 

[hammystyle]

He's a big guard who can handle the rock and plays tough defense. He also has good shooting mechanics and can learn to spot up. He is also a beast in slashing and scoring, and can handle contact and use his athleticism. And he's cheap. And he's young.

That's way overstating his case. He's average in some of those areas and has no particular strength. Just a marginal NBA SG who isn't any better than anyone we have or anyone we could get with an early 2nd round pick.

 

[Kingsguy881]

That's way overstating his case. He's average in some of those areas and has no particular strength. Just a marginal NBA SG who isn't any better than anyone we have or anyone we could get with an early 2nd round pick.

Thats not what I saw from him in preseason and the first month of the season, but to each his own I guess.

 

[rhythmless]

Is it just me, or is Beno the type of person who you would hate in real life? He's always the guy with an excuse. He's always the guy singling out people and pointing fingers.

Hey Beno, STFU. Got something to say? Say it to their face.

 

[Bricklayer]

1) this could of course be Petrie's normal trading philosophy -- tell everybody you are not interested in order to drive up offers, as opposed to sounding desperate and having teams low ball. Should also be noted that as a former player Geoff has sympathy, perhaps even excessively so, for player's feelings about being trade fodder, and seems almost angry about the modern limelight when rumors fly.

2) however it has been noted, with good reason, that Petrie has waited too long to trade piece after piece in recent years, and watched them all decline in value before finally shuffling them off for scraps. Far from being a genius, which implies somebody who can quickly and intuitively size up a situation, he has pedantically required sometimes years to "evaluate" players who were on the way out long before he realized it. Or perhaps he did realize it, and it was sentiment or stylistic preference or unwillingness to admit being wrong, or meddling Maloofs or whatever excuse you want to throw in there. But whatever it was, we waited too long to trade guy after guy over the years, and while we were sitting on our hands "evaluating" the rest of the league sat back watching our players struggle and get exposed and their value dropped right through the floor.

Remember all that "we are getting back a 30pt scorer!" nonsense about Kevin? Well it was nonsense, but if you are ahead of the game enough to realize what effect Kevin's return might have, its the same line of nonsense you could have peddled to interested teams while he was out. Peak type value (which is of course when a "genius" would sell). So now we struggle, Kevin struggles. Teams watch this. There is no way this is a positive -- there are questions about Kevin, we look more desperate, Kevin is already down from peak value. Now maybe we are gpoing to sit on our hands evaluating again for another few months of misery for everyone. Kevin, who BTW is on pace for his 5th straight year of declining FG% begins to lose his luster and look like maybe a player in decline. The value falls further. Etc. This has been the repeated pattern with Geoff in the last half decade. It certainly could happen again.

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

At this point, I am in total dump mode for Martin...I would be in TOTAL aggreance of trading Martin for expirings...BUT, if it is Houston we trade with, I'd like to see us try to make a 'sweetheart' deal with them like the Artest trade. I would hope we could maybe pry their 1st rounder from them. If they gave us McGrady and a 1st rounder, I'd say DEAL in a Texas heartbeat! We can then put Mr. McGrady on the 'inactive' list for the rest of the season so he cant contaminate our young guys.

 

[Bricklayer]

As an aside, I have said before that Cisco's game and personality make him a good fit next to Reke. But he is also a long contract for a vet at a crowded position we could understandably be willing to shed. If he goes so Kevin can stay....that's just atrocious. But go he might if he can get healthy -- teams rarely trade for injured players.

Should be perhaps noted that in regards to the Thabeet rumors/thoughts by the national media types, Memphis has been rumored to be looking for a 6th man G/F with shooting/scoring punch to help thme make their playoff run. The only piece we have on this team, again if you set aside Kevin, who fills that description is Cisco. Not sure how "on the block" he is, but if that is what Memphis is looking for, they could have asked.

 

[AriesMar27]

At this point, I am in total dump mode for Martin...I would be in TOTAL aggreance of trading Martin for expirings...BUT, if it is Houston we trade with, I'd like to see us try to make a 'sweetheart' deal with them like the Artest trade. I would hope we could maybe pry their 1st rounder from them. If they gave us McGrady and a 1st rounder, I'd say DEAL in a Texas heartbeat! We can then put Mr. McGrady on the 'inactive' list for the rest of the season so he cant contaminate our young guys.

thats what im saying... even if we use thomas in the trade we are still getting rid of martins contract. i would want beno or nocioni moved with martin so that we could combine mcgrady's contract with thomas' but to be hoest i'd be just as happy with mcgradys 22.5 million as opposed to just thomas' 8 million...

