Kings 2009-2010 NBA Draft:

[Capt. Factorial]

Lack of youtube videos = bust

Now, now. I never said that. My point was that in this day where every thirteen-year-old kid has a YouTube video with a collection of his dunks, this particular video from Motiejunas has a remarkable number of shots of him running lay-up drills in practice. That doesn't mean he's a bust, but I think it at least raises the question of whether he has actually done much up to this point. That particular video does not have "superstar" written all over it. I'll leave the boom/bust pronouncements to those who have actually seen him play.

(BTW, I've looked at his stats in Treviso this year, and it seems that he's scoring OK but not rebounding very strongly, but I don't know how to gauge that because it's a totally different league.)

 

[Vlade4GM]

It's just the premise that something must be up with him because some anonymous fan hasn't posted his game videos on youtube yet, that I have a problem with. I mean, not every Euro prospect has the fan notoriety of Ricky Rubio at 19 years old. How much do you really expect to gauge from a highlight video anyways? That's a very poor way to make any kind of signficant judgments about a player.

I really don't know what to say about whether he's done much in his career so far except that he's 19 and I don't know if anyone would describe him as a seasoned veteran that has led teams to championships. He's a prospect and if he declares this year he'll probably be a high risk/high reward type pick, which is typically the case with international prospects because it's based more on projection than college picks.

 

[NME]

You know what's scary? When half of a guy's highlight reel comes from practice. I mean, I have no idea how to evaluate Motiejunas but if two minutes of in-game highlights can't be put together he may not have much of a resumé yet.

Practice? We talking about PRACTICE?!?

 

[Capt. Factorial]

It's just the premise that something must be up with him because some anonymous fan hasn't posted his game videos on youtube yet, that I have a problem with. I mean, not every Euro prospect has the fan notoriety of Ricky Rubio at 19 years old. How much do you really expect to gauge from a highlight video anyways? That's a very poor way to make any kind of signficant judgments about a player.

I really don't know what to say about whether he's done much in his career so far except that he's 19 and I don't know if anyone would describe him as a seasoned veteran that has led teams to championships. He's a prospect and if he declares this year he'll probably be a high risk/high reward type pick, which is typically the case with international prospects because it's based more on projection than college picks.

Honestly, I don't disagree with any of this. I think our only point of contention is that the highlight video caused me to raise an eyebrow, and for you it didn't.

 

[Warhawk]

Honestly, I don't disagree with any of this. I think our only point of contention is that the highlight video caused me to raise an eyebrow, and for you it didn't.

Agreed. There is just nothing there. Someone got excited over this guy because of that video? Really?

 

[bajaden]

I actually found a couple of more videos, but they didn't show much either. Personally I'll stick with my code of not commenting on a player that I haven't been able to see play. Your never going to see a bad play in a Youtube video. I have no idea how good this kid is, or will be.

 

[bajaden]

After watching the Kentucky/Louisville game last saturday, DeMarcus Cousins is starting to climb my list. He's turning into a very good player. He lets his emotions cloud his vision at times, but he's becoming a presence inside for Kentucky. He's listed at 6'10" and I believe that he's all of that. Patrick Patterson is listed at 6'8" and at one point in the game when they gave each other a hug, Cousins appeared to be at least 4 inches taller than Patterson. He has a very soft touch in the post and is a very good rebounder. His man defense still needs a lot of work, but hey, he's a freshman in college. He's also very quick for a player of his size and weight. He's also running the floor much better than earlier in the year.

This is a guy with legitimate size right now. And despite weighing 260, you can see where he could easily carry another 15 to 20 pounds of muscle. His worse enemy appears to be his own mind. He gets down on himself at times and lets it affect his play. But I've seen nothing serious on the court that would deflect me from drafting him.

 

[hammystyle]

^^^^ If he keeps producing like he is, I think eventually he ends up as a top 5 pick or higher. There will be concerns about conditioning and attitude I'm sure. Possibly that will turn teams off when he goes in for workouts as well. But as a comparison, per-minute he's way ahead of Beasley's frosh year in rebounds and blocks, and is essentially equal in points, assists and steals. The difference is Cousins looks like he has legit center size.

Another comparison is Cousins is having almost an identical statistical season to Greg Oden's freshman year....except doing it in 10 less minutes a game.

Cousin's stats: http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=45882

Oden's Stats: http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=31545

Beasley's Stats: http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=36671

 

[Capt. Factorial]

^^^^ If he keeps producing like he is, I think eventually he ends up as a top 5 pick or higher. There will be concerns about conditioning and attitude I'm sure. Possibly that will turn teams off when he goes in for workouts as well. But as a comparison, per-minute he's way ahead of Beasley's frosh year in rebounds and blocks, and is essentially equal in points, assists and steals. The difference is Cousins looks like he has legit center size.

Another comparison is Cousins is having almost an identical statistical season to Greg Oden's freshman year....except doing it in 10 less minutes a game.

Cousin's stats: http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=31545

Oden's Stats: http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=31545

Beasley's Stats: http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/player/profile?playerId=36671

Your link to Cousins is actually Oden again - player ID is 45882 for Cousins.

Those stats do look pretty similar. Cousins isn't quite the block machine Oden was (but with equal minutes he's closer) and his FG%/efficiency aren't quite there. But I've always wondered why he's been so low on the mock boards. Maybe folks are worried about his conditioning or his attitude, but he looks to have the tools. He'll probably be a draft riser before all is said and done.

 

[bajaden]

Your link to Cousins is actually Oden again - player ID is 45882 for Cousins.

Those stats do look pretty similar. Cousins isn't quite the block machine Oden was (but with equal minutes he's closer) and his FG%/efficiency aren't quite there. But I've always wondered why he's been so low on the mock boards. Maybe folks are worried about his conditioning or his attitude, but he looks to have the tools. He'll probably be a draft riser before all is said and done.

I can guarantee you one thing. If you play on Kentucky, you will be in condition in short order. Kentucky runs the ball with the best of them. And as I said, he's getting up and down the floor much better now than at the start of the season. He's not an instinctive shot blocker, but he's not bad. He is very imposing down on the block. He's a big boy. I can't wait for a match up with Kansas or Texas. Probably won't be until the tourney, if ever.

 

[Vlade4GM]

I'd like to know Cousins' standing reach, I wouldn't want to take a chance on him unless I was sure his shot blocking would translate to the NBA.

How's his low post game?

 

[Capt. Factorial]

I can't wait for a match up with Kansas or Texas. Probably won't be until the tourney, if ever.

It'll be tourney or bust this year for Kentucky as regards those two, as Kentucky is playing nothing but SEC teams the rest of the way. Kansas and Texas, however, meet up on Feb. 8th. That'll be one to watch!

 

[hammystyle]

I'd like to know Cousins' standing reach, I wouldn't want to take a chance on him unless I was sure his shot blocking would translate to the NBA.

How's his low post game?

Not sure on the standing reach, but according to DX he was measured to a 7'6" wingspan at the Lebron James academy.

 

[Vlade4GM]

He has pretty wide shoulders, but that should still lead to a decent-good standing reach if he's really 6'10-11. I just watched the kentucky/louiseville game and he kinda looks like an Al Jefferson type, although I'm not predicting he'll be as good as Jefferson. He's got good hands and he's definitely a good rebounder, but he appears to lack explosiveness and his conditioning is a problem. Not a great athlete. Maybe he'd improve athletically with better conditioning, but he doesn't really explode up very well which led to short shots and getting stripped by smaller players.

 

[bajaden]

I'd like to know Cousins' standing reach, I wouldn't want to take a chance on him unless I was sure his shot blocking would translate to the NBA.

How's his low post game?

I don't know his standing reach, but just looking at him, he appears to have very long arms. Hard to say how his shotblocking translates. You never know for sure with any of them. All I know is that no one is going to push him around in the post.