 

[Kingster]

1) this could of course be Petrie's normal trading philosophy -- tell everybody you are not interested in order to drive up offers, as opposed to sounding desperate and having teams low ball. Should also be noted that as a former player Geoff has sympathy, perhaps even excessively so, for player's feelings about being trade fodder, and seems almost angry about the modern limelight when rumors fly.

2) however it has been noted, with good reason, that Petrie has waited too long to trade piece after piece in recent years, and watched them all decline in value before finally shuffling them off for scraps. Far from being a genius, which implies somebody who can quickly and intuitively size up a situation, he has pedantically required sometimes years to "evaluate" players who were on the way out long before he realized it. Or perhaps he did realize it, and it was sentiment or stylistic preference or unwillingness to admit being wrong, or meddling Maloofs or whatever excuse you want to throw in there. But whatever it was, we waited too long to trade guy after guy over the years, and while we were sitting on our hands "evaluating" the rest of the league sat back watching our players struggle and get exposed and their value dropped right through the floor.

Remember all that "we are getting back a 30pt scorer!" nonsense about Kevin? Well it was nonsense, but if you are ahead of the game enough to realize what effect Kevin's return might have, its the same line of nonsense you could have peddled to interested teams while he was out. Peak type value (which is of course when a "genius" would sell). So now we struggle, Kevin struggles. Teams watch this. There is no way this is a positive -- there are questions about Kevin, we look more desperate, Kevin is already down from peak value. Now maybe we are gpoing to sit on our hands evaluating again for another few months of misery for everyone. Kevin, who BTW is on pace for his 5th straight year of declining FG% begins to lose his luster and look like maybe a player in decline. The value falls further. Etc. This has been the repeated pattern with Geoff in the last half decade. It certainly could happen again.

I'm with you on Petrie waiting too long to trade a guy. It seems like he waits for them to implode before he trades them. (I guess Richmond would be the exception). Peja, Bibby, Artest. He waited too long. Martin is imploding now. I'm still not sure whether he wants to trade Martin though. You mention that they (Reynolds, Petrie's voice) was certain about the benefits of Kevin Martin and Tyreke. Well, people usually don't change their opinions 180 degrees in a matter of a few weeks. They'll hold out to see if they were right to begin with. If I had to bet, I'd say he's not traded by the trade deadline.

 

[bajaden]

Did anyone happen to notice during the Spurs game that when Reynolds and Grant were talking about the Spurs and their needs, Reynolds let slip something along the lines of, the spurs are about to complete a trade for a backup point guard and a SF. I don't remember his exact words, but it was something close to that. So the question looms, how would he know that unless the Kings were somehow involved.

They certainly need a backup point right now. I don't know about the SF situation. The next question is, who do they have that we would want?

 

[cstorm]

Did anyone happen to notice during the Spurs game that when Reynolds and Grant were talking about the Spurs and their needs, Reynolds let slip something along the lines of, the spurs are about to complete a trade for a backup point guard and a SF. I don't remember his exact words, but it was something close to that. So the question looms, how would he know that unless the Kings were somehow involved.

They certainly need a backup point right now. I don't know about the SF situation. The next question is, who do they have that we would want?

You mean besides Eva?

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Did anyone happen to notice during the Spurs game that when Reynolds and Grant were talking about the Spurs and their needs, Reynolds let slip something along the lines of, the spurs are about to complete a trade for a backup point guard and a SF. I don't remember his exact words, but it was something close to that. So the question looms, how would he know that unless the Kings were somehow involved.

They certainly need a backup point right now. I don't know about the SF situation. The next question is, who do they have that we would want?

Yeah, it was a little tease and then they dropped it. I wasn't under the impression at the time that the Kings would be involved - they said that the Spurs might have to shorten their rotations due to the impending trade, but the rotations seemed normal and I haven't seen any talk since. At any rate, if we were involved, we would have been shortening our rotations too, right? It just seems odd that our own announcers would tease a trade involving us as another team's trade and not our own. I'm inclined to guess we weren't the other team.

 

[bajaden]

Yeah, it was a little tease and then they dropped it. I wasn't under the impression at the time that the Kings would be involved - they said that the Spurs might have to shorten their rotations due to the impending trade, but the rotations seemed normal and I haven't seen any talk since. At any rate, if we were involved, we would have been shortening our rotations too, right? It just seems odd that our own announcers would tease a trade involving us as another team's trade and not our own. I'm inclined to guess we weren't the other team.

Well, we did shorten our rotation. Thompson didn't play and neither did Beno. I must say that I found it odd that Beno didn't play and Sergio did, especially since Beno says that there wasn't any reason he couldn't play.