As for his low post game, thats all he has at the moment, and for the most part its mostly a power game. In the game against Louisville he was doubled and at times tripled in the post and was still able to score. He ended up with 18 points and 18 rebounds. I believe he had 2 blocks. He's not a bad passer and he catches the ball cleanly most of the time. And as I stated earlier, he has a nice touch around the basket.

Earlier in the season I don't think he was in basketball shape. That, and getting into foul trouble lessened his minutes. But of late he's staying out of foul trouble and is in much better shape.

 

[bajaden]

He has pretty wide shoulders, but that should still lead to a decent-good standing reach if he's really 6'10-11. I just watched the kentucky/louiseville game and he kinda looks like an Al Jefferson type, although I'm not predicting he'll be as good as Jefferson. He's got good hands and he's definitely a good rebounder, but he appears to lack explosiveness and his conditioning is a problem. Not a great athlete. Maybe he'd improve athletically with better conditioning, but he doesn't really explode up very well which led to short shots and getting stripped by smaller players.

I've stated this before, and I'll say it again. He's hard to get a read on. He's a better athlete than you think. He'll move at one speed, and then suddenly surprise you with a very quick move. People last year said the same thing about Griffin, and I stated the very same thing. I was right. You have to watch a lot of games to really get the whole picture with him. His conditioning isn't a problem. He just needs to get into his best shape. Its not as though he can't do it. He's already improved his conditioning from the beginning of the year. Its not unusual for a kid out of highschool go through a transitioning period in college. Hell, Dexter Pittman was well over 400 pounds in his freshman year. And now he's down to 290.

Here's the deal. We could end up picking somewhere between 10 and 13. Its possible that Cousins could be available there. He may not be the perfect choice, but he's showing potential. So he's someone to keep our eye on.

 

[NME]

I read somewhere that he has a 9'0" standing reach, which puts him on par with almost any PF, but shorter than most centers. Some of the rap on him reminds me of what was said about Boozer predraft.

 

[M_Barragan]

If he is 7'6 across and 6'10 long he has to have a higher standing then that... Tyreke at 6'4 barefoot with a wingspan of 6'11.25 has an 8'8 Standing. Say cousins is really 6'9 barefoot at the very least he could be is 9'1 standing (add the 5 inches of height). Prolly closer to 9'3 when you account his arms are 1 inch longer then Tyreke in proportion.

Tyreke 7.25 inches wider then he is tall.

Cousins 8 inches wider then he is tall.


This puts just how long tyreke is into prospective lol. Tyreke is a whole 5 inches (at least) shorter yet in proportion less then and inch is lost in arm lenght.... crazy.

 

[Vlade4GM]

If he is 7'6 across and 6'10 long he has to have a higher standing then that... Tyreke at 6'4 barefoot with a wingspan of 6'11.25 has an 8'8 Standing. Say cousins is really 6'9 barefoot at the very least he could be is 9'1 standing (add the 5 inches of height). Prolly closer to 9'3 when you account his arms are 1 inch longer then Tyreke in proportion.

Tyreke 7.25 inches wider then he is tall.

Cousins 8 inches wider then he is tall.


This puts just how long tyreke is into prospective lol. Tyreke is a whole 5 inches (at least) shorter yet in proportion less then and inch is lost in arm lenght.... crazy.

You have to remember, with wingspan you have to take shoulder width into account. Take Shelden Williams for example, long wingspan but very short standing reach because a lot of that wingspan comes from his very wide shoulders. Also, a person's shoulder height is really what affects their standing reach, not their head height.

 

[Vlade4GM]

I've stated this before, and I'll say it again. He's hard to get a read on. He's a better athlete than you think. He'll move at one speed, and then suddenly surprise you with a very quick move. People last year said the same thing about Griffin, and I stated the very same thing. I was right. You have to watch a lot of games to really get the whole picture with him. His conditioning isn't a problem. He just needs to get into his best shape. Its not as though he can't do it. He's already improved his conditioning from the beginning of the year. Its not unusual for a kid out of highschool go through a transitioning period in college. Hell, Dexter Pittman was well over 400 pounds in his freshman year. And now he's down to 290.