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

Well, we did shorten our rotation. Thompson didn't play and neither did Beno. I must say that I found it odd that Beno didn't play and Sergio did, especially since Beno says that there wasn't any reason he couldn't play.

Yeah, that was kinda strange...I wonder what's up...if anything? I can only hope it involves Martin, although the Spurs dont need him with Jefferson and all.

 

[DocHolliday]

Well, we did shorten our rotation. Thompson didn't play and neither did Beno. I must say that I found it odd that Beno didn't play and Sergio did, especially since Beno says that there wasn't any reason he couldn't play.

Thompson went back East to attend his cousins funeral. That is the only reason he did not play. He will not be back for tonights game either.

 

[FaStRmAn]

One thing I am pretty sure about Petrie is that if you see a rumor regarding the Kings in a trade, it is usually bogus. Petrie plays his cards VERY close to his vest. It is always possible that the other team lets on that there is trade activity with the Kings. In that case, it might be the only way we ever have any prior knowledge of a trade, and might pee Petrie off enough to scuttle the trade

I, unlike many here am not so hot on trading Martin just yet. I don't think the Kings can get value right now for him because he is playing so poorly. The problem with K-Mart is K-Mart right now is He is missing shots he normally makes. That is not a chemistry issue. It is a player issue. So to maximize Martin's worth, the Kings have to get Martin going and scoring again. That shouldn't be too hard because Martin is a good scorer who is bound to pull out of the nosedive his career is in.

I can't see the worth in taking on T-Mac and his huge salary. Sure it is a giant expiring contract, but what would we do with that big of an expiring contract? Are there still some here that believe the Kings have a shot at ANY of the top 5 free agents this summer? I think the Kings are shooting for something much lower than that. I think the Kings have the assets to acquire a Defensive Minded Center who can rebound and protect the paint. I also think that the Kings can do a deal without trading Martin to do it.

I believe that after practice, PW made a very astute observation regarding the Kings issues. He stated quite plainly that the problem with the Kings right now is interior defense. He said that the Kings are "Soft in the Middle". He is totally correct in this. The Kings have had a hole in the center of their defense all year and are the softest team in the league in the paint. This is the aspect of the team that is most desperate for the Kings to address. Hawes is still improving but it will take him a year or two to bulk up to play center in the NBA. Kings need help in the front court to be a team that is competitive. A defensive minded center who can rebound and play defense one on one against centers around the league. If the Kings had that, they would be much better defensively and would win a few more of these close games. This is NOT a playoff team. Even if they made the playoffs they would be one and done. So they need to build for the future.

 

[beb0p]

I'm with you on Petrie waiting too long to trade a guy. It seems like he waits for them to implode before he trades them. (I guess Richmond would be the exception). Peja, Bibby, Artest. He waited too long. Martin is imploding now. I'm still not sure whether he wants to trade Martin though. You mention that they (Reynolds, Petrie's voice) was certain about the benefits of Kevin Martin and Tyreke. Well, people usually don't change their opinions 180 degrees in a matter of a few weeks. They'll hold out to see if they were right to begin with. If I had to bet, I'd say he's not traded by the trade deadline.

I disagree. We traded Peja for Ron Artest. That's hardly qualifies as "waited too long." Bibby was traded for his fair market value, expirings, which was his value all along even if he had been traded earlier. The Kings actually got a better deal by waiting an extra year to trade Artest.

As for the Martin trade, it takes two to tangle. Please set aside any fantasy of Al Jefferson and Chris Bosh and really look at what's on the table: Jose Calderon, Josh Howard, T-Mac. Even the world's best trader can't trade something that no one wants. No team is willing to give equal value for KMart now, that could change in the summer as the free agency plays out, but for now there is no good deal out there, so you can't fault GP for not making a deal. Remember, it takes two to tangle.

.

 

[beb0p]

Kevin, who BTW is on pace for his 5th straight year of declining FG% begins to lose his luster and look like maybe a player in decline. The value falls further. Etc. This has been the repeated pattern with Geoff in the last half decade. It certainly could happen again.

Unless I'm missing something, the players on the table are 1) Jose Calderon 2) Josh Howard 3) T-Mac.

Thanks, but no thanks.

.

 

[Tetsujin]

Did anyone happen to notice during the Spurs game that when Reynolds and Grant were talking about the Spurs and their needs, Reynolds let slip something along the lines of, the spurs are about to complete a trade for a backup point guard and a SF. I don't remember his exact words, but it was something close to that. So the question looms, how would he know that unless the Kings were somehow involved.

They certainly need a backup point right now. I don't know about the SF situation. The next question is, who do they have that we would want?

George Hill looked like freaking Kevin Johnson against us.