Here's the deal. We could end up picking somewhere between 10 and 13. Its possible that Cousins could be available there. He may not be the perfect choice, but he's showing potential. So he's someone to keep our eye on.

I'm not saying he can't get in better shape, but right now his stamina does appear to be an issue.

 

[bajaden]

I'm not saying he can't get in better shape, but right now his stamina does appear to be an issue.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that he shows potential. To me stamina and getting in shape is the least of my worries as long as its born out of ignorance. Which is common with highschool players. Lets see what he looks like at tourney time. To me the plus is that this is a kid that pulled down 10 rebounds in 13 minutes in one game. So we know he's probably going to be able to rebound at the next level.

What I don't know about him is whats between his ears. Whats his attitude like. How dedicated is he. Those are the questions I would like answered.

 

[Gary]

DeMarcus Cousins: 6'10", 260 lb, PF, Freshman

He's been playing real well as of late.. Let's hope he stays in the range of the Kings pick so we could nab him. He's the type of player that can play center in the NBA (lots of growing left). I know there was the issue of weight, but overall talent this kid has so I say take a chance if he is around when we pick.

EDIT: just read the discussion above.. Hrmmm.. Gotta find me a couple recent Kentucky games.

 

[Vlade4GM]

I guess what I'm trying to say is that he shows potential. To me stamina and getting in shape is the least of my worries as long as its born out of ignorance. Which is common with highschool players. Lets see what he looks like at tourney time. To me the plus is that this is a kid that pulled down 10 rebounds in 13 minutes in one game. So we know he's probably going to be able to rebound at the next level.

What I don't know about him is whats between his ears. Whats his attitude like. How dedicated is he. Those are the questions I would like answered.

I'm just reporting what I saw in that game, I've seen other Kentucky games but I can't honestly say I was paying too much attention to Cousins since they have this guard that looks pretty good

He's got a lot of potential and that does make him someone to consider at our pick, but if we're going to opt for a high risk/high reward type player instead of a player that fits a more immediate need, I'd like to be convinced that a.) he has a clear position, and b.) he has a high upside either as a low-post scorer or as a defender.

 

[bajaden]

I'm just reporting what I saw in that game, I've seen other Kentucky games but I can't honestly say I was paying too much attention to Cousins since they have this guard that looks pretty good

He's got a lot of potential and that does make him someone to consider at our pick, but if we're going to opt for a high risk/high reward type player instead of a player that fits a more immediate need, I'd like to be convinced that a.) he has a clear position, and b.) he has a high upside either as a low-post scorer or as a defender.

Right now I would project hims as PF. A big PF, but a PF. However, I can see where he might eventually become a center. He is young, and its possible that he'll grow more. He'll certainly put on more weight. He weighs 260 now and he actually looks a little on the thin side. But we just have to wait and see how he develops as the year goes on.

All I know is that he's playing better now than he was at the beginning of the year. His stamina is better than it was at the beginning of the year. So the fact that he's improving is promising. I will admit that its hard to watch anyone else other than Wall when you watching Kentucky. But I've noticed that Wall is getting Cousins more involved in the game now than he was earlier in the year. They seem to be developing chemistry.

 

[Vlade4GM]

Right now I would project hims as PF. A big PF, but a PF. However, I can see where he might eventually become a center. He is young, and its possible that he'll grow more. He'll certainly put on more weight. He weighs 260 now and he actually looks a little on the thin side. But we just have to wait and see how he develops as the year goes on.

All I know is that he's playing better now than he was at the beginning of the year. His stamina is better than it was at the beginning of the year. So the fact that he's improving is promising. I will admit that its hard to watch anyone else other than Wall when you watching Kentucky. But I've noticed that Wall is getting Cousins more involved in the game now than he was earlier in the year. They seem to be developing chemistry.

I think the two big questions with him are 1.) Can he play above the rim? and 2.) Is he mentally/emotionally mature enough to maximize his potential in the NBA?

I really like that Kentucky is forcing him to play down low because one of the big reasons I sort of ignored Cousins is that during the HS all-star games he seemed far too in love with his jump shot and perimeter game, which matched his reputation. He probably would play better if he was allowed to play more in the high post, but learning the low post game will be far more beneficial to him in the long run.

 

[fxhsurjono]

he declares this year he'll probably be a high risk/high reward type pick, which is typically the case with international prospects because it's based more on projection than college picks.

peja, hedo, omri were all high risk/ high reward picks and look how they turned out.
i have faith.

 

[MassachusettsKingsFan]

How do you guys feel about drafting another PF? Ive been doing more reading lately ( and less watching .. Its a dangerous thing, but it saves time ) and the more I read the more I realize a lot of the better big man defenders ( something I want us to draft this year UNLESS we can get Wall or Turner ) are short. Not terribly short, but they dont have NBA Center height.

You look at some of the top NCAA shotblockers In our range.
Jarvis Varnado 6'9 - 230
Epke Udoh 6'10 - 240
Ed Davis 6'10 - 220
Dexter Pittman 6'10 - 290
Larry Sanders 6'11 - 235

I know there are more shot blockers, but these are the ones In our range .. I may have forgot some.

The only two real defensive Centers in the top half of the first round are Aldrich and Alabi.

So my real question is, can these guys play next to JT? Thompson obviously looks more confortable playing the PF. Can any of these shot blocking PF's move over to center?

Personally, Im leaning towards Pittman, Udoh, Sanders, or Alabi.

 

[hammystyle]

I read somewhere that he has a 9'0" standing reach, which puts him on par with almost any PF, but shorter than most centers. Some of the rap on him reminds me of what was said about Boozer predraft.

That's on his nbadraft.net profile under a 2006 scouting entry. It was taken after his freshman year of high school and even also lists a 7'3"wingspan. His wingspan measured 7'6" two years later at the Lebron James Skills Academy, so at worst, his standing reach should be 9'3". I'd guess more since he probly grew in height AND he might have grown since the summer of '08.

 

[Gilles]

He is big, he sure plays big. After watching last couple of games I'm all for drafting him. As of right now 19 year old freshman is THE best rebounder in college basketball among NBA prospects. He's strong and while you cannot rely on him to control the lane he can check his own man. As a bonus he can score like bigman should.

 

[bajaden]

How do you guys feel about drafting another PF? Ive been doing more reading lately ( and less watching .. Its a dangerous thing, but it saves time ) and the more I read the more I realize a lot of the better big man defenders ( something I want us to draft this year UNLESS we can get Wall or Turner ) are short. Not terribly short, but they dont have NBA Center height.

You look at some of the top NCAA shotblockers In our range.
Jarvis Varnado 6'9 - 230
Epke Udoh 6'10 - 240
Ed Davis 6'10 - 220
Dexter Pittman 6'10 - 290
Larry Sanders 6'11 - 235

I know there are more shot blockers, but these are the ones In our range .. I may have forgot some.

The only two real defensive Centers in the top half of the first round are Aldrich and Alabi.

So my real question is, can these guys play next to JT? Thompson obviously looks more confortable playing the PF. Can any of these shot blocking PF's move over to center?

Personally, Im leaning towards Pittman, Udoh, Sanders, or Alabi.

Kingster would probably disagree with me, but the best shotblocker is Varnado. He just instinctive. He's not a center, but I think you could put him on the floor with JT. He's also a good rebounder. He's not big, but he's tough, and not a bad finisher. Alabi will probably be gone before we pick, as will Aldrich. I like Udoh, and he does play center, although I think PF will be his best position in the NBA. He needs polish though. Pittman is a center. If he can lose another 15 pounds, you just might have something. I mean he moves pretty well right now at 290. Stamina is his enemy right now. But he could be a force if he can get into NBA shape